Calling players for another rousing game of Here I Stand.
ACTS + Cyberboard unless someone can convince me otherwise, with me sending a file around every impulse. Positions will be assigned randomly; everyone can name one position they don't want (really, this should be the last position you had, but I'm damned if I can remember who had what last).
As soon as we get 6 players, the game is on. I do own a physical copy of the game, if that makes any difference to any potentials.
I am in.
I don't want to play the Protestants.
I will play, but I can't promise I won't cheat in Berkut's favor if Martinus is also playing.
I don't care who I play.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 09, 2009, 01:27:48 PM
I will play, but I can't promise I won't cheat in Berkut's favor if Martinus is also playing.
So it was all about hosing Marty?
Damn, I thought I was special!
Well, that looks like 4 out of 6 so far, assuming ehrie is still interested, so 2 more...Tamas? Viking? Delerium? Szmik? Bueller? Martinus?
I am in, if ulmont indeed volunteers to take responsibility for file updating. I will play whatever I get. I will win.
Quote from: Tamas on April 09, 2009, 02:28:13 PM
I am in, if ulmont indeed volunteers to take responsibility for file updating. I will play whatever I get. I will win.
Well, that's 5 out of 6, and I'll send around once per impulse anyway.
Why would Ulmont have to volunteer to keep the files updated? Everyone should be sending their own updates via CB.
It does seem like the most successful way of doing HiS PBEM these days is to use ACTS for the die rolling/communication, and CB for everything else.
Although we don't really need ACTS for commo either, since we have Languish.
I'm in! Any country will do.
Edit: would like Habsburg, though.
Habbaku, this would be the "play cards and roll dice on ACTS, update a shared CB" model that has worked in the past, although feel free to keep up your own CB (a cross-check is always nice to have) as well.
Assuming ehrie is in, we're solid (and if ehrie is out, our replacement 6th can take whoever he rolls), so we have:
1-5 (Ottoman, England, France, Papacy, Protestant) for Ulmont: 5. Goddamnit. Here I Stand (and roll dice. lots of dice.).
1-4 (Ottoman, England, France, Papacy) for Berkut: 4. Take up your Papal Miter.
1-3 (Ottoman, England, France) for Habbaku: 1. The Sultan rides.
1-2 (England, France) for Tamas: 2. Tamas the French gypsy.
1-1 (England) for Ehrie: 1. You can be: Henry the 8th.
0-0 (Hapsburg) for Delerium. Yay Chuck.
Ottoman: Habbaku.
Hapsburgs: Delirium.
England: Ehrie.
France: Tamas.
Papacy: Berkut.
Protestant: Ulmont.
Habbaku, Tamas, Berkut, I have your ACTS information. Ehrie, your account seems to be deleted, or I've forgotten your name one of the two. Delirium, I never had your information.
Ehrie and Delirium: send me your ACTS names via PM and this party can start.
Damnit! Just missed the cut. Well count me in if someone drops, don't care who I play.
Ohhh, you did save me a spot, nice! And I'm English, sweet.
damn.... thats what I get for playing ETW:DarthMod0.9 all of today...
Viking, you will probably have a spot when Berkut finds out he is the Papacy. :P
Quote from: Habbaku on April 09, 2009, 04:41:20 PM
Viking, you will probably have a spot when Berkut finds out he is the Papacy. :P
Pope Throbby XIV
Quote from: Habbaku on April 09, 2009, 04:41:20 PM
Viking, you will probably have a spot when Berkut finds out he is the Papacy. :P
If I have to play the Protestants :bleeding: Berkut can play the Papacy.
I'm Habsburg and Habs is the Ottomans? How interesting.
My luck as the Ottomans in Languish games is rather spectacularly poor. Expect to roll 10 hits on 10 dice in our first field battle.
I was referring to our discussion of my variant on Habsburg naval policy. Still not sure if it's worth the chance though, will probably decide when I see my hand.
It's an interesting strategy, very much in line with my own interest in trying an Italian campaign as the Ottomans. As usual, cards and diplomacy do dictate your strategy to a certain extent, though.
I think I haven't played France yet. :w00t:
Gonna be afk for much of today, in case you guys fire your FTLs and get to my turn by that time.
Habs, the reason is why I prefer to have a designated person responsible for distributing a CB file (and thus making that CB file The Truth) is that when we did not have such a person, the ACTS+CB combo resulted in total chaos. By all means keep your own one (as I will) as well.
I don't think you understand, Tamas. There is no "keeping your own." We're going to do update files for each of our rounds, right after our card plays in ACTS. Everyone playing knows how to use CB right now, so there shouldn't be any trouble making your file right after you post your move/a battle is finalized.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 10, 2009, 01:18:16 AM
I don't think you understand, Tamas. There is no "keeping your own." We're going to do update files for each of our rounds, right after our card plays in ACTS. Everyone playing knows how to use CB right now, so there shouldn't be any trouble making your file right after you post your move/a battle is finalized.
That's how you guys are handling the Napoleonic Wars game now, right? That could work, then.
Yeah, the only problem is that the HiS ACTS module pretty much blows due to the pain in the ass nature of the card management and its poor implementation.
Unless they've fixed that?
If not, I still recommend we manage cards in CB (exchanging a move file each play) and just use ACTS for dice rolling.
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 08:20:05 AM
Yeah, the only problem is that the HiS ACTS module pretty much blows due to the pain in the ass nature of the card management and its poor implementation.
Unless they've fixed that?
I hadn't had any problems with HiS ACTS, except for making sure to flip the "Henry Heir Status" field when appropriate, whatever it may be.
Quote from: ulmont on April 10, 2009, 08:31:21 AM
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 08:20:05 AM
Yeah, the only problem is that the HiS ACTS module pretty much blows due to the pain in the ass nature of the card management and its poor implementation.
Unless they've fixed that?
I hadn't had any problems with HiS ACTS, except for making sure to flip the "Henry Heir Status" field when appropriate, whatever it may be.
Hmmm, perhaps there is a new one then, since I don't recall such a field at all last time we used it.
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 08:40:55 AM
Hmmm, perhaps there is a new one then, since I don't recall such a field at all last time we used it.
Quote from: Ed Beach home pageHenry's Heir Status – This value MUST be kept up to date, as this triggers when the English heir and Reformation Cards are added to the deck. The starting value is 0. The value is changed to 1 at the end of the turn that Henry marries Anne Boleyn, 2 at the end of turn before Edward enters the deck, 3 at the end of the turn before Mary enters the deck, and 4 at the end of the turn before Elizabeth is to enter the deck. It is important therefore at the end of each turn to review the marital status track and the Pregnancy table to see if this value needs to be changed.
Note that the value should be adjusted at the end of the turn before END TURN is selected (when new cards are added to the deck). Please note the values 2-4 relate to the to the heir card being added to the deck, NOT when the heir is born. Also note that the English reformation cards will enter the deck when the value is 1 or more to cover the case of a late marriage.
All other cards will enter at the appropriate turn, controlled by the game setting.
http://home.comcast.net/~ebeach/HIS_ACTS_Custom_Module.rtf
OK, I am game for giving ACTS a shot at the card play. As long as someone else gets to deal with keeping the hand sizes correct.
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 09:32:41 AM
OK, I am game for giving ACTS a shot at the card play. As long as someone else gets to deal with keeping the hand sizes correct.
That shouldn't be too tough, as long as the board is accurate, which should be easy if we're sending continual updates. Just waiting on Ehrie's ACTS info to kick-start; his username appears to have been deleted.
Mine has been recreated under Craig Pearce.
Ok, it begins. The initial CB boards have been emailed and the ACTS game has been started. We will track cards and dice on ACTS, and use CB to send out file updates after each move so it doesn't get all fucked up, much like the Napoleonic Wars game is running.
Initial hand sizes:
Ottoman = 3 (key) + 0 (suleiman + 0 (saved) = 3
Hapsburgs = 5 (key) + 0 (charles) + 0 (saved) = 5
England = 2 (key) + 1 (henry) + 0 (saved) = 3
France = 3 (key) + 1 (francis) + 0 (saved) = 4
Papacy = 3 (key) + 0 (leo) + 0 (saved) = 3
Protestant = 4 (electorates) + 0 (luther) + 0 (saved) = 4*
*I'm going to have to figure out how it runs 95 Theses again, so there may be a bit of weirdness.
I await diplomats from France and the land of the chin in my PM box. :)
I suggest everyone IM the Ottoman player their choices for Diet cards, then the Ottoman can resolve it.
95 Theses attempts. In summary:
Converted:
Brandenburg, Magdeburg, Leipzig, Erfurt.
Failed:
Lubeck.
In detail:
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 4
3
3
5
6
Message from Protestant:
95 Theses attempt 1/5. Targeting Brandenburg.
1 adjacent protestant space (wittenberg)
1 adjacent stack (wittenberg)
1 adjacent reformer (luther, wittenberg)
1 for 95 theses
=
4 Protestant dice
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 6
3
4
5
1
6
3
Message from Protestant:
(brandenburg converted, protestant 6 and wins ties)
95 Theses Reformation 2/5
2 from adjacent protestant spaces (brandenburg, wittenberg)
2 from adjacent protestant land units (brandenburg, wittenberg)
1 from adjacent reformer (luther)
1 from 95 theses
=
6 Protestant dice.
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 4
3
3
1
3
Message from Protestant:
(Magdeburg converted; Protestant 6 and wins ties)
95 Theses attempt 3/5, targeting Lubeck.
2 from adjacent protestant spaces (magdeburg, brandenburg)
1 from adjacent protestant land unit (brandenburg)
1 from 95 theses
=
4 protestant dice.
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 2
5
1
Message from Protestant:
95 Theses attempt 3/5, targeting Lubeck, Papal dice (Protestants have a 3)
2 dice from adjacent spaces (Hamburg, Stettin)
=
2 Papal dice.
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 4
6
5
6
6
Message from Protestant:
Lubeck stays Catholic.
95 Theses attempt 4/5, targeting Leipzig.
1 adjacent space (Wittenberg)
1 reformer (Luther, Wittenberg)
1 adjacent land stack (Wittenberg)
1 from 95 Theses
=
4 Protestant dice.
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 3
2
1
3
Message from Protestant:
Leipzig converted (win-on-ties 6)
95 Theses attempt 5/5, targeting Erfurt.
2 from adjacent spaces (Magdeburg, Leipzig)
1 from 95 Theses
=
3 Protestant dice.
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 1
3
Message from Protestant:
Erfurt, Papal dice (Protestant highest is 3)
1 from adjacent spaces (Kassel)
=
1 Papal die.
A move file has been sent, but I forgot to update the Protestant spaces count. If the next person to muck with the CB could update that (now 5) and the VP (+1 Protestant, -1 Papacy), that would be good.
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 10:20:14 AM
I suggest everyone IM the Ottoman player their choices for Diet cards, then the Ottoman can resolve it.
Diet card sent to Habbaku.
Just need Del's Diet commitment and we're good to go.
England (Ehrie) should not let this halt his initial negotiations with France (Tamas) or the Habsburgs (Del) however, to keep things speedy.
Also, if you believe your spring deployment will not be affected in the least by what happens between now and my initial impulse, feel free to post it.
Ottoman SD : 6 regulars, 1 cavalry, Suleiman and Ibrahim to Nezh.
Wow, I guess that worked out pretty well for Ulmont, huh?
QuoteOttoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 13
5
5
6
5
3
6
4
6
6
2
4
4
1
Message from Ottoman:
And the Diet commitments are locked in.
Protestants are using Treachery (5)
Papacy is using Mercenaries Bribed (3)
Habsburgs are using Venetian Informant (1)
Protestants get 9 dice, Papacy gets 4. Protestants first.
7 hits vice 0 hits for the Papacy. Ulmont gets to pick 7 spaces. An early surge for the Protestants!
wow
Everyone should play their respective card at some point for the discard.
Now we're up for the English diplomacy with the others. Again, though, post your SD if it's unaffected (most likely the Papacy and Habsburgs).
This early surge by the Protestants is likely going to result in a very quin run for the electorates, assuming that Ulmont doesn't just take all of them. The Papacy is going to have a rough time containing such an early movement--so anyone holding Schmalkaldic League should be very eager to play it quick so that the Protestants don't get too much territory. Then again, maybe they can make a deal with the Protties to hold it for a bit longer?
Remember, all diplomacy that is not in the diplomacy phase must be open and public to everyone. Keep any wheeling and dealing posted here, as it will be more fun for all involved.
Converted from the Diet:
Brunswick
Kassel
Mainz
Trier
Koln
Worms
Augsburg
I updated the spaces / VPs on ACTS and sent around a move file.
Quote from: HabbakuThis early surge by the Protestants is likely going to result in a very quin run for the electorates, assuming that Ulmont doesn't just take all of them.
I just took all of them.
Wow.
OK, how do we stop an early Prot win? Counter-reformation is almost useless until I get a new Pope.
Del...you gotta stomp on him.
Quote from: ulmont on April 10, 2009, 01:14:03 PM
I just took all of them.
Can't say I'm surprised. :D
I just hope that if someone was dealt the League card that they'll play it now and give the Habsburgs some interesting choices...
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 01:21:18 PM
OK, how do we stop an early Prot win? Counter-reformation is almost useless until I get a new Pope.
Well, he hasn't won yet. Nowhere near it, in fact. An early surge of taking all the electorates certainly gives him a nice base of support in Germany, mind you, but even with that he did just drop a 5 point card into the Diet. He has no Bibles translated and rather few actual, Protestant spaces. He still needs to branch out to France to cement a win.
Which gives Del plenty of time to smush an electorate (or two, or three...) before things get out of hand. You just need the League to form up.
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 01:21:18 PM
OK, how do we stop an early Prot win?
I'm still like 38 spaces away from a win, guys.
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 01:21:18 PM
Del...you gotta stomp on him.
The depth of the Hapsburg commitment to the Catholic cause was, as usual, made obvious by the traditional use of "Venetian Informant" for the Diet of Worms.
Quote from: ulmont on April 10, 2009, 01:27:24 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 01:21:18 PM
OK, how do we stop an early Prot win?
I'm still like 38 spaces away from a win, guys.
Sure, of course YOU would say that!
38 spaces is nothing. The Prots are one of the players most capable of a Turn 3/4 win, and I've never seen them start this strong. We are almost certainly doomed.
Well, this not only changes things, but probably borks me good and plenty too.
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 01:29:21 PM
We are almost certainly doomed.
You are. But what's going to happen is that the League is going to go down, Del is going to start raping me, and then Habbaku is going to take Suleiman to Vienna and victory.
Quote from: ulmont on April 10, 2009, 02:02:47 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 01:29:21 PM
We are almost certainly doomed.
You are. But what's going to happen is that the League is going to go down, Del is going to start raping me, and then Habbaku is going to take Suleiman to Vienna and victory.
Too conventional.
Mark my words - we will see Ottomans in Italy before this is all over.
Oh only noticed it now. Would play otherwise. Count me in for the next game. :)
Quote from: Martinus on April 10, 2009, 02:07:33 PM
Oh only noticed it now. Would play otherwise. Count me in for the next game. :)
Did you ever apologize for accusing me of cheating?
Quote from: ulmont on April 10, 2009, 02:02:47 PM
You are. But what's going to happen is that the League is going to go down, Del is going to start raping me, and then Habbaku is going to take Suleiman to Vienna and victory.
Prophecy!
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 02:13:10 PM
Did you ever apologize for accusing me of cheating?
What game was that in...I thought I read all the Languish HIS threads, and I don't recall a game with both Martinus and Berkut?
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 02:13:10 PM
Quote from: Martinus on April 10, 2009, 02:07:33 PM
Oh only noticed it now. Would play otherwise. Count me in for the next game. :)
Did you ever apologize for accusing me of cheating?
Did you ever apologize for saying anything on Languish? :P
Quote from: Martinus on April 10, 2009, 02:19:13 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 02:13:10 PM
Quote from: Martinus on April 10, 2009, 02:07:33 PM
Oh only noticed it now. Would play otherwise. Count me in for the next game. :)
Did you ever apologize for accusing me of cheating?
Did you ever apologize for saying anything on Languish? :P
There is Languish chatting, and there are PBEM games posted on Languish. -_-
Quote from: Martinus on April 10, 2009, 02:19:13 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 02:13:10 PM
Quote from: Martinus on April 10, 2009, 02:07:33 PM
Oh only noticed it now. Would play otherwise. Count me in for the next game. :)
Did you ever apologize for accusing me of cheating?
Did you ever apologize for saying anything on Languish? :P
If I ever said something that I felt needed apologizing for.
I take that as a no.
Quote from: ulmont on April 10, 2009, 02:17:54 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 10, 2009, 02:13:10 PM
Did you ever apologize for accusing me of cheating?
What game was that in...I thought I read all the Languish HIS threads, and I don't recall a game with both Martinus and Berkut?
Don't really remember, just remember Marty stating at some point that he thought I was cheating.
France is very worried seeing the spreading heresy in Germany. To help stem their tide, I make the following offer: a truce with the Habsburg-Papacy coalition. As part of the deal, I would commit valuable French troops for peacekeeping operations in the unruly city of Metz.
Quote from: Tamas on April 10, 2009, 02:56:36 PM
France is very worried seeing the spreading heresy in Germany. To help stem their tide, I make the following offer: a truce with the Habsburg-Papacy coalition. As part of the deal, I would commit valuable French troops for peacekeeping operations in the unruly city of Metz.
LOL.
To sum up where we are:
We are waiting for Ehrie to decide, in his English way, whether he will accept any deals from the Chin.
Then we see if Ehrie will accept any deals from the Franks.
Both of those should have happened before the Diet, so as not to be influenced by Luther's Great Victory, but you can't have everything.
After that, the remainder of the Spring Deployments (we have Ottomans, and unsurprisingly there will be no Protestant Spring Deployment), and then we're off to the impulse races.
Quote from: Viking on April 09, 2009, 04:55:28 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 09, 2009, 04:41:20 PM
Viking, you will probably have a spot when Berkut finds out he is the Papacy. :P
Pope Throbby XIV
:lmfao:
Sorry, that one hit me in the funnay bone.
I sent some stuff out; however, I'm going to sit on the sidelines this turn. Nothing to announce with either the Frogs or the Hapsburgs.
Tamas, are you getting my PMs? I can't tell with this horrible new software. There's nothing in my sent box for PMs, yet it says I replied to your PM. X.x
Just need spring deployments from the other four capable of it, then...
Henry 3+0 to Berwick
No I am not getting PMs, ehrie.
I hate this frackin new software. What am I doing wrong? I am hitting reply, hitting send, the message itself says I have replied to it, yet nothing seems to be happening.
Quote from: ehrie on April 11, 2009, 01:36:55 PM
I hate this frackin new software. What am I doing wrong? I am hitting reply, hitting send, the message itself says I have replied to it, yet nothing seems to be happening.
Use the dropdown menu from the person's name.
Click "View User Profile."
Scroll down to the bottom and click "send this member a personal message."
Type your message.
Verify that the recipient is listed at the top.
Hit send message.
That's really all there is to it. Works fine for me and others.
Got it now.
Quote from: grumbler on April 10, 2009, 05:19:38 PM
:lmfao:
Sorry, that one hit me in the funnay bone.
His Papla Bluls are famous.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 11, 2009, 01:42:55 PM
Quote from: ehrie on April 11, 2009, 01:36:55 PM
I hate this frackin new software. What am I doing wrong? I am hitting reply, hitting send, the message itself says I have replied to it, yet nothing seems to be happening.
Use the dropdown menu from the person's name.
Click "View User Profile."
Scroll down to the bottom and click "send this member a personal message."
Type your message.
Verify that the recipient is listed at the top.
Hit send message.
That's really all there is to it. Works fine for me and others.
Just tried that again and it didn't work. :mad: That is what I've been doing. I get notice that the message sent, but when I check there is nothing in the sent messages folder.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 10, 2009, 01:21:46 PM
I just hope that if someone was dealt the League card that they'll play it now and give the Habsburgs some interesting choices...
Speaking of which, the rules (21.6) say
QuoteThe Mandatory Event Schmalkaldic League can be played as early as Turn 2
although the card strangely doesn't specify that, the FAQ says it can't be triggered turn 1. Unfortunately.
On another note, I apologize for my silence, been away on Easter thingies. So it was not out of disrespect to the English. We welcome their decision to stay neutral for the time being. We also encourage their right to enforce order in the unruly Scottish lands.
Regarding the French offer of truce we welcome such a proposal but cannot yield the heavy responsibility of keeping the peace in Metz to the French in these chaotic times, surely they have enough duties already.
I Spring Deploy a single regular to Nuremberg.
No Spring Deploy for me.
No papal SD
All spring deployments are in:
Ottoman SD : 6 regulars, 1 cavalry, Suleiman and Ibrahim to Nezh.
Hapsburg SD : 1 regular from Vienna to Nuremberg.
English SD : 3 regulars and Henry from London to Berwick.
French SD : none
Papal SD : none
Protestant SD : none
Habbaku is up.
And don't forget to apply our SD's as well.
Quote from: Delirium on April 13, 2009, 12:15:57 PM
And don't forget to apply our SD's as well.
? Habbaku can apply the SDs before his impulse.
And that's what I just told him to do.
Ottomans play their home card to raise 4 regulars in Nezh.
Habsburgs are up.
Charles moved to Besancon, recruited some mercenaries and then went to Metz, to discuss the matter of peace-keeping with its citizens. England is up.
Noting the strong Protestant opening we know that everyone understands that there are only two powers who benefit, and that is Luther himself, and also the Ottomans. We, the Habsburg Empire, will, and must, see it as our responsibility to contain the heretics but in doing so must commit resources otherwise best used elsewhere. We know the heathen Turks will take advantage of the situation, but we also know that the rest of Europe will instead see the logic in helping us defend civilization against this threat.
Ehrie's up.
The London ship yards churned out a fleet and both fleets in London set sail for the North Sea. On to the frogs.
France: Play Card as Operations
#74: 5 / Diplomatic Overture
Message from France:
Build 1 regular and 3 mercs in Paris.
You sending a file?
Quote from: Berkut on April 14, 2009, 08:55:52 AM
You sending a file?
I wanted to but no one before me bothered so I figured I need not to.
I sent one out. o_o
Quote from: Tamas on April 14, 2009, 09:03:00 AM
I wanted to but no one before me bothered so I figured I need not to.
There have been several files sent out, at least 1 from everyone except you. You have been cc'd at your gmail account (the same one on ACTS) for all of them.
Ooops, mail subject sucks. File sent.
Okay, Il Papa is up then.
The Pope has found that he has some deal about CLoth prices or some such?
He is wondering what it might be worth to the English and Hapsburgs players to have that played as an event...
That is a pretty good event for all three of us, us getting cards and you two mercs.
Apart from an alliance and to help you against Luther with troops and protect you from the Ottomans and the French, I also acknowledge your right to Italy as your sphere of influence and I promise to play any beneficial events on your part.
But you're probably thinking about card offers in return. I honestly think our joint purpose is better served at this point by me rather than you having the maximum number of cards; although there is a point to you having a lot of cp's available for conversion attempts, I think me being able to fend off the Ottomans while beating up the Schmalkaladddnen league is a tougher job and better for us in the long run.
That's my truthful opinion.
Speaking of trades: what does it worth for the unholy papal-habsburg alliance to delay the arrival of the barbary pirates?
Delay it for all of three or four impulses? lulz
Quote from: Berkut on April 14, 2009, 12:19:02 PM
He is wondering what it might be worth to the English and Hapsburgs players to have that played as an event...
You could play one of your 3 other cards while you negotiate, so as to allow Luther the chance to proselytize a bit more?
Quote from: Tamas on April 14, 2009, 01:15:13 PM
Speaking of trades: what does it worth for the unholy papal-habsburg alliance to delay the arrival of the barbary pirates?
It's mandatory, so as Habs says, it's going to be played this turn whether we want to or not. I personally don't think it's in anyone's interest to maximize the Ottomans' time to wreak havoc with their pirates, but if you believe otherwise I don't feel I have anything to offer you other than that we should keep a truce this turn and conclude a white peace next turn.
Quote from: Delirium on April 14, 2009, 01:24:01 PM
Quote from: Tamas on April 14, 2009, 01:15:13 PM
Speaking of trades: what does it worth for the unholy papal-habsburg alliance to delay the arrival of the barbary pirates?
It's mandatory, so as Habs says, it's going to be played this turn whether we want to or not. I personally don't think it's in anyone's interest to maximize the Ottomans' time to wreak havoc with their pirates, but if you believe otherwise I don't feel I have anything to offer you other than that we should keep a truce this turn and conclude a white peace next turn.
I want Metz for peace.
So what do you want for playing Pirates late?
Papacy: Message
Play Papal Bull for 4 CPS.
2/4: Build 2 mercs in Ravenna
3/4: Move 1+3 from ravenna to Modena
4/4: Control Modena
Tamas has the option to intercept in Modena, but likely won't.
Ulmont's up.
I can't really see what I could offer the Pope for the play of Cloth. It doesn't make sense to give you a card for a card and I don't really have any way of assisting the Papal player otherwise being up here on my comfy island fortress.
God, that was awful. 4 reformation attempts, 1 of which had 7! dice, and I managed to fail all but Stettin.
Quote3 / Erasmus
If played on Turn 1 or 2, Protestant player makes 4 Reformation attempts targeting all language zones. If played on Turn 3 or later, Papal player makes 4 Counter Reformation attempts targeting all language zones.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
3
2
1
1
2
2
Message from Protestant:
Reformation 1/4, targeting Nuremberg.
4 adjacent spaces (Kassel, Mainz, Worms, Augsburg)
2 adjacent stacks (Mainz, Augsburg)
=
6 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 1
3
Message from Protestant:
Reformation 1/4, Nuremberg, Protestant.
I forgot Leipzig, giving me a 7th die.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
4
2
6
Message from Protestant:
Nuremberg, Papal dice (Protestants have a 3).
1 adjacent (Regensburg)
2 from a stack.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
1
3
1
Message from Protestant:
Nuremberg fails.
Reformation attempt 2/4, targeting Lubeck.
2 adjacent (Magdeburg, Brandenberg)
1 adjacent stack (Brandenberg)
=
3 protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
2
6
Message from Protestant:
Lubeck, Papal dice (Protestants have a 3)
2 adjacent (Hamberg, Stettin)
=
2 Papal dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
4
1
5
2
Message from Protestant:
Reformation attempt 3/4, targeting Liege.
2 adjacent (Koln, Trier)
2 adjacent stacks (Koln, Trier)
=
4 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
2
5
5
2
2
6
Message from Protestant:
Liege, Papal dice.
3 adjacent spaces (Antwerp, Brussels, Metz)
3 adjacent stacks (Antwerp, Brussels, Metz)
=
6 Papal dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
3
5
Message from Protestant:
Reformation attempt 4/4, targeting Stettin
1 adjacent (Brandenberg)
1 adjacent stack (Brandenberg)
=
2 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 1
5
Message from Protestant:
Stettin, Papal dice.
1 adjacent space (Lubeck)
=
1 Papal die.
Back to Habbaku.
Hint : England and Habsburgs should offer at least one mercenary, perhaps 2 next turn for play of the event. The Pope would get ~4-6 mercenaries and the other two would get a card for their troubles. The average CP value of cards in HIS is something like 2.4 or 2.6 or something, and that's not counting the "inherent" CP value of some of the more powerful events.
Saying you have "no way of assisting the Papal player" is silly. You always have something to exchange to another player.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#35: 1 / Siege Artillery
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/1 - Suleiman and entourage all to Belgrade. Belgrade under siege.
Suleiman and pals head off to take their rightful place in Serbia.
Delirium's up.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 14, 2009, 02:18:11 PM
The average CP value of cards in HIS is something like 2.4 or 2.6 or something, and that's not counting the "inherent" CP value of some of the more powerful events.
2.66 for the cards available on turn 1, excluding home cards.
Quote from: ehrie on April 14, 2009, 02:10:06 PM
I can't really see what I could offer the Pope for the play of Cloth. It doesn't make sense to give you a card for a card and I don't really have any way of assisting the Papal player otherwise being up here on my comfy island fortress.
Of course it makes sense to give me a card for a card - a card today is worth more than a card next turn, isn't it? Can a card next turn send an explorer or colony or maybe even both THIS turn?
And while I agree that being friendly to the Hapsburgs is valuable all on its own, lets be reasonable - this is a 4CP card, pretty much the best card in my hand, and my hand is pretty damn small. I do NOT agree that a card in the Hapsburgs players hand is worth more than one in the Papal hand - quite the opposite in fact, especially when I have such a poor leader. I have very few cards, therefore each card is relatively valuable compared to the Hapsburg and English player who have cards falling out of...well, anyway, a lot more cards than I do.
I think it would be very reasonable for you two to trade me card for card. You both get a card this turn in trade for a card next turn. Heck, you could both turn around and spend that card you get from this on a colony, for example, and have a decent chance of not even losing a card from the deal.
The Pope, however, is in the opposite position - I only have 2 non-home cards, so of course each is very valuable to me, and I need to secure another key still to get that next card. So burning this as an event, instead of taking Florence, is certainly much more painful, and hence deserving of a commensurate reward.
Quote from: ulmont on April 14, 2009, 02:22:38 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 14, 2009, 02:18:11 PM
The average CP value of cards in HIS is something like 2.4 or 2.6 or something, and that's not counting the "inherent" CP value of some of the more powerful events.
2.66 for the cards available on turn 1, excluding home cards.
All the more reason to give 2 mercenaries in exchange. The Habsburgs and English get a card in the early turns and the Pope gets 6 mercenaries, ensuring that he's going to be under no physical danger for the rest of the game. Win-win.
Quote from: ulmont on April 14, 2009, 02:22:38 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 14, 2009, 02:18:11 PM
The average CP value of cards in HIS is something like 2.4 or 2.6 or something, and that's not counting the "inherent" CP value of some of the more powerful events.
2.66 for the cards available on turn 1, excluding home cards.
And again, as was mentioned, the real value is considerably higher considering that some cards are worth much more than their CP value.
The median card is 3 CPs. That is a colony for either player. They are going to spend cards to get colonies anyway, so obviously the colony is more valuable the more turns it is being used.
I would like a card from each of them next turn. That would be a very agreeable price for everyone involved. It is,
at worst a wash for them.
Quote from: Berkut on April 14, 2009, 02:26:02 PM
I need to secure another key still to get that next card. So burning this as an event, instead of taking Florence, is certainly much more painful, and hence deserving of a commensurate reward.
Florence alone won't give you another card. You'd need another key on top of that, unless you're slipping and giving away that you have Andrea Doria or another card to grab Venice.
Quote from: Berkut on April 14, 2009, 02:28:55 PM
Lets not quibble.
Just keeping the record straight. Including the commentary over Florence. ;)
Quote from: ulmont on April 14, 2009, 02:32:48 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 14, 2009, 02:28:20 PM
The median card is 3 CPs.
Only barely.
Indeed - the card you give up may be only a 1 CP card.
Like I said, a card for card trade is a net plus for you - certainly cannot be a negative, since a card this turn is better than a card next turn when it comes to New World stuff. Which I cannot do, but you can.
Quote from: Berkut on April 14, 2009, 02:38:44 PM
Indeed - the card you give up may be only a 1 CP card.
Like I said, a card for card trade is a net plus for you - certainly cannot be a negative, since a card this turn is better than a card next turn when it comes to New World stuff. Which I cannot do, but you can.
You have confused me with ehrie or Delirum. I am busily prosyletizing in Germany, although extremely ineffectively.
Quote from: ulmont on April 14, 2009, 02:44:59 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 14, 2009, 02:38:44 PM
Indeed - the card you give up may be only a 1 CP card.
Like I said, a card for card trade is a net plus for you - certainly cannot be a negative, since a card this turn is better than a card next turn when it comes to New World stuff. Which I cannot do, but you can.
You have confused me with ehrie or Delirum.
That seems entirely possible.
So here is the deal I am offering:
If I do not use this card for CPs, I cannot take Florence this turn, which I would like to do. The two mercs the event gives me are nice, but not that material right now.
So I am asking for a card draw from each of you in return for playing this as an event. This would be a benefit to all of us, I think. Enlightened self interest and all that.
Would you consider an offer of a mercenary next turn and a card on turn 3?
The Ottomans don't plan on anything major until the Protestants are moderately well-contained. If the Habsburgs leave a garrison in Vienna to keep me honest, I will stick to building the Death Star and delay Final Victory a bit longer.
A very wise policy by the Sultan, that makes us appreciate his sense of long-term strategic necessity. On the other hand, the lack of this quality displayed by the French disappoints us. If the French want to hazard the future of Europe on one large field battle outside Metz which would only favour the Protestants there is nothing I can do about it.
I will make sure the Schamallalkad league is played early next turn and then promptly whoop Luther's ass, it's the only thing that can avoid a Protestant early victory. But if you want to aim for second place behind ulmont, then by all means, fight. If not, I welcome the chance for peace.
White smoke issues and there is a new Pope.
I move fleets to sea and take Metz. England is up.
I'm willing to give a gift of a couple mercs. I'm not willing to give a card for Cloth play. My turn is inc shortly. I don't have my board handy so I can't send an update, but I know what I want to do.
England: Message
DOW Scotland. French get a free DOW if they want one.
4/5 Build 4 Mercs in Henry's Army.
5/5 Henry and his stack beseige the Scottish Capital.
Tamas is up...Tamas, if you wouldn't mind rolling ehrie's move into your board update?
Quote from: ehrie on April 15, 2009, 07:27:39 AM
I'm willing to give a gift of a couple mercs. I'm not willing to give a card for Cloth play. My turn is inc shortly. I don't have my board handy so I can't send an update, but I know what I want to do.
So you won't give a card for a card, but instead insist that you give less than a card for a card?
Why would I agree to that?
Quote from: Berkut on April 15, 2009, 07:55:39 AM
Quote from: ehrie on April 15, 2009, 07:27:39 AM
I'm willing to give a gift of a couple mercs. I'm not willing to give a card for Cloth play. My turn is inc shortly. I don't have my board handy so I can't send an update, but I know what I want to do.
So you won't give a card for a card, but instead insist that you give less than a card for a card?
Why would I agree to that?
Because you're already getting something from the card play itself and getting something from another player.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 15, 2009, 01:28:01 AM
The Ottomans don't plan on anything major until the Protestants are moderately well-contained.
I dunno if you noticed, but I converted 1 lousy space last impulse. At this rate I will win sometime after everyone else.
I'd be crying along with you if that hadn't been your thirteenth space, first round, turn 1. :rolleyes:
Quote from: ehrie on April 15, 2009, 08:27:23 AM
Quote from: Berkut on April 15, 2009, 07:55:39 AM
Quote from: ehrie on April 15, 2009, 07:27:39 AM
I'm willing to give a gift of a couple mercs. I'm not willing to give a card for Cloth play. My turn is inc shortly. I don't have my board handy so I can't send an update, but I know what I want to do.
So you won't give a card for a card, but instead insist that you give less than a card for a card?
Why would I agree to that?
Because you're already getting something from the card play itself and getting something from another player.
The other player has offered me a card two turns from now. Not a bad counter proposal really, but I am not giving up a card right now for a card two turns from now.
I would give up the card now in return for a card from you next turn, and a card from the Hapsburgs the turn after. That would be reasonable. Or you two could argue about the order.
But I won't give England an advantage for nothing. I will be happy to simply take the 3 CPs and use them to take Florence.
I suggest we pause the negotiations while we wait for French activities this turn, I think they could affect the deal in your favour.
And I think you would be right in demanding something from the English.
Listen, I agree that there will be no battle between Habsburg and France forces this turn, but only on the condition of the Papacy leaving me, and especially Milan, alone.
You think the Pope is going to attack Milan?
Uhhh, no.
Quote from: Delirium on April 15, 2009, 08:48:19 AM
I suggest we pause the negotiations while we wait for French activities this turn, I think they could affect the deal in your favour.
And I think you would be right in demanding something from the English.
OK, so where does this leave us?
Well I wanted to be sure there won't be any backdoor sneak attack if I make truce with the Chin.
So I consider the truce to be in effect.
In other news, I am letting Scotland fall. I sent out an explorer, built a fleet, and moved the French fleet out to the Channel in a purely defensive manner.
Quote from: Berkut on April 15, 2009, 10:34:37 AM
OK, so where does this leave us?
It leaves you up, and with the 100% conviction that the Hapsburgs and the English do not want to pay you what it's worth to play cloth prices fluctuate as an event.
Quote from: ulmont on April 15, 2009, 10:49:34 AM
Quote from: Berkut on April 15, 2009, 10:34:37 AM
OK, so where does this leave us?
It leaves you up, and with the 100% conviction that the Hapsburgs and the English do not want to pay you what it's worth to play cloth prices fluctuate as an event.
Well, that isn't the case, now is it? Seeing as Del just said that the deal with France may change his mind?
Papacy: Play Card as Event#104: 3 / Trace Italienne
Message from Papacy:
Add a fortress to any unfortified space (even if under Unrest or controlled by another power). Unless space is independent or in unrest, add 1 regular to that space from the counter mix of the power in control of the space.
Add a fortress and 1 Papal regular to Modena
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Event
#81: 3 / Indulgence Vendor
Message from Protestant:
German translation, committing Melanchthon.
German New Testament now at 4 CP.
Back to Habbaku.
The Ottomans successfully sack Belgrade with minimal losses (1 cavalry, which I noted in ACTS but forgot to take off the map--Del, please do so). In addition, 1 cavalry each were raised in Nezh and Sofia to patrol the lines.
Habsburgs are up.
I think the wise choice of the French bodes well for Europe. I am willing to offer you a card draw next turn if the English do so as well, with the caveat that if it's a certain Shcmamalaka league you draw, you must play it first impulse.
In other news, Habsburg fleets maneuver the Mediterranean. England is up.
That is acceptable to me.
ehrie?
I don't agree. I know we're all concerned about the Prottys and all, but I don't want the Papal player getting 2 mercs and 2 cards for a 3 CP card. I'm still willing to gift you some amount of mercs, 2 or so, but not a card. I don't have access to a board. I plan to play a 1 CP card to assualt the Scots. Can someone roll that for me and I'll ditch the card when I get back?
Quote from: ehrie on April 15, 2009, 05:21:15 PM
I plan to play a 1 CP card to assualt the Scots. Can someone roll that for me and I'll ditch the card when I get back?
QuoteProtestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 9
4
3
5
4
6
1
5
1
3
Message from Protestant:
Rolling the English assault on Edinburgh.
4 dice from units (3 regulars, 4 mercs, / 2 and round up)
1 die from Henry (1 battle rating)
=
5 English dice.
3 dice from units (3 regulars)
1 die from being the defender
=
4 Scottish dice.
English dice are first.
English get 2 hits, Scots get 1 hit. Edinburgh is reduced to 1 Scottish defender and England crunches a merc.
Tamas is up.
Quote from: Berkut on April 15, 2009, 11:29:23 AM
Quote from: ulmont on April 15, 2009, 10:49:34 AM
It leaves you up, and with the 100% conviction that the Hapsburgs and the English do not want to pay you what it's worth to play cloth prices fluctuate as an event.
Well, that isn't the case, now is it? Seeing as Del just said that the deal with France may change his mind?
Quote from: ehrie on April 15, 2009, 05:21:15 PM
I don't agree.
:lol:
Quote from: ulmont on April 15, 2009, 06:19:26 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 15, 2009, 11:29:23 AM
Quote from: ulmont on April 15, 2009, 10:49:34 AM
It leaves you up, and with the 100% conviction that the Hapsburgs and the English do not want to pay you what it's worth to play cloth prices fluctuate as an event.
Well, that isn't the case, now is it? Seeing as Del just said that the deal with France may change his mind?
Quote from: ehrie on April 15, 2009, 05:21:15 PM
I don't agree.
:lol:
Del was talking about Del's mind, not ehrie the stubborn who apparently is a big fan of the protestants and their 13 conversions on turn 1 so much that he is willing to screw himself rather than let the Pope deal with them.
No amount of reason can overcome obstinacy though, I guess. Don't back down no matter what!
I think it is perfectly reasonable for Ehrie to offer mercenaries along with Del's offer of a mercenary and a card in combination to "pay" for the event play. The Habsburgs can far better afford to pay things than the English can, by virtue of having the ability to get more cards in the first place.
Well, at the risk of pissing off the Hapsburgs, I will make one last offer:
1 card from the Hapsburgs next turn.
3 mercs from England next turn.
So Del pays 1 less merc, and ehrie pays 1 more. AT least that would be an median CP value for the card he gets this turn.
Edit: I will agree to that deal, but nothing less from England.
Tamas is up.
Barbarossa and the barbary pirates set up base, while a new French colony is established in the New World (I forgot to place it on the map, please put it there, dear Pope)
Try again, dear Frenchy, your colonies cost 3 cp each.
Quote from: Delirium on April 16, 2009, 07:19:47 AM
Try again, dear Frenchy, your colonies cost 3 cp each.
Thats how I remembered, but the chart in the CB box said 2. Anyways, build a regular in Paris instead.
It doesn't say that, actually. Maybe you misread the limits of two counters as the cost?
Anyway, Protestants are up.
Quote from: Delirium on April 16, 2009, 08:36:26 AM
Anyway, Protestants are up.
Not unless Pope Berkut VII made a play when I wasn't looking.
Heheeh, sorry about that, Pope. :blush:
Il Papa is up!
Need to here from ehrie, since if I am not playing it as the event, it is getting played as ops right now.
I realize I made a slight misjudgement, getting that extra card this turn isn't all that essential after all. Won't back down from accepting your offer though, as long as ehrie does too.
3 Mercs is fine with me, next turn as well provided epic luck on the part of the scots doesn't come through.
Papacy: Play Card as Event
#72: 3 / Cloth Prices Fluctuate
Message from Papacy:
If England controls Calais and Hapsburgs control Antwerp, both powers draw a card from the deck; the power playing this card adds 2 mercenaries in a friendly home space not under siege. OR Draw and discard a card at random from power controlling Antwerp. Add unrest on up to 2 unoccupied spaces from this list: Antwerp, Brussels, Amsterdam, all German and Italian-speaking Hapsburg home spaces.
Place 2 mercs in Ravenna.
OK, played as an event, with the understanding that I will be getting a card draw from the Hapsburgs next turn and 3 mercs from the English.
Finished the German New Testament and converted Nuremberg, Lubeck, Munster, Regensburg, Salzburg, and Bremen.
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Operations
#110: 4 / War with Persia
Message from Protestant:
4 points into german translation, committing Luther for a 5th.
2/5 - German New Testament is completed.
5/5 - German Bible is at 3 CP.
6 Reformation attempts forthcoming.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 7
3
5
3
4
3
5
6
Message from Protestant:
Reformation 1/6, Nuremberg.
5 adjacent spaces (Leipzig, Kassel, Mainz, Worms, Augsburg)
2 adjacent stacks (Mainz, Augsburg)
=
7 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
6
5
5
2
Message from Protestant:
Nuremberg converts.
Reformation 2/6, Lubeck.
3 adjacent spaces (Magdeburg, Brandenburg, Stettin)
1 adjacent stack (Brandenburg)
=
4 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
6
2
1
Message from Protestant:
Lubeck converts.
Reformation 3/6, Munster.
2 adjacent spaces (Koln, Kassel)
1 adjacent stack (Koln)
=
3 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
5
6
4
Message from Protestant:
Munster converts.
Reformation 4/6, Regensburg.
2 adjacent spaces (Nuremberg, Augsburg).
1 adjacent stack (Augsburg).
=
3 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
5
6
6
Message from Protestant:
Regensburg converts.
Reformation 5/6, Salzburg.
2 adjacent spaces (Augsburg, Regensburg).
1 adjacent stack (Augsburg).
=
3 Protestant dice.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
4
6
Message from Protestant:
Salzburg converts.
Reformation 6/6, Bremen.
2 adjacent spaces (Munster, Brunswick).
=
2 Protestant dice.
Habbaku is up.
:mad:
You converted six out of six? This cannot, and will not stand!
Holy shit. I didn't even get a roll!
Ottomans play Shipbuilding as event to raise 2 new squadrons to Coron.
I'm out of cards, so I will go ahead and post my winter (and anyone planning on passing the rest of the turn should also post their winter when they can).
Ottoman winter :
1 cavalry from Sofia to Salonika.
1 regular from Salonika to Istanbul.
1 cavalry from Nezh to Istanbul.
6 regulars and both leaders from Belgrade to Istanbul.
Del is up, no matter what Habbaku sent in his email.
Quote from: Delirium on April 16, 2009, 12:20:49 PM
You converted six out of six?
Makes up for my earlier 1 of 4. :bleeding:
Quote from: ulmont on April 16, 2009, 12:27:14 PM
Quote from: Delirium on April 16, 2009, 12:20:49 PM
You converted six out of six?
Makes up for my earlier 1 of 4. :bleeding:
You're doing an amazing protestant zerg rush so just STFU with the whining :P
I placed a colony and a merc in Valladolid.
England is up.
Why would you place a colony in a major city? Seems rather counter-productive.
<_<
England: Play Card as Operations
#70: 4 / Charles Bourbon
Message from England:
1/4 Hit Edinburgh again
4/4 Place Colony
No board access at the moment again. Could someone roll this for me please?
Already did it. England won with no losses. I'll make a file shortly.
File out. Berkut's Papacy is up.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 16, 2009, 02:25:12 PM
Already did it. England won with no losses. I'll make a file shortly.
:yeah:
Quote from: Habbaku on April 16, 2009, 01:59:48 PM
Why would you place a colony in a major city? Seems rather counter-productive.
:lol:...... :lmfao:
Quote from: Habbaku on April 16, 2009, 02:27:36 PM
File out. Berkut's Papacy is up.
Or possibly Tamas's French.
Oh, whatever.
Quote from: Delirium on April 15, 2009, 03:32:35 PM
I think the wise choice of the French bodes well for Europe. I am willing to offer you a card draw next turn if the English do so as well, with the caveat that if it's a certain Shcmamalaka league you draw, you must play it first impulse.
Not to butt in on your game, but that is a proviso, not a caveat. :nerd:
I play my home card for my chateau(?) VP.
Unless something unexpected, I am going to pass all the way. I dont really need any winter move, except for my fleets going back to Rouen.
I will play my remaining home card for St. Petes.
Quote from: grumbler on April 16, 2009, 06:10:01 PM
Not to butt in on your game, but that is a proviso, not a caveat. :nerd:
Ah. Apologies.
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 12:35:54 AM
I will play my remaining home card for St. Petes.
That puts Ulmont up.
Guess Luther can move the French chateau and Papal St Petes markers in his move file.
I assume the Pope is gathering strength to start a kick-ass counter-reformation next turn?
I'm going to play my home card to pull back treachery and hold it. Will send out a board if no one gets there first. Del I guess is up.
:mad:
Who played Treachery this turn?
I pass. England is up.
Quote from: Delirium on April 17, 2009, 01:08:11 AM
I assume the Pope is gathering strength to start a kick-ass counter-reformation next turn?
Counter-reformation never works. I am just going to take over Italy instead.
Quote from: ulmont on April 17, 2009, 01:15:39 AM
I'm going to play my home card to pull back treachery and hold it. Will send out a board if no one gets there first. Del I guess is up.
Did you send out a file or do you want me to do it?
No need for it, really. Ehrie can handle it.
Ehrie, please adjust the French chateaux VP by +1 and the St. Peter's CPs by 3 when you do your new file/turn.
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 01:34:37 AM
Counter-reformation never works. I am just going to take over Italy instead.
I'm slightly concerned with the ahistorical thinking of Pope Berkster VII.
Del, I played Treachery as my Diet card earlier in the turn.
England: Play Card as Operations
#30: 2 / Tercios
Message from England:
Send an Explorer
File Sent. Winter is Henry and his three merc buddies back to London.
Papacy has no winter either.
Hapsburgs still have 2 cards, and the Prots and French have 1. Is everyone passing the turn at this point?
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 09:11:09 AM
Hapsburgs still have 2 cards, and the Prots and French have 1. Is everyone passing the turn at this point?
Yes. Del passed, Ehrie is out of cards now, Tamas said he was passing, Berkut is out of cards, I pass, Habbaku is out of cards, so that's the action phase over.
I will do the file, but someone else needs to do the ACTS card stuff. Not me. No way, no how.
Quote from: ehrie on April 17, 2009, 08:58:30 AM
England: Play Card as Operations
#30: 2 / Tercios
Message from England:
Send an Explorer
File Sent. Winter is Henry and his three merc buddies back to London.
Fleets to Calais?
Winters:
Ottomans:
1 cavalry from Sofia to Salonika.
1 regular from Salonika to Istanbul.
1 cavalry from Nezh to Istanbul.
6 regulars and both leaders from Belgrade to Istanbul.
Hapsburgs:
????
England:
3 mercenaries and Henry from Edinburgh to London.
France:
Fleets to Rouen, no other winter.
Papacy: none
So if Del could kindly give us his winter?
Protestant: none
Still need a Hapsburg winter
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 09:16:58 AM
I will do the file, but someone else needs to do the ACTS card stuff. Not me. No way, no how.
Ok, after you send out the file, I'll do the New World phase and then get the cards set up.
And an Ottoman as well, actually.
Quote from: ulmont on April 17, 2009, 09:20:13 AM
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 09:16:58 AM
I will do the file, but someone else needs to do the ACTS card stuff. Not me. No way, no how.
Ok, after you send out the file, I'll do the New World phase and then get the cards set up.
I am doing the winter/new world/ and such. You just setup the card draws in ACTS.
Please :P
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 09:21:15 AM
And an Ottoman as well, actually.
Habbaku gave us his winter already:
Ottomans:
1 cavalry from Sofia to Salonika.
1 regular from Salonika to Istanbul.
1 cavalry from Nezh to Istanbul.
6 regulars and both leaders from Belgrade to Istanbul.
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 09:21:50 AM
I am doing the winter/new world/ and such. You just setup the card draws in ACTS.
Please :P
Yup. As soon as I know about any new world fun.
Are we rolling for explorers, or just using the CB random draw function?
Screw it, I am just drawing them from the random tray. You can all trust me. Probably.
Explorers are Cartier (3), Rut(1), and Navarez(-1). We will roll in that order.
Papacy: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
2
3
Message from Papacy:
Cartier explores, +3
Great lakes.
Papacy: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
3
4
Message from Papacy:
Rut,+1
St. Lawrence River
Papacy: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
6
2
Message from Papacy:
Navarez, -1
Finds nothing and doesn't even have the deceny to get himself killed.
Papacy: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
3
4
Message from Papacy:
Hapsburg conq is Pizarro, gets a +3
Aztecs
Papacy: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
6
3
6
3
6
5
Message from Papacy:
English colony
Hapsburg colony
Aztecs
+1 English card
+2 Hapsburg cards.
That ends the winter and turn 2 prep, file is forthcoming.
Hand sizes for turn 2:
Ottoman: 4 from keys, 0 from Suleiman, 0 saved, 0 bonus = 4.
Hapsburgs: 5 from keys, 0 from Charles, 2 saved, 2 bonus = 9.
England: 3 from keys, 1 from Henry, 0 saved, 1 bonus = 5.
France: 3 from keys, 1 from Francis, 1 saved, 0 bonus = 5.
Papacy: 3 from keys, 0 from Clement, 0 saved, 0 bonus = 3.
Protestant: 4 default, 0 from Luther, 1 saved, 0 bonus = 5.
Turn has ended, diplomacy begins.
Aww, yeah. Reversion to the mean with a vengeance!
Let the diplomacy begin!
I say we give it until Tuesday, since maybe people will be away for the weekend.
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 10:25:27 AM
Let the diplomacy begin!
I say we give it until Tuesday, since maybe people will be away for the weekend.
Sounds reasonable.
My Winter is Charles, 1+3 to Besancon, and the lone guy in Germany to Vienna.
Del, you should probably send out a new file with your winter, since you are the only one who wasn't done. Don't forget your fleets.
And while I appreciate the card, it actually happens as a result of the diplomatic phase - it should not be in my hand yet.
Gave the Pope his due as well. Commencing diplomacy now.
Hmm, I won't get to it until 3 or 4 hours from now. Fleets to Gibraltar if anyone else feels up to it, otherwise I'll do it tonight when I get back.
Okay, what do we do now, can you give it back?
Yeah, I just gave it back.
The file update can actually wait until SDs and such.
The Protestants will be glad to know that despite our best efforts, the French refuse to end the war on reasonable terms, instead electing to prosecute a distracting struggle that only serves Luther and his minions.
We regret that this places the Kings mortal soul in peril, and we may be required to react appropriately, regardless of our desire for peace and our desperate pleas for the same.
Quote from: Berkut on April 17, 2009, 11:53:44 AM
The Protestants will be glad to know that despite our best efforts, the French refuse to end the war on reasonable terms, instead electing to prosecute a distracting struggle that only serves Luther and his minions.
:hug:
Quote from: Delirium on April 17, 2009, 11:04:54 AM
My Winter is Charles, 1+3 to Besancon, and the lone guy in Germany to Vienna.
Where are your naval squadrons going? That is important.
Quote from: ulmont on April 17, 2009, 09:21:52 AM
Habbaku gave us his winter already
Indeed, I was first to post it.
Big, bold letters aren't enough for some people. Next time, I will raise the font level for our elderly players.
What the Pope is doing is insane. I call for white peace.
What is the Pope doing that's so insane?
I do believe that a white peace is reasonable in these troubled times and will speak to Pope Berk VII in private to learn his feelings on the matter.
Why would a white peace be reasonable? What does the Papacy gain from ending the war with France?
Quote from: Delirium on April 17, 2009, 11:09:49 AMHmm, I won't get to it until 3 or 4 hours from now. Fleets to Gibraltar if anyone else feels up to it, otherwise I'll do it tonight when I get back.
See? Bold letters are everyone's friend.
A white peace is simply not possible. Why would I do that?
Quote from: Habbaku on April 18, 2009, 12:36:44 AM
Why would a white peace be reasonable? What does the Papacy gain from ending the war with France?
Hmm, I may have wrongly assumed that our own empire was included in the deal for a white peace, and as I offered a white peace with France, and will not back down from my word I will agree to peace. However, it was with the understanding that all three countries would be included.
I will not conclude a separate peace though, unless the Pope wills me to.
Quote from: Berkut on April 18, 2009, 12:41:59 AM
A white peace is simply not possible. Why would I do that?
You have no reason to. I offered him white peace early in the turn.
Uhh yeah, you might want to bring me in on those kinds of offers.
There is no real downside to me being at war with France, and plenty of potential upside. Converserly, for France, there is no upside to being at war with me, and plenty or downside. So why would I just give him peace for nothing?
I made him a extremely reasonable offer, and he refused.
I will get that card out of him one way or another. :pope:
I apologize to His Holiness (although it was made public here in the thread).
Will His Holiness allow me to make peace with France, or do you wish me to continue the war?
Quote from: Delirium on April 18, 2009, 12:53:20 AM
I apologize to His Holiness (although it was made public here in the thread).
Will His Holiness allow me to make peace with France, or do you wish me to continue the war?
I have no issue with you making peace.
Excellent.
My Winter is now in a file near you.
Okay, I need some opinions. I made no secret of the fact that I held the Shcamalalkalsd leage last turn and it was one of the two cards I saved. However, as was pointed out, it is a Mandatory Event and cannot be held. On the other hand, it says it must be played for the event, which cannot happen turn 1, so I thought it was excepted.
Would be much easier if the card wasn't added to the deck until turn 2, but since the Protties rarely have 12 spaces turn 1, I guess it's usually not an issue.
The question is what to do in this game. I could hold it, or discard it and draw another, or discard it and assign a chance of someone drawing it this turn, around 30 in 110.
Ulmont's opinion will carry a bit more weight on this, I think. I am of the mind that either we just assume the Habsburgs drew it (being able to draw it turn 1, but not hold it or play it as event is very weird) or roll a die to settle the matter.
It is an anomaly. I posted on Consimworld as well.
If indeed the Schalmalkedic Leauge gets to stay in Habsburg hands this turn, I welcome white peace with them, as a gesture of good will and common effort to stop the monster which is growing in germany.
Quote from: Delirium on April 18, 2009, 01:26:57 AM
Okay, I need some opinions. I made no secret of the fact that I held the Shcamalalkalsd leage last turn and it was one of the two cards I saved. However, as was pointed out, it is a Mandatory Event and cannot be held. On the other hand, it says it must be played for the event, which cannot happen turn 1, so I thought it was excepted.
What normally happens if the League is drawn on turn 2 or 3 but the Protestants have less than 12 spaces...it seems like it should be the same result here?
...from looking at the text of the League card, it appears that if it is drawn on turn 2 or 3 but the Protestants have less than 12 spaces, it will fire as a mandatory event but will have no effect.
In that case, I think you should roll to see if you keep it (drew it on turn 2) and discard if you don't succeed. Figure out roughly what the odds of anybody drawing the League were this turn and use that.
Quote from: Ulmont, at ConsimworldEd: So presumably if drawn turn 1, it plays like if drawn on turns 2-3 with the Protestants converting 11 or less provinces, i.e., must be played, gives only 2 CP, and then is reshuffled?
Quote from: Ed Beach, at ConsimworldCorrect.
I calculate the odds of somebody drawing the League this turn as approximately 45%. There were 27 draws and there were only 60 cards left in the deck, I believe. Others can feel free to correct my math.
So Del, roll a percentile and if you get 45 or less keep the card, else discard it and draw another, IMO.
You return all discards to the deck and re-shuffle before dealing new cards, so it can't be more than 30%. I'll roll and see if there's need for detailed calculation.
Edit: dammit, I rolled 26. Counting up cards now.
Edit: actually, 43 out of 110 cards are not available, either being home cards, turn or event specified. So it's 27 in 67 of someone drawing it this turn, so the 26 means somebody drew it. But we still don't know if I drew it, in all fairness it could have ended up in the Protestant's hand, meaning it wouldn't get played until late in the turn.
Cards drawn this turn:
Ottomans 4
Habsburgs 7
England 4
France 5
Pope 3
Protestants 4
Assigning a percentage chance to each of the six powers, in this order, I'll roll a d100.
The roll of 60 means France drew the card. Again, if we want to be strict about this, France should discard a card randomly, get Schlamlalam league from me and then I draw another card.
Or we could assume France would play the card early and just go on with me having the card in my hand. I "lose" 2 cp last turn for not playing it, and I'm "forced" to use one action for the play of the card this round even though it's not "in my hand". Probably sufficient penalty for me, but the card still gets played this turn.
Other opinions?
And I guess I'm done with diplomacy. After we solve the SL question, I'm for moving on.
Quote from: Delirium on April 19, 2009, 05:43:47 AM
And I guess I'm done with diplomacy. After we solve the SL question, I'm for moving on.
I am still waiting answers from England and Ottomans, but I hereby offer a white peace for Habsburgs.
Quote from: Delirium on April 19, 2009, 05:22:03 AM
You return all discards to the deck and re-shuffle before dealing new cards, so it can't be more than 30%. I'll roll and see if there's need for detailed calculation.
Yes, it can. There were only 60 cards available...the 67 you identified, less the 4 in people's hands, less 3 events already played and removed from the deck.
The first draw has a 59 / 60 chance of *not* being the league, the second draw (if the first is not the league) has a 58 / 59 chance of *not* being the league, the third has a 57 / 58 chance, and so forth, so the final chances of no one drawing the league are:
59 * 58 * ... * 34 * 33 / 60 * 59 * ... * 35 * 34, or about 45%.
But this is irrelevant. The League can stay in your hand, let's move on.
I felt my second edit made it clear I was wrong about the percentage in the original post, so you didn't really have to do the numbers. ;)
But as you said, it's irrelevant.
Quote from: Tamas on April 19, 2009, 07:06:32 AMI am still waiting answers from England and Ottomans, but I hereby offer a white peace for Habsburgs.
I believe we declare our offers formally in initiative order, so we'll have to wait a day or two. You can assume I will make the same offer though.
So I see I still can't reply to PMs. Sigh. I will have no diplo to announce this turn, with the exceptino of granting the Pope 3 Mercs as promised.
Ottomans have no diplomacy.
Ottomans also have no new DoWs.
Ottoman spring deployment :
Suleiman, 3 regulars and 1 cavalry spring deploy to Belgrade.
Our Empire offers France a white peace. We offer an alliance to Pope Berk VII and wish to borrow his fleet. We also give His Holyness a card from our hand.
Spring deployment: Ferdinand, 4+1 to Salzburg.
We seem to be in order of declarations re:diplomacy here, England has nothing to declare, France seems to have gotten their answers from the English and the Ottomans. Does Tamas have anything else, besides the aforementioned white peace?
Oh, and feel free to post your Spring Deployments, folks.
Well, actually I would like to see the DOW phase before my SD.
I will have no Spring Deployment as well.
Unsurprisingly, the Protestants will have no Diplo, DoWs, or SD, although I do expect to be at war sometime around the first Hapsburg impulse.
I was thinking it would be fair play to defer Schmallkaesj to my second impulse (since it was "assigned" to France's hand, and they play after me). I know it's self-imposed, but my conscience will be clean. :smarty:
So Pope Berkut wants to see France's final diplomacy before announcing his own. Everyone else have announced their shit, so Tamas and Berk can take care of their business, then we proceed. Oh, and His Holyness will get a card from my own humble person.
Diplo is easy, I will pretend I go before France:
I announce an alliance with the Hapsburgs, the loan of the papal fleets to the same, and a card from the hapsburgs.
I will accept a card draw AND a white peace with the French.
SD must wait until I find out if the Ottomans are going to declare war, and whether the French are going to accept peace.
I already stated that I have no wars to declare.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 20, 2009, 02:59:00 PM
I already stated that I have no wars to declare.
You have to use the big font and bold, remember.
And preferrably shiny colours as well.
So now we're only waiting for Tamas. :frog:
Quote from: Habbaku on April 20, 2009, 02:59:00 PM
I already stated that I have no wars to declare.
Wimp.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 20, 2009, 02:59:00 PM
I already stated that I have no wars to declare.
True, but you tend to lie a lot.
Pope - Infidel 1-0
I am now reconsidering my peaceful ways.
Quote from: Delirium on April 20, 2009, 03:02:54 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 20, 2009, 02:59:00 PM
I already stated that I have no wars to declare.
Wimp.
He doesn't need to pay to DoW the Hapsburgs. :contract:
I know, I know. :(
My first play has been filed and sent out.
Ottoman: Play Card as Operations
Quote#93: 3 / Revolt in Ireland
Message from Ottoman:
CPs :
1/3 - Naval move. 3 Aegean-border squadrons to Aegean Sea. 2 squadrons in Coron to Ionian Sea, Barbarossa and 2 corsairs to Barbary Coast.
2-3/3 - Naval transport Ibrahim and 5 regulars to Rhodes. Rhodes besieged.
Del's up whenever the French/Papacy get their stuff together.
OK, my SD is 2 mercs from Ravenna to modena
Quote from: Habbaku on April 20, 2009, 03:13:54 PM
Del's up whenever the French/Papacy get their stuff together.
The card draw is pretty important as well.
Quote from: Delirium on April 20, 2009, 03:19:39 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 20, 2009, 03:13:54 PM
Del's up whenever the French/Papacy get their stuff together.
The card draw is pretty important as well.
:huh: So what are you waiting for? Give him the card.
I tried to before, guess it could potentially affect his diplomacy. I'm fine with handing it over now.
Diplomacy's practically over. They cannot discuss anything else between themselves. Since Tamas has no way of seeing what card you're giving to Berkut, there is practically zero effect on whether they sign a peace deal or not.
Actually, I need to wait until I here from Tamas before I take a card. It could change everything.
:rolleyes:
<_<
Okay, thought I was clear to play my first impulse, ignore it then. And Berk should give back the card he got.
Quote from: Delirium on April 20, 2009, 03:35:17 PM
<_<
Okay, thought I was clear to play my first impulse, ignore it then.
I was kidding.
England is up.
:cry:
Swedes are easily confused.
After some messing about on ACTS, Suleiman needs to decide which troops to send to Egypt.
Also, the merc in Vienna should be in Salzburg, my SD was Ferdy and 4+1.
Easier if Habs does a file himself I guess.
Del, are you sure you speak English? Do we need to get Kenny to take over for you?
Bah, learn to count my troops instead! And remove yours!
Quote from: Berkut on April 20, 2009, 03:15:13 PM
OK, my SD is 2 mercs from Ravenna to modena
Spring deployment must always be from your capital. Rome is your capital. Ravenna is a shitty, third-world hellhole.
Given the card I got from Del, I am going to withdraw my offer of peace with France.
:face:
I fixed the Revolt in Egypt play. Things like that should be played as Active Events, not just "events".
Given the number of times I played the card I felt it would count as "active".
File sent to deal with the revolt as well as a corrected Habsburg SD.
Papacy still needs to rejigger their SD and France still needs to come to terms with its own SD and a potential peace with the Pope.
Meanwhile, unless Ehrie thinks that stuff will affect him, England is up.
Quote from: Berkut on April 20, 2009, 03:44:42 PM
Given the card I got from Del, I am going to withdraw my offer of peace with France.
Perfectly legal play.
QuoteAnnouncements can be made as individual items, or as a group of agreements that need to be ratified together. All powers involved in an agreement that follow later in Impulse Order must confirm all the contents of this declaration when it is their turn in the Impulse Order. If they do not confirm the full deal, NONE of the items in the agreement take effect. If the agreement is confirmed by all parties, the players immediately change the game state by updating diplomatic status, marking and moving loaned naval squadrons, returning army leaders, changing political control of spaces, drawing random cards, and exchanging mercenaries.
You guys talk way too much. So whats up with me and Schalmalkaldic leauge?
And no, I am not going to be robbed for making a favor for the Pope. So no peace. BTW the Pope like has no fleets now, correct?
Quote from: Tamas on April 20, 2009, 04:02:44 PM
You guys talk way too much. So whats up with me and Schalmalkaldic leauge?
In some alternate universe where Del didn't fuck up his play of the League turn 1, you would have drawn it on turn 2. For now, no difference, it stays in Del's hand.
Quote from: Tamas on April 20, 2009, 04:02:44 PM
And no, I am not going to be robbed for making a favor for the Pope. So no peace. BTW the Pope like has no fleets now, correct?
Correct.
Nope, no fleets. You should invade.
I think we excel in talking.
Seems everything is in order, except Berk's SD. Then it's England.
No SD. I have to defend Rome from the suddenly incredibly aggressive French.
You can see the lie of his claim to desire a "white peace".
Oops, I thought France had said they had no SD, they should get a chance to declare SD right before yours.
My SD: Francis, 4 regulars, 3 mercs from Paris to Grenoble (IIRC I cant SD through passes)
Good. Ehrie, please perform France's spring when you do your own file.
Quote from: Tamas on April 20, 2009, 04:16:12 PM
My SD: Francis, 4 regulars, 3 mercs from Paris to Grenoble (IIRC I cant SD through passes)
You also cannot SD with more troops than your leader can command.
Quote from: Berkut on April 20, 2009, 04:18:27 PM
Quote from: Tamas on April 20, 2009, 04:16:12 PM
My SD: Francis, 4 regulars, 3 mercs from Paris to Grenoble (IIRC I cant SD through passes)
You also cannot SD with more troops than your leader can command.
Lucky me then, Francis can command 8.
:D
Foiled!
The Pope is in a facetious mood.
What did you call me? :mad:
Jolly? Gay? Merry?
Quote from: Berkut on April 20, 2009, 04:27:26 PM
What did you call me? :mad:
"Full of shit," I think. ;)
England?
Morocco.
Holiday?
Santa?
Communist?
Again, waiting for England. :bowler:
England: Play Card as Operations
#89: 3 / Pirate Haven
Message from England:
1/3 1 Merc to London
3/3 Mark those two Scottish spaces. Don't have access to to a board right now, so no file, can France put my turn into it please?
Also, Tamas, please take 3 English mercs from London and place them as 3 Papal mercs in Rome.
France: Play Card as Operations
#69: 3 / Auld Alliance
Message from France:
Move Francis and 4+3 from Grenoble to Milan
Last chance, Pope: if you move against Florence, I will take that as an act of truce between us.
Quote from: Tamas on April 21, 2009, 10:00:33 AM
France: Play Card as Operations
#69: 3 / Auld Alliance
Message from France:
Move Francis and 4+3 from Grenoble to Milan
Last chance, Pope: if you move against Florence, I will take that as an act of truce between us.
:boggle:
You move a number of troops into Italy that can have no purpose other than to try to attack me, and then start talking about a
truce while the Protestants are running rampant?
Did ehrie hack your account or something?
I am defending Milan and showing you that I mean business. I will get peace from you this turn, but I would rather do it CP-free for both of us.
Wonderful. You sure have shown me that you mean business.
Papacy: Play Card as Event
#13: 2 / Schmalkaldic League
Message from Papacy:
ONCE ONLY MANDATORY EVENT If 12 or more spaces are currently under Protestant religious influence or this is the Winter Phase of Turn 4, the Protestant defense league is formed as specified in 21.6. Protestant spaces in unrest count toward the total of 12. Remove from deck once defense league is formed. If drawn on Turn 5 or later, immediately play and draw replacement
2/2: Build a regular in Rome.
I am going to be a while before I can get the file out with the League formation and such, probably this afternoon sometime.
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 10:44:09 AM
I am going to be a while before I can get the file out with the League formation and such, probably this afternoon sometime.
I sent a file around. I also corrected Zurich's religious status (Zwingli auto-converts it when he comes in), although I forgot to account for my electorate VP.
Everybody take a look, and if that file looks sane I'll go ahead and play.
The file's fine, except that the war between France and the Habsburgs should be ended, now that I look up there.
You should play regardless.
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Event
#84: 1 / Julia Gonzaga
If Barbary Pirates has been played, award the Julia Gonzaga marker (1 bonus VP) to the Ottoman player if Piracy later this turn in the Tyrrhenian Sea scores a hit. Remove from deck if played as event.
And let me gently try and guide the Sultan's target a bit, or at least get this worthless card out of my hand.
The exceptional guidance proves useful, methinks...
QuoteOttoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
6
5
Message from Ottoman:
No anti-piracy dice since the Habsburgs aren't at war with me and there are no Papal squadrons that aren't on loan within the zone.
I only get two dice, however, since there is only 1 port to target.
2 hits. The Papacy have no squadrons to offer up to the corsair gods, so they must either award cards or VPs. I'll assume 2 VPs (on top of the Gozaga VP). Julia goes off to the harem...
My last CP was spent assaulting the Knights, which failed with no hits to either side.
Habsburgs are up.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 21, 2009, 11:47:34 AM
The exceptional guidance proves useful, methinks...
QuoteOttoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
6
5
Message from Ottoman:
No anti-piracy dice since the Habsburgs aren't at war with me and there are no Papal squadrons that aren't on loan within the zone.
I only get two dice, however, since there is only 1 port to target.
2 hits. The Papacy have no squadrons to offer up to the corsair gods, so they must either award cards or VPs. I'll assume 2 VPs (on top of the Gozaga VP). Julia goes off to the harem...
I suggest Berk denies you those VPs!
Nice game you have there, except for Schmalklandic League faux pas. :nerd:
Quote from: Tamas on April 21, 2009, 11:57:37 AM
Quote from: Habbaku on April 21, 2009, 11:47:34 AM
The exceptional guidance proves useful, methinks...
QuoteOttoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
6
5
Message from Ottoman:
No anti-piracy dice since the Habsburgs aren't at war with me and there are no Papal squadrons that aren't on loan within the zone.
I only get two dice, however, since there is only 1 port to target.
2 hits. The Papacy have no squadrons to offer up to the corsair gods, so they must either award cards or VPs. I'll assume 2 VPs (on top of the Gozaga VP). Julia goes off to the harem...
I suggest Berk denies you those VPs!
Yeah, right. I would, but the French seem to be intent on dancing to the Protestant and Ottoman drummer, so I don't really have much choice.
I am rather astounded that the Protestants would just give the Ottomans a VP though.
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 02:08:53 PM
I am rather astounded that the Protestants would just give the Ottomans a VP though.
I'm kind of screwed until you (or, more importantly, Delirium) realize that the Ottomans are a bigger threat than the Protestants.
So...Go Sultan!
Quote from: Tamas on April 21, 2009, 10:00:33 AM
France: Play Card as Operations
#69: 3 / Auld Alliance
Message from France:
Move Francis and 4+3 from Grenoble to Milan
Last chance, Pope: if you move against Florence, I will take that as an act of truce between us.
It sure is a good thing you didn't go and waste a card getting a peace with me.
Quote from: ulmont on April 21, 2009, 02:10:39 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 02:08:53 PM
I am rather astounded that the Protestants would just give the Ottomans a VP though.
I'm kind of screwed until you (or, more importantly, Delirium) realize that the Ottomans are a bigger threat than the Protestants.
So...Go Sultan!
Oh shush, you have the French dancing to your tune, and in turn you are dancing to Habs tune. It isn't exactly surprising, but you know how it will end.
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 02:13:28 PM
It isn't exactly surprising, but you know how it will end.
Quote from: ulmont on April 10, 2009, 02:02:47 PM
what's going to happen is that the League is going to go down, Del is going to start raping me, and then Habbaku is going to take Suleiman to Vienna and victory.
Yeah.
I am always amazed in HiS that people so consistently play the game so poorly because they react emotionally to diplomacy, rather than realizing that the calculus of the game is relatively straightforward.
I saw a Hapsburg player burn an entire turns worth of cards taking Antwerp back because the English player refused to give it back without a formal peace and a VP or card. He literally spent probably 25 or more CPs taking back a city he could have gotten for a 3CP card.
Habs won that damn game as the Ottomans as well.
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 02:50:10 PM
I am always amazed in HiS that people so consistently play the game so poorly because they react emotionally to diplomacy, rather than realizing that the calculus of the game is relatively straightforward.
Well, if not for the emotional diplomacy option, wouldn't the game just come down to dice rolls?
Quote from: ulmont on April 21, 2009, 02:51:53 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 02:50:10 PM
I am always amazed in HiS that people so consistently play the game so poorly because they react emotionally to diplomacy, rather than realizing that the calculus of the game is relatively straightforward.
Well, if not for the emotional diplomacy option, wouldn't the game just come down to dice rolls?
Not at all. Emotional diplomacy is not the only kind of diplomacy.
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 02:57:06 PM
Not at all. Emotional diplomacy is not the only kind of diplomacy.
Right. But if everyone is employing rational diplomacy, you end up with a continued coalition against the then-leader until (wait for it) dice rolls and cards determine the winner.
Quote from: ulmont on April 21, 2009, 02:58:18 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 02:57:06 PM
Not at all. Emotional diplomacy is not the only kind of diplomacy.
Right. But if everyone is employing rational diplomacy, you end up with a continued coalition against the then-leader until (wait for it) dice rolls and cards determine the winner.
That would be the case if everyone engage in perfect unemotional diplomacy.
But there is enough give and take even within rational diplomacy for plenty of variability, especially when you through in the randomness of dice rolls and cards that change the fundamental direction of the game.
And honestly, people should be playing "stomp the leader". That is the beauty of HiS - I've never played any game that is so focused on keeping other from winning, rather than just trying to win yourself (depending on who you are playing of course).
You know what it is called when people rationally play to keep the person in the lead from winning?
A long, fun, close game.
Besides, then you get the fun of the diplomacy becoming everyone trying to convince everyone else that someone other than themselves are winning.
Quote from: Berkut on April 21, 2009, 03:04:28 PM
everyone trying to convince everyone else that someone other than themselves are winning.
Giving a VP to the Ottomans seems like the easiest way to be convincing on that score. :lmfao:
Berk, all you had to do is leaving me alone to preserve your military power and CPs to deal with Protestants and Ottoman piracy. Yet, despite all those odds against you, you kept being stubborn and wanting me to pay tribute.
I am not going to help a rival stay strong without me gaining anything.
It was you practicing emotional diplomacy, not me.
Tamas, so far, in order to avoid giving up a card, you've spent a card and used your spring deployment - and you still have the exact same problem that you started with. Before it is over, you will have spent much more than 1 card to get out of the war you start the game in.
This is exactly what I mean - you cannot see how you are "not gaining anything", but of course you are gaining something - you are getting out of the war and not having to burn even more cards sending your entire army to Milan and ending the risk of excommunication. You have already spent more than I asked for!
All you are doing now is giving the Protestants cards instead of me. You are making the classic gaming mistake of reacting to a perfectly reasonable and rational offer with your ego instead of your brain. "What? Me give you a card? NEVER!!!"
I rarely comment on other players' behaviour, but I have to say that just handing the Ottomans a gratuitous vp just because you want them to appear in the lead is pretty weird.
Berk the point you are missing is of course, that onec I defeat you thanks to this extra investment, we won't only make a white peace, so I will not close the deal with a loss. :P
Quote from: Delirium on April 21, 2009, 04:21:06 PM
I rarely comment on other players' behaviour, but I have to say that just handing the Ottomans a gratuitous vp just because you want them to appear in the lead is pretty weird.
Is there a reason you haven't taken your turn yet?
Quote from: Tamas on April 21, 2009, 04:23:26 PMwe won't only make a white peace, so I will not close the deal with a loss.
If you can beat him. I wouldn't bet the farm on that.
Enjoy your excommunication!
File sent. Moved three armies. England is up.
Quote from: Tamas on April 21, 2009, 04:23:26 PM
Berk the point you are missing is of course, that onec I defeat you thanks to this extra investment, we won't only make a white peace, so I will not close the deal with a loss. :P
That would be a reasonable position if you thought that was your plan all along - of course, if that was the case, you would never have offered the white peace.
But in any case, I accept the truce offer, and will be moving on Florence shortly.
Been thinking about the Protestant strategy, does it mean that the more Protestants I kill, the more Luther will help the Ottomans win behind my back?
And England is still up.
England: Message
Home Card to ask for divorce, oh pweety please Mr pope sir mister.
On to the French.
This French-Papacy War Sure looks like fun. Hey, whoever gets me my divorce I can give a card to this turn. A combat Card at that. Might turn the tide a bit.
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 02:21:27 AM
Been thinking about the Protestant strategy, does it mean that the more Protestants I kill, the more Luther will help the Ottomans win behind my back?
More like in front of you, but yes. Perhaps you could start fighting the real threats and ignore poor Luther.
Heh, this turn I've played two cards, one to attack two electorates of yours, the second as a hostile event against the Ottomans. As I'm not at war with the Ottomans there seems little else I can do at the moment, or do you have suggestions? If so, I'm ready to listen to them if it means you'll stop giving away victory points unnecessarily.
Quote from: ulmont on April 22, 2009, 10:16:47 AM
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 02:21:27 AM
Been thinking about the Protestant strategy, does it mean that the more Protestants I kill, the more Luther will help the Ottomans win behind my back?
More like in front of you, but yes. Perhaps you could start fighting the real threats and ignore poor Luther.
Are you competing with tamas to see who can make more nonsensical plays?
"Don't try to stop me from winning or I will throw the game to someone else!"
Really - come on. It's turn 2.
Quote from: ehrie on April 22, 2009, 10:16:22 AM
This French-Papacy War Sure looks like fun. Hey, whoever gets me my divorce I can give a card to this turn. A combat Card at that. Might turn the tide a bit.
I am pretty sure France cannot get you a divorce, so I would guess you are talking to me.
Could you be a bit more specific?
I assume he's talking about a response card, since I'm pretty sure you can't play battle cards on other players.
I'm also pretty sure there's no response card that's worth a divorce in itself.
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 12:01:14 PM
I assume he's talking about a response card, since I'm pretty sure you can't play battle cards on other players.
I'm also pretty sure there's no response card that's worth a divorce in itself.
I am playing emotionally now, so who knows?
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 11:35:58 AM
As I'm not at war with the Ottomans there seems little else I can do at the moment, or do you have suggestions?
Well, buggering off out of my electorates would be the preferred move, unsurprisingly.
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 11:51:49 AM
Are you competing with tamas to see who can make more nonsensical plays?
It's the chicken steering wheel strategy.
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 12:01:14 PM
I'm also pretty sure there's no response card that's worth a divorce in itself.
Probably not, although the zap all mercenaries event is always fun.
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 12:01:14 PM
I'm also pretty sure there's no response card that's worth a divorce in itself.
Indeed, unless a mental cripple were to be playing the Papacy. I find that this is something that new players just don't get, though--they think the divorce is worth a card draw or a token favor and so bargain accordingly.
Then they get pissed off when people that know the actual value of it refuse to grant it for anything below the real cost...
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 12:04:08 PM
I am playing emotionally now, so who knows?
Right now, you're not playing at all. Which is strange, since it's your turn.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 12:07:09 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 12:04:08 PM
I am playing emotionally now, so who knows?
Right now, you're not playing at all. Which is strange, since it's your turn.
Or possibly Tamas's French.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 12:06:21 PM
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 12:01:14 PM
I'm also pretty sure there's no response card that's worth a divorce in itself.
Indeed, unless a mental cripple were to be playing the Papacy.
:berkut:
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 12:07:09 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 12:04:08 PM
I am playing emotionally now, so who knows?
Right now, you're not playing at all. Which is strange, since it's your turn.
How in gods name can you confuse me with Tamas?
Quote from: ulmont on April 22, 2009, 12:07:35 PM
Or possibly Tamas's French.
Just making sure someone was paying attention. :goodboy:
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 12:07:39 PM
:berkut:
Where'd you get that sign? Did you steal it? I'm calling Strix. Don't bother getting your gun, I heard he was bulletproof.
And that puts Habs firmly in the lead in the "mixing up the turn order" category!
Quote from: ulmont on April 22, 2009, 12:04:12 PM
Probably not, although the zap all mercenaries event is always fun.
That is a fun event, but it's neither a response card or a "combat card". :smarty:
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 11:51:49 AM
"Don't try to stop me from winning or I will throw the game to someone else!"
That's the universal and only Languish diplomacy strategy I have seen in all of the HIS games. :lol:
Quote from: Tamas on April 22, 2009, 01:22:54 PM
That's the universal and only Languish diplomacy strategy I have seen in all of the HIS games. :lol:
It's your turn.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 01:32:17 PM
Quote from: Tamas on April 22, 2009, 01:22:54 PM
That's the universal and only Languish diplomacy strategy I have seen in all of the HIS games. :lol:
It's your turn.
I know.
France: Play Card as Event
#100: 2 / Shipbuilding
Message from France:
Not playable by Protestant. Add 2 new squadrons in any controlled home port (or 1 squadron in each of two home ports). Ottoman may choose to substitute 2 corsairs for each naval squadron.
One to Rouen, one to Marseille
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 12:08:09 PM
How in gods name can you confuse me with Tamas?
Well altough indeed I am younger, smarter, and more handsome than you, I am also less French, so maybe that's why. :P
Well, I imagine if the French rampage up and down Italy they could make the price of peace an English divocery. However, I could gift you Merc Grow Restless to ensure he can't take any keys from you for the same price via play of the Diplomatic Overture card.
:lol: Yes, France will fight to get England a divorce.
Seeing as Tamas already offered it to me if I helped him in his Italian escapades, laugh all you like heathen. :P
Interesting how that's contingent on the Pope actually being willing to grant such a favor, since there is zero that Tamas can do to actually force the issue.
Good luck.
Play Card as Operations
#85: 3 / Katherina Bora
Message from Papacy:
1/3: Merc in Rome
3/3: 4 mercs from Rome to Florence
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Event
#79: 3 / Fuggers
Message from Protestant:
Drew 2 cards. Habbaku is up.
Quote from: ehrie on April 22, 2009, 01:47:32 PM
Well, I imagine if the French rampage up and down Italy they could make the price of peace an English divocery.
No he couldn't.
QuoteHowever, I could gift you Merc Grow Restless to ensure he can't take any keys from you for the same price via play of the Diplomatic Overture card.
I think that sounds like a great idea - in fact, you should send me the card anyway, so as to screw over your actual rival for power and keep him bogged down in Italy while you take Rouen.
Frankly, his building additional French fleets on the Channel is tantamount to an act of war - they have zero use to him except to attack England.
As far as a divorce is concerned, we can talk about that privately when the time comes, unless you want to make a public deal in respects to the play of Mercs Grow Restless. But while I would certainly not mind some os his mercs dieing, it is not a major issue. If he wants to throw French troops against the Popes fortresses, I am mostly ok with that, so it doesn't have as much value to me as you might think.
Now if you have unsanitary camp, that is a different thing altogether...
Turks play Sebastian Cabot for CPs to assault Rhodes.
QuoteOttoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
4
5
3
6
1
4
Message from Ottoman:
2nd assault of Rhodes.
4 Ottoman vs. 2 Knights, Ottoman first.
The Knights fall without incident.
Habsburgs are up.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 02:14:03 PM
Habsburgs are up.
Fair warning, Del; assault those electorates and prepare for Chuck to be taken by the Protestants.
Quote from: ulmont on April 22, 2009, 02:29:25 PM
Fair warning, Del; assault those electorates and prepare for Chuck to be taken by the Protestants.
Fair warning back; that's impossible. If you play Mercenaries Grow Restless, then the siege will immediately be broken without an assault and Charles (and 1 regular) will be forced to retreat to Metz, where he will be safely ensconced in some nice, defensible walls.
Christ Del! Don't force him to give more VPs to the Ottomans! Don't do it!
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 02:33:36 PM
Christ Del! Don't force him to give more VPs to the Ottomans! Don't do it!
:yes:
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 02:33:26 PM
Fair warning back; that's impossible. If you play Mercenaries Grow Restless, then the siege will immediately be broken without an assault and Charles (and 1 regular) will be forced to retreat to Metz, where he will be safely ensconced in some nice, defensible walls.
It was more in the nature of a threat against Chuck's continued safety rather than a promise to capture him with one response card.
I don't think he's going to be too concerned about that. ;)
Boy, there sure are a lot of unenforceable threats in this game...
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 02:39:11 PM
I don't think he's going to be too concerned about that. ;)
Hope springs eternal.
My fleet building at the Channel is entirely defensive, and all concerned parties know this all too well.
Besides Berk, what if I did squash you and did ask for the english divorce as price of peace? Would not you be rational enough to accept it? :P
Quote from: Tamas on April 22, 2009, 02:53:10 PM
My fleet building at the Channel is entirely defensive, and all concerned parties know this all too well.
Besides Berk, what if I did squash you and did ask for the english divorce as price of peace? Would not you be rational enough to accept it? :P
No, I would be rational enough to say "Here, have a VP and a card draw, and give me all my stuff back have a nice day."
Quote from: ulmont on April 22, 2009, 02:38:13 PM
It was more in the nature of a threat against Chuck's continued safety rather than a promise to capture him with one response card.
Fair enough.
QuotePlay Card as Operations #95: 5 / Sack of Rome
Message from Hapsburgs:
1/5 Assault Trier with Charles. No cards for me.
Cards?
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 04:03:55 PM
Cards?
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Event
#31: 2 / Foul Weather
Message from Protestant:
Hmm, it's been a while, does that mean I have 3 or 4 cp left?
Quote from: Delirium on April 22, 2009, 04:13:10 PM
Hmm, it's been a while, does that mean I have 3 or 4 cp left?
Should be 4.
Quote2 / Foul Weather
RESPONSE Play during another power's impulse just after they have announced they are spending CP to move, assault, initiate piracy, conduct a naval move, or start a naval transport. 1 CP is lost. For the rest of the impulse, no land unit of that power may move more than 1 space; assault, piracy, naval moves, and naval transport are prohibited. All effects last only during this power's impulse. May not be used to stop Treachery! event.
Okay, I'll send out an explorer and a colony for the remaining 4. No file. England is up.
England: Play Card as Operations
#34: 2 / Professional Rowers
Message from England:
Send an Explorer
File coming shortly.
Well I'll either offer a random card draw next turn Mr Popesmith or you can have the Mercs Card now. If you have something else in mind, I'm all ears.
He's not going to grant a divorce for a single card, Ehrie, which is what I've been getting at this whole time.
A divorce's value in CPs averages somewhere near 7.5-8.5, depending on the circumstances on the ground. I guarantee you Berkut isn't going to take your measly offer.
Quote from: ehrie on April 22, 2009, 04:41:54 PM
England: Play Card as Operations
#34: 2 / Professional Rowers
Message from England:
Send an Explorer
File coming shortly.
Well I'll either offer a random card draw next turn Mr Popesmith or you can have the Mercs Card now. If you have something else in mind, I'm all ears.
I am not sure I would accept both, to be honest.
IMO, the fair price for a divorce is somewhere around 2 cards. To be honest (and this is Berkut talking, not the Pope) I think granting a divorce is actually rather harmful to the Pope - not just a matter of it being helpful to you, it is actually detrimental to me since it means an earlier English Reformation.
Lets hold off on the discussion until either I need the mercs card (if Tamas actually attacks) or diplo of next turn.
Me and Habs were actually discussing the divorce, and were wondering if in fact it should ever be given - that perhaps the fair price for the Pope is not really worth it to the English.
Quote from: Berkut on April 22, 2009, 06:38:44 PM
Me and Habs were actually discussing the divorce, and were wondering if in fact it should ever be given - that perhaps the fair price for the Pope is not really worth it to the English.
I think you're right that it should never be granted. It's effectively 5 VP, and there's not really anything England can give to the Pope to make it up.
Quote from: ulmont on April 22, 2009, 06:42:44 PM
I think you're right that it should never be granted. It's effectively 5 VP, and there's not really anything England can give to the Pope to make it up.
Well, not exactly, but it is a huge leap towards getting the 5 VPs, and no one wants that. The French don't want it because the faster The Heir is born, the faster the English are going to sit up and start taking on duties on the continent. The Habsburgs don't want it for the same reasons, albeit to a lesser extent than the French, since they only have Antwerp to lose. The Papacy doesn't want it because it virtually eliminates the possibility (no matter how small) of Mary coming to the throne--and Mary coming to the English throne is a gigantic, potentially even game-winning instance for the Papacy.
The Ottomans, naturally, could care less, other than that it means their best ally (France) is likely to be distracted by England at some point if the divorce does go through.
Speaking of which, France is up.
And I agree, I've seen plenty a (newbie) pope who were all too eager to accept a card for a divorce, not realizing the long-term effects of that deal.
Experienced popes do not make that mistake.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 22, 2009, 02:39:11 PM
I don't think he's going to be too concerned about that. ;)
Boy, there sure are a lot of unenforceable threats in this game...
Well, he did rain on my parade.
France: Play Card as Operations
#91: 3 / Ransom
Message from France:
Create a colony
Tamas, don't send I file, I will add you colony to my file.
Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
5
2
4
3
Message from Papacy:
Playing Liepzig debate for CPs:
2/3: Squadron in Ravenna
3/3: Assault Florence
Florence:
Papacy 2 dice
Indies 2 dice
You emailed around your board instead of the playback, but I've got it.
Doh!
QuoteProtestant Play Card as Operations #105: 5 / Treachery
Message from Protestant:
4/5 CP - recruit 4 mercenaries in Mainz.
5/5 CP - Philip, 1+4 move to Trier.
Protestant Play Card as Event #33: 1 / Landsknechts
Message from Protestant:
and, 2 more Protestant mercs appear in Trier.
Philip, 2+6 would like to talk to Chuck about his urban renewal program. No further cards, and may your dice rolls suck.
I think I've also caught up on the board, since Hapsburgs/English/French sent no file, but have a look.
Del is up to resolve the field battle, but presumably Habs can go if he doesn't really care about the outcome.
The English did send out a file and you missed the Papal squadron built in Ravenna, but I'll fix that.
Meanwhile, my own play :
QuotePlaying Janissaries as event :
1 regular to Nezh.
1 regular to Sofia.
1 regular to Salonika.
1 regular to Nicopolis.
I'm going to pass the remainder of the turn.
OTTOMAN WINTER :
Suleiman and 2 regulars from Belgrade to Istanbul.
Scattered regulars (Nezh, Sofia, Nicopolis) to Istanbul.
Ibrahim and all troops in Rhodes to Istanbul.
Squadrons in Aegean Sea to Coron.
Barbarossa and 2 corsairs from Tyrrhenian Sea to Algiers.
Squadrons in Barbary Coast to Algiers.Habsburgs are up.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 23, 2009, 11:29:28 AM
The English did send out a file
You're right. I just remember that Berk's board he sent out didn't have the English stuff either.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 23, 2009, 11:29:28 AM
and you missed the Papal squadron built in Ravenna, but I'll fix that.
Yay.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 23, 2009, 11:29:28 AM
OTTOMAN WINTER :
You forgot the big font.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 23, 2009, 11:29:28 AM
Habsburgs are up.
And with a field battle to resolve.
I can't figure out your number of units as 2+6, it's either 1+6 or 3+6 or 4+6.
Can you place mercs in a space under siege? Otherwise you're limited to Philip's rating of 6.
Quote from: Delirium on April 23, 2009, 02:29:55 PM
I can't figure out your number of units as 2+6, it's either 1+6 or 3+6 or 4+6.
The final 1 is inside the Trier fortress to begin with, and sallies forth.
Quote from: Delirium on April 23, 2009, 02:29:55 PM
Can you place mercs in a space under siege? Otherwise you're limited to Philip's rating of 6.
You cannot place mercs in a space under siege, but...
Quote from: LandsknechtsMercenaries are placed in any combination of spaces already containing friendly land units (even just before a field battle or assault), but not in a stack under siege.
I'm not placing them in a stack under siege, but placing them in the stack that's about to have a field battle.
1) Raise 4 mercs in Mainz (1+4)
2) Move to Trier (1+4)
3) Trier sieged forces sally (2+4)
4) Landsknechts adds to the battle (2+6).
Philip's battle rating is irrelevant, since I don't need him to move the entire formation there. He gets the 1+4 to the space, the 1+0 sallies, and then 0+2 gets added. On the other hand, if you want to give me 4+6, I'll take that.
Ulmont, you are fine to place the units in the space prior to the field battle, but they wouldn't be capable of contributing to it as they would bypass Philip's command rating.
The maximum you can possibly have participating in that battle is the 6 troops with Philip along with whatever sallied out from the besieged space itself--IE, the 1 regular. You'll be rolling 7 dice, in other words.
Playing Landsknechts here is pretty useless, unless you only bring Philip in with 4 troops.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 23, 2009, 02:40:54 PM
Ulmont, you are fine to place the units in the space prior to the field battle, but they wouldn't be capable of contributing to it as they would bypass Philip's command rating.
I'm not seeing that limitation in the rules.
Quote from: 14.12. Attacker Adds Up Battle Dice: The active player is always considered
the attacker in a field battle. The attacker adds up the number
of dice he will roll as follows:
• 1 die for each land unit in the moving formation
• 1 die for each Battle Rating point from the highest-rated leader in
the attacking force
I see no restriction that the formation fighting be supportable by a leader in the attacking force.
You quoted it yourself, but alright...
Quote• 1 die for each land unit in the moving formation
So go to the definition of formation (5.1, Formations) :
QuoteA formation is a group of land units in a single space that functions
as a combined entity for the purposes of movement, field battle,
intercept, and assault. One or more army leaders may also be included
in the formation. The maximum number of land units in a
formation is dependent on the Command Rating of any leaders
present:
Leaders Present : 1
Maximum Formation Size : Command Rating of Leader
Quote from: Habbaku on April 23, 2009, 02:45:50 PM
So go to the definition of formation (5.1, Formations) :
Well, that sucks (and I'm not sure it interacts well with the Relief Forces option that allows all to participate ignoring formation limits). It looks to me like after the sieged forces sally out they are no longer a stack under siege and I should be able to add the 2 mercs there and get the full dice pool.
Del, I am uninterested in a 6-die / 6-die battle with you, and was even before you pulled out the tercios. Mind if I rewind that move?
Quote from: ulmont on April 23, 2009, 02:50:25 PM
Well, that sucks (and I'm not sure it interacts well with the Relief Forces option that allows all to participate ignoring formation limits). It looks to me like after the sieged forces sally out they are no longer a stack under siege and I should be able to add the 2 mercs there and get the full dice pool.
It interacts just fine with the Relief Forces rule because the Relief Forces rule is the exception to it, as is clearly stated in the rulebook.
I'm not sure what would give you the impression that the besieged forces are no longer under siege, though. If the siege is not broken (and it is not considered broken until you actually drive the besiegers off somehow), then they are considered besieged for all purposes. There is no point where they are not under siege until then.
Quote from: Habbaku on April 23, 2009, 02:54:53 PM
I'm not sure what would give you the impression that the besieged forces are no longer under siege, though.
Well, this thread, for one, which describes the same scenario.
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/2848204
I went ahead and posted on CSW. We'll get a definite answer soon.
In that thread you referred to on BGG Ed answered a different question.
I'm with Habs here, I just don't see that there is any way you could view the units in the fortress as even temporarily not under siege.
But since I cheated with Schammlakaak I'm fine with you taking your move back.
Quote from: Delirium on April 23, 2009, 03:35:17 PM
In that thread you referred to on BGG Ed answered a different question.
Yup, Ed answered a different question. Ed also didn't contradict all the "count all units and ignore the stacking requirement" comments.
Quote from: Delirium on April 23, 2009, 03:35:17 PM
But since I cheated with Schammlakaak I'm fine with you taking your move back.
It'll be faster that way. Replaying now.
Board sent. Just recruited 5 mercs for Philip instead.
Edit: changed my move completely.
QuoteHapsburgs: Play Card as Operations
#82: 2 / Janissaries Rebel
Message from Hapsburgs:
Fuck it, I'll redo the whole move, return my home card and play this instead. These two cp's sees a merc from Ferdinand's stack move back to Salzburg and control it. England is up. Bah, stupid rules.
File sent.
This is just bad play on my part, and pretty unnecessary too. I was in Salzburg before my second impulse, had three cp and moved on Trier and Augsburg and then moved Alva, anticipating a 1-in-10 scenario in the Med. Third cp to control Salzburg instead, if I had read the rules correctly, and I wouldn't have to waste an impulse to correct that mistake.
England: Play Card as Operations
#74: 5 / Diplomatic Overture
Message from England:
3/5 Place a Colony
5/5 1x Fleet to Calais
File shortly.
That puts Tamas up.
Quote from: Tamas on April 22, 2009, 01:45:27 PM
Well altough indeed I am younger, smarter, and more handsome than you, I am also less French, so maybe that's why. :P
:lol: Ouch. That water snorted out the nose hurt!
Tamas is still up.
France: Play Card as Operations
#77: 2 / Fountain of Youth
Message from France:
Send an explorer
Someone place it on the map please
Hmm, another race to the other side of the world!
That puts Pope Berk up.
Quote from: Tamas on April 25, 2009, 04:52:15 AM
France: Play Card as Operations
#77: 2 / Fountain of Youth
Message from France:
Send an explorer
Someone place it on the map please
That won't be necessary.
Papacy: Play Card as Event
#98: 2 / Search for Cibola
Message from Papacy:
Cancel a Voyage of Exploration or Conquest that is underway. Remove the Exploration Underway, Conquest Underway or Conquest marker for the targeted power and place it on the Turn Track to reenter play next turn and to serve as a reminder that this power may not launch another voyage of this type until next turn
Cancel the French explorer.
Protestants are up.
Question, if you use Fuggers twice in a turn, is it -2 cards next round?
It's impossible to use Fuggers twice in one turn.
You also cannot use Luther to pull a card that's been used as an event.
Quote from: Delirium on April 25, 2009, 12:29:35 PM
You also cannot use Luther to pull a card that's been used as an event.
Not true. The Protestants can retrieve any card so long as they, themselves, have not played it as event. Even if they retrieve a card someone else has played as event, however, they may still not play it as event themselves, per rule 11, "Playing a card as an event".
I was just going to correct that.
Whatever.
Pulled back Katherina Bora, converted Strasburg / Basel / Liege / Metz.
QuoteProtestant Play Card as Event #85: 3 / Katherina Bora
Message from Protestant:
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 2
2
5
Message from Protestant:
Bora attempt 1/5
Basel.
1 adjacent space
1 adjacent reformer
=
2 dice.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 3
1
1
2
Message from Protestant:
Basel, Papacy (Protestants have a 5)
3 adjacent spaces
=
3 dice
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 2
1
5
Message from Protestant:
Basel flips. Attempt 2, Strasburg.
2 adjacent spaces
=
2 dice.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 2
4
1
Message from Protestant:
Strasburg, Pope (Protestant 5)
2 adjacent spaces
=
2 dice.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 2
2
4
Message from Protestant:
Strasburg flips. Attempt 3, Besancon.
2 adjacent spaces
=
2 dice.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 3
5
3
6
Message from Protestant:
Besancon, Pope, Protestant 4.
3 adjacent spaces.
=
3 dice.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 4
2
2
2
4
Message from Protestant:
Besancon fails. Attempt 4, Liege.
2 adjacent spaces
2 adjacent stacks
=
4 dice.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 7
4
2
1
1
3
3
2
Message from Protestant:
Liege, Pope (protestant 4)
4 adjacent spaces
3 adjacent stacks
=
7 dice.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 4
6
5
4
1
Message from Protestant:
Liege flips. Metz, last attempt.
3 adjacent spaces
1 adjacent stack
=
4 dice.
File sent; Del is up.
There is being good, and then there is being lucky.
Home card thrown in. First three cp sets up assault of Augsburg (and Trier). No combat card. ulmont?
QuoteOkay, now it's home card time. Charles to Antwerp.
1/5 Merc in Salzburg to Augsburg.
2/5 Charles +2 to Liege.
3/5 Charles +2 to Trier.
4/5 Assault Augsburg.
Quote from: Delirium on April 25, 2009, 02:41:03 PM
Home card thrown in. First three cp sets up assault of Augsburg (and Trier). No combat card. ulmont?
Nah, roll it.
Augsburg fell with no losses to me, but I had to use siege artillery to get the second hit. Last cp to attack Trier. No combat cards for me, guess none for ulmont?
Nope, hit it.
Trier also fell but only just, no losses to me. File on its way and England is up.
:bleeding:
In retrospect, I really should have not bothered to raise mercs and just gone straight towards the 50 space option. Oh well.
Quote from: Delirium on April 25, 2009, 02:50:50 PM
Trier also fell but only just, no losses to me. File on its way and England is up.
Can you also commit Luther in your file, I forgot that earlier?
Sorry, just sent it. I forgot to adjust vp though, ehrie can do both.
England: Play Card as Operations
#25: 1 / Field Artillery
Message from England:
1x Merc to London. Passing the rest of the turn.
I think Tamas should do all three.
:rolleyes:
Okay, sent a cleanup file with Luther committed, vp adjustments and the English merc added. All ready for Tamas.
Playing my home card for my 1VP. ACTS is adjusted, CB isnt.
Unless anything funny happening, I'll be passing. My winter is: Mr. French King leaves a total of 4 regulars in Milan, rest goes back to Paris.
That puts the Pope up.
Excommunicated Francis, and unrest springs up in Grebnoble and St. Dizier over the warmongering of their king.
Protestants are up.
Both treatise attempts failed. Sending file now; Del is up.
QuoteProtestant Play Card as Operations #102: 3 / Spring Preparations
Message from Protestant:
1/3 CP - move 0+2 from Mainz to Koln.
3/3 CP - publish treatise in French zone. Will take Oek... for bonuses w/in 2 spaces of Basel.
If you are passing the remainder of the turn (or think you are likely to do so), please post your winter.
I am not sure, I am waiting to see if Tamas is still planning on passing.
Assuming he does nothing new, I don't have a winter and will be passing out the turn. However, I think the unrest means he would take attrition, so I suspect he will change his mind about passing.
Help me out here please I dont have easy access to anything: how much CP do I need to reopen my way home from Milan in winter?
Quote from: Delirium on April 26, 2009, 02:36:28 PM
Never mind.
That doesn't count as your card play.
Tamas, you need 1 CP to open the path up again.
Heh, I was mixing up games again, then remembering the rules.
I played a 1 cp card to move some mercs. If England still passes I suppose France is up.
France: Play Card as Operations
#71: 4 / City State Rebels
Message from France:
2 CPs to remove my uprisings
2CP to build a regular to Paris
<_<
My winter stays the same.
File coming?
Pope Berk is up, unclear if he wants to pass.
Quote from: Delirium on April 26, 2009, 03:14:41 PM
File coming?
I suspect that if he can't access the map 20 minutes ago, the likelihood is low.
Pass
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Operations
#94: 2 / Revolt of the Communeros
Message from Protestant:
+2 cp to german bible, commit melancthon for +1
Passing out the turn unless Del puts another electorate under siege.
Del is up.
I pass as well.
Winter: 1 merc Liege - Antwerp, 1 merc Liege - Metz; 1 merc Augsburg - Vienna; Whole stack Madrid - Valladolid.
That's everyone, along with everyone's winter except for England. I'm going to assume they don't have one, so I'll go ahead with winters and send a file shortly.
I'll handle the end of turn stuff, as well.
File's out along with the card draw on ACTS. Diplomacy starts now, folks.
I have a winter. I don't have a board infront of me, but I know I have three regulars in scotland, I want two of them back to london. That is all.
I had Nervaez two turns in a row? :rolleyes:
Okay, this is open diplomacy.
I've managed to contain the Protestants somewhat, but with a lot of effort. It is my belief that I need another turn to bring them down to size, so the good Pope may launch his counter-reform, lest we should find Luther within easy reach of 50 spaces. Just imagine some more translations with ulmont dice if you don't believe me.
And then there is the problem of the Ottomans. Even though they should be commended for showing restraint (and "only" taking Rhodes) we must be aware that they have easy vp coming, they have not taken Buda, they have not built a single corsair but are at 15 vp already, thanks to Protestant philanthropy and smoking piracy dice. The fleet in Algiers is already almost impossible to handle, thanks to Barbarossa and if they combine both fleets they will own the Mediterranean, and there is nothing I can do about it.
In short: I have my hands full policing this game. The Ottomans are already doing well and I need help or they will sail away (literally) with the win. Any events that could affect their naval power in the first place and Suleiman's army in the second should, and ought to, be played. That is my honest opinion, or I believe the Ottomans may very well win next turn. They may do so anyway.
I am prepared to not backstab and pwn the Habsburgs this turn, at the price of white peace with Pope (and removal of my excommunication obviously).
That was not the reaction I was hoping for. :(
Tamas just doesn't get it.
You had your chance to get a peace cheap, and you refused. Now you have forced me to spend cards on you, and you expect the price to go down? If I was going to give you a white peace, why in the world would I waste my home card excommunicating you? If you want to go to war with the Hapsburgs, go right ahead and spend the card to do so. You are already down 1 card from excommunication, you can spend another to go to war, then fight me and the Hapsburgs with your remaining cards. Good luck with that.
Del: There is no way the Ottomans are winning this turn. They need 10 VPs, and they can get maybe 4, at best. They are going to win however, if we don't start slowing them down, but you can do that pretty much single handed if you can focus on it.
Given France intransigence on his pet war, I propose that England goes to war with France and kicks their teeth in so the Hapsburgs can focus on the Ottomans without interference from the continents emoKing. I would be willing to consider a relatively inexpensive divorce so England can use their home card to DOW France. England should get in touch with me privately to discuss the details of this.
Assuming we can come to some agreement on this (this is also assuming France stays insane, maybe he will come around!) I would be willing to then focus on slowing down the Protestants, as best I can with his insane dice.
The Pope possesses a certain directness which is appealing. I don't have anything to add to his message to the French, except that blackmailing player A and threaten to sabotage player B's efforts to stop player C from winning doesn't often work.
Regarding the Ottomans, next turn should be read as turn 4, not this turn.
Leave Del alone this turn, he has the turks and the Prottys to check. I want to go on my merry childbirthing way, if you make me dow you I will make you sue to peace.
Sounds off when you are done with diplomacy, please.
:frusty:
I guess I have no more diplomacy.
Ottomans are finished.
Ottomans have nothing to announce during diplomacy.
No new DoWs.
Spring deployment : Suleiman, Ibrahim and 11 regulars to Belgrade.
Papacy is done, and so is France. Tamas went to sleep.
So we need to hear from England and the Protestants about Diplomacy.
I have nothing to announce.
Quote from: Delirium on April 27, 2009, 02:36:00 PM
So we need to hear from England and the Protestants about Diplomacy.
You're kidding, right?
The Protestants will continue on their merry conversion ways, although we would appreciate if France would put a monster stack of mercenaries in Italy at some point.
...nothing to announce.
Well, I made it a point to make you feel involved, this is your first turn of real diplomacy after all. ;)
Anyway, we still await England's announcements.
I will leave instructions with the Pope, going to bed.
England announces a merry divorce granted in exchange for two english cards to the popesmith. That is all.
Now to wait for Tamas to propose anything of his own.
In the meantime, the Habsburgs should post their DoWs and spring deployment...
France (Tamas) proposes the following (all of which the Pope will accept, strangely enough):
1 card to the Pope
1 merc to the Pope
A white peace with the Pope
Alliance with the Pope
Loan of 1 naval squadron to the Pope.
The Pope accepts the cards from England and grants the divorce.
The Pope graciously removes his excommunication of King Francis.
Hapsburg DOW:
The Hapsburgs declare war on Venice.
The Pope is outraged, OUTRAGED I SAY! at this act of naked aggression, and kindly agrees to take the Venetians under their protection.
The Papacy and the Hapsburgs are now at war.
What card is the Papacy using to pay for their intervention?
That depends on what I get from France and England.
My Spring Deployment is Alva 4+1 to Gibraltar and I used good old Venetian Informant to pay for the DoW.
Sent a file with the diplo stuff and my and Habs's SD's. Of course I forgot to adjust the power card stuff.
Gave the card to the Pope. Of course it turned out to be an event useful for me. Dammit.
Spring Deployments from England, France and the Pope, then we can begin turn 3.
No SD for me.
I'll wait for the English SD, just in case.
England should roll for their divorce before their SD, as well.
So where is that lazy Englishman? Fornicating?
My move doubtfully affects the English/French SD, so I went ahead.
2 CPs from Smallpox were used to maneuver my fleet while the other went towards a piracy attempt in the Tyrrhenian Sea, targeting the Habsburgs...and garnering 2 hits.
Off to Del to determine my presents.
Awarded two vp.
Would you rather I gave him two cards? :rolleyes:
Unsanitary camp on Belgrade? Anyone?
Seriously, this is looking rather grim. 4 (+1 from the Protestants) from piracy already and he's barely started. Plus there's 2+2 coming in from Buda and winning war with Hungary. That puts him at 21, barring even more success with piracy (although it's hard to beat 4 out of 5 so far).
We just have to bring him down to size. I will do my part but I need help dammit.
I changed my mind about waiting. Played 1 cp to move fleets, sending file.
Off to England to do all their stuff.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 1
5
Message from England:
Firing a full broadside at Anne Boleyn
Edward is born! Though...something isn't quite right with him.
Now before I take my turn, can I play my home card to get me some of that Jane Seymour or because I already rolled a kid this turn I can only have one? Don't remember and don't have the rulebook with me.
England: Play Card as Operations
#43: 3 / Zwingli Dons Armour
Message from England:
1 Regular and 1 Merc to Calais
File coming shortly
You can roll again if you wish.
Quote from: ehrie on April 28, 2009, 08:45:41 AM
Now before I take my turn, can I play my home card to get me some of that Jane Seymour or because I already rolled a kid this turn I can only have one? Don't remember and don't have the rulebook with me.
I don't see anything stopping you; the section says starting turn 2 England can play the home card to advance the wives track, or that the wives track can be advanced by the pope granting a divorce.
Okay, I'll keep that in mind thanks. I took my turn regardless, so it's on to Tamas.
Okay seeing the English spring, my spring is moving Francis, 6 regulars and 2 mercs to Boulogne, to keep Henry honest.
And my turn is:
France: Play Card as Operations
#77: 2 / Fountain of Youth
Message from France:
Sending an explorer
Played Fuggers in the hopes of getting something to use against the Ottomans.
Protestants are up, no file coming. Someone drop a -1 marker on me at some point please.
Quote from: Berkut on April 28, 2009, 10:45:16 AM
Protestants are up, no file coming. Someone drop a -1 marker on me at some point please.
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Event
#11: 2 / Defender of the Faith
Message from Protestant:
After the Pope finishes his Counter Reformation attempts, I'll be putting 3 CP (+1 for committing Melancthon) into the German bible.
You want me to roll your best 3 shots (I believe Liege, Metz, Basel, in that order) and send a file around?
Nah, I will do it, and send a file.
We successfuly convert three spaces, file sent, Otts are up.
Everyone really need to get their fleets out onto water to combat piracy.
Quote from: Berkut on April 28, 2009, 11:02:39 AM
We successfuly convert three spaces, file sent, Otts are up.
QuoteThe Papacy wins all ties if this is a space within the target language
zone and Paul III or Julius III is the Papal ruler; otherwise the Protestant
wins all ties.
Did Clement VII die when I wasn't looking, or should I have Liege back with a 6-6 tie?
Nope, you are correct - forgot about that stupid Pope not winning ties thing.
If anyone has the REAL pope in hand...
Anyway. Habbaku is up, and if he could fix the file (return Liege to Protestant, correct spaces [22] / VP numbers on the board) that would be great.
I played Janissaries as event, raising 3 regulars in Nezh and 1 in Sofia.
Del's up.
Quote from: Delirium on April 28, 2009, 03:22:27 AM
We just have to bring him down to size.
I told you the Ottomans were the threat, not the Protestants, but noooo, you wouldn't listen... :mad:
Quote from: ulmont on April 28, 2009, 11:57:00 AM
Quote from: Delirium on April 28, 2009, 03:22:27 AM
We just have to bring him down to size.
I told you the Ottomans were the threat, not the Protestants, but noooo, you wouldn't listen... :mad:
The protestants where the threat though. They just aren't as much now.
You know very well you were the immediate threat.
You managed to increase the threat of the Ottomans quite nicely yourself. I predict that the Gonzaga vp will be the game-breaker next turn.
:zzz
Quote from: ehrie on April 28, 2009, 08:45:41 AM
Now before I take my turn, can I play my home card to get me some of that Jane Seymour or because I already rolled a kid this turn I can only have one? Don't remember and don't have the rulebook with me.
Forgot to elaborate on this. Basically, you can keep rolling until you get either a healthy Edward or both sickly Edward and Elizabeth. After that, you're stuck.
I played Cloth Prices Fluctuate, drew a card and placed two mercs in Antwerp.
England is up to draw a card thanks to those very cloth prices and do their turn.
Quote from: Delirium on April 14, 2009, 01:22:09 AMNoting the strong Protestant opening we know that everyone understands that there are only two powers who benefit, and that is Luther himself, and also the Ottomans. We, the Habsburg Empire, will, and must, see it as our responsibility to contain the heretics but in doing so must commit resources otherwise best used elsewhere. We know the heathen Turks will take advantage of the situation, but we also know that the rest of Europe will instead see the logic in helping us defend civilization against this threat.
I'd like to quote myself after my first impulse, turn one.
Even though it may seem like I'm talking to myself, I'd like to announce that I'll be away on semi-holiday starting this evening to Sunday. It is probable that I can't access the board during that time, but I think I will be able to check in here a few times and on ACTS and hopefully keep the game moving anyway with some help.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 1
1
Message from England:
+1 drm for Jane.
Played my home card to move the shindig along, but alas it's a 2 with Jane's +1. Bring on the next biznitch! On to Tamas, not bothering with sending out file for that.
Hmm, didn't expect the game not to have gone anywhere. This was my only chance to check in for 48 hours, so see you later.
Quote from: Delirium on April 30, 2009, 03:40:11 AM
Hmm, didn't expect the game not to have gone anywhere. This was my only chance to check in for 48 hours, so see you later.
It does seem hard to believe, until you realize who is up...:P
Quote from: Berkut on April 30, 2009, 07:25:58 AM
Quote from: Delirium on April 30, 2009, 03:40:11 AM
Hmm, didn't expect the game not to have gone anywhere. This was my only chance to check in for 48 hours, so see you later.
It does seem hard to believe, until you realize who is up...:P
:rolleyes: Languish was down than I was sleeping. Give me a break.
I play my home card for yet another VP. I shall update ACTS, won't send a file though.
Quote from: Tamas on April 30, 2009, 10:57:26 AM
:rolleyes: Languish was down than I was sleeping. Give me a break.
ACTS was always up...
...over to you, Popey.
You know Tamas, you could have played your home card for a VP at any point in the turn.
Instead, you play it now rather than send your fleet to sea, and making it that much easier for you to be pirated.
Protestants are up.
Pope sent his fleets to sea.
Summary: finished the German Bible, converted Hamburg, Trier (again), Innsbruck, Linz, Graz.
QuoteProtestant Play Card as Operations #82: 2 / Janissaries Rebel
Message from Protestant:
1 CP to German Bible; Commit Luther to finish the Bible.
1 CP to French New Testament
QuoteProtestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 5
3
1
1
2
1
Message from Protestant:
German Bible 1/6 (all results +1).
Hamburg:
4 Protestant dice (4 adjacent).
1 Papal die.
Protestant dice first.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 7
5
3
2
4
2
1
2
Message from Protestant:
German bible 2/6 (Protestant dice +1)
Trier.
3 Protestant dice (2 adj. sp., 1 adj. stack)
4 Papal dice (1 adj. sp., 1 stack in prov, 1 adj. stack)
Protestant first.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 4
3
1
1
1
Message from Protestant:
German Bible 3/6
Augsburg.
3 Prot dice (2 adj. sp., 1 adj. reformer)
1 Papal die (default, all adjacent modifiers across pass)
Prot dice first.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 6
6
5
3
4
1
6
Message from Protestant:
(previous was Innsbruck, sorry, misread the map)
German Bible 4/6, Linz.
2 Protestant dice (2 adj. sp.)
4 Papal dice (2 adj. sp., 2 adj. stacks)
Prot dice first.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 6
4
1
6
1
6
3
Message from Protestant:
German Bible 5/6, Vienna.
1 Protestant die.
5 Papal dice.
Protestant die first.
Protestant Die roll request Request: 6-sided die x 6
6
6
6
2
3
4
Message from Protestant:
German Bible 6/6, Graz.
1 Protestant die.
5 Papal dice.
Protestant die first.
Ottomans are up.
The Ottomans play Machiavelli to raise 2 cavalry in Nezh.
Habsburgs are up.
Quote#76: 4 / Foreign Recruits
Message from Hapsburgs:
I build two mercs in Tunis, one merc in Trier and one merc in Augsburg (if there are counters available), if not two in Augsburg.
No board available so it's from memory (= no file). England is up.
England: Play Card as Operations
#83: 3 / John Zapolya
Message from England:
1 Regular + 1 Merc to Calais
I don't have access to a board. Tamas can you please put Del's and my play into it?
Jesus. How many units can you possibly fit into a small English foothold on the continent?
I was curious to see if my builds were legitimate so I made a file with those and ehrie's.
Tamas is up.
I am going to pass one round.
That puts Pope Berkut up.
To sum up Berkut's move: Called a debate, went to round 2, Eck beat Bullinger 2-0, converted back Liege and Strasburg.
My move:
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Operations
#95: 5 / Sack of Rome
Message from Protestant:
4/5 CP - Translate French New Testament (at 5 CP)
1/5 CP - Translate English New Testament (at 1 CP)
Over to the Ottomans.
Berkut...since you called the Debate with Leipzig, why not send in Eck round 1?
Because I forgot I called it with Liepzig, because I am distracted, pissed off, and generally in a shitty mood.
No reason otherwise.
I would say those are good reasons.
Quote from: Berkut on May 04, 2009, 12:18:00 PM
Because I forgot I called it with Liepzig, because I am distracted, pissed off, and generally in a shitty mood.
No reason otherwise.
Fair enough. You won the debate anyway, so no harm done.
The Ottomans, meanwhile, maneuvered some of their reinforcements into Belgrade while Suleiman recovers from an attack of Gout.
That and Barbarossa's fleet joined up with the Barbary squadrons.
I know I'm up, but I need to rush out for a bit.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 04, 2009, 12:33:14 PM
The Ottomans, meanwhile, maneuvered some of their reinforcements into Belgrade while Suleiman recovers from an attack of Gout.
That and Barbarossa's fleet joined up with the Barbary squadrons.
Your play on ACTS has a big-ass stack moving all the way from Belgrade to Szegedin, which isn't in the CB file you sent out.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#26: 3 / Mercenaries Bribed
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/3 - 2 regulars, 2 cavalry from Nezh to Belgrade.
2/3 - Suleiman, Ibrahim and 15 (12 regulars/3 cavalry) to Szegedin.
3/3 - Naval move, detailed in file.
1) You say 12 + 3, but you don't have 12 + 3 in Belgrade to move, you have 17 + 2.
2) The CB file doesn't move out of Belgrade.
Should there be 13 + 2, Suleiman, Ibrahim in Szegedin now, leaving 4 + 0 in Belgrade, or something else?
There is a reason that I posted that Suleiman had Gout in the post you quoted...
Quote from: Habbaku on May 04, 2009, 01:01:44 PM
There is a reason that I posted that Suleiman had Gout in the post you quoted...
...I assume you're waiting on the Hapsburg response card to hit ACTS. Where does the 3rd cavalry unit come from?
That's a typo. Should be 13 regulars, 2 cavalry (15 total).
Okay, played a 3 cp card. First cp moved Ferdinand and his entire stack to Worms. Phil of Hess failed to intercept. Second cp moved the regular from Brussels to Liege and the three regulars in Koln rolled double sixes.
Does ulmont want to intercept? A third cp remains after this.
On second thought, I'm going to bed. Third cp controls Worms.
If ulmont wants to intercept he can roll the battle. My third cp would see Charles attack protestants in Liege in that case.
Since talk is open and free during turns, I would be willing to discuss a truce with the Shcallamlala League for this turn and the next with borders exactly as they are in my file.
No intercept, and sure, the Shmalkaldic League could be persuaded to not wreak righteous vengeance upon you for this turn and the next in exchange for you not pursuing further unrighteous vengeance upon us. You may signal your acceptance by moving all your troops away from us.
Some troops will remain, others will leave during Winter. We both keep what territory we have after my impulse and will not move into each other's territory or convert political control of said territory nor incite unrest in said territory. Conditions last turn 3 and 4 and end beginning of turn 5.
And England is up.
If anyone managed to miss that, the Ottomans have 19 units in Belgrade. There will never be a better opportunity for Unsanitary Camp, not in this game or most others you will ever play. Seven units will die. Die.
I would play it on them, but I cannot spare the 2 CPs. Plus we are at war now anyway.
You could have fooled me.
Word from Protestant HQ on whether they accept the terms for the truce or not would be welcome.
And England is still up.
What say you people, shall we try and pick up the pace again? We were on a pretty good roll there for a while.
Quote from: Delirium on May 05, 2009, 09:48:10 AM
Word from Protestant HQ on whether they accept the terms for the truce or not would be welcome.
? I already accepted.
Quote from: Delirium on May 05, 2009, 09:48:10 AM
And England is still up.
What say you people, shall we try and pick up the pace again? We were on a pretty good roll there for a while.
Talk to Ehrie and Tamas. I doubt it, though, since Tamas is about to fuck off to Italy.
Well here is the deal: unless someone makes a move which can be deemed anti-French, I will pass. BUT! I want to play my last card eventually. So if you guys plan to ignore France, just go on your business while I am in Italy, to the point where it looks likely that the turn will end, in which case I wanna play that last card.
I know its a game mechanic that you can get burned if everyone else also passes with you, but since I declare my passivity in advance, me and the game's pace deserve that you consider that above position of mine.
Quote from: Tamas on May 05, 2009, 10:51:19 AMSo if you guys plan to ignore France, just go on your business while I am in Italy, to the point where it looks likely that the turn will end, in which case I wanna play that last card.
Yeah, ok. Berkut has to make 6 card plays before the turn can end anyway, so that should be doable.
Quote from: Tamas on May 05, 2009, 10:51:19 AM
Well here is the deal: unless someone makes a move which can be deemed anti-French, I will pass. BUT! I want to play my last card eventually. So if you guys plan to ignore France, just go on your business while I am in Italy, to the point where it looks likely that the turn will end, in which case I wanna play that last card.
I know its a game mechanic that you can get burned if everyone else also passes with you, but since I declare my passivity in advance, me and the game's pace deserve that you consider that above position of mine.
If you want, send your play in to the Ottomans are someone else uninterested or allied, just tell them what you want to do and when.
Quote from: ulmont on May 05, 2009, 10:31:48 AM
? I already accepted.
I don't believe you did, actually, but I'm glad you didn't object to the details.
England: Play Card as Operations
#71: 4 / City State Rebels
Message from England:
2/4 Send an Explorer.
4/4 2 Mercs to Calais
No board access until tomorrow. Please add this to the file Tamas. I'm passing the rest of the turn.
Tamas has stated he's passing until it looks like the turn might end.
Berkut's Papacy's up.
Pope burns some books, fails on both attempts - one 6-2, one 5-1.
You cannot beat dice like that.
4 CP into the English new Testament
1 mercenary in Koln.
Protestants will pass out the turn unless Del absentmindedly wanders onto an electorate.
Over to Habbaku's Ottomans.
Ottomans pass for the moment. Off to the Habsburgs.
Our glorious Empire recruits three mercenaries in Vienna and sends the turn on to Pope Berkster VII since both England and France pass.
And the Pope finally burns some books with competency, converting Linz, Graz and Trieste back to Christ.
I believe that brings it back to the Ottomans.
Pass again.
If the play gets around to me twice more, my next 2 plays are both 1-CP cards into St. Petes.
Okay, I built two fleets and sent out a file, so it's back to Habbaku again after that St Petes effort.
Uh, the turn is nearing the end I believe. Did Tamas ever send someone his vital last card play?
Not me, no... Pass again.
My dramatic last card play:
France: Play Card as Operations
#35: 1 / Siege Artillery
Message from France:
build a merc to Paris
:rolleyes: :D
Okay, implementing everything. The order of the previous impulse was:
Habs passing
I build fleets
England passing
France building a merc
Pope playing a 1 cp card to St Pete's
ulmont passes
This impulse so far is
Habs passes
I played my home card to explore, colonize and move my fleet to the Tyrrhenian Sea.
The Pope plays his second 1 cp card to St Pete's (is not included in my file).
Back to the Ottomans.
Pass again.
And I pass as well, so it's the Pope's turn.
As discussed with Del, I don't think that Berkut's play will affect mine, but am fine with rewinding to his impulse if he is going to do so, so I'm going ahead with my play.
The Battle of Buda/Mohacs (in which Tamas' ancestors sold weapons to the Turks and told the local authorities where the Gypsies were) predictably resulted in a victory for the Turks, with two hits taking place (1 lost regular, 1 lost cavalry).
The Habsburg alliance is activated--handing over Bohemia to the Empire even as the Hungarians sell themselves out.
Agree on everything.
Pope Berkut needs to play his two 1 cp cards, then his play for the previous impulse (wouldn't mind him moving up the Venetian fleets).
Then Habs's Buda attack kicks in.
I don't want to do my turn until I've seen the Pope's play. I'll probably pass though.
Del, my fleets cannot help you, since I am not at war with the Ottomans.
I play UNpaid Mercs for 3 more CPs to St. Petes.
No worries, as long as they winter in Corfu, we'll be okay.
I believe your St Pete's count is wrong, I had already adjusted the track for the 2 x 1 cp, giving you a vp in the process. Your 3 cp card should have placed you just below the "add a vp" space, not on it.
Ok, so:
Current impulse:
Ottomans crush Buda. 0-1 plays remaining.
Hapsburgs are up. 0-2 plays remaining.
England passes out. 0 plays remaining.
France has 0 cards. 0 plays remaining.
Papacy has 1 card + 1 home card. 1-2 plays remaining.
Protestants pass out. 0 plays remaining.
Ok, you three (Habs / Del / Berkut) sort out the turn winding down...
Quote from: Delirium on May 06, 2009, 02:21:49 AM
The Pope plays his second 1 cp card to St Pete's (is not included in my file).
So this was just meant to be confusing?
Did you update the ACTS VP tracker?
I sent at least one file after that file, including one called minorfixes, but I agree that particular post would be confusing.
I did adjust the ACTS vp tracker.
I know I'm up, I'm thinking.
I will trust you to fix everything so it is as it should be. Because at this point I have no idea.
Did my move, built a sqaudron and moved my fleet to shelter in Messina.
Pope Berk is up.
I dare say that everything is now as it should be.
Papal Bull for 4 CPs, all into St. Petes, passing out the turn.
That puts Suleiman up.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Event
#66: 3 / Akinji Raiders
Message from Ottoman:
Playable as event if Ottoman is at war with a power and Ottoman cavalry is within 2 spaces of a space controlled by that same target power. Any intervening space must be controlled by Ottoman. Ottoman draws a card at random from the target power and keeps it in his hand
I'd like a card now, please.
Everyone who is passing the turn should post their winters ASAP so we can move to the next turn once Del give me my loot.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 06, 2009, 12:34:10 PM
Everyone who is passing the turn should post their winters ASAP so we can move to the next turn once Del give me my loot.
No Protestant winter. I know you're shocked.
Papal Winter:
Venetian fleets to Corfu
Corfu regular to Venice
Papal squadron from Tyyr to Rome
Card sent to Ottoman sheep shaggers. :cry:
I'd like to see what the Ottomans do with my fine shiny card before I send out my Winter.
I'll be saving the card.
Ottoman winter :
1 regular from Nezh to Istanbul.
1 regular from Sofia to Istanbul.
1 regular from Belgrade to Istanbul.
8 regulars, 1 cavalry, Suleiman and Ibrahim from Buda to Istanbul.
Navy to Algiers.
Okay, my winter:
1 regular Liege - Trier.
Charles 3+2 (yes, everyone) Trier - Vienna .
Ferdinand 4+0 (leaving 1 merc) Augsburg - Vienna.
1 merc Gibraltar - Valladolid.
That's 4/6 winters and the other 2 are rather obvious (England sending back the excess from Calais to London, France sending their stuff to Paris). They are, of course, free to modify it a bit but I'm going to go ahead and do the end of turn stuff now.
Winter file's been sent out and new cards have been drawn. Diplomacy may begin now.
Habbaku got my winter right.
Quote from: ehrie on May 06, 2009, 09:41:06 PM
Habbaku got my winter right.
Mostly, anyway. I forgot to move the leaders back to London. I'm assuming you want them both there.
Meh, they are going right back there for Spring, so don't bother on the file. And since I still can't PM people, Del, where should I e-mail you for diplo? This lack of me being able to send PMs really sucks ass.
Well, I got your pm, so apparently you succeeded without knowing it.
If you want to email, my address is among those in the ACTS group emails.
I have no discoveries. :face:
This game sucks.
Quote from: Delirium on May 07, 2009, 01:06:18 AM
Well, I got your pm, so apparently you succeeded without knowing it.
If you want to email, my address is among those in the ACTS group emails.
Well what do you know, bout time one of them went through.
Second went through as well. I think you just forget to click "Add" after writing the name of the recipient.
How's diplomacy going for everyone?
I'm still waiting on an answer for one of my PMs but am otherwise ready.
I'm ready.
Tamas* hasn't answered my pm either. :(
Other than that I'm ready.
(*= I just realised he is in Italy with the rest of the Languish travelling circus. Unless he checks in on the road, we'll probably need to postpone the game until he's back.)
Quote from: Tamas on May 05, 2009, 10:51:19 AM
So if you guys plan to ignore France, just go on your business while I am in Italy, to the point where it looks likely that the turn will end, in which case I wanna play that last card.
Well, he did announce his absence, in a way, he just didn't mention it's till the eleventh. <_<
For Tamas to blow some life into this and then we can move on. :frog:
I am busy preparing for my Berlin trip (taxi will be here in a couple of hours and I have to like, bring stuff with me. Might be taken for a jew if without papers). I have some interesting diplomatic offers I need to consider. I will give answers from Berlin tonight.
10-4.
I am now done with Diplomacy. Let's try and round up everyone shall we?
Habbaku, can you get the ball rolling with Ottoman Diplomatic announcements, if any, and then maybe Delirium will be so kind as to actually post his Diplomacy rather than hinting all around it?
:lol:
Interesting view. Another option would have been for you to and the rest to actually, you know, announce that you were done with Diplomacy when prompted to do so five days ago, or anywhere in the interim, instead of keeping silent the whole time that Tamas was away.
You apparently choose this way of signalling that you're done, so can we hear from Tamas and Berkut before going ahead?
Quote from: Delirium on May 12, 2009, 09:59:43 AM
Another option would have been for you to and the rest to actually, you know, announce that you were done with Diplomacy when prompted to do so five days ago, or anywhere in the interim, instead of keeping silent the whole time that Tamas was away.
I don't need to announce that I'm done. The private diplo state normally lasts 1 or 2 days, not 5.
Tamas said he was going to respond to PMs from Berlin, and apparently did, so can we just get a move on?
I am not done, going to need a few more days to work out these complex agreements.
Quote from: Berkut on May 12, 2009, 10:05:10 AM
I am not done, going to need a few more days to work out these complex agreements.
:bleeding:
I hope you absentmindedly left off the :lol: on that post.
Ottomans have nothing to announce.
No DoWs.
SD : Suleiman, Ibrahim, 1 cavalry and 12 regulars to Belgrade.
Quote from: ulmont on May 12, 2009, 10:02:50 AMI don't need to announce that I'm done. The private diplo state normally lasts 1 or 2 days, not 5.
Tamas said he was going to respond to PMs from Berlin, and apparently did, so can we just get a move on?
You don't
need to announce? :huh:
I'm sorry, I didn't realise how painful it must be for you to actually post here and discuss the game.
Said Hungarian replied to my pm, I have no idea about those other pm's of his.
:frusty: I already announced my diplomacy. Just post yours already.
Announcing:
White peace with the Pope and alliance and the loan of their fleets.
Alliance with France and the loan of their fleets, as well as the transfer of Metz and them giving me a card draw.
I believe that's it. I need to see the whole shebang before announcing my Spring Deployment though (yeah I know, I'm really keeping this game on hold).
Quote from: Habbaku on May 12, 2009, 03:39:45 PM
:frusty: I already announced my diplomacy. Just post yours already.
I was writing it.
I know people are joking when they insinuate that I'm holding up the game but it could easily become irritating.
I have nothing to announce.
Pope accepts the white peace and alliance with the hapsburgs, including the laon of the papal and venetian fleets.
Nothing else to announce.
Nothing to announce.
Assuming the Frogs confirm the stuff posted, we're clear to move on to spring deployments (unless anyone has any DoWs?).
I've already posted mine.
Mine moves all my forces save one regular from London to Calais.
You can only transport 5 units (and any number of leaders) via one sea-zone during spring deployment.
I confirm the french-habsburg deal. My SD is both leaders and all troops expect for a single regular from Paris to Boulogne, under operation Keep The English Honest 2
Good. Making a file with everything. I SD everything but a regular to Gibraltar.
I then play Halley's Comet to skip the first Ottoman impulse.
Attacked Algiers with 26 dice against 15, won 11 hits vs 8.
5 Ottoman squadrons and a corsair hit the bottom, 3 Venetian and one Habsburg die as well. A single corsair remains.
England is up.
England: Play Card as Active Event
#110: 4 / War with Persia
Message from England:
Ottoman player must remove 5 land units from the map and place them (along with any leaders desired) on this Foreign War card. Persians start with 3 land units. If Ottoman strength drops below 5 land units, all new Ottoman land unit builds must be placed on card until total of 5 is restored
With the Sultan's Armies busy in the West the Persians strike in the East.
Dang, Habs is going to be cranky today. I am going to turn off google mail chat.
France is up.
I think my SD was skipped, not that it is ever very important.
1 merc and 3 regulars from Rome to Modena. I will update when the file gets around to me.
You had nothing to announce, so I assumed you had no SD. But who am I to know what gets announced in this game? :P
No worries.
Tamas plays a 2 CP card for an explorer.
Pope excommunicates Cranmer and calls a debate in England on the matter.
Aleander is up against Coverdale, and things go badly right from the start, with Coverdale babbling like Sarah Palin on a bad day, and loses 4-0.
Whats that smell?
Coverdale is BBQed.
I get to flip 5 spaces, since that is my debaters bonus.
London
Augsburg
Innsbruck
Salzburg
Worms
Ow. Finished the French New Testament, got next to nowhere with the rolls (Besancon and Grenoble), started on the French bible. Over to Habbaku.
Quote from: Berkut on May 13, 2009, 09:44:31 AM
No worries.
Tamas plays a 2 CP card for an explorer.
Pope excommunicates Cranmer and calls a debate in England on the matter.
Aleander is up against Coverdale, and things go badly right from the start, with Coverdale babbling like Sarah Palin on a bad day, and loses 4-0.
Whats that smell?
Coverdale is BBQed.
I get to flip 5 spaces, since that is my debaters bonus.
London
Augsburg
Innsbruck
Salzburg
Worms
:bleeding:
Glad to see my good friend the Pope is doing well. :)
I did a thorough vp check, I think everything is good now. Well, not good, in that I am last, but still.
Quote from: Berkut on May 13, 2009, 07:52:00 AM
Dang, Habs is going to be cranky today. I am going to turn off google mail chat.
Nope, I'm doing quite fine. In fact, it's actually refreshing to finally see the board gang up on me. If I had been allowed to walk away with the game it wouldn't have been all that fun.
Besides, I've played multiple games where I've had every negative event hit me and still won quite nicely, as you may recall...
My 4 garrison regulars from my home keys are removed, along with the 1 cavalry in Belgrade, to satisfy the War in Persia.
My play :
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#30: 2 / Tercios
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/2 - Raise 1 cavalry in Istanbul.
2/2 - Raise 1 cavalry in Athens.
File coming shortly. Del's up.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 13, 2009, 12:30:37 PMIn fact, it's actually refreshing to finally see the board gang up on me. If I had been allowed to walk away with the game it wouldn't have been all that fun.
Funny you should say that. <_<
Hilarious. :unsure:
Played a 3 cp card to destroy the last corsair, won 3 to 2 with 18 dice vs 4. Lost a squadron. <_<
The remaining two cp saw Alva to Algiers with 4+1 troopers.
England is up.
You're making the assumption that I won't fight a field battle when you naval land at Algiers.
You are wrong.
Any CCs?
Quote from: Habbaku on May 13, 2009, 05:59:40 PM
Hilarious. :unsure:
No one has ganged up on you to stop you from winning except me and Berk. The rest are just bribed, so don't get too excited.
Quote from: Delirium on May 13, 2009, 06:09:36 PM
No one has ganged up on you to stop you from winning except me and Berk. The rest are just bribed, so don't get too excited.
But, of course, greasing their palms in order to play events like "Haha, lose 5 troops" is exactly what the huge Habsburg hand size is for.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 13, 2009, 06:07:41 PM
You're making the assumption that I won't fight a field battle when you naval land at Algiers.
You are wrong.
Any CCs?
Well, with the dice rolling thus far, I can't possibly win the battle anyway, so no, no cards.
Good sir, you are a prophet.
Quote
Ottoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 9
1
4
3
6
2
5
5
6
3
Message from Ottoman:
Algiers field battle. 6 vs. 3, Habsburg first.
2 hits for each side--Ottoman garrison is wiped out, but the defender wins ties. Alva is captured and his entire landing force is destroyed.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 13, 2009, 06:10:57 PMBut, of course, greasing their palms in order to play events like "Haha, lose 5 troops" is exactly what the huge Habsburg hand size is for.
Perhaps, but it still does not constitute "ganging up". The game continues for the sole reason that I felt like paying for it, nothing else.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 13, 2009, 06:12:56 PM
2 hits for each side--Ottoman garrison is wiped out, but the defender wins ties. Alva is captured and his entire landing force is destroyed.
You're joking.
No, I'm afraid not.
Per 14.1 :
QuoteAll remaining units and army leaders from the losing power must
retreat...If no legal space exists, all units in that stack are eliminated; any army leaders
present are captured.
Second bullet :
QuoteUnits may not retreat into a sea zone.
Probably the only game in history that doesn't view an eliminated side as the loser of a battle. But I can't argue with dice.
I can only assume we aren't going to get a file, now.
Ehrie's up.
That is a dumb as crap rule.
England: Play Card as Event
#79: 3 / Fuggers
Message from England:
Fuggers bring joyness.
On to France.
Playing my home card for chateau VP
Played 2 CP for St. Petes.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#65: 4 / A Mighty Fortress
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/4 - Raise 1 cavalry in Salonika.
2/4 - Raise 1 cavalry in Edirne.
3/4 - Raise 1 cavalry in Sofia.
4/4 - Raise 1 cavalry in Nezh.
File coming. Del's up.
My spring isn't in game file. Del can you correct if your move makes a file necessary? If not I will during my turn.
Your Spring is in the game file, you just weren't allowed to ferry more than 5 troopers at a time.
Quote from: ehrie on May 14, 2009, 12:10:59 PM
My spring isn't in game file. Del can you correct if your move makes a file necessary? If not I will during my turn.
If you look at London and Calais in the SD file Del sent out, 5 units moved from London to Calais, the max allowed across a sea zone in SD. Exactly what were you expecting?
Ah, yup, brain freeze. I realized it after I looked closer.
I sent guys to Algiers. Again. <_<
England is up.
Why not just build 2 mercenaries in Gibraltar and accomplish the same thing, only going up 2 troops? :unsure:
England: Play Card as Event
#63: 4 / Dissolution of the Monasteries
Message from England:
English player draws 2 cards from deck. Protestant player then makes 3 Reformation attempts targeting the English language zone. Remove from deck if played as event.
Vow of poverty my ass. Cromwell has done well here.
Moar cards. Ulmont needs to make three reformation attemps in the English zone. then on to Tamas.
Quote from: ehrie on May 14, 2009, 12:39:55 PM
Ulmont needs to make three reformation attemps in the English zone
You know there are no legal reformation targets actually in the English zone right now, right?
Quote from: ulmont on May 14, 2009, 12:42:31 PM
You know there are no legal reformation targets actually in the English zone right now, right?
There are several. Berwick, Edinburgh, Norwich and London are all legal targets.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 14, 2009, 12:34:54 PM
Why not just build 2 mercenaries in Gibraltar and accomplish the same thing, only going up 2 troops? :unsure:
Because I'm trying to do three things at the same time and apparently not prioritizing correctly.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 14, 2009, 12:45:27 PM
There are several. Berwick, Edinburgh, Norwich and London are all legal targets.
1 sea zone away from Bremen, I take it?
Quote from: ulmont on May 14, 2009, 12:46:37 PM
1 sea zone away from Bremen, I take it?
I was looking at Hamburg, but yes, same effect.
Quote from: Delirium on May 14, 2009, 12:46:28 PM
Because I'm trying to do three things at the same time and apparently not prioritizing correctly.
So we'll just assume you did prioritize correctly. No big deal.
Edinburgh and Norwich convert. Tamas is up.
Ulmont's file doesn't take the latest Habsburg play into account.
Tamas, ignore it and just flip Norwich and Edinburgh to Protestant in your own file, please.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 14, 2009, 12:58:44 PM
Ulmont's file doesn't take the latest Habsburg play into account.
Really? I just reloaded my replay, and I moved 2 guys from Gibraltar and 2 guys from Tunis to Algiers...
...or were you saying I should have just added 2 mercs in Gibraltar, moved those to Algiers, and left the 2 mercs in Tunis, per your little colloquy with Del?
I'm saying that you didn't just load Del's file, then do your own like we're supposed to be doing.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 14, 2009, 01:35:17 PM
I'm saying that you didn't just load Del's file, then do your own like we're supposed to be doing.
:face:
Quote from: Habbaku on May 14, 2009, 01:35:17 PM
I'm saying that you didn't just load Del's file, then do your own like we're supposed to be doing.
Never got Del's file; your T4-09 Otto file is the last I saw. I assumed he hadn't sent one out.
Could be because he only sent it to me, judging by the e-mail. :P
Let's run off of Ulmont's file, then.
Tamas is still up.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 14, 2009, 12:50:16 PM
So we'll just assume you did prioritize correctly. No big deal.
A bit lost there, just a simple mistake on my part.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 14, 2009, 01:41:15 PM
Could be because he only sent it to me, judging by the e-mail. :P
Apparently this isn't my day.
I want to pass this single round. I am back home btw.
Berkutimus Hippitus Hoppitus is up.
Played Liepzig for another debate in England, which Eck won 2-0 converting both English spaces back to the True Faith.
Protestants are up.
Quote from: Tamas on May 14, 2009, 05:05:09 PM
I want to pass this single round. I am back home btw.
I thought you can only pass if you have played your home card and are at or below your save limit. You have two cards and Francis can only save 1.
I'm also at 19 VP, btw, not 18. Ulmont didn't put me up to 20 after my card play.
Quote from: ehrie on May 15, 2009, 08:16:46 AM
I thought you can only pass if you have played your home card and are at or below your save limit. You have two cards and Francis can only save 1.
Yes, that is correct.
Quote from: HIS Rulebook, Section 11Powers may never pass if:
• Their Home card has not been played,
• A Mandatory Event is in their hand that has not been played, or
• They have more cards in their hand than their ruler's Administrative
Rating.
Since Berkut has already skipped Tamas ulmont might conceivably do so as well on the proviso that French action does not affect either player. But I suppose it's up you.
Actually, we should not skip him, since I am going to ask him to make a play that could very well effect the protestant player.
Quote from: Delirium on May 15, 2009, 08:30:32 AM
Since Berkut has already skipped Tamas ulmont might conceivably do so as well on the proviso that French action does not affect either player. But I suppose it's up you.
Quote from: Berkut on May 15, 2009, 08:39:58 AM
Actually, we should not skip him, since I am going to ask him to make a play that could very well effect the protestant player.
Well, shit, I already went ahead on the theory that I was irrelevant. I'm happy to rewind if Tamas has something to play against me.
Well I did my play but just now saw that Berkut was about to ask me something. Since my move was just burning a card, I ask permission to hear out Berk and then maybe change my play.
I have nothing against that.
I do wonder why ulmont's file seemed to skip Berk's file?
If you don't have something useful to do, building more mercs is always a good idea.
Building them in some useful spot is an even better idea...like St. Dizier, for example?
I will offer the following: For every 2 mercs you place in a spot I direct, I will send you another merc next turn, so you are getting two for one.
Or I am open to other arrangements. But the Protestant with his never miss dice is going to start converting France, and I would like to make it a little harder.
Well, Il Papa, the way I see it, you are inches away from winning the game, while Ulmont is miles away from that. So I'll just stick with my original move which is:
France: Play Card as Operations
#35: 1 / Siege Artillery
Message from France:
Move my entire northern fleet to Teh Channel
Quote from: Delirium on May 15, 2009, 08:50:42 AM
I do wonder why ulmont's file seemed to skip Berk's file?
I was deleting email too fast, so I missed Berkut file. It seemed simple enough to reimplement on mine though.
Ok, after all of that fun, Habbaku is up again.
Quote from: ulmont on May 15, 2009, 09:07:07 AMI was deleting email too fast, so I missed Berkut file. It seemed simple enough to reimplement on mine though.
Okay, wasn't sure if you did that. No problem then.
We can actually get a few card plays in now if Habbaku comes here and plays his.
Quote from: Tamas on May 15, 2009, 08:59:07 AM
Well, Il Papa, the way I see it, you are inches away from winning the game, while Ulmont is miles away from that. So I'll just stick with my original move which is:
France: Play Card as Operations
#35: 1 / Siege Artillery
Message from France:
Move my entire northern fleet to Teh Channel
Betrayal!
The Pope declares jihad against the French traitors to the Faith.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#54: 3 / Potosi Silver Mines
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/3 - Control Agram.
2/3 - Control Mohacs.
3/3 - Raise 1 cavalry in Nezh.
Del's up.
And now ofcourse Del isn't around and if he isn't soon I won't be around until tomorrow.
Quote from: ehrie on May 15, 2009, 12:38:15 PM
And now ofcourse Del isn't around and if he isn't soon I won't be around until tomorrow.
Naturally. You could PM someone your play, if it's unlikely to be impacted by the Hapsburgs.
I'm here, doing my move now. Hmm, guess it's too late.
You have 10 minutes before I have to go.
Okay, playing Mercator's Map to send an explorer with a really good map (although it's bound to be Nervaez again).
Someone could just add it to their next file.
England: Play Card as Operations
#27: 2 / Mercenaries Grow Restless
Message from England:
Send an explorer
Tamas is up and may legally pass this round. :P
Okay, if you're heading out I'll do a file with our explorers. If Tamas attempted passing from last round is any indication he'll probably pass legitimately this round. Berkut could probably do his move.
Great minds think a-likely.
I am just playing ireland Revolts for 3 CPs towards St. Petes.
No file coming for that.
Yeah I passed. :P As a matter of fact, I think I'll keep passing.
Ulmont, please redo your Reformation attempts from the French Bible. Bibles do not give bonus dice, they give a +1 DRM to the dice being rolled. 5s become 6s, 1s become 2s, etc.
...edited for goat rodeo.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 15, 2009, 03:58:30 PM
Ulmont, please redo your Reformation attempts from the French Bible. Bibles do not give bonus dice, they give a +1 DRM to the dice being rolled. 5s become 6s, 1s become 2s, etc.
Oh, right, goddammit. I was thinking of the Printing Press. Will redo now.
Ok...committed Olivetan, finished French Bible, converted Liege / Avignon / Toulouse.
QuotePlaying home card for CPs :
1-2/5 - Build 2 corsairs in Scutari.
3/5 - Naval move, 2 corsairs to Adriatic Sea.
4-5/5 - Pirate the Papacy in the Adriatic Sea.
Pirates didn't turn up any loot this time around, alas.
Del's up.
Algiers fell. Moved fleets to block in pirates. Built a merc in Vienna. Moved Charles to attack Buda. Forgot to adjust vp in the file.
England: Play Card as Event
#87: 2 / Mercenaries Demand Pay
Message from England:
Target power loses all mercenaries unless they discard a card immediately. Value of card determines number of mercenaries kept (target power chooses which are kept): 1 CP=2 mercs; 2 CP=4 mercs; 3 CP=6 mercs; 4 CP=10 mercs; 5 or 6 CP=all mercs retained.
All this standing around has made French mercs rather cranky.
Target is Tamas. I don't have a board handy, but I think he has three or 4 mercs in Francis's stack.
I have 3 mercs total, all with my king. I let them die, then, start of my round, I invoke the Sultan to honor our deal and give me my 4 mercs into Boulogne. After which I pass.
Damn Swiss.
Interesting development. Wonder what the French part of the agreement was?
No matter if the Ottomans honour the agreement or not, the Pope is up.
File? Why aren't we sending out files?
Quote from: Berkut on May 16, 2009, 09:29:02 AM
File? Why aren't we sending out files?
Didn't Del send a file? England just nuked French mercs and France passed...
I did send a file.
If Habs does play Swiss Mercenaries Tamas goes up one merc in Boulogne. If he doesn't, Tamas goes down three. That's the only change from my file.
I'm not playing Swiss Mercenaries.
Berkut is...still...up...
Played shipbuilding for 2 CPs to St. Petes.
England does look threatening with their five cards plus their home card, they could possibly convert those into six victory points to win, in case anyone happened to miss that. :bowler:
Protestants are up.
Calvin masterfully defeated Campeggio, converting Limoges, Tours, and Orleans.
Back to the Ottos.
And Del...England also still has their home card, so I'd be real nervous if I was Hapsburgs or France.
Ottomans play Diplomatic Overture to draw some cards and to give France a card.
Off to Del (no file).
Quote from: ulmont on May 17, 2009, 09:59:07 AMAnd Del...England also still has their home card, so I'd be real nervous if I was Hapsburgs or France.
That's exactly what I said. :unsure:
QuoteHapsburgs: Play Card as Operations
#51: 4 / Michael Servetus
Message from Hapsburgs:
2/4 Move Charles back to Vienna.
4/4 Build a colony.
In the interest of helping everyone, including the Ottomans, safeguard against an English win, I voluntarily break the siege of Buda. Peace and prosperity, people. England is up.
England: Play Card as Event
#101: 4 / Smallpox
Message from England:
Playable by England, France, Hapsburgs. Launch a Voyage of Conquest at no additional CP cost. Place the "+2 Smallpox" marker next to the Conquest Underway or Conquest marker for this power. Add this modifier when resolving the voyage during the New World Phase.
Blankets consist of 50% wool, 50% love, 50% death.
Well, there's always this way to win then.
I just made a bet with Habs you'll win this turn, partly by conquering the Incas. I'll hate you for it.
Tamas is up, then. Might I suggest you spread your mercenaries out a bit, please? 1 in Bordeaux and the other 3 in Paris/Rouen would be great.
Sending a file with my and ehrie's plays.
Quote from: Habbaku on May 17, 2009, 03:25:07 PM
Tamas is up, then. Might I suggest you spread your mercenaries out a bit, please? 1 in Bordeaux and the other 3 in Paris/Rouen would be great.
No kidding.
The Protestants hardly need any help.
France: Play Card as Event
#36: 1 / Swiss Mercenaries
Message from France:
3 with my King's stack, 1 to Bordeaux.
Quote from: Delirium on May 17, 2009, 03:23:22 PM
I just made a bet with Habs you'll win this turn, partly by conquering the Incas. I'll hate you for it.
I'm not going to win this turn. Can;t convert enough of England to do it.
Pass
:zzz:
Tamas, I take back what I said about stationing some troops to slow the Protestatns down. It won't make any difference anyway. As long as they get 1 die, they will manage to convert regardl;ess of how many *I* get to roll!
Sorry, missed Berk's post and didn't see anything in the journal.
Published a treatise, had a debate, converted Trier, Worms, Strasburg, and Augsburg, but could not disgrace a papal debater, alas.
Quote from: Berkut on May 18, 2009, 12:37:14 PM
Tamas, I take back what I said about stationing some troops to slow the Protestatns down. It won't make any difference anyway. As long as they get 1 die, they will manage to convert regardl;ess of how many *I* get to roll!
You say that after watching me fail miserably with the French NT and Bible...
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#94: 2 / Revolt of the Communeros
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1-2/2 - Raise 2 cavalry in Nicopolis.
Off to Del.
Quote from: ulmont on May 18, 2009, 12:42:12 PM
Quote from: Berkut on May 18, 2009, 12:37:14 PM
Tamas, I take back what I said about stationing some troops to slow the Protestatns down. It won't make any difference anyway. As long as they get 1 die, they will manage to convert regardl;ess of how many *I* get to roll!
You say that after watching me fail miserably with the French NT and Bible...
Don't even try. Your dice overall on reformation attempts have been obscene.
I'm gonna pass this round. Over to England.
Quote from: ulmont on May 18, 2009, 12:40:42 PM
Sorry, missed Berk's post and didn't see anything in the journal.
Using the forum to stay in touch with the game is generally a good idea.
Quote from: Delirium on May 18, 2009, 03:57:20 PM
Using the forum to stay in touch with the game is generally a good idea.
I read the forum like 80 times a day, obsessively refreshing "Recent Unread Topics," so I'm surprised I missed his post.
I read it 81 times, myself.
England: Play Card as Operations
#69: 3 / Auld Alliance
Message from England:
Place a Colony
I pass
I'll just preemptively pass out this turn, absent someone sieging an electorate of mine.
Pass
Ottomans plan on passing the turn provided the Habsburgs do the same.
Since England merely established a colony this time around, I imagine that Del is going to pass again and wait to see which way Ehrie jumps.
Ehrie's up.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 1
3
Message from England:
Babybabybabybackribs
Anne of Cleves is a whorebagel. Next time I pass I get to take another roll. File coming shortly.
Everyone's passing except you. Since you didn't declare war, methinks that Del's going to keep passing. You may as well play out the rest of your hand as you wish and we can see if Del wants to do something with either of his remaining cards when he gets back on.
Seeing as everybody is going to pass out the turn, I'm just going to finish my turn.
England: Play Card as Event
#48: 2 / Galleons
Message from England:
The Big ships carry the phat lewts.
Can I committ Protty debaters when I publish?
Only if the Protestant player consents to it.
England: Play Card as Operations
#78: 3 / Frederick the Wise
Message from England:
Publish Treatsie in England. I want to committ Latimer if I can. I will assume I can not for now and if I can I will add in the dice later.
Targets are Norwich and Plymouth
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
1
4
Message from England:
1 vs 1 Norwich. Protty first
Fails.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
1
5
2
Message from England:
Plymouth 1 vs 2. Protty first
Bah. Pair of ones. Okay then my next impulse would be to pass. I get to take another marriage roll and the turn is over.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 1
6
Message from England:
Bring on the next wench
Healthy Edward!
Wait we aint done yet. According to da rules I draw I card since I rolled Katherine Howard
England: Play Card as Operations
#104: 3 / Trace Italienne
Message from England:
1 Merc to London, 1x Fleet to Calais.
Now I'm done for the turn.
I included my winter.
I play Copernicus for 2 vp, then I'm done and I guess the turn is as well. Posting my Winter in a bit.
Better yet, I'm doing Winter and New World now.
File sent. Habs did the card draws on acts, we may begin diplomacy.
A reminder here as well. If someone draws Paul III, discard it and draw a new card.
What is the English VP level at? I don't think ACTS is correct.
Quote from: Berkut on May 19, 2009, 08:09:26 AM
What is the English VP level at? I don't think ACTS is correct.
That matches the file.
11 from keys + 5 from Edward + 2 from Amazon + 1 from St. Lawrence + 1 from Maya = 20.
...also, when we do spring deployment files, we should probably grab Caraffa and Pole from the "enter turn 5" tray.
As long as the Protestant space count is valid, I believe both ACTS and the cb file have the correct vp levels.
Quote from: Delirium on May 19, 2009, 09:42:00 AM
As long as the Protestant space count is valid
It matches the board:
0 in England
10 in France (Tours, Orleans, Limoges, Toulouse, Avignon, Grenoble, Lyons, Geneva, Besancon, Liege)
22 in Germany (Munster, Bremen, Hamburg, Lubeck, Stettin, Brunswick, Magdeburg, Brandenburg, Koln, Kassel, Erfurt, Leipzig, Wittenberg, Trier, Mainz, Strasburg, Worms, Nuremberg, Augsburg, Regensburg, Basel, Zurich)
0 in Spain
0 in Italy
0 in Hungary
=
32
Announcement:
Starting six hours from now, I'll be offline for 48+1d8 hours.
I will pm my diplo stuff and SD to the Pope.
Get my PM Del?
:zzz
Ottomans are done. Just waiting on Del to return.
Quote from: Delirium on May 20, 2009, 02:23:34 AM
Starting six hours from now, I'll be offline for 48+1d8 hours.
2009-05-20, 03:23:34 + 6 hours = 2009-05-20 09:23:34.
2009-05-20 09:23:34 + 48 hours = 2009-05-22 09:23:34.
2009-05-22 09:23:34 + 8 hours = 2009-05-22 17:23:34.
And yet, here we are. :bleeding:
Apologies for my absence. I was at a games convention, then at a family gathering and presumed I would be able to log on in between. I was wrong. On the upside, I won a game of Here I Stand as the Habsburgs during the convention, military victory in turn 5. :)
Given this delay I have nothing to announce except a card draw to England.
I have nothing else to announce.
I actually haven't announced, but...
Ottomans will accept a card draw from the French.
Ottomans offer an alliance to the French.
Anyone wanting some last-second talks with me should hurry up.
I confirm both Ottoman declarations.
And FYI, I will be in Munich from tomorrow, so no promises for my speed for next week. :(
The Pope has nothing to confirm and nothing to announce, by default, unless he's made a deal with the Protestants. Tamas needs to give me a random draw in ACTS, as well.
That being the case...Spring deployments need to be posted :
Ottoman SD :
Suleiman, Ibrahim, 12 regulars and 6 cavalry deploy to Mohacs.
SD: a single merc from Vienna to Augsburg.
No SD.
I give this game 4 to 1 odds of finishing.
Quote from: Delirium on May 26, 2009, 04:01:59 PM
I give this game 4 to 1 odds of finishing.
Where, oh where, did Pope Berkut VI disappear to?
:berkut:
Waiting on me? SD all available troops to my northern Italian fortress.
Quote from: Berkut on May 26, 2009, 05:08:45 PM
Waiting on me? SD all available troops to my northern Italian fortress.
Actually, now that I look at the thread again, Tamas-in-Munich, goddammit. I thought he had posted SD earlier, but apparently not.
Indeed. The Euro contingent seems desperate to halt this.
Due to reasons I can't talk about here, I really can't launch CB at the munich office. But I will be home in 1.5 days.
Is there a reason why you can't post your Spring Deployment without cb?
Quote from: Habbaku on May 26, 2009, 10:34:55 PM
The Euro contingent seems desperate to halt this.
I didn't know Berkut and ulmont lived in Europe? :huh:
I dont even know how many forces I have, let alone my opponents and their current disposition, Del.
Quote from: Delirium on May 27, 2009, 07:34:13 AM
Quote from: Habbaku on May 26, 2009, 10:34:55 PM
The Euro contingent seems desperate to halt this.
I didn't know Berkut and ulmont lived in Europe? :huh:
Oh please, nobody is waiting on the Pope.
Quote from: Berkut on May 27, 2009, 07:57:04 AM
Quote from: Delirium on May 27, 2009, 07:34:13 AM
Quote from: Habbaku on May 26, 2009, 10:34:55 PM
The Euro contingent seems desperate to halt this.
I didn't know Berkut and ulmont lived in Europe? :huh:
Oh please, nobody is waiting on the Pope.
And the Protestants can't SD by rule, having no capital and all.
France: Play Card as Event
#102: 3 / Spring Preparations
Message from France:
Add 1 regular to Paris (10+3)
SD Montmercy, 3 regulars, 2 mercenaries to Milan
I see Tamas has decided who he is going to throw this game to.
So the Ottomans are finally up for an impulse?
Quote from: ulmont on May 29, 2009, 08:12:22 AM
So the Ottomans are finally up for an impulse?
Indeed.
I played Threat to Power for CPs :
1/3 - Suleiman and friends to Graz. (Interception failed)
2/3 - Flag Graz.
3/3 - Suleiman and friends to Vienna.
Habsburgs succeeded at the evasion roll, so I need to know if Del wants to fight or not. File incoming.
I'll play Gout on Suleiman when he attacks Vienna which ends that impulse. I then play a 5 cp card to land some guys in Constantinople.
England is up.
Quote from: Berkut on May 29, 2009, 08:06:24 AM
I see Tamas has decided who he is going to throw this game to.
Oh puhleeze. Who massed a huge-ass army against Milan? I just sent reinforcements for the defense.
England: Play Card as Operations
#69: 3 / Auld Alliance
Message from England:
Treatsie in England. Targets are Norwich and London
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
2
6
1
Message from England:
Norwich 2 Protty vs 1 Catholic, protty first
Success
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 7
5
5
3
2
5
4
5
Message from England:
London 3 Protty vs 4 Catholic, protty first
London and Norwich are converted.
File coming shortly, on to Tamas
France: Play Card as Operations
#72: 3 / Cloth Prices Fluctuate
Message from France:
1 merc each to Dijon, Tours, Paris
Papacy: Play Card as Event#57: 2 / Philip of Hesse's Bigamy
Message from Papacy:
Protestant player must either remove Philip of Hesse from the game or discard one card (chosen at random).
Whoremonger
Quote from: Berkut on May 31, 2009, 10:26:11 AM
Protestant player must either remove Philip of Hesse from the game or discard one card (chosen at random).
So long, Phil.
This run of insane dice rolling is truly amazing.
Published 2 treatises in France, converted Bordeaux, Nantes, and Metz. Back to the Ottomans.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#58: 5 / Spanish Inquisition
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/5 - Suleiman and friends attack Vienna.
To Del to potentially evade or play any reactions.
I play Foul Weather on the Ottomans (sorry for taking so long, but as I've warned Habs about, I have much less computer access these days, the HD died in one of my two homes).
Quote from: ulmont on May 31, 2009, 10:47:01 AM
Published 2 treatises in France, converted Bordeaux, Nantes, and Metz. Back to the Ottomans.
Since you didn't care to apply the French file, someone ought to place those merc builds. I suggest Habs.
Quote from: Delirium on June 02, 2009, 04:26:13 AM
Since you didn't care to apply the French file
Missed it, sorry; I did give the Pope his T5 debaters he'd been missing.
I don't have the file handy, but he dropped several French mercs - did your rolls reflect them? Not that it really matters, giving the way you roll dice...
Quote from: Berkut on June 02, 2009, 08:51:02 AM
I don't have the file handy, but he dropped several French mercs - did your rolls reflect them?
They did not, but it wouldn't have changed the outcome. First die was a 6 on Bordeaux and Nantes, Metz was unchanged, and I failed Dijon (which is where the biggest impact would have been).
If you want, I'll reroll the whole thing.
Nah, no need to do that. The Pope has a lot of work to do.
QuoteOttoman: Message
Remaining 4 CPs :
1-3/4 - Raise 3 cavalry in Edirne.
4/4 - 4 cavalry from Edirne move to attack Constantinople.
Off to Del to resolve the fight.
I played Foul Weather, you can't attack.
I think you need to read Foul Weather again.
Quote2 / Foul Weather
RESPONSE Play during another power's impulse just after they have announced they are spending CP to move, assault, initiate piracy, conduct a naval move, or start a naval transport. 1 CP is lost. For the rest of the impulse, no land unit of that power may move more than 1 space; assault, piracy, naval moves, and naval transport are prohibited. All effects last only during this power's impulse. May not be used to stop Treachery! event.
Translation: you may attack next door only.
Why is towards the end of these games someone always stops playing?
Quote from: ehrie on June 03, 2009, 09:24:30 PM
Why is towards the end of these games someone always stops playing?
Why is it when someone says sorry, I won't have access to a computer / I'll have less access to a computer, someone always bitches about them in these kind of games?
Quote from: ulmont on June 03, 2009, 09:38:53 AM
Quote2 / Foul Weather
RESPONSE Play during another power's impulse just after they have announced they are spending CP to move, assault, initiate piracy, conduct a naval move, or start a naval transport. 1 CP is lost. For the rest of the impulse, no land unit of that power may move more than 1 space; assault, piracy, naval moves, and naval transport are prohibited. All effects last only during this power's impulse. May not be used to stop Treachery! event.
Translation: you may attack next door only.
:huh:
No, it says you cannot move more than 1 space and that you cannot assault, do piracy, naval moves or naval transport at all, that's what it says. If there is a card FAQ that says otherwise, fine, if not, I really don't see how you can interpret it any other way.
Quote from: Delirium on June 04, 2009, 08:59:04 AM
Quote from: ulmont on June 03, 2009, 09:38:53 AM
Quote2 / Foul Weather
RESPONSE Play during another power's impulse just after they have announced they are spending CP to move, assault, initiate piracy, conduct a naval move, or start a naval transport. 1 CP is lost. For the rest of the impulse, no land unit of that power may move more than 1 space; assault, piracy, naval moves, and naval transport are prohibited. All effects last only during this power's impulse. May not be used to stop Treachery! event.
Translation: you may attack next door only.
:huh:
No, it says you cannot move more than 1 space and that you cannot assault, do piracy, naval moves or naval transport at all, that's what it says. If there is a card FAQ that says otherwise, fine, if not, I really don't see how you can interpret it any other way.
But he isn't moving more than one space or assaulting or doing any of those things...
Okay. The confusion comes from the distinction between "move" and "assault", we've been playing this card wrong for so long ftf that I didn't bother to look it up in the rules. Makes the card much less powerful and it obviuosly kills my entire turn pretty effectively. Kind of meh. Go on and kill my troops.
I think what you really wanted to do was use Foul eather after he spent his 4th CP, to cancel the 5th, making him lose his attack on Constantinople. But that would mean letting the attack on Vienna happen, of course.
Well, there was no point in playing Gout last turn and then set up the Constantinople attack if he could attack Vienna *and* Constantinople this turn anyway. Wasted two Response cards, 5 cp and 3 troops. And on top of that ehrie accuses me of having stopped playing. :P
QuoteOttoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 8
5
1
3
6
6
6
1
4
Message from Ottoman:
Constantinople.
4 Ottoman vs. 4 Habsburg, Ottoman first.
Something of a wash. 2 hits on each side--2 cavalry die as do 2 Habsburg mercenaries.
The cost to get more troops to Istanbul is rather prohibitive, so I just have to hope that 1 die misses, basically. File coming. Del is up now.
Charles performs a strategic redisposition of forces, picks up his army and moves to Wittenberg, leaving a maxed out garrison in Vienna.
Quote from: Delirium on June 04, 2009, 02:56:34 PM
Charles performs a strategic redisposition of forces, picks up his army and moves to Wittenberg, leaving a maxed out garrison in Vienna.
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Event
#33: 1 / Landsknechts
Message from Protestant:
In response to the announcement of the move to Wittenberg, drop 2 more mercs there.
That puts Ehrie up.
England: Play Card as Operations
#96: 3 / Sale of Moluccas
Message from England:
Publish in England. Targets are Portsmouth and Lincoln
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
1
6
1
4
Message from England:
Portsmouth. 2 vs 2. Protty first
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
5
6
4
Message from England:
Lincoln. 2 vs 1. Protty first
Both convert. Pope Berkut seen crying. On to Tamas File coming shortly.
I'm on to you and ulmont's scheme of converting the world to win. He won't, though. Not sure what to do about you...
So what can I do to stop England from winning?
1. Play events that will let the pope do counter-reformation shit in England.
2. Not let him surprise DoW you and take cheap keys.
3. Steal cards from him.
4. Distract him with silly noises.
Quote from: Tamas on June 05, 2009, 06:17:32 AM
So what can I do to stop England from winning?
It is always funny in HiS when people ask this question after it is much too late...
I think he can still be stopped. Unfortunately, I've been too busy wasting my cards on stupid plays, but I think it can be done, I want a turn 6 dammit.
Quote from: Delirium on June 05, 2009, 01:10:14 AM
I'm on to you and ulmont's scheme of converting the world to win.
I don't think of it so much as a "scheme" as "the obvious Protestant strategy."
Quote from: Delirium on June 05, 2009, 01:10:14 AM
He won't, though.
Says you. Only 11 spaces to go...
We'll see.
Quote from: ulmont on June 05, 2009, 08:47:27 AM
Quote from: Delirium on June 05, 2009, 01:10:14 AM
I'm on to you and ulmont's scheme of converting the world to win.
I don't think of it so much as a "scheme" as "the obvious Protestant strategy."
Quote from: Delirium on June 05, 2009, 01:10:14 AM
He won't, though.
Says you. Only 11 spaces to go...
The dice will turn. France is ripe for counter reformation.
England is the real problem. I don't know how I can counter that.
France: Play Card as Operations
#42: 4 / Roxelana
Message from France:
Place 2 mercs to Paris
Move 4 regulars to Metz
Update the CB please
I could have paid you real money to play that event. :bleeding:
Quote from: Delirium on June 05, 2009, 08:31:50 AM
I think he can still be stopped. Unfortunately, I've been too busy wasting my cards on stupid plays, but I think it can be done, I want a turn 6 dammit.
I didn't mean to say it is too late, although that is in fact exactly what I said.
What I mean is that HiS is a game (and this, IMO, is one of the reasons it is such a great game) that demands a lot of foresight frmo the players - you cannot have the attitude that "Oh, player X only has Y VPs, so we can ignore them..." and expect to have a good shot at winning.
Played 2 CP card to CR in France, flipped Cajetan for an extra space.
Flipped Nantes, Tours, and Orleans.
Over to the heretic.
Sigh. Olivetan/Cajetan debate is a slim Papal victory. Berkut, what do you want to flip in France before I move on?
Grenoble
Good job Pope Berkut. Keep up the good work in France.
And the end result is +1 Protestant spaces for my impulse, or that is to say +0 for the action round.
Back to the Ottomans.
Quote from: ehrie on June 05, 2009, 09:31:52 AM
Good job Pope Berkut. Keep up the good work in France.
Hopefully the Holy Roman Emperor will be giving him something else to worry about.
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 09:52:49 AM
Hopefully the Holy Roman Emperor will be giving him something else to worry about.
:bleeding: No doubt. I actually had a better card to kick the Emperor with, but decided to go with the pointless French stuff instead. :cry:
My plan to leave Cajetan out as bait worked perfectly!
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 10:12:50 AM
My plan to leave Cajetan out as bait worked perfectly!
I'm easy. :Embarrass:
I played Zwingli Dons Armor for CPs, built some cavalry in Edirne, sent the cavalry in Edirne to attack Istanbul...and promptly lost rather annoyingly against the lone regular.
My last CP is used to besiege Vienna (assuming the mercenaries don't stand and fight).
Hell no, siege it is. Doing my turn now.
I will attack Wittenberg, unsurprisingly. No cards. If ulmont replies within five minutes I can still resolve, if not he can do it, applying whatever cards he wants to use.
I play my home card to assault Wittenberg, then place a conquest underway marker. ulmont can resolve, then England can include the result in his file as he's up next.
I resolved anyway since he replied through email. I lost two guys, he lost three so the city didn't fall unfortunately. England can remove the troops and place the conquest underway marker, have to rush out.
England: Play Card as Operations
#26: 3 / Mercenaries Bribed
Message from England:
Spread the good word in England. Target are are Bristol and Plymouth
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
1
4
1
5
3
4
Message from England:
Bristol. 3 Protty vs 3 Papal. Protty first
Fails.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
6
2
Message from England:
Plymouth. 1 vs 1. Protty first
Plymouth Converts. File incoming. On to Tamas
And now we enter the long, dark, wait for the Hungarian...
Have a gypsy in the game might have been a mistake...
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 02:17:07 PM
And now we enter the long, dark, wait for the Hungarian...
Have a gypsy in the game might have been a mistake...
Yeah. Better than a Baltimorewegian though.
My bet is on: Home Card For VP, and holding Foul Weather or some other random trash.
EDIT: And I was right!
France: Message
Playing Home Card for my VP
Quote from: ulmont on June 05, 2009, 02:56:25 PM
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 02:17:07 PM
And now we enter the long, dark, wait for the Hungarian...
Have a gypsy in the game might have been a mistake...
Yeah. Better than a Baltimorewegian though.
My bet is on: Home Card For VP, and holding Foul Weather or some other random trash.
EDIT: And I was right!
lol screw you like I have a better option.
We use Leipzig debate to put Eck up against poor Latimer in England.
Say, what is that smell?
Eck wins 5-1, Latimer is BBQed, and all of Engalnd except London converts back to the True Faith.
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 03:06:10 PM
We use Leipzig debate to put Eck up against poor Latimer in England.
The English debaters are really just destined for the stake. I hate them all.
Home card to first publish a treatise in France and then call a debate.
Calvin v. Cajetan for the 4-0 disgrace.
Orleans, Tours, Nantes, Rouen, St. Dizier, and Brussels flip.
Over to the Ottomans.
That's going to leave a mark.
One thing he didn't bother to mention - he is now at 25 VPs.
And more 6's rolled one crappy conversion attempts.
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 03:47:06 PM
One thing he didn't bother to mention - he is now at 25 VPs.
Yeah, that's going to last until right about Del's next impulse.
Just thought I would point it out, in case anyone has cards that might help keep this game going until turn 6...
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 03:50:13 PM
Just thought I would point it out, in case anyone has cards that might help keep this game going until turn 6...
Yeah, like if Del has a 1-CP card in hand to assault Wittenberg.
You have proven that you can rustle up a couple more VPs at will, simply by finding some spot that you can roll a die or two against 8 Papal dice to convert.
Worse, at this rate now he can just complete the english new testament and go to town there.
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 03:55:49 PM
You have proven that you can rustle up a couple more VPs at will, simply by finding some spot that you can roll a die or two against 8 Papal dice to convert.
And yet, I'm still 10 spaces away from my religious victory.
Quote from: Berkut on June 05, 2009, 08:05:59 AM
Quote from: Tamas on June 05, 2009, 06:17:32 AM
So what can I do to stop England from winning?
It is always funny in HiS when people ask this question after it is much too late...
The difference between a competent HiS player and an incompetent one is the competent one is telling you what you need to do before you realize that England will soon be in a position to win.
Quote from: Viking on June 05, 2009, 07:33:50 PM
The difference between a competent HiS player and an incompetent one is the competent one is telling you what you need to do before you realize that England will soon be in a position to win.
I tried to warn them about the Ottomans, but they wouldn't listen. :rolleyes:
The Ottomans assaulted Vienna, inflicting 2 losses to each side. The city stands.
I also raised 1 cavalry for another relief force for Istanbul. We'll see how that goes later...
Off to Del again.
Played a 5 cp card. First one assaulted Wittenberg with a single loss each, luckily that's enough. Remaining 4 cp lands 4 guys from Algiers in Constantinople.
England is up.
England: Play Card as Operations
#45: 1 / Calvin Expelled
Message from England:
Fleet move: 4x Fleets in Calais to the North Sea. 1x Fleets in Portsmouth to the Channel
Can you update the file, tamas?
Quote from: Delirium on June 06, 2009, 04:04:53 AM
Remaining 4 cp lands 4 guys from Algiers in Constantinople.
You don't have a squadron in Barbary Coast. You can't do this.
I pass
Quote from: Habbaku on June 06, 2009, 09:51:49 AMYou don't have a squadron in Barbary Coast. You can't do this.
But apart from that it's a really good move! Sorry about that, was meaning to move the guys from Naples, then I thought, "wow, that's four guys in Algiers, bring 'em instead"!
Change that to 2 guys from Naples.
And, over to the Pope.
Fixed the Haps move, implemented the English move, France was skipped.
Treatise in France, flipped 3 spaces.
Prots are up.
I swear, it's like Groundhog Day.
Finished the English New Testament, converted Norwich, Lincoln, Portsmouth, Plymouth. Remaining 2 CPs into the English Bible.
Over to the Ottomans.
Took a chance and it paid off...
Quote#97: 2 / Scots Raid
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/2 - Raise 1 cavalry in Edirne.
2/2 - 3 cavalry in Edirne attack Istanbul.
The resulting battle was 2/0 hits for Ottomans/Habsburgs, respectively. Habsburg troops are pushed into the sea.
File coming shortly. Off to Del.
Obvious game logic, as long as I didn't reinforce, you couldn't hit for toffee. When I spend an additional 4 cp to actually take Constantinople, you win instantly. :rolleyes:
I pass this round.
Remind me, did we ever see a healthy Eddie, or is it going to be Mary next turn?
Quote from: ulmont on June 07, 2009, 03:57:48 PM
Remind me, did we ever see a healthy Eddie, or is it going to be Mary next turn?
Edward is currently healthy. Mary becomes a spinster.
England: Message
Home Card. Dow the Hapsburgs.
4 CP to take Henry, the Duke of Suffolk, & 5+5 to Calais. Then both leaders 6+7 beseige Antwerp. Del may fight. Please. Pretty please.
Unpaid Mercenaries or Mercenaries Grow Restless would be amusing right now.
Let it be known I wasn't going to war this turn, originally. Del is a layup in Brandenburg and his Conquest from winning, though.
Tamas is probably passing, so we played our HC to exco Calvin and call a debate, which we promptly lost 1-2. Flip yet another French space. No file coming.
Actually, I will send a file. I haven't updated the sapce yet though, of course.
Quote from: ehrie on June 07, 2009, 04:37:23 PM
Let it be known I wasn't going to war this turn, originally. Del is a layup in Brandenburg and his Conquest from winning, though.
You choose to forget 200k Turks outside Vienna, I will be down to 21 and couldn't win. Your analysis fails.
Two vp's from Antwerp will do it for you though, along with two more English spaces. Attacking Antwerp is an obvious and effective move at this stage and you do it to win, nothing else. I wouldn't want you to develop a consience all of a sudden, that could be troublesome for you. :P
Quote from: Delirium on June 08, 2009, 02:11:43 AM
Quote from: ehrie on June 07, 2009, 04:37:23 PM
Let it be known I wasn't going to war this turn, originally. Del is a layup in Brandenburg and his Conquest from winning, though.
You choose to forget 200k Turks outside Vienna, I will be down to 21 and couldn't win. Your analysis fails.
Two vp's from Antwerp will do it for you though, along with two more English spaces. Attacking Antwerp is an obvious and effective move at this stage and you do it to win, nothing else. I wouldn't want you to develop a consience all of a sudden, that could be troublesome for you. :P
:pope:
Protestant: Play Card as Operations
#80: 1 / Gabelle Revolt
Message from Protestant:
Free French space is Marseilles.
1+3 from Mainz walk over to Trier.
Vienna manages to hold out a bit longer--only 1 hit for each side.
File coming shortly. Del's up.
At least that's good news.
I'll pass this round as well, but I'll probably play next round.
England: Play Card as Event
#105: 5 / Treachery
Message from England:
There's two things Del hates. People who are intolerant of other cultures and the treacherous Dutch.
No access to a board, can someone update a file and send it out please?
Ehrie, you have to roll for Treachery. I'll do it as part of the update.
Quote105 5 / Treachery
Play against any fortified space that is currently under siege, even a space where a besieging power does not meet the requirements for assault (either because of a lack of a LOC or because of the presence of naval units). Immediately initiate an assault by a besieging power on the units within the fortifications. If after the assault, the besieging units still outnumber the units within, apply these results: all defending units are eliminated; defending leaders are captured; space becomes controlled by besieging power.
Henry loses 2 dudes and takes Antwerp.
Tamas is up, but I think Berkut can assume he's passing.
Quote from: ulmont on June 08, 2009, 01:38:48 PM
Henry loses 2 dudes and takes Antwerp.
Tamas is up, but I think Berkut can assume he's passing (especially since he didn't even bother to confirm he passed last round).
I did say I pass last round. :huh: And I pass now again.
Quote from: Tamas on June 08, 2009, 01:50:16 PM
I did say I pass last round. :huh: And I pass now again.
So you did, so you do.
Play a 3CP card to accomplish nothing at all.
Successfully assaulted Trier, then built a couple of mercs in Brandenberg.
Back to the Ottomans.
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 01:09:57 PMThere's two things Del hates. People who are intolerant of other cultures and the treacherous Dutch.
Right about the second part, but the first part is not the way I intend my signature to be interpreted.
Anti-climactic sack of Vienna--the city finally falls.
I also started the rebuilding of my navy on the off-chance the game goes another turn. Unless the Habsburgs can take an electorate or Berkut manages to convert some spaces, things are looking grim.
I don't think I've ever played a game of Here I Stand where so much of France was converted.
Since most of you don't seem interested in doing anything to keep the game going except for what gives them cards and/or victory points I don't see why I should bother. But then I remembered it's been this way from the beginning so what the hell.
2 cp card, first moves Charles to Brandenburg with eleven guys. Second builds a merc in Naples.
I pass for the rest of the turn.
If I had any means of actually aiding the anti-Protestant efforts, I'd have made use of them by now.
Don't worry, I can certainly keep both of them from winning without any help from anyone else! That way my dice have been, they are totally doomed.
After all, my rate of conversion over the last two rounds has been -1 Papal space per 5 CPs spent!
Well, if England is passing, looks like Berkut's up again, to put the nail in my coffin for the turn.
*sigh*
Quote from: ulmont on June 08, 2009, 02:50:25 PM
Well, if England is passing, looks like Berkut's up again, to put the nail in my coffin for the turn.
*sigh*
Sigh? What are you sighing about? You've had epic dice all game.
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 02:53:44 PM
Sigh? What are you sighing about? You've had epic dice all game.
1) Berkut or Delirium are going to knock me down to 24 VP.
2) Then you, @#*&^* that you are, are going to hit 25 next turn.
Always the bridesmaid, never the bride.
That and I could have done better if I'd thought more about the League, and timing the New Testaments to all pop at once.
Quote from: ulmont on June 08, 2009, 02:54:52 PM
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 02:53:44 PM
Sigh? What are you sighing about? You've had epic dice all game.
1) Berkut or Delirium are going to knock me down to 24 VP.
2) Then you, @#*&^* that you are, are going to hit 25 next turn.
Always the bridesmaid, never the bride.
That and I could have done better if I'd thought more about the League, and timing the New Testaments to all pop at once.
I have not won yet. And I've finished in 2nd in every Languish HIS game I've been in I think. :P
Quote from: Berkut on June 08, 2009, 02:46:45 PM
:o
You are not included, we've had a great partnership throughout the game.
:lmfao:
This is just classic.
Played Diplo Mrraige for 5 CPs, because that is just how I like to play that card.
First 2 we counter-reform in France, flip a couple of spaces.
Then we call a debate,a dn get the amtch up we hope for: Pole (3) against a commited Olivetan (1), for a nice 6 against 2 roll. Which is a complete whiff, of course. Second round is Bullinger against my worst guy, which the prots win, 1-2.
net effect of this 5 CP card: +1 space for the Pope, which is really great since that evens me out to a net 0 over my last 10 CPs played!
I hate this game.
Let me know what space you want to flip and I will send out the file. I flipped Dijon and Orleans ion the CR.
I'll take Nice.
Just for the record...my last card cannot harm the Protestants. If someone is hoping that I can stop them, well, I can't anymore.
I have 8 dice to kill 3 protestants, obviously I need some luck.
The Hapsburg camp in Brandenberg turned out to be unsanitary to the tune of 3 regulars + 1 merc.
Scratch that, we just saw Unsanitary Camp for the first time in the game.
Game over.
Yup, game over.
Wow
Quote from: Delirium on June 08, 2009, 03:17:22 PM
Scratch that, we just saw Unsanitary Camp for the first time in the game.
Don't you still have 6 dice to kill 3 Protestants with, or at least give the old college try?
Lemme check that map.
Once again I must say, there are way too many VP in this game.
Never mind.
I can't see that kind of luck at this stage in the game.
Got nothing to lose by trying....
This was just handed to me...
I pass.
Give it the old College try, Del.
Quote from: Delirium on June 08, 2009, 03:33:40 PM
This was just handed to me...
I pass.
You pass? Passing means you are ending the game.
After Habbaku had a chance to play or pass, that is.
Not necessarily. I pass as well.
Tamas is going to play his card, I believe.
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 03:34:30 PMYou pass? Passing means you are ending the game.
No, there are other players active after me, I get a new shot next round.
France: Play Card as Event
#106: 3 / Unpaid Mercenaries
Message from France:
With everyone passing before me, I play this to remove the 2 Protestant mercs from Brandenburg
Quote from: Delirium on June 08, 2009, 03:35:25 PM
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 03:34:30 PMYou pass? Passing means you are ending the game.
No, there are other players active after me, I get a new shot next round.
Ahhh, okay.
Quote from: Tamas on June 08, 2009, 03:35:39 PM
France: Play Card as Event
#106: 3 / Unpaid Mercenaries
Message from France:
With everyone passing before me, I play this to remove the 2 Protestant mercs from Brandenburg
You sly Magyar you. There's hope for you, yet.
I can't help but think that card had my name on it.
He just managed to catch me on Google Talk. I underestimated the Hungarian, I did.
I do hope that if Del manages to take Brandenburg that Berkut will consider just not playing any cards next turn. I think the Protestants lose more when he does that.
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 03:36:58 PM
I can't help but think that card had my name on it.
:cry:
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 03:36:58 PM
I can't help but think that card had my name on it.
Yes. :(
Well, the Pope's up.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 08, 2009, 03:37:34 PM
I do hope that if Del manages to take Brandenburg that Berkut will consider just not playing any cards next turn. I think the Protestants lose more when he does that.
:cry:
Pass
Quote from: Habbaku on June 08, 2009, 03:37:34 PM
I do hope that if Del manages to take Brandenburg that Berkut will consider just not playing any cards next turn. I think the Protestants lose more when he does that.
:lol:
Alright, can Del get 1 hit on 6 dice? The moment of Truth!
Assuming ulmont and Habs pass, I play my last card to attack Brandenburg.
Quote from: Delirium on June 08, 2009, 03:49:36 PM
Assuming ulmont and Habs pass, I play my last card to attack Brandenburg.
0 cards, Del.
KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!
Well, another turn. Praise Jesus.
The game lives for yet a few minutes!
Second cp builds a merc in Innsbruck. I'm done, going to bed. See you in turn 6!
Yay.
Assuming Habs / Ehrie / Berkut are passing out, if someone would be so kind as to handle the end-of-turn garbage?
And I believe there's a flag to set on ACTS for Edward now?
I will handle the end-of-turn stuff when people are done posting their winters, sure.
Ottoman winter :
1 cavalry from Nezh to Edirne.
1 cavalry from Sofia to Istanbul.
1 regular from Buda to Istanbul.
1 regular from Belgrade to Istanbul.
9 regulars, 1 cavalry and both leaders from Vienna to Istanbul.
No winter for the Pope. He is too busy converting to Calvinism.
French winter:
Mercs from Dijon and Tours, and everything from Milan except for Montmercy and 4 regulars, go to Paris
My Winter:
All Fleets to Calais
Henry, Brandon, 4+0 back to London, 0+3 to Calais leaving 2+2 in Antwerp. I'll do the French and Ottoman Winters and do the New World garbage. Also taking the -1 card off of me as that shoulda been taken off at the start of this turn.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 08, 2009, 04:06:30 PM
I will handle the end-of-turn stuff when people are done posting their winters, sure.
Ottoman winter :
1 cavalry from Nezh to Edirne.
1 cavalry from Sofia to Istanbul.
1 regular from Buda to Istanbul.
1 regular from Belgrade to Istanbul.
9 regulars, 1 cavalry and both leaders from Vienna to Istanbul.
Habbaku, don't think you can do all that. There aren't enough pieces to break everything down.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
1
5
Message from England:
Cortez takes a shot at the Incas. +4 drm
Since you need an 11 to get the Incas I assume that means Del gets nothing. Lemme check the rules.
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 09:08:29 PM
Habbaku, don't think you can do all that. There aren't enough pieces to break everything down.
I checked in my own file before I posted my winter--there are plenty of pieces to allow it once you combine a lot of the stray 1-pointers.
Quote from: ehrie on June 08, 2009, 09:18:26 PM
Since you need an 11 to get the Incas I assume that means Del gets nothing. Lemme check the rules.
It's on the reference card, which is included in the CB. He needs an 11--and thus Cortez is sent back with nothing.
Okay, lemme try again then.
Got it. Okay rolling new world now.
Please do not end the turn in ACTS unless you know what you're doing. Turn 6 is coming up and the Heir value needs to be set properly.
Do check this file when you get it Habbaku. I had to move so many pieces around I may have made a mistake.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
6
3
4
3
Message from England:
English Colonies
+1 Card, No Effect.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
1
1
Message from England:
French Colony
Scalped by natives.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
6
6
2
3
1
5
Message from England:
Hapsburg Colonies
+1 Card, No effect, No effect
I'm not touching ACTS. I've never done that before and I know turn 6 has a lot to do.
One of the cavalry you placed in Istanbul should be in Edirne, instead, but otherwise it looks fine.
I'm not going to end the turn on ACTS or deal cards until Del posts his winter, though. Of course, if he feels confident (or reads the module notes) he should feel free to end it when he does so.
Sending out a file with my Winter. Don't want to do the ACTS thing.
On ehrie's Winter, it looked like you sent guys from Antwerp to Calais. You can't do that, from a controlled fortress you can only go to your capital.
Good times.
Turn ended, cards dealt. Diplomacy starts now.
I did mistakenly assign the wrong hand size to Ulmont, though. The Protestants need to draw another card.
If anyone has the any of the counter-reformation cards, mandatory or otherwise, please contact me. They need to be played in the most advantageous manner possible if we want to knock the Prots down a step or two.
PM sent.
Now, as soon as you feel ready you may start sending me tokens of appreciation for my prolonging the game although I knew I would lose most of what I had in doing so. Anything will do.
Alright I am willing to help stopping the protestant bastards (England and Protties) from winning, but I want help. Namely a card or two.
Thank you for proving my point! :P
All right, to be fair you did play the merc card on ulmont, that was Right.
I think I was shorted a card. 3 from keys 1 from Henry 1 Held 1 from colony yet I was dealt to five cards in my hand instead of six. Can someone confirm?
Quote from: ehrie on June 09, 2009, 08:00:29 AM
I think I was shorted a card. 3 from keys 1 from Henry 1 Held 1 from colony yet I was dealt to five cards in my hand instead of six. Can someone confirm?
Did you play Fuggers? There is a -1 card marker on your monarch.
you played Fuggers on Turn 4 - maybe someone forgot to remove the marker?
Yah looks like the marker wasn't removed.
OK, lets start announcing diplo.
Ottomans have no announcements and no DoWs.
France announces an alliance with Habsburg and Pope, and in case of acceptance of the latter at least, declares war on England. ACTS cardplay shall commence.
Slow down tiger, DOWs come after the diplo phase.
Quote from: Berkut on June 10, 2009, 01:37:24 PM
Slow down tiger, DOWs come after the diplo phase.
Alright pussycat, but Habs already declared the obvious (no DoW) so I am also declaring the obvious, to save time. I even left instructions. namely, if you dont accept my alliance, I declare no war on England.
I will, of course, accept the alliance, as discussed. Just saying that it could matter in your case. Both the Hapsburgs and England announce before you, and knowing that you are going to DOW Engalnd could change how that plays out, at least in theory.
Quote from: Berkut on June 10, 2009, 01:42:25 PM
I will, of course, accept the alliance, as discussed. Just saying that it could matter in your case. Both the Hapsburgs and England announce before you, and knowing that you are going to DOW Engalnd could change how that plays out, at least in theory.
Yeah I know, it's just that I am fairly sure everyone handled that DoW as a certanity.
No announcements. No Dows. Come and get me.
Alliance with Pope Berk Paul VII and La France. Eagerly applauding war with England.
Confirm alliance with both the Hapsburgs and France.
Obviously no announcements, almost as obviously no DoWs. We begin!
Well, France is DOWing England, and will need to toss a card to pay for it.
Meanwhile, though, we can do spring deployments :
Suleiman, Ibrahim, 11 regulars and 2 cavalry deploy to Vienna.
I played my DoW card
Papacy sends 2 mercs from Florence and 2 mercs from Modena to Turin.
Quote from: Berkut on June 11, 2009, 12:43:31 PM
Papacy sends 2 mercs from Florence and 2 mercs from Modena to Turin.
That doesn't make any sense. Are you sure you've played this game before?
Sigh. What a pain in the ass you people are, with your rules and procedures.
Fine, SD 3+1 from Rome to Turin.
:blush:
All four regulars in Valladolid to Coruna.
Any particular reason why England and France don't want to post their SDs?
I am waiting for England.
Hmm, yes so you are. Good reason.
Both leaders, 5+0 to Antwerp
Quick Tamas, post your SD and we can be on our way!
I have a horrible feeling ehrie was a half hour late and we have to wait another 24 hours. :bleeding:
Francis plus 8 regulars from Paris to Brussels
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Event
#45: 1 / Calvin Expelled
Message from Ottoman:
Remove the Calvin reformer and debater from the map for the rest of the turn. Both return to play at the start of the next turn (replace the reformer in Geneva). Commit Calvin.
The Ottomans engage in part 1 of their anti-Protestant assistance package. Let's hope that the Pope can do something with it.
File coming--off to Del.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 12, 2009, 12:23:27 PM
The Ottomans engage in part 1 of their anti-Protestant assistance package.
:rolleyes:
You are 9 average (for you, lucky bastard) rolls away from an auto-victory. Don't want to hear it.
I play Shipbuilding to place two squadrons on the Atlantic Coast. England is up.
England: Play Card as Operations
#68: 5 / Andrea Doria
Message from England:
Damnit for me not being able to play this as an event.
1/5 Naval Move: Royal Navy to the North Sea
3/5 Move 3+2 from London to Antwerp
4/5 Henry, Brandon, 10+3, leaving 1 merc in brussels goes and says Oh Hai to Francis.
Is a file too much to ask for?
Once my turn is resolved I will send out a file.
Quote from: ehrie on June 12, 2009, 05:06:37 PM4/5 Henry, Brandon, 10+3, leaving 1 merc in brussels goes and says Oh Hai to Francis.
In my file Francis is in Brussels so I assume you mean you leave 1 merc in Antwerp. You could also roll for evasion in advance and if failed, declare if you'll use any combat cards. That would speed up play.
#25: 1 / Field Artillery
Message from France:
Playing it for combat, so as I see its 14 english dice vs. 13 french ones.
Anyone objects to me resolving? Ehrie did not state any CCs...
Guess you could resolve, but ehrie has 1 cp left so you couldn't do your move anyway...
I'll do it since I have a CP left. Rolling now.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 14
4
3
1
5
6
6
2
4
6
6
3
1
3
4
Message from England:
English attack dice 13 Units + Henry.
5 French Regulars eat it.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 13
6
2
3
1
1
5
5
3
1
5
3
1
3
Message from England:
French Defense 8 Units + Francis(1) + Arty(3) + Defender(1) = 13
4 hits. 1+3 brave Englishman die. Francis has to pick where he runs off to then I'll finish my turn.
FFS of course I lose by a single hit! Because those are 5 units, Ehrie
I retreat to St. Quentin.
1 Merc to Calais for my last CP. Tamas can you put all of this in a file when you do your turn? I don't have a board handy now.
Uhm, without a leader you can only move 4 sps per cp spent. I will be a nice guy and not ask for a reroll, bu will leave a merc of you home
France: Play Card as Operations
#12: 2 / Master of Italy
Message from France:
Move 4 mercs from Paris to St. Quentin
Francis, 3 plus 4 attack Brussels
CC?
Sorta.
England: Play Card as Event
#31: 2 / Foul Weather
Message from England:
No attack for j00
WTF does that card do again?
You lose a CP and nobody can move more than one space. So I assume you will just have the mercs link with Francis?
Quote from: Tamas on June 13, 2009, 09:28:08 AM
WTF does that card do again?
Quote2 / Foul Weather
RESPONSE Play during another power's impulse just after they have announced they are spending CP to move, assault, initiate piracy, conduct a naval move, or start a naval transport. 1 CP is lost. For the rest of the impulse, no land unit of that power may move more than 1 space; assault, piracy, naval moves, and naval transport are prohibited. All effects last only during this power's impulse. May not be used to stop Treachery! event.
So you're down to 1 CP for the impulse and you can only move any given piece 1 space.
Yeah I drop the attack, obviously
That puts the Pope up.
Used Leipzig to call a debate between Eck and Olivetan, which Eck won handily, sending Olivetan to hell and flipping two spaces.
Good, good. This turn started out quite okay, except for England winning in Bruxelles, of course.
Quote from: Tamas on June 13, 2009, 09:03:45 AM
Uhm, without a leader you can only move 4 sps per cp spent. I will be a nice guy and not ask for a reroll, bu will leave a merc of you home
He went from 1/5 to 3/5 with that move so I think he spent two cps to move all five actually.
Quote from: Delirium on June 13, 2009, 02:11:37 PM
Quote from: Tamas on June 13, 2009, 09:03:45 AM
Uhm, without a leader you can only move 4 sps per cp spent. I will be a nice guy and not ask for a reroll, bu will leave a merc of you home
He went from 1/5 to 3/5 with that move so I think he spent two cps to move all five actually.
yeah, to move them 2 spaces
Of course. You're right. :blush:
Quote from: Berkut on June 13, 2009, 11:54:01 AM
Used Leipzig to call a debate between Eck and Olivetan, which Eck won handily, sending Olivetan to hell and flipping two spaces.
:bash: Goddamn Eck.
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Operations
#73: 5 / Diplomatic Marriage
Message from Protestant:
+5 CP to English Bible.
No file for that.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#96: 3 / Sale of Moluccas
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/3 - Suleiman, Ibrahim, 11 regulars and 2 cavalry to Linz.
2/3 - Control Linz.
3/3 - Same group besieges Prague.
Off to Del.
England is up, no file sent just gave and drew cards.
Why is it that when the game is almost over someone always stops playing? :rolleyes:
England: Message
Home Card for CPS
1/5 Assault Brussels
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 11
3
1
2
2
2
2
4
4
1
3
6
Message from England:
First 10 English attack last one Chin defense
:bleeding: Lose one regular. That's just...gah. Well the hell with this seige then.
2/5 Henry, Brandon 8+0 go back to Calais
5/5 Publish in England. Targets are Bristol and Shrewsbury
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
4
2
5
4
4
5
Message from England:
Bristol. 4 Protty vs 2 Papal. Prot first
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
5
4
3
2
2
3
Message from England:
Success. Shrewsbury. 3 Vs 3 Prot first
Both convert. File coming shortly.
BTW. ACTS has 43 Protty spaces, but the game file has 41. Not sure which one is right.
Quote from: ehrie on June 15, 2009, 08:57:59 AM
BTW. ACTS has 43 Protty spaces, but the game file has 41. Not sure which one is right.
Looks like the game file; I don't think Berkut adjusted ACTS after roasting Olivetan.
Spaces (41):
England (7):
Shrewsbury, Lincoln, Norwich, Bristol, Plymouth
Portsmouth, London
Germany (22):
Munster, Bremen, Hamburg, Lubeck, Stettin
Koln, Kassel, Brunswick, Magdeburg, Brandenburg
Erfurt, Leipzig, Wittenberg, Trier, Mainz
Strasburg, Worms, Nuremberg, Regensburg, Basel
Zurich, Augsburg
France (12):
Brussels, Liege, St. Dizier, Metz, Besancon
Bordeaux, Limoges, Lyons, Geneva, Toulouse
Grenoble, Marseilles
Tamas is up.
Thank you Pope Obvious IX.
Quote from: Delirium on June 15, 2009, 02:08:21 AM
Why is it that when the game is almost over someone always stops playing? :rolleyes:
:lol:
Well played.
Quote from: ehrie on June 15, 2009, 11:27:51 AM
Thank you Pope Obvious IX.
I like to prod him when I notice him posting in other threads but not in this one.
We are brain-surgeoning my HDD so dont expect any answers for at least a couple of hours
France: Play Card as Operations
#46: 5 / Calvin's Institutes
Message from France:
2 squadrons in Marseille move to Brest
No file for this
They cannot reach that far.
Lyon
Barbary
Gibraltar
Atlantic
Biscay
Ah yes. Bay of Biscay then.
Actually Tamas, take abck that move for the moment.
I have Treachery. What is it worth to you to have me play it on Antwerp during my move if you go place it under siege right now?
I mean to suggest something like this after England finished their move, but then I forgot about it when I prodded you!
Quote from: Berkut on June 15, 2009, 03:24:05 PM
Actually Tamas, take abck that move for the moment.
I have Treachery. What is it worth to you to have me play it on Antwerp during my move if you go place it under siege right now?
I mean to suggest something like this after England finished their move, but then I forgot about it when I prodded you!
Okay I am taking my move back until we negotiate this :P
I dont see why should I pay for it: if you dont play it, Ehrie probably wins. And I would be still far from winning, with my mainland exposed to the English. So I say I put antwerp under siege, and you play that card, both in the interest of giving both of us the chance to see next turn.
Pfft, no chance. It is 5 CPs, a huge card, which would get me a treatise in England and a debate in the same. That would get me VPs and knock the English down a VP, maybe even two. From the standpoint of keeping him from winning, it is likely a wash.
Going to have to offer me something I am afraid, otherwise I will play it right now for a treatise and debate.
In fact, the more I think about it, the more I think that there isn't much you can give me to make it worth playing in that manner. I think I will just hang onto it for now, and leave the threat hanging over his head. Hold onto a card large enough to besiege on of his keys till the end of the turn, and if we need to do so in order to keep him from winning, we can.
4 CP for a treatise in England and France.
Flipped 1 English and 2 French spaces.
Fine, just make him win. :P
My naval move stands then.
Quote from: Tamas on June 15, 2009, 04:07:49 PM
Fine, just make him win. :P
My naval move stands then.
Most of the time that England wins it is because France was too passive against them.
Perhaps, if in fact England wins, this won't be one of those times.
Finished the English Bible, converted Shrewsbury, York, Carlisle, Berwick.
England is now at 26 VP, Protestants at 42 spaces.
My VPs are wrong. I should be at 27. 5 from Protty spaces + 13 from Keys + 5 from Edward + 4 from the New World = 27.
Suleiman takes Prague with little trouble and raises his navy back to a certain degree of strength.
Part 2 of my anti-Protestant campaign will take place next impulse, most likely, but I'm afraid there's little I can do against the English at the moment. If the Habsburgs have the CPs for it, I can help them take Antwerp provided that the French do something to hold down the troops in Calais.
File's out--off to the Habsburgs.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 15, 2009, 05:36:19 PM
Part 2 of my anti-Protestant campaign will take place next impulse, most likely,
<_<
Quote from: ulmont on June 15, 2009, 04:20:40 PM
Finished the English Bible, converted Shrewsbury, York, Carlisle, Berwick.
England is now at 26 VP, Protestants at 42 spaces.
Why would you do that?
There is not much chance of stopping England now.
Quote from: Berkut on June 15, 2009, 06:00:37 PM
Quote from: ulmont on June 15, 2009, 04:20:40 PM
Finished the English Bible, converted Shrewsbury, York, Carlisle, Berwick.
England is now at 26 VP, Protestants at 42 spaces.
Why would you do that?
Most / best conversion attempts for the CP. 50-space auto-victory has been my only hope for several turns.
Quote from: Berkut on June 15, 2009, 06:00:54 PM
There is not much chance of stopping England now.
Unless you convert some spaces or one of either Antwerp or Calais falls to Treachery, sure. Not exactly that difficult to do so long as France and the Habsburgs are willing to pour the CPs in.
As I said, I am helping in what way I can--I will knock the Protestants down a bit more and might be able to do the same to England.
Looks pretty difficult, but let's give it a try at least.
Hapsburgs: Play Card as Operations
#90: 5 / Printing Press
Message from Hapsburgs:
1/5 Move fleets.
2-5/5 Build 4 mercs in Brussels.
England: Play Card as Event
#18: 2 / Dragut
Message from England:
Barbarossa departs this earth.
1/2 Naval Move - Move the Royal Navy to the Channel. Both Del and Tamas have intercept decisions.
Well now with England past 25VPs, I expect the Pope to keep hold of Treachery and play it as soon as I lay siege to an English key.
I need an about an hour before I can access CB, but how is interception handled? Del decides first and I can see his success/failure and if yes, will battle wait until I do my interception attempt(s)?
Checking rules now.
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack. Each such attempt
is resolved separately and the owning player chooses the order of
those attempts. If multiple stacks from different enemy powers all
want to intercept, resolve the intercept attempts in Impulse Order.
Once one power succeeds, no other power may attempt an interception
(even if that other power is an ally of the intercepting power).
I read this as saying that Tamas can combine his five squadrons into a single interception attempt, but that French and Habsburg fleets cannot both intercept.
So a single roll for the entire French navy is what we want, and the Habsburg fleet will not intercept (since they cannot join a fight and won't fight alone against the Royal Navy)
ehrie can roll and go on if Tamas fails.
What the heck does "Each such attempt is resolved seperatly and the owning player chooses the order of those attempts" mean then? I'm thinking the line you bolded means they can fight together, but must roll their intercepts seperatly.
If the enemy has a small force you want to divide your forces as well to increase chances of someone finding.
Edit on your edit: I don't think that is what it says; "attempt to intercept as a single stack" to me is a single roll, if not the entire sentence is pointless.
I am not sure. I am leaning toward Del's interpretation, because that is how it makes sense, but I am obviously biased. :P
We need a ruling on this, since it can decide the game.
It's crystal clear to me, but sure, we can wait for other opinions.
What is there to decide? The rules are perfectly clear. If multiple stacks are adjacent, the owning player can choose the order to resolve their interception, but once one power intercepts, no other powers can do so.
I jsut don't understand the point of the second sentence then under your interpretation. I believe the bolded one is telling the player that unlike land interceptions, naval ones all happen at the same time and the single stack all fights together.
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 08:49:45 AM
What is there to decide? The rules are perfectly clear. If multiple stacks are adjacent, the owning player can choose the order to resolve their interception, but once one power intercepts, no other powers can do so.
The rules seems to imply that I can combine my 2 stacks into one for interception-checking purposes
I'm sorry but I just don't see how you can read it any other way than that there is a single roll if you want.
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 08:52:36 AM
I'm sorry but I just don't see how you can read it any other way than that there is a single roll if you want.
But Del, if two powers can't intercept why would the the rules say each such attempt to intercept must be resolved seperatly if you can fight from two different sea zones together? When would you ever choose to roll seperatly if you could roll together?
Quote from: ehrie on June 16, 2009, 08:51:11 AM
I jsut don't understand the point of the second sentence then under your interpretation. I believe the bolded one is telling the player that unlike land interceptions, naval ones all happen at the same time and the single stack all fights together.
But the end of the fourth bullet says exactly that:
QuoteAll stacks that successfully intercept are combined into a single stack (and will fight as a combined force in the naval combat in Step 7 below).
By your reading the second sentence is completely redundant.
Quote from: ehrie on June 16, 2009, 08:51:11 AM
I jsut don't understand the point of the second sentence then under your interpretation. I believe the bolded one is telling the player that unlike land interceptions, naval ones all happen at the same time and the single stack all fights together.
Quote from: TamasThe rules seems to imply that I can combine my 2 stacks into one for interception-checking purposes
Yes, they can in fact all stack and fight together, but that doesn't mean they all roll together.
The rules imply nothing at all, they clearly state that once all intercepts are resolved, the intercepting power can fight as a single stack - it says absolutely NOTHING about rolling interceptions together, and in fact explicitly states that they are rolled seperately, in whatever order the owning player decides.
ehire moves.
Now we go in turn order, so Haps decides if he wants to try to intercept.
Habs chooses not to. (If he chose to intercept and succeeded with even 1 squadron, nobody else can intercept)
France decides if he wants to intercept, he does.
He rolls each adjacent stacks intercept attempt separately, in whatever order he chooses.
Any that succeed will fight as a combined stack.
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 08:52:36 AM
I'm sorry but I just don't see how you can read it any other way than that there is a single roll if you want.
A single
combat roll, but separate
interception rolls.
Quote from: ehrie on June 16, 2009, 08:57:48 AMBut Del, if two powers can't intercept why would the the rules say each such attempt to intercept must be resolved seperatly if you can fight from two different sea zones together? When would you ever choose to roll seperatly if you could roll together?
Because that's not the point, the point is that one power can have more than one stack and wants to roll for them as a single stack. Two powers cannot succeed in an interception, that's been stated a number of times.
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack.
That is saying that within each stack, the stack may intercept with one roll (or not).
Multiple adjacent stacks cannot intercept with one roll, however. not the FROM EACH.
Okay, bear with me here. Point 4:
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack
Then point 7:
QuoteIf naval units of the active power and
an enemy power occupy the same sea zone or port, naval combat
occurs in that location.
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 09:01:20 AM
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack.
That is saying that within each stack, the stack may intercept with one roll (or not).
Multiple adjacent stacks cannot intercept with one roll, however. not the FROM EACH.
Hmm, okay, that is a logical interpretation we didn't think of.
But if that is the case, then why are the words "if multiple stacks are adjacent" present at all? If Berk is correct, then that is redundant.
Can someone just post this on whereever we usually post these rules questions? :P
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 08:59:56 AM
Quote from: ehrie on June 16, 2009, 08:57:48 AMBut Del, if two powers can't intercept why would the the rules say each such attempt to intercept must be resolved seperatly if you can fight from two different sea zones together? When would you ever choose to roll seperatly if you could roll together?
Because that's not the point, the point is that one power can have more than one stack and wants to roll for them as a single stack. Two powers cannot succeed in an interception, that's been stated a number of times.
Again, they
can will roll the combat together, they cannot roll the intercept together unless the ships are in a single stack to begin with. For obvious reasons. Hell, naval units did not coordinate that well in WW2, much less several hundred years earlier.
Quote from: ehrie on June 16, 2009, 09:05:59 AM
Can someone just post this on whereever we usually post these rules questions? :P
Knock yourself out - I don't have any question about what the rules say.
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:04:10 AM
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 09:01:20 AM
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack.
That is saying that within each stack, the stack may intercept with one roll (or not).
Multiple adjacent stacks cannot intercept with one roll, however. not the FROM EACH.
Hmm, okay, that is a logical interpretation we didn't think of.
But if that is the case, then why are the words "if multiple stacks are adjacent" present at all? If Berk is correct, then that is redundant.
Because it is saying that you don't have to choose only 1 stack to intercept from - that in fact they can ALL make the attempt, and whichever are successful will all fight as one stack.
I get the historical logic, I'm just going on what the rules say.
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 09:01:20 AM
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack.
That is saying that within each stack, the stack may intercept with one roll (or not).
Multiple adjacent stacks cannot intercept with one roll, however. not the FROM EACH.
:yes:
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:10:05 AM
I get the historical logic, I'm just going on what the rules say.
They are perfectly clear Del. Just read them, and don't try to read anything into them.
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 09:09:36 AM
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:04:10 AM
Hmm, okay, that is a logical interpretation we didn't think of.
But if that is the case, then why are the words "if multiple stacks are adjacent" present at all? If Berk is correct, then that is redundant.
Because it is saying that you don't have to choose only 1 stack to intercept from - that in fact they can ALL make the attempt, and whichever are successful will all fight as one stack.
:yes:
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 09:07:51 AM
Quote from: ehrie on June 16, 2009, 09:05:59 AM
Can someone just post this on whereever we usually post these rules questions? :P
Knock yourself out - I don't have any question about what the rules say.
I don't either, I agree with you, but I meant for Del.
The point of all this is saying that you can order your intercept attempts so that you can choose to NOT attempt to intercept with a weaker force if the larger force fails its interception attempt. Or vice versa.
So Tamas can roll for one force, then if that fails, choose to NOT roll for the other force. Of course, if he succeeds with the first, he may very well fail with the second anyway. Either way, if there is a resulting battle, it will be done with all successfully intercepting forces fighting together.
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 09:13:04 AM
The point of all this is saying that you can order your intercept attempts so that you can choose to NOT attempt to intercept with a weaker force if the larger force fails its interception attempt. Or vice versa.
So Tamas can roll for one force, then if that fails, choose to NOT roll for the other force. Of course, if he succeeds with the first, he may very well fail with the second anyway. Either way, if there is a resulting battle, it will be done with all successfully intercepting forces fighting together.
And that is exactly how I read the rules as well.
If three of you agree then sure.
I maintain that the second sentence is strangely worded if you're right, the first part of the sentence seems to be a condition for the second when in fact it isn't.
Please read the second sentence again before you go. If you're still convinced, shoot.
Quote from: The Second SentenceEach such attempt
is resolved separately and the owning player chooses the order of
those attempts.
How is that strangely worded? In fact, it is the explicitness I was talking about - it clears states that each attempt is to be resolved...hell, I cannot even restate it any more clearly than what it already states!
In fact, I am not even sure what you are suggesting the rules might mean otherwise! Are you suggesting that they are NOT resolved separately?
That is the third sentence, not the second. If you've been reading that all the time then I understand your confusion. :P
Edit: Or are we using different rules? Have to check this.
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:29:30 AM
That is the third sentence, not the second. If you've been reading that all the time then I understand your confusion. :P
Sentence #1:
If multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack.
Sentence #2:
Each such attempt
is resolved separately and the owning player chooses the order of
those attempts.
Sentence #3:
If multiple stacks from different enemy powers all
want to intercept, resolve the intercept attempts in Impulse Order.
Sentence #4:
Once one power succeeds, no other power may attempt an interception
(even if that other power is an ally of the intercepting power).
This is the rules that *you* quoted, I believe.
Quote from: Berkut on June 16, 2009, 09:31:42 AM
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:29:30 AM
That is the third sentence, not the second. If you've been reading that all the time then I understand your confusion. :P
Sentence #1:
If multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player’s choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack.
Sentence #2:
Each such attempt
is resolved separately and the owning player chooses the order of
those attempts.
Sentence #3:
If multiple stacks from different enemy powers all
want to intercept, resolve the intercept attempts in Impulse Order.
Sentence #4:
Once one power succeeds, no other power may attempt an interception
(even if that other power is an ally of the intercepting power).
This is the rules that *you* quoted, I believe.
:face:
I was referring to the rule book, and had been doing so for a number of posts since that initial quote.
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:34:42 AM
I was referring to the rule book, and had been doing so for a number of posts since that initial quote.
Do you want me to find the second sentence in the rulebook? :P
How about you just tell us which sentence it is you find confusing?
But that's not really important, I guess.
The point is that the second sentence of the Rule Book, point 4, OR the first sentence of my quote two pages ago is strangely worded if you guys are correct. Again, I am only going on what the text says, nothing else. I find it strange that you can't see my point, but I'll live with that. Now play it the way you want to.
Sigh. Quoting, AGAIN:
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack
Why the "if" when the fact that there are several stacks has no importance whatsoever?
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:39:26 AM
But that's not really important, I guess.
The point is that the second sentence of the Rule Book, point 4, OR the first sentence of my quote two pages ago is strangely worded if you guys are correct. Again, I am only going on what the text says, nothing else. I find it strange that you can't see my point, but I'll live with that. Now play it the way you want to.
No need to be all passive aggressive. I see your point, but you can't escape the glaring word seperatly in the naval interception rules. It's there for a reason. It clarifies every point you're trying to make.
OK, if you are talking about teh first sentence, then I still don't see how it is strangely worded.
If multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack.
It is simply saying that if you have multiple adjacent stacks that can intercept, one or more from each may intercept. The from each is the important clause.
This establishes a couple things:
1. You can intercept from more than one stack.
2. You do not have to intercept with all units from each stack.
3. Each stack intercepts as a group - ie you do not have to roll each individual squadron within a stack separately.
Sorry to belabor this Del, but the other alternative is to spend my time figuring out why my ArrayList of ports is only booking the first port in the list instead of all of them. Bickering with you is more interesting.
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:39:26 AM
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack
Why the "if" when the fact that there are several stacks has no importance whatsoever?
To make it clear that you can intercept with more than just one stack.
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:39:26 AM
Sigh. Quoting, AGAIN:
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack
Why the "if" when the fact that there are several stacks has no importance whatsoever?
Again, all that is saying is that unlike Land interceptions, once all interceptions are rolled all the stacks fight as a single stack. The next sentence makes that crystal clear.
If Tamas decides to intercept and succeeds I have no CCs to play. I gotta go, be back later.
Quote from: ehrie on June 16, 2009, 09:47:05 AM
Quote from: Delirium on June 16, 2009, 09:39:26 AM
Sigh. Quoting, AGAIN:
QuoteIf multiple enemy stacks are adjacent to the destination
space, one or more naval units (owning player's choice) from each
stack may attempt to intercept as a single stack
Why the "if" when the fact that there are several stacks has no importance whatsoever?
Again, all that is saying is that unlike Land interceptions, once all interceptions are rolled all the stacks fight as a single stack. The next sentence makes that crystal clear.
Well, no. Lets not confuse even more stuff. The land battles work the same way, in that you only fight one battle with all intercepting forces.
The only difference is that with land battles, you have to declare all interception attempts ahead of time, then resolve them - you cannot choose to forgo an interception if a previous one failed. I think. It doesn't really come up nearly as often, since the land system is point to point as oposed to area to area in the naval system.
France: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
1
6
Message from France:
Interception attempt #1, with the 3 squadrons from Rouen
It failed. No more attempts, Ehrie must spend one more CP
2/2 Port attack on Rouen. No CCs. Tamas can roll as I don't know if his rowers are any good and some such. :P
France: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 10
4
5
6
6
5
3
2
6
1
3
Message from France:
English port attack
Oh come one :bleeding: I will lose 2 squadrons
France: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 7
1
4
6
5
3
5
5
Message from France:
French port defense
Not bad. Two French and two English squadrons are lost. English fleet returns to the Channel
You lost 3 squadrons.
Dammit okay, so I will only attack the English with 3 squadrons:
Playing my home card for 5 OPS:
1/5: place a merc to St. Dizier
2/5: move Henry, 3+5 to Brussels
4/5: build a squadron to Rouen
5/5: all 3 squadrons of mine move to the Channel
I'll be back in 20 minutes, ehrie can resolve if he arrives, and then I will send out a file.
You can't build squadrons that have been destroyed in the current turn.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 16, 2009, 04:07:59 PM
You can't build squadrons that have been destroyed in the current turn.
Oops :blush: build a regular to Paris, then instead, but I still attack the English fleet.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
3
5
6
6
Message from England:
French attack
Blahhhhh
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 7
4
2
6
2
4
6
3
Message from England:
English Defense
And the only thing that coulda stopped me this turn happens. Tamas rolls over 50% hits and sinks my fleet. :bleeding: My lone ship retreats to the North Sea.
Quote from: Tamas on June 16, 2009, 04:36:19 PM
Oops :blush: build a regular to Paris, then instead, but I still attack the English fleet.
Why would you build it in Paris rather than with Francis?
Quote from: Habbaku on June 16, 2009, 04:53:58 PM
Quote from: Tamas on June 16, 2009, 04:36:19 PM
Oops :blush: build a regular to Paris, then instead, but I still attack the English fleet.
Why would you build it in Paris rather than with Francis?
because he is already at 8 units and my capital was only defended by mercs?
You're right, I suppose the bogey man might come and take your capital.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 16, 2009, 05:02:44 PM
You're right, I suppose the bogey man might come and take your capital.
:P
A file from one of you chuckleheads would be pretty nice.
Sent!
Did you include your turn in the file Tamas?
Yes
Pope CRs in England, to no effect.
Lets get this over with, shall we?
Publish treatises in Germany and converted 3 spaces, but then had a debate versus Tetzel! go into the second round. Nothing happened there either, it turns out.
So that's pretty much my chances of winning turn 6, sigh.
Ottomans play their home card for CPs :
1-2/5 - Construct a squadron in Scutari.
3/5 - Dragut and navy moves to Adriatic Sea.
Habsburgs got the interception roll, so it's up to Del if he wants a fight or not (currently 9 vs. 8, my favor).
Quote from: ulmont on June 17, 2009, 01:36:29 PM
Publish treatises in Germany and converted 3 spaces, but then had a debate versus Tetzel! go into the second round. Nothing happened there either, it turns out.
So that's pretty much my chances of winning turn 6, sigh.
You never had a chance of winning Turn 6. Which is why throwing the game to England seemed so odd.
Quote from: Berkut on June 17, 2009, 01:54:34 PM
You never had a chance of winning Turn 6.
Sure I did. I only needed 9 spaces, and I could make about 15 attempts.
Quote from: ulmont on June 17, 2009, 01:56:54 PM
Quote from: Berkut on June 17, 2009, 01:54:34 PM
You never had a chance of winning Turn 6.
Sure I did. I only needed 9 spaces, and I could make about 15 attempts.
And I can make a like number of attempts to convert back - and easy spaces, like France. No way.
I question my locking up of the game now. It's really possible for me to lose two keys if I get another bad battle once Tamas and Del move in.
Quote from: ehrie on June 17, 2009, 02:03:22 PM
I question my locking up of the game now. It's really possible for me to lose two keys if I get another bad battle once Tamas and Del move in.
Sure, anything is possible. Just not very likely. Heck, if we can get one key away from you and I can manage to convert one space, we can get you down to 24.
I can convert spaces back with ease the rest of this turn, Habbaku has Unpaid mercs in his hand for one of my spaces and You have Treachery. My poor navy, sunk to the bottom.
My money is on Habbaku climbing my corpse to victory as Tamas, Del and Berkut stab me to death. Couldn't you have waited until Habbaku made his move to convert all of freakin England ulmont? :P
Quote from: ehrie on June 17, 2009, 02:15:58 PM
I can convert spaces back with ease the rest of this turn, Habbaku has Unpaid mercs in his hand for one of my spaces and You have Treachery. My poor navy, sunk to the bottom.
True, you can convert spaces in England easily, and they cannot be easily converted back, which against makes the decision to do those conversions for you rather odd.
Quote from: Berkut on June 17, 2009, 02:20:42 PM
Quote from: ehrie on June 17, 2009, 02:15:58 PM
I can convert spaces back with ease the rest of this turn, Habbaku has Unpaid mercs in his hand for one of my spaces and You have Treachery. My poor navy, sunk to the bottom.
True, you can convert spaces in England easily, and they cannot be easily converted back, which against makes the decision to do those conversions for you rather odd.
Last turn I was one measly space from 25 VP. I also really didn't think ulmont was going to do me the favor of completing the English Bible and choosing spaces that would be easy to convert. I figured he'd stick to the Scotland. This turn I only did the one as I reasoned my Navy could keep me atleast one key if I took out the French in Rouen. Best laid plans. :P
Quote from: Berkut on June 17, 2009, 02:20:42 PM
True, you can convert spaces in England easily, and they cannot be easily converted back, which against makes the decision to do those conversions for you rather odd.
Eh, I see focusing your attention on England as a feature, not a bug.
Quote from: ehrie on June 17, 2009, 02:24:21 PM
Best laid plans. :P
You ain't kidding. Tamas the Bastard screwed my Turn 5 plans.
Quote from: ulmont on June 17, 2009, 02:24:55 PM
Quote from: Berkut on June 17, 2009, 02:20:42 PM
True, you can convert spaces in England easily, and they cannot be easily converted back, which against makes the decision to do those conversions for you rather odd.
Eh, I see focusing your attention on England as a feature, not a bug.
I really rather you had not, lol. I see it setting off the chain reaction where Del and Tamas beat me up because they have to with me being at 27 VP and Habbaku waltzing right in and snatching victory away.
That is a very likely scenario, yes.
I'll chance a battle. Interception. No cc, you resolve.
The Habsburgs win 4 to 3--two Ottoman squadrons sunk, one Habsburg sunk.
Last two CPs build another squadron in Scutari.
Off to Del.
Okay, I played a 4 cp card and some fake orders on ACTS. Here is what happens:
1/4 Move a squadron to Irish Sea. ehrie suceeded in intercepting, so I'll leave it to him to decide on a battle one-on-one.
Since I'm going away for at least 24 hours, the rest of my move is conditional:
*If* there is still a Habsburg squadron in Irish Sea, the remaining 3 cp will move the four regulars from Corunna to Bristol.
If not, two cp will move those guys to Brest instead, and the fourth builds a merc in Brussels.
See you when I get back. Posting a file with my move and some cleaning up to this point.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 5
5
4
3
4
5
Message from England:
Well I see no choice in the matter of fighting so yes I intercerpt
2 English Dice vs 3 Hapsburg, me first.
1 Hit each. I don't have a rulebook handy so I honestly don't know what happens.
Oops, I actually rolled one extra dice for you. Only get that defender dice when in a port. As that would be your hit dice, ofcourse. I will reroll the fight.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
2
4
4
3
Message from England:
Corrected Naval Encounter. First 2 English last 2 Hapsburg.
Starving for hits this turn.
So correct me if I'm wrong, ties mean the attacker, in this case me, has to retreat?
Quote from: ehrie on June 19, 2009, 11:43:12 AM
So correct me if I'm wrong, ties mean the attacker, in this case me, has to retreat?
You're half right.
Quote from: 16.27. Declare Winner: The side scoring the most hits is declared the
winner of the battle. In the case of a tie, the defender is declared the
winner.
Quote from: 16.2If the combat occurred in a sea
zone, the loser retreats to an adjacent port under its control or an
adjacent sea zone that is free of enemy naval units.
So yes, the defender wins and the attacker has to retreat. However:
Quote from: 16.2The active player is always considered
the attacker in a naval combat.
So Del is the attacker, the loser, and must retreat.
Well, that works then. I'll have my move up in an hour or so when I can take a break.
England: Play Card as Event
#16: 2 / Calvin
Message from England:
Another leader bites the dust.
1/2 Move my fleet back to the North Sea. Tamas may intercept.
2/2 1 Merc in London moves to Bristol
once Tamas decides what he wants to do I'll post a file.
6
4
Message from France:
Trying to intercept into North Sea
Request: 6-sided die x 4
3
5
2
5
Message from France:
Battle of North Sea, first 2 dice are the English ones
Me being teh defender I stay in North Sea. But -does the English feet get destroyed due to receiving a single hit and being the loser?
Yep.
Glug, glug, glug.
Oh and I pass this one round.
Quote from: Berkut on June 19, 2009, 03:36:35 PM
Yep.
Glug, glug, glug.
What makes you think that? It's a tie and thus I retreat according to the rules ulmont posted earlier.
Quote from: ehrie on June 19, 2009, 03:41:15 PM
Quote from: Berkut on June 19, 2009, 03:36:35 PM
Yep.
Glug, glug, glug.
What makes you think that? It's a tie and thus I retreat according to the rules ulmont posted earlier.
Indeed you do retreat.
But the loser of the fight has to take any odd hits as another loss. So you lose 1 squadron.
God I can't believe I lost my whole navy this frakin turn. File coming shortly.
So, the Pope is up.
Used Papal Bullto call a debate in England. Had two 3 value debaters up against one another, Pope won 2-0 to flip a couple English spaces. File sent. I think I forgot to put the debaters back, if someone could do that on the next file.
Published a treatise, converted Avignon, sent file, over to Ottomans.
Protestants pass out the rest of the turn.
File out. The Ottomans raise another naval squadron in Scutari with Surprise Attack's CPs (see why I wanted a land battle so badly?).
Del's up. England's soon to be down to one card, then we should be able to work together to snatch a key from them and extend the game.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 22, 2009, 09:19:58 AM
File out. The Ottomans raise another naval squadron in Scutari with Surprise Attack's CPs (see why I wanted a land battle so badly?).
Jesus H Christ. In hindsight, I cut my losses quite handily by surrendering Vienna then.
Hapsburgs: Play Card as Operations
#69: 3 / Auld Alliance
Message from Hapsburgs:
1/3 Move fleets to Channel.
2-3/3 Move the four regulars from Brest to Portsmouth.
Got to run. If ehrie wants to attempt any interceptions he can do it and resolve any combat, no cards from me. Hope someone can include this in their file or I'll do it in a few hours time.
File is sent.
:unsure:
:zzz
Oh well, it was a good game.
Start another?
Quote from: Delirium on June 24, 2009, 12:24:43 AM
Oh well, it was a good game.
Start another?
Ehrie regularly disappears for days. Wait.
My computer exploded, sorry for the delay, I've been off from work the last couple days. Taking my turn now. I have no board or game file anymore though.
England: Play Card as Operations
#82: 2 / Janissaries Rebel
Message from England:
1 Regular in London.
As an aside, the file crcdisk.sys can die in a fire.
My sympathies.
I submit that a good use of Treachery would be on a siege on either Bristol or London started by me next round.
ehrie, please do take a look on the BSG thread and catch up with us ASAP :P
Tamas, you may want to announce how much longer you will be passing.
One more round for sure.
So the Pope is up.
Played 1 CP card to St. Petes, completing it in all its glory.
And I will pass for the time being. Del's up.
Played the home card to see Charles to Brussels.
The four guys in Portsmouth went to London, and Charles plus eight guys went to Antwerp. The English failed both interception rolls so I assumed they did not want field battles.
The English are: up.
You are stealing my Antwerp! :mad:
:lol:
Good one.
I was trying to explain all the reasons why we can't wait for you to move, even assuming that Antwerp is "yours", but then I decided I'll just hope it was a joke. :hug:
Del, barring some epic failure on your part to take them after attempting it and to prolong the game, I will not be using Treachery on either key.
I may do so if you try to take them and fail, of course - but I expect that you can take them without me blowing a 5 CP card for it.
Then I hope you will reconsider.
1. In London I have two dice against his three, that won't work.
2. In Antwerp I do have a pretty good shot, assuming Henry just sits still and allows me to take it. Odds are he'll attack me instead. Tamas will intercept on 8 or more. If he fails I'll get my ass kicked. The good news is that Henry will be in Antwerp, which means Tamas can attack Calais and hope Henry misses his 8+ interception. If that happens Tamas will need treachery against Calais.
Rather than all the ifs and buts of (2) you ought to use Treachery on London. Why? It is safer, causes more damage and because you said you would use it against England to prolong the game, much as Habbaku said he would do his part in helping bringing England down if me and Tamas poured the CPs in. Well, I have, and given Tamas a card to get us this chance to prolong the game and I have yet to see Habs or you contribute. I've played this entire turn wasting CPs on the assumption you would help.
In all fairness, I think you owe us Treachery. I deem it most useful against London.
Holy fuck, are you kidding me? I've burned card after card after card after card trying to keep England down a few VPs, not to mention trying to keep the Protestants from winning (they are at 24 you know).
Christ, the idea that I have not contributed?
I said I would use Treachery if it was needed to prolong the game. That doesn't mean I will use it to avoid *you* needing to burn a card. It will be the last card in my hand. You still have 2 cards to take a shot at London. (He has 1 unit there, that is 2 dice, not three, and you only need 1 hit - that means you have a little better than even odds of taking it by spending 1 CP, as opposed to me blowing 5).
Those 5 CPS can mean another debate AND a CR attempt. So no, I will NOT use Treachery before it is absolutely needed.
Okay, what I meant was "contributed with treachery or other cards that would help take keys". I know you've done a lot of religious shit but we need to take keys as well.
Besides, I told you at the start of this turn that I have Anabaptists, I've been holding that for a case when you need it, partly because you would play Treachery.
Well, since I never said I would play Treachery at the start of the turn, I kind of doubt that. In fact, it was a huge mistake on my part to even mention that I had it, since everyone immediately started playing like THEY had it.
In any case, I will play Treachery if it is needed, but I will let England win rather than lay it to avoid you guys having to pay 1 CP to initiate a siege.
Ideally, you take London and Antwerp without Treachery, then I can play it to CR some more spaces in England, then we can extend the game and hopefully not have to spend the entire next turn stopping England and the Protestants from winning again.
Quote from: Berkut on June 25, 2009, 09:01:40 AM
In any case, I will play Treachery if it is needed
No, no, it's clearly needed. You should go ahead and play Treachery immediately. :lmfao:
Wow, it was that funny? :huh:
Quote from: Berkut on June 25, 2009, 09:01:40 AMI will let England win
I'm leaning towards that conclusion as well.
Quote from: Delirium on June 25, 2009, 09:21:42 AM
Quote from: Berkut on June 25, 2009, 09:01:40 AMI will let England win
I'm leaning towards that conclusion as well.
Do not quote me out of context, that just isn't nice.
Why are you so insistent that I burn a card in such an inefficient manner?
Sorry about the quote, guess it wasn't funny.
It's not the card in itself, I suppose I'm growing tired of this game. Maybe it's that I hate diplomacy games, maybe it's just too hot here...
I have no game file anymore as I said last time I was able to get on. How many units do I have in Calais at the moment?
10
And Treachery on London makes no sense at all. If I get any lucky dice which I'm kind of due that whole 5 CPs can go to waste. You don't play that card unless you are sure it's going to work.
England: Play Card as Operations
#43: 3 / Zwingli Dons Armour
Message from England:
This probably isn't going to work but what the hell.
2/3 Build 2 mercs in Calais.
3/3 Henry, Brandon and 10 units, leaving 2 regulars in Calais go to Antwerp.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
1
2
Message from England:
Can Tamas intercept?
French decide to be French instead of intercept.
Well, Charles evaded on ACTS a while ago so it's the French.
Why did he do that? I have no idea what you people are doing, or why, anymore.
Yes WTF am I supposed to tackle the english army alone now?
That was....unexpected.
The only way that makes sense if that card Habbaku has been menancing me with all turn is Mercs Demand Pay, in which case I was boned anyway.
I guess we can hope.
Is France passing again?
Feel free to just tell us in advance, without the need to ask EVERY SINGLE TURN Tamas.
Well, I won't. Pass.
:huh:
He had 14 dice against my 11 so he'll win and make me retreat anyway, with losses, so why take that battle?
Now I get to move on Calais, a smaller garrison, and he is out of cards. If he intercepts there's a battle, then Tamas can move on Antwerp with Treachery looming.
So what's your take on it?
Anyway, I'm offline until Sunday.
I'll spend a 3 cp card to attack London, build a merc in Brussels, then move everything to Calais.
Quote from: Delirium on June 26, 2009, 10:42:11 AM
:huh:
He had 14 dice against my 11 so he'll win and make me retreat anyway, with losses, so why take that battle?
Now I get to move on Calais, a smaller garrison, and he is out of cards. If he intercepts there's a battle, then Tamas can move on Antwerp with Treachery looming.
So what's your take on it?
My take on a 11 v 14 fight is that it is nearly even odds, and losing the fight has no real negative (so you lose a couple troops, probably 3) but winning is huge.
I would take that fight everytime, unless I had some other plan.
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 11:56:00 AM
I would take that fight everytime, unless I had some other plan.
Like playing Treachery, since you're up? :P
Quote from: ulmont on June 26, 2009, 12:06:02 PM
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 11:56:00 AM
I would take that fight everytime, unless I had some other plan.
Like playing Treachery, since you're up? :P
Is someone going to send out a file in this game other than me?
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 12:12:50 PM
Is someone going to send out a file in this game other than me?
Habbaku and I have been pretty good about sending files; you just had the bad luck to play after the Power Trio.
How did that English merc get into London? I thought there was only a regular there - did I miss it earlier?
Either way, the Hapsburgs lost 1 merc in the assault, and the English lost nothing.
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 12:35:20 PM
Either way, the Hapsburgs lost 1 merc in the assault, and the English lost nothing.
Why did you roll a Hapsburg assault, already, just assuming the Ottomans will pass?
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 12:33:19 PM
How did that English merc get into London? I thought there was only a regular there - did I miss it earlier?
There was a regular on the London space, and a merc in the London box at the top of the map. Del moved the merc down onto the space.
Play Smallpox for 4 CPs, call a debate in England, Pole against Tyndale, which I win 2-1 and flip Shrewsbury.
Last CP
4/4: Naval move
1 squadron to Ionian, 1 to north African Coast.
I assume you all realize that Jeromey is playing you, and won't be doing anything against England? He is going to try to win this with his last two cards.
Quote from: ulmont on June 26, 2009, 12:38:50 PM
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 12:35:20 PM
Either way, the Hapsburgs lost 1 merc in the assault, and the English lost nothing.
Why did you roll a Hapsburg assault, already, just assuming the Ottomans will pass?
Are they not passing?
Why did you say I was up then?
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 12:44:39 PM
Why did you say I was up then?
Because you were up, England having played their last card and *France* having passed.
Now I pass, so the Ottomans are up again, and after that the Hapsburg assault comes in.
Quote from: ulmont on June 26, 2009, 12:50:22 PM
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 12:44:39 PM
Why did you say I was up then?
Because you were up, England having played their last card and *France* having passed.
Now I pass, so the Ottomans are up again, and after that the Hapsburg assault comes in.
Oh, I thought that Hapsburg play happened *before* I went - isn't that the case?
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 12:51:28 PM
Oh, I thought that Hapsburg play happened *before* I went - isn't that the case?
I don't think so, since Del posted it right after he evaded the English attack; I assumed it was just his next move coming, since he's offline until Sunday.
Right, then ignore that entire thing. It was kind of a lame attack anyway - I thought there was only 1 troop in London, hence pretty good odds that it works.
I will pass, unless the Habsburgs think it eminently helpful that I nuke the English mercenaries somewhere.
FYI, I'm currently in Virginia, so my time between responses will not be anywhere near what I normally do.
Quote from: Habbaku on June 26, 2009, 01:10:30 PM
I will pass, unless the Habsburgs think it eminently helpful that I nuke the English mercenaries somewhere.
Since they are at an undisclosed but offline location, doubtful.
So the Habsburgs are up, and would do their assault on London that Berk already rolled, then build a merc in Brussels, and then move that stack to Calais for a siege, as per Del earlier:
Quote from: DeliriumI'll spend a 3 cp card to attack London, build a merc in Brussels, then move everything to Calais.
Ehrie would be up, but he's out of cards, so Tamas is up.
France: Play Card as Operations
#28: 1 / Siege Mining
Message from France:
build a merc to Rouen
I want to try and intercept in Calais.
I'll leave 1 merc in Awterp. So that means I should take 12 units with me if I succeed.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
1
3
Message from England:
English intercpt attempt for great justice
Love my dice this turn. Love them.
Ok. So whee, 1 more merc in Rouen and the Pope is up again.
...not that there's any hurry, since Del doesn't get back until Sunday.
I used Treachery to call a debate in England, which pitted Aleander against Wishart, and the Pope won 2-1 again. Flipped 2 spaces since Aleander gets 1 more space, then called for some good book burning in England to flip 2 more spaces.
England is down to 24 VPs again.
With the English contained rather decisively, I will pass the remainder of the turn.
As long as the prots continue to pass, I will as well.
Quote from: Berkut on June 26, 2009, 02:06:14 PM
As long as the prots continue to pass, I will as well.
Yes, I'm passing out the turn.
Then unless the Hapsburgs want to take another crack at London, I think we are done.
He might want to try to talk the ottoman into getting rid of the merc there, then he has a decent shot of taking it.
Why don't I just assault Calais instead?
I killed Francis and replaced him with Henry, then assaulted London and Calais, the latter with success.
Alright, let's get some winters in.
Ottoman winter :
Suleiman, Ibrahim and 9 regulars head back to Istanbul (leaving 2 regulars, 2 cavalry in Prague).
Papal Winter:
2 mercs from Florence to Rome
2 regulars from Turin to Florence
1+1 from Turin to Ravenna
Fleets to Corfu
English Winter
All fleets to the bottom of the ocean. :cry:
Both leaders, 6+6 back to London
I'm going to do the New World now.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
1
2
6
5
1
4
Message from England:
Hapsburg Colonies
+1 Card, Hispanola eaten by natives
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 4
1
4
2
6
Message from England:
English Colonies
Galleon gets me a card. NE on the other.
This is a good illustration of one of the few rules in HIS that really doesn't make sense. The excess units in Calais are not allowed to winter in Brussels, but have to go to Valladolid instead, taking attrition. Now, units in an unfortified space adjacent to two fortified spaces are allowed to split to those fortresses without having to go the capital. No logic, but at least I was aware of it beforehand.
Fleets to Messina and Corunna.
My king's stack goes to Paris, my other leader and all units in excess of 4 in Milan go to Paris as well
Quote from: Berkut on June 29, 2009, 07:54:19 AM
Papal Winter:
2 mercs from Florence to Rome
2 regulars from Turin to Florence
1+1 from Turin to Ravenna
I don't think you can do this. Land units in unfortified spaces have to return to the home capital or to the nearest fortified space. Modena is the closest fortified space, and it's full, so everything from Turin has to go to Rome. I'm guessing at that point you'd leave the mercs in Florence, but correct me if I am wrong.
Quote from: Delirium on June 29, 2009, 02:50:17 PM
This is a good illustration of one of the few rules in HIS that really doesn't make sense. The excess units in Calais are not allowed to winter in Brussels, but have to go to Valladolid instead, taking attrition.
Why would these units take attrition? You're allied with france, and paths can be traced over any number of sea zones without needing a friendly unit, so Calais -> Valladolid should be a no-brainer?
Sent out a winter file. Papal winter modified as noted above, and no attrition to the Hapsburgs as I read the rules (correct me, again).
Hand size calculations:
Ottomans: 5 (keys) + 2 (saved) + 0 (sultan) + 0 (bonus) = 7.
Hapsburgs: 5 (keys) + 0 (saved) + 0 (charles) + 1 (bonus) = 6.
England: 3 (keys) + 0 (saved) + 1 (henry) + 1 (bonus) = 5.
France: 3 (keys) + 0 (saved) + 0 (henry) + 0 (bonus) = 3.
Papacy: 4 (keys) + 1 (saved) + 1 (paul iii) + 0 (bonus) = 6.
Protestants: 4 (electorates) + 1 (saved) + 0 (calvin) + 0 (bonus) = 5.
forgot to nuke the alliances, though, in the winter file.
Quote from: ulmont on July 01, 2009, 08:58:14 AM
Quote from: Berkut on June 29, 2009, 07:54:19 AM
Papal Winter:
2 mercs from Florence to Rome
2 regulars from Turin to Florence
1+1 from Turin to Ravenna
I don't think you can do this. Land units in unfortified spaces have to return to the home capital or to the nearest fortified space. Modena is the closest fortified space, and it's full, so everything from Turin has to go to Rome. I'm guessing at that point you'd leave the mercs in Florence, but correct me if I am wrong.
Sure I can. Look at the order. You can move units from a fortified space to home.
So the units from Florence go to Rome.
Then the units from Turin need to go home, and they have to go to the nearest fortified space that is not already full - so Modena is full, so they can go to Florence. Once Florence becomes full, they can then go Ravenna.
They go to the nearest unfortified space that can hold them, or to the capital.
Also, during the mandatory events phase, I will place a Jesuit college in Bristol and Dijon
Quote from: Berkut on July 01, 2009, 09:15:03 AM
Then the units from Turin need to go home, and they have to go to the nearest fortified space that is not already full - so Modena is full, so they can go to Florence. Once Florence becomes full, they can then go Ravenna.
I don't read the rule as allowing that option. I read it as allowing you to stack the nearest fortified space to 4 and then requiring any excess to be sent to the capital.
Hmmm, you might be right - it does seem to suggest that the option is the nearest fort, then home if the nearerst fort(s) is full.
Quote2. Return Units: Now review all land units in unfortified spaces
and in fortified spaces not controlled by their major power. These
units must either:
• Return to their home capital, or
• Return to the nearest fortified space controlled by their power
(but not if that would put more than 4 land units in that space).
The nearest space is always computed using a direct path to the
destination without regard to which power controls any of the
intervening spaces.
England: Play Card as Event
#15: 2 / Society of Jesus
Message from England:
Since it's turn 7, this gets resolved now.
As Berkut already pointed out, this needs to be placed.
Let diplomacy begin, then.
If only to light a fire under this game once more, I suggest we set a deadline for diplomacy to end by Friday.
Some general observations:
The Ottomans are now the power that needs to be beat down a little bit. I think I can hold the Protestants off, if I am left alone to do so.
The Hapsburgs need to turn and either retake Vienna or something like that. It is very possible that the Ottomans DOW the Pope in an effort to get some keys in Italy. Maybe not though, hard to say. He can probably win just by piracy, so we can't really be passive against him.
I agree with the Pope.
I think that the Pope is the real threat and that we should all concentrate our efforts on knocking him down a peg.
I humbly offer my soldiers for the task.
I am the consumate "stop everyone else from winning" player in this game. I might get a win, but only if I get real lucky with card draws and grab Copernicus or something.
You see? Even now, he admits to having Copernicus in his hand.
I'd prefer if no one looked in the removed-from-play pile after reading that statement.
My ass is sore from last turn. Go rape Habbaku this turn, everybody.
Quote from: Berkut on July 01, 2009, 11:12:10 AM
I am the consumate "stop everyone else from winning" player in this game. I might get a win, but only if I get real lucky with card draws and grab Copernicus or something.
That is even truer for me.
Charles was supposed to go to Valladolid as well, let's place him there in an SD file in the near future.
File TODO:
1) Jesuit college in Bristol.
2) Jesuit college in Dijon.
3) Charles to Valladolid.
I offer an alliance to France and the Pope, that's it.
Ottomans offer an alliance to England and the Protestants.
Potentially more to come in the DoW segment, assuming the Habsburgs don't sue for peace.
France confirms alliance with Habsburg and offers alliance to the Pope.
War with England shall rage on unless I receive the scottish key.
Quote from: Habbaku on July 03, 2009, 02:46:34 AMassuming the Habsburgs don't sue for peace.
That would be an unexpected move, wouldn't it?
Ehrie is up to announce whether he's doing anything or not.
Sueing for peace against the terribad chin armies. ditching a merc in london and one in the key west of there. getting back my key for another VP. No other announcements. Preparing to put the hurt on the French.
Don't have the rules available, I suppose that means I get Antwerp back?
Yes, you get Antwerp back.
Berkut, any diplo to announce?
Excellent news!
Accept alliance with the Hapsburgs and France.
Accept alliance with Ottomans. I think Habbaku had more DoWs coming?
No, I've got enough phony wars on my hands, I think.
Assuming no one declares on me (and assuming the Habsburgs don't sue for peace), my SD :
Suleiman, Ibrahim, 9 regulars and 3 cavalry to Munster.
Edit : Changed SD around.
Charles and the guys in Valladolid go to Augsburg.
Henry 5+0 to Calais.
Any SD for France, and then any for the Pope?
No papal SD.
I leave 2 regulars in Paris the rest goes to Boulougne
That should mean we're ready to go with Habs opening the seventh turn.
Working on a file now.
Quote from: Delirium on July 06, 2009, 03:44:36 AM
Charles and the guys in Valladolid go to Augsburg.
I don't see a way to do this without crossing a pass (forbidden) or a sea zone (limited to 5), so Charles and 1+4 can make it, leaving 0+1 in Valladolid.
File sent. The VP seems to have diverged again from the board and the ACTS record; I'll recheck it later.
Whyare all the Venetian fleets gone?
Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 10:37:30 AM
Whyare all the Venetian fleets gone?
While I couldn't tell you, I note that all four Venetian fleets were in the "Military Units - Independent" tray as of Del's last move in Turn 6, before the wintering started.
I am trying to remember some huge fleet battle that sank them all, but nothing comes to mind.
Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 10:45:18 AM
I am trying to remember some huge fleet battle that sank them all, but nothing comes to mind.
They all started Turn 6 in that tray, too.
Must have been soemthing, they were in the "dead" pile on Turn 4. Too many games at once.
Quote from: Berkut on July 07, 2009, 10:46:28 AM
Must have been soemthing, they were in the "dead" pile on Turn 4. Too many games at once.
There was a massive naval battle in Turn 4 (entries 327-330), looks like, 26 Hapsburg dice to 15 Ottoman dice. Del must have cheerfully taken all the losses on Venetian ships?
Also, Berk, don't forget to add Gardiner to the debater mix.
Quote from: ulmont on July 07, 2009, 10:29:33 AMI don't see a way to do this without crossing a pass (forbidden) or a sea zone (limited to 5), so Charles and 1+4 can make it, leaving 0+1 in Valladolid.
I thought I had five guys there...
Turn 4 destroyed the Ottoman fleet (now rebuilt) and the Venetians saw the brunt of the fighting.
QuoteOttoman: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 3
6
6
3
Message from Ottoman:
Three dice for the piracy attempt--only 1 port, but +2 dice from Dragut.
And we're off. The Ottomans play Spanish Inquisition to set their fleet to moving on out...and hitting the Adriatic ports of the Habsburgs, getting two hits in the process.
Need to know whether Del's giving me cards or VPs (or someone's playing Foul Weather to stop me from moving/pirating).
I have a port on the Adriatic? Why? :huh:
And why do you never roll less than two hits on three piracy dice? :huh:
I'll give you one card and one vp.
And the chances, rather than 1 in 6, of that turning out to be my best card were...?
:yeah:
Remaining 2 CPs -
4/5 - Suleiman and all troops to Amsterdam.
5/5 - Control Amsterdam.
Off to Del.
Quote from: Habbaku on July 08, 2009, 10:27:12 AM
:yeah:
Remaining 2 CPs -
4/5 - Suleiman and all troops to Amsterdam.
5/5 - Control Amsterdam.
Off to Del.
Just WTF
I'm just spreading Islam 500 years early.
People simply DO NOT understand the power of alliances. If someone is offering an alliance, you really have to ask yourself why, and what they will gain out of it, and what you have to gain by giving it to them.
Freaking Ottomans on the English Channel. :facepalm:
Quote from: Berkut on July 08, 2009, 10:39:38 AM
If someone is offering an alliance, you really have to ask yourself why, and what they will gain out of it, and what you have to gain by giving it to them.
Why - because Habbaku thinks he can win through Hapsburg keys.
What They Will Gain - SD straight to the Low Countries.
What I Have To Gain - no worries about Hapsburgs interfering with me. He'll be a bit busy. ;)
I dont have the board in front of me but what alliances? my alliance with him dated out start of this turn. Who else?
See, this is what I mean. The Hapsburgs are going to be busy fighting the Ottomans because if he doesn't the Ottomans will win, regardless of you letting him romp all over the map. All you have done is make it MUCH easier for the Ottomans to win. You have helped him a ton, and helped yourself not at all.
If anything, you have made it so hard for the Hapsburgs to deal with the Ottomans, he might not even bother.
But that is why this game is so great. it disguises mistakes rather well, then brutally punishes those who make them. The beauty of it is that most of the time, they don't even know they made a mistake, even after they lost the game because of it. :P
Calvin needs to be dropped back on the board at some point, by the way.
Well, I don't think he can build fleets in the North Sea.
I think it's your turn.
I think this is not the easiest move in the world. Can't believe you drew Cloth Prices...
:osama:
I am pretty sure I can keep the Protestants from winning this turn.
So can I.
Hapsburgs: Play Card as Operations
#46: 5 / Calvin's Institutes
Message from Hapsburgs:
1-2/5 build squadron in Antwerp.
3-4/5 move fleets to Barbary Coast.
5/5 move Ferdinand to Wittenberg.
Quote from: Delirium on July 08, 2009, 12:15:19 PM
3-4/5 move fleets to Barbary Coast.
Your squadrons in Corunna cannot make it that far on 2 moves. The Atlantic and Barbary Coast are not connected--Gibraltar is in the way.
Quote from: Berkut on July 08, 2009, 12:19:19 PM
Excellent, I will leave it to you then!
That's okay, I'm used to you letting the Protestants win.
Quote from: Habbaku on July 08, 2009, 12:22:10 PM
Quote from: Berkut on July 08, 2009, 12:19:19 PM
Excellent, I will leave it to you then!
That's okay, I'm used to you letting the Protestants win.
:bleeding:
Allying with the Ottomans as the Hapsburgs to war on the Pope automatically repudiates any gripes you can make about the Protestants winning.
Quote from: Berkut on July 08, 2009, 12:26:57 PM
Allying with the Ottomans as the Hapsburgs to war on the Pope automatically repudiates any gripes you can make about the Protestants winning.
Those Ottoman ships must've had Protestant refugees on them. Is that why you attacked them so zealously?
Quote from: Habbaku on July 08, 2009, 12:30:14 PM
Quote from: Berkut on July 08, 2009, 12:26:57 PM
Allying with the Ottomans as the Hapsburgs to war on the Pope automatically repudiates any gripes you can make about the Protestants winning.
Those Ottoman ships must've had Protestant refugees on them. Is that why you attacked them so zealously?
Blah, blah, blah, you allied with the Ottomans so you could war on the Pope, and the Protestants won. The actions of the Pope are not relevant at that point. If you did not want the Pope to be sinking Ottoman and Hapsburgs ships, you probably should not have allied with them and sent your army into Italy, instead of Germany.
It was not bad play on your part, since had it worked you would have won, but really, don't bitch to the Pope about the Protestants winning when it didn't work. When Ottoman and Hapsburgs allies park themselves in Italy, and siege every single one of my keys, the Protestants? Don't care about them anymore - they are YOUR problem.
It was terrible play on the part of the Ottomans though, since he had no chance of winning even if it had worked - since then you would have won.
Quote from: Habbaku on July 08, 2009, 12:21:55 PMYour squadrons in Corunna cannot make it that far on 2 moves. The Atlantic and Barbary Coast are not connected--Gibraltar is in the way.
Donnerwetter. Okay, I'll park them in Gibraltar then and let England be on their way.
I'm on the road most of the day today. I'll have my turn up at some point today, probably in a few hours.
England: Message
Home Card for CPs
2/5 Build 1 Fleet in London.
3/5 Move Fleet into North Sea
5/5 Move Brandon, 3+2 to Calais
Tamas, can you put this into the file when you take your turn? Thanks.
Tamas is up...
Are you guys telling me that no one has made any files since spring? :bleeding:
Quote from: Tamas on July 12, 2009, 11:54:49 AM
Are you guys telling me that no one has made any files since spring? :bleeding:
No. Delirium sent out a file, which was sent to your gmail; I just re-forwarded it to you. It is true that ehrie made no file.
Playing my home card for ops:
4/5: build two flees in Rouen
5/5: move 3 fleets to the Channel
Pope Berkut is up.
Don't want to sound too negative, but do we think we could pick up the pace somewhat? A move every two days like now in turn 7 is the worst we've ever done I think.
Doh, I just messed up my CR roll, and ended up rolling an extra die.
However, given that the troops are not Hungarian, duh, I would rather not even try to convert where I was planning on converting (eastern Germany), so unless the Prot objects, I will undo my play and CR in France instead, and start my rolls from scratch?
Is that ok with you?
Quote from: Berkut on July 13, 2009, 02:20:08 PM
I will undo my play and CR in France instead, and start my rolls from scratch?
Is that ok with you?
Yeah, that's fine.
CR in France instead with Carraffa, flipped 2/3 spaces, no VP change.
Calvin had a vicious debate against Caraffa, which was inconclusive. Bullinger, however, managed to disgrace Tetzel, flipping Nice and Brest.
Sending out a file as soon as I can finish up the ACTS shit; ACTS is being very slow for me right now.
Mmmm, yummy French debaters! Tasty!
Quote from: Berkut on July 13, 2009, 02:51:32 PM
Mmmm, yummy French debaters! Tasty!
Those level 2 debaters are vicious! Vicious I tell you!
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Event
#72: 3 / Cloth Prices Fluctuate
Message from Ottoman:
"Draw and discard a card at random from power controlling Antwerp. Add unrest on up to 2 unoccupied spaces from this list: Antwerp, Brussels, Amsterdam, all German and Italian-speaking Hapsburg home spaces."
Event. Unrest applied to Brussels and Trieste.
My play. Off to Del to discard a card, then make his play.
So if anyone has any doubts on the outcome of this turn you might want to look at the number of cards available to each power...
Hapsburgs: Play Card as Operations
#99: 1 / Sebastian Cabot
Message from Hapsburgs:
Gather all squadrons
This places my five squadrons in one fleet, just as the file had them, so the only thing that needs to be done is unrest in Brussels and Trieste. Over to England.
Why would unrest need to be placed in those spaces? I already did that in my own file.
Quote from: Delirium on July 14, 2009, 10:50:37 AM
So if anyone has any doubts on the outcome of this turn you might want to look at the number of cards available to each power...
I warned you guys, but you refused to believe that the Ottomans were the real threat, not the Protestants...
You mean in turn 1? That is true in exactly the same way as the clock that has stopped and still shows the right time twice a day.
Quote from: Habbaku on July 14, 2009, 10:59:13 AM
Why would unrest need to be placed in those spaces? I already did that in my own file.
Most likely I forgot to apply your file before pondering my move.
Quote from: ulmont on July 14, 2009, 11:02:42 AM
Quote from: Delirium on July 14, 2009, 10:50:37 AM
So if anyone has any doubts on the outcome of this turn you might want to look at the number of cards available to each power...
I warned you guys, but you refused to believe that the Ottomans were the real threat, not the Protestants...
Oh please.
England: Play Card as Operations
#78: 3 / Frederick the Wise
Message from England:
2/3 Bring 0+4 in London to Calais
3/3 Both Leaders, 8+6 offer glorious battle to Tamas
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
2
3
Message from England:
Can Tamas evade?
He can not. No CCs for me.
I'm getting an error trying to load Habbaku's file. Saying it wasn't made for this game.
PLZ someone give us a correct file. Like ehrie who should have sent out one anyways :P
Quote from: Tamas on July 15, 2009, 02:48:18 PM
PLZ someone give us a correct file. Like ehrie who should have sent out one anyways :P
File sent around.
English roll:
France: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 15
5
6
6
3
5
5
4
3
5
6
3
6
4
3
2
:bleeding: 8 hits craptastic
French roll:
France: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 12
5
2
4
3
6
3
1
5
5
4
2
5
5 hits
England loses 5 mercs, France 8. Remainins 2 French regulars and two leaders retreat to Paris.
France: Play Card as Operations
#28: 1 / Siege Mining
Message from France:
My 3 fleets move to the North Sea to try and destroy the English navy.
I ignore your naval crap and skip ahead to my Piezig debate in France.
Eck up against Cop, 7-4, wins 5-1. :yeah:
Flip Nice, Avignon, Marseilles, Brest
I guess the English and the French should resolve their little naval fight at some point.
FYI: Ehrie is up to resolve the naval fight in the North Sea, or evade, or whatever.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
4
1
Message from England:
Can I: Evade?
Darn.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 8
6
3
5
5
5
4
6
3
Message from England:
First six French attack dice, last 2 English
:lol: I think I've been wearing bullseyes this game in battles. ulmont can you add this to the file with your turn?
Popped a treatise, converted Portsmouth, yay.
Ottomans play Unpaid Mercenaries to delete Charles' hired hands.
File sent. Off to Del.
Hapsburgs: Message
Home Card for cp. Charles to Tunis.
1/5 2+2 from Algiers to Tunis.
2-5/5 Start Voyage of Conquest
England is up.
Quote from: Delirium on July 16, 2009, 02:13:17 PM
Hapsburgs: Message
Home Card for cp. Charles to Tunis.
1/5 2+2 from Algiers to Tunis.
2-5/5 Start Voyage of Conquest
Your move of troops from Algiers to Tunis costs 2 CPs, not 1.
Gah. A lot of things going on right now, apologies.
Build a merc in Valladolid instead.
England: Play Card as Event
#19: 2 / Edward VI
Message from England:
And after nine tries we finally kill Henry VIII
1/2 Mark Bolognue
2/2 Both Leaders, 8+1 off to Paris
File coming shortly.
I retreat to the fort
Congratulations, Tamas, you retreated into the fort.
You planning on playing your next impulse within this week?
Did ehrie sent out to the promised file eventually?
I did. Did it not go through? I've got it onmy flash drive which is at work. I can resend in an hour.
Never saw a file, no.
Resent
Got it.
Quote from: Delirium on July 17, 2009, 01:50:15 AM
Gah. A lot of things going on right now, apologies.
Build a merc in Valladolid instead.
I meant to say that Charles goes to Valladolid as well, don't want him in Tunis without any troops. Sorry about my lack of focus.
France: Play Card as Operations
#96: 3 / Sale of Moluccas
Message from France:
Move 1 fleet from North Sea to the Channel
Move 1+1 from Rouen to Calais, start siege
Berkut's up.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 2
5
2
Message from England:
Brandon 3+1 attempt to intercept those tards going to Calais. +1 drm for leader
8 a success? I can't remember, no rulebook handy.
No, 9+ is a success.
Berkut's still up.
Had another debate in France, which we won 2-1, flipped another space. Prots up.
Raised a merc in Koln, sieged Augsburg.
QuoteOttoman: Play Card as Operations
#65: 4 / A Mighty Fortress
Message from Ottoman:
For CPs.
1-4/4 - 2 squadrons to Lepanto.
Del's up.
I'll pass this round.
England: Play Card as Event
#22: 2 / Julius III
Message from England:
Down goes another leader.
Dudley 2+1 go to Calais
No CCs for me. Awaiting the good word of Tamas.
i take teh battle, no cc
Roll 'em, Ehrie or Tamas or somebody...
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 7
3
6
3
3
5
3
4
Message from England:
Calais 4 English dice vs 3 Frogs, English first
1 hit each. Merc dies on each side. file coming shortly.
:huh: So Dudley and 3 troops hit Calais with no CCs and somehow get 4 dice? Dudley's combat rating is zero.
Doh. :bleeding: Forgot he was a 0. Reolling.
England: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
1
6
6
3
5
4
Message from England:
Reroll. First 3 English, last three French
Dudley being a zero obviously meant he is better for some reason. Tamas can you edit my file?
THANKS A LOT HABS! :mad:
As usual, Tamas feels fine commenting but not actually making his move.
I propose that I run France from here on out.
Quote from: Habbaku on July 23, 2009, 07:39:23 AM
As usual, Tamas feels fine commenting but not actually making his move.
I propose that I run France from here on out.
I am at work goddamit
Actually, seeing the board, I pass this turn.
Berkut is still up.
Swiss mercs to drop a merc in Venica and Ravenna
Prots are up.
QuoteProtestant: Play Card as Operations
#86: 2 / Knights of St John
Message from Protestant:
1/2 - Assault Augsburg.
Protestant: Die roll request
Request: 6-sided die x 6
5
3
2
5
1
3
Message from Protestant:
3 dice from armies (5/2) + 1 from Maurice = 4 Protestant dice.
1 die from army + 1 from defending = 2 Habsburg dice.
Protestant dice first.
Protestant: Message
While I await Del's Foul Weather or other reaction card to undo my Augsburg conquest, I'll just move Maurice and his stack to Nuremberg.
Will also go ahead and eventually adjust VPs on ACTS, which is really slow for me right now.
What file are you running from, Ulmont? You don't have my latest builds in the one you sent and those took place a while ago...
Quote from: Habbaku on July 24, 2009, 10:29:27 AM
What file are you running from, Ulmont? You don't have my latest builds in the one you sent and those took place a while ago...
I ran from Berkut's file, unless I was off a round there. Let me check...
...yeah, the Languish-HIS9-T7-20-Papacy4.gmv file sent this morning.
That's not the file you ran from or, if you did, you didn't actually save the game state.
I'll just add your move to my file.
Quote#39: 4 / Augsburg Confession
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1-2/4 - Raise 1 squadron in Lepanto.
3/4 - Naval move. Navy congregates in Ionian Sea.
Rolling for interception.
Habsburgs got the interception. If they take it, the battle is 10 vs. 15. If they do not take it, my final CP will be used to naval move and attack the fleet in Barbary Coast (where Del may then attempt to evade, if he wishes).
No CCs for the battle. File's out. Del to respond, resolve battle if any, then play.
Quote from: ulmont on July 24, 2009, 09:08:20 AM
While I await Del's Foul Weather or other reaction card to undo my Augsburg conquest, I'll just move Maurice and his stack to Nuremberg.
Germany was given to you by Habs, I have nothing to add.
Succesfully evaded to Gulf of Lyon.
I pass, but I sent out a file anyway with my evasion and some corrections, Charles is in Valladolid with two mercs and the guys in Tunis are back in Algiers.
England: Play Card as Operations
#109: 1 / Venetian Informant
Message from England:
1 Merc to London. Hoping this goes another turn. Passing the rest of the turn unless Tamas causes trouble
Tamas is up to play or pass, then.
France: Play Card as Operations
#53: 2 / Plantations
Message from France:
1 regular to Rouen
Berkut's up. Presumably, he can place the regular in the file that he makes, since Tamas doesn't feel up to the arduous task.
Used Bull to CR in France and Germany, converted 4 spaces.
Protties are up.
Quote from: Berkut on July 26, 2009, 10:09:30 AM
Used Bull to CR in France and Germany, converted 4 spaces.
Protties are up.
Did you send out a file?
No, he didn't. We're eschewing files from here on out. Use your imagination.
Quote from: Habbaku on July 26, 2009, 12:12:36 PM
No, he didn't. We're eschewing files from here on out. Use your imagination.
Fair enough. Protestant religious auto-victory. :menace:
Ok, will attempt to apply all moves after the last file I got, which was apparently Del's.
Converted 2 spaces in England and 2 in Germany. File sent.
Ottomans play Auld Alliance for CPs, moving the fleet to North African Coast, then pirating the Habsburgs.
I got 1 hit. File sent--off to Del to either give a VP or a card.
I gave you a card since you'll win otherwise. You'll probably win anyway, especially since you got the good card I had left.
I pass my round, so it's England now.
Guess England will pass though.
Quote from: Delirium on July 27, 2009, 01:23:56 PM
I gave you a card since you'll win otherwise. You'll probably win anyway, especially since you got the good card I had left.
It's Habbaku or Berkut. My money's on Berkut.
It's off to Berkut, now.
Quote from: Delirium on July 27, 2009, 01:23:56 PM
I gave you a card since you'll win otherwise. You'll probably win anyway, especially since you got the good card I had left.
I pass my round, so it's England now.
Did you do a file with the card? The last one I have is from habs.
I don't recall a Delirium file with the card. I will pass as well (passing out), since I can't do anything useful with my last card.
No, he doesn't need to, it is in ACTS, duh.
Played Marburg for 5 CPs.
Moved a squadron, then CRed in Germany twice to flip 3 spaces.
Back to the Ottomans then.
Hey Del, don't forget that you can take piracy hits on your fleet...
But Habs only said vp or card, so I assumed they weren't adjacent, never looked at the map.
If I could have killed a fleet I want to do so and have the card back.
Quote from: Delirium on July 28, 2009, 08:04:43 AM
But Habs only said vp or card, so I assumed they weren't adjacent, never looked at the map.
They weren't adjacent, which is why I didn't offer. I also wouldn't have even tried piracy with 5 squadrons adjacent. ;)
I see, Berk was talking about future piracy, check.
Quote#76: 4 / Foreign Recruits
Message from Ottoman:
Playing for CPs :
1/4 - Naval move. All to Ionian Sea.
2-3/4 - Piracy against the Habsburgs.
QuoteRequest: 6-sided die x 4
5
2
1
4
Message from Ottoman:
No effect. 4 piracy dice against the Habsburgs.
One more hit against the Habsburgs. Either a card or VP is mine.
Last CP will be used to move the fleet to Barbary Coast, where Del may intercept if he truly wishes.
Played Peasants War to place 5 unrest markers in Germany.
The peasants are tired of the elitist heathens keeping them from their True Faith!
Prot spaces down to 27.
Del, please tell me you saved some nice 1 and 2 CP cards to give to the pirates?
Habsburg fleet failed to evade from a stand-up naval battle, resulting in 2 of their squadrons getting sunk.
Need to know where the fleet is retreating to. I have 1 CP left.
This is going to come down to the piracy roll against the helpless French. :(
Quote from: Habbaku on July 28, 2009, 08:50:39 AM
Habsburg fleet failed to evade from a stand-up naval battle, resulting in 2 of their squadrons getting sunk.
Need to know where the fleet is retreating to. I have 1 CP left.
A port that borders both that and the sea area south of it.
You do not have to retreat to a port, you can retreat to adjacent sea zone as well. I suggest Barbary Coast, since he did not leave a ship behind to lock you out of it. That would allow you to take piracy losses from your remaining ships.
Although he isn't likely to pirate you again anyway.
Ah, in that case I retreat to Barbary Coast, wasn't aware of that rule.
The Habsburg fleet put up a decent fight, but is now down to 1 squadron. The remaining Ottoman navy is in Gulf of Lyon.
Off to Berkut for his final play (he can't hold any cards), then Ulmont?
Passing out. I'm holding a 1 CP card and I can't do anything with it.
2CPs to CR in Germany, flipped 1 space, and I am done.
27 VPs, up to Habs to see if he can beat it with piracy.
And I did, with the aid of my home card and some decent piracy rolls. My attempt against Tamas nabbed me a VP, but my try for it in Barbary was a big whiff.
Fortunately, the Tyrrhenian Sea piracy netted 3 more hits--giving me 3 VPs since the Habsburgs are out of cards and squadrons to absorb the hits.
I played Servetus as my final play, bringing me to 29 VPs to Berkut's 27.
Osmani uber alles.
Grats on the win Habbaku, well played. You also have my rapeage last turn to thank for it. :P
3 months and 19 days, 7 turns. Not bad.
I thought I had a good shot once we extended to turn 7.
Freaking Habs. We should play any HiS game he is in as if he was France in Nappy Wars. Everyone spends the first 3 turns smacking him down, THEN go back to playing for VPs.
Quote from: Berkut on July 28, 2009, 02:29:00 PM
I thought I had a good shot once we extended to turn 7.
Oh, yeah, I thought you had it.
Quote from: Berkut on July 28, 2009, 02:29:00 PM
Freaking Habs. We should play any HiS game he is in as if he was France in Nappy Wars. Everyone spends the first 3 turns smacking him down, THEN go back to playing for VPs.
:yes:
Well, I came with in one roddy conversion in England from winning in Turn 5. Meh.
Quote from: Berkut on July 28, 2009, 02:29:00 PM
I thought I had a good shot once we extended to turn 7.
And now you know why I enjoy playing the Papacy so much. If the game goes that late (and it generally will if players are cooperative about knocking down the leaders every turn), then their chance to win skyrockets. Those late-game debaters allow you to easily one-two punch the hapless Protestants in France and England.
Quote
Freaking Habs. We should play any HiS game he is in as if he was France in Nappy Wars. Everyone spends the first 3 turns smacking him down, THEN go back to playing for VPs.
I've still won under those circumstances. Or are you forgetting about NBW? ;)
Quote from: ehrie on July 28, 2009, 03:48:11 PM
Well, I came with in one roddy conversion in England from winning in Turn 5. Meh.
England's best chance is precisely when you took it; you shouldn't feel bad about it failing. In general, the English chance of winning is considered to be one of the lower ones as their strengths are in the early game--when they have relatively few cards to take advantage of it.
The crap-shoot of their heir roll is another failing point for them, unfortunately. It could be 5 CPs or as many as 25 spent to get those 5 VPs--creating a giant divergence in experiences between those extremes.
I think the sequel game,
The Virgin Queen, will likely take a lot of these minor niggles into account. I suppose I'll find out in a few days when Ed Beach gives his seminar.
It's also really dependent on drawing 3 CP+ cards of which I didn't draw many in turns 6 and 7. Also woulda been nice if the Prottys could have won a debate or two in England instead of getting steamrolled every time.
Quote from: ehrie on July 28, 2009, 07:20:05 PM
It's also really dependent on drawing 3 CP+ cards of which I didn't draw many in turns 6 and 7. Also woulda been nice if the Prottys could have won a debate or two in England instead of getting steamrolled every time.
:bleeding:
Yes, then I would have won a religious auto-victory...I was 5 spaces away :cry:
Quote from: ulmont on July 28, 2009, 07:32:01 PM
Quote from: ehrie on July 28, 2009, 07:20:05 PM
It's also really dependent on drawing 3 CP+ cards of which I didn't draw many in turns 6 and 7. Also woulda been nice if the Prottys could have won a debate or two in England instead of getting steamrolled every time.
:bleeding:
Yes, then I would have won a religious auto-victory...I was 5 spaces away :cry:
I help the Peasants Revolt for a couple turns, just in case I needed to stop a late win by you.
Quote from: Berkut on July 28, 2009, 09:38:23 PM
I help the Peasants Revolt for a couple turns, just in case I needed to stop a late win by you.
It really is a devastating card if played properly (by an anti-Protestant player).
Congratulations to Habs on the win, but he didn't seem to need to play that well, most of the players never cared about what needs to be done to stop the Ottomans and I certainly didn't produce enough of a threat with my own play. The alliance with the Protestants to target Antwerp, that was cool though.
In my view Berk played an inspired Papacy and probably needed to play better to almost win.
Given that very few of the players looked interested in long-term play I'm surprised the game lasted seven turns. Overall the way people approached this game has had a negative effect on my appreciation of Here I Stand.
Quote from: Delirium on July 29, 2009, 05:11:35 AM
Congratulations to Habs on the win, but he didn't seem to need to play that well, most of the players never cared about what needs to be done to stop the Ottomans and I certainly didn't produce enough of a threat with my own play. The alliance with the Protestants to target Antwerp, that was cool though.
In my view Berk played an inspired Papacy and probably needed to play better to almost win.
Given that very few of the players looked interested in long-term play I'm surprised the game lasted seven turns. Overall the way people approached this game has had a negative effect on my appreciation of Here I Stand.
That doesn't seemto make much sense. In order of play turn:
Habbaku - Won so yes, he played a really really good game.
Del - Can't really see what you did wrong either. Surrendering Austria was tough, but all the people around you took turns being on the brink of winning.
Me - I had one chance to win and went for it. Can't really see what I did wrong. I never had cards that could negativly affect any player all game.
Tamas - He played a kind of passive France, sure, but I find it hard as France to make war on anybody because it's so easy for another player to stab you in the back.
Berkut - He played awesome, IMO. To be so far down and come to the brink of victory was very impressive
Ulmont - I mean, what else did you want from him? He had sickeningly luck early on, why wouldn't you try and capitalize on that?
Well, to be fair to Del, the hapsburgs have a very hard job in HiS. While they have a great shot at winning, they are hard pressed to balance all the things they need to do.
However, I do not agree that others did little to stop the Ottomans - quite honestly, the only one who can really stop the Ottomans is the Hapsburgs. He can get some help with fleet loans and such, and certainly people should be doing that, but the onus is on him, and of course people will use those fleet loans as bargaining chips.
ANd Jeromey is really, really good at playing the Ottomans. It is a tough road to beat him, and I actually think that most everyone played a decent game. HiS among good players comes down to timing, luck, and recognizing when the timing is right to do something big.
What ehrie said about France is true - it is hard for them to go to war with others - but that doesn't mean they should not - it just means they need to be very careful about their timing. In fact, I would say that barring some amazing luck, France cannot win without a war.
Timing is everything. Jeromey won, but most of the other players could have won, and Jeromey won because he was able to get the cards and dice he needed when he needed them - and he set himself up so that that opportunity would present itself.
I think I did the same thing - but it didn't fall my way this time. It was still a lot of fun.
I saw today that GMT is making a sequel to this game called "Virgin Queen" that goes from 1559 - 1598. :)
Yeah, I've been helping play-test it off and on. It's a lot more involved and I think a lot of the sub-systems need to be excised from the game. Of course, it's only at version .4 or something by now, so there's plenty of time to fix it.
One of the largest problems seems to be the attempt to force it to be a 6-player game.
Quote from: Caliga on March 22, 2011, 02:07:43 PM
I saw today that GMT is making a sequel to this game called "Virgin Queen" that goes from 1559 - 1598. :)
Yes the sequel has been in production for a while. They just finally added it to their PS500 list for pre-order.