The Georgia Board of Pardons and Paroles denied clemency to him yesterday. The state is scheduled to kill him by lethal injection at 7:00pm EST today.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fightbacknews.org%2Fsites%2Fdefault%2Ffiles%2Ftroy%2520davis.jpg&hash=4084431ea495eda27657e80c06b513cf7fb1f40a)
State murder in the USA in 2011. :swiss:
Why is this notable?
Also, I don't think the word "murder" means what you think it means.
What bothers me is the fact that the state has not proven guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, and that was BEFORE 7 of 9 witnesses recanted their testimony.
Quote from: Berkut on September 21, 2011, 04:10:14 PM
Also, I don't think the word "murder" means what you think it means.
:D
I was in favor of a delay until I heard Europeans open their big stupid ape like mouths on the issue.
Stick the needle in.
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:11:16 PM
What bothers me is the fact that the state has not proven guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, and that was BEFORE 7 of 9 witnesses recanted their testimony.
I think you have confused the word "fact" with the term "in my opinion".
Quote from: Barrister on September 21, 2011, 04:15:47 PM
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:11:16 PM
What bothers me is the fact that the state has not proven guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, and that was BEFORE 7 of 9 witnesses recanted their testimony.
I think you have confused the word "fact" with the term "in my opinion".
Not in this case. In his previous hearings, even the state admitted as much. This is a different matter than the usual protest about an execution - there's some serious doubt about the procedure, etc.
I am not against the death penalty, but I do demand that those slated to be executed get a fair trial, have their guilt absolutely proven and that their appeals are heard promptly and fairly.
Besides most of the witnesses bagging out, the state did not provide material evidence that he was the murderer.
No weapon, no DNA, nothing. That case was decided on the eyewitnesses, and seven of nine have recanted.
He has offered to take a poly, and the state refused to give him a poly.
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:30:38 PM
I am not against the death penalty, but I do demand that those slated to be executed get a fair trial, have their guilt absolutely proven and that their appeals are heard promptly and fairly.
Berkut is going to respond how unjust death penalty is not worse than prison sentence in 3. 2. 1...
Also, until you do away with your barbaric customs, please refrain from ever criticizing Europe for violating basic freedoms, such as a freedom to yell gibberish in Arabic in a street.
There are merits to being pro- and anti-death penalty. Barbarism is also in the eye of the beholder.
For the record, I am pro-death penalty in principle, but anti-death penalty in certain circumstances.
I have zero problem with a guilty murderer being executed, but I demand in return that the state not abuse this power in weak cases.
I'm just pointing out than in Europe we have decided universally that death penalty is a basic violation of human rights.
I'm rather happy to be a part of culture that considers human life to be more valuable than an ability to express a belief in imaginary creatures.
Heard the DA who tried the case interviewed on CNN. He pointed out that the defense team had possession of the recantations and sat on them (for years??) until 8 days before the orginal execution date. And that a court examined the recantations and found them not credible.
Here's a link to another death penalty story - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44613428/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/ (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44613428/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/)
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 21, 2011, 05:01:16 PM
Heard the DA who tried the case interviewed on CNN. He pointed out that the defense team had possession of the recantations and sat on them (for years??) until 8 days before the orginal execution date. And that a court examined the recantations and found them not credible.
Very troubling.
Quote from: Martinus on September 21, 2011, 04:59:03 PM
I'm just pointing out than in Europe we have decided universally that death penalty is a basic violation of human rights.
I'm rather happy to be a part of culture that considers human life to be more valuable than an ability to express a belief in imaginary creatures.
Tainted
Mart and Tim form the axis of taint.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 21, 2011, 05:01:16 PM
Heard the DA who tried the case interviewed on CNN. He pointed out that the defense team had possession of the recantations and sat on them (for years??) until 8 days before the orginal execution date. And that a court examined the recantations and found them not credible.
At the evidentiary hearing ordered by the U.S. Supreme Court (which was a very unusual move), the defense also did not actually call the witnesses, but merely relied on their affidavits. :hmm:
Oh, and there is going to be a vigil at my university for Davis. What do you guys think the prospects are for scoring some tail at said event?
Quote from: Kleves on September 21, 2011, 06:25:54 PM
Oh, and there is going to be a vigil at my university for Davis. What do you guys think the prospects are for scoring some tail at said event?
1/20 going in cold, 1/5 warm.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 21, 2011, 04:14:41 PM
I was in favor of a delay until I heard Europeans open their big stupid ape like mouths on the issue.
Stick the needle in.
Yeah. Less worrying about our bidness and more fixing your sovereign debt problems, Euroweenies. :mad:
That said, I'm opposed to capital punishment, but don't understand why this guy's case is special or is more deserving of commutation than anyone else's.
Execution delayed as the US Supreme Court debates whether to grant a stay of execution...
I thought the Texas arson case was the more interesting. Incidentally Perry was governor at the time and has been accused of blocking any investigation into it.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 06:53:26 PM
Execution delayed as the US Supreme Court debates whether to grant a stay of execution...
They granted that five minutes
after the guy was supposed to have been executed. Better late then never, I guess.
Quote from: Kleves on September 21, 2011, 06:25:54 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 21, 2011, 05:01:16 PM
Heard the DA who tried the case interviewed on CNN. He pointed out that the defense team had possession of the recantations and sat on them (for years??) until 8 days before the orginal execution date. And that a court examined the recantations and found them not credible.
At the evidentiary hearing ordered by the U.S. Supreme Court (which was a very unusual move), the defense also did not actually call the witnesses, but merely relied on their affidavits. :hmm:
Oh, and there is going to be a vigil at my university for Davis. What do you guys think the prospects are for scoring some tail at said event?
Follow the smell of pachouli and thou wilt scoreth if thee condemneth the wickedness of republicans.
Quote from: Martinus on September 21, 2011, 04:47:48 PM
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:30:38 PM
I am not against the death penalty, but I do demand that those slated to be executed get a fair trial, have their guilt absolutely proven and that their appeals are heard promptly and fairly.
Berkut is going to respond how unjust death penalty is not worse than prison sentence in 3. 2. 1...
Berkut never made any such claim. Stop being such a liar.
Quote from: Berkut on September 21, 2011, 07:48:08 PM
Quote from: Martinus on September 21, 2011, 04:47:48 PM
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:30:38 PM
I am not against the death penalty, but I do demand that those slated to be executed get a fair trial, have their guilt absolutely proven and that their appeals are heard promptly and fairly.
Berkut is going to respond how unjust death penalty is not worse than prison sentence in 3. 2. 1...
Berkut never made any such claim. Stop being such a liar.
You did say so in a way.
You said when it comes to an innocent being found guilty, prison or death sentence was equivalent, neither could be corrected and it wasn't a valid argument to be agains death penalty.
I think that was sort of my argument, with which Berkut agreed, IIRC. However, the point of my argument was that it's kind of stupid to attack death penalty because there could have been a wrongful conviction. So, wrongfully sending a guy to prison for the rest of his life is not that bad? This is an argument against wrongful conviction, not against death penalty.
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:16:10 PM
I think that was sort of my argument, with which Berkut agreed, IIRC. However, the point of my argument was that it's kind of stupid to attack death penalty because there could have been a wrongful conviction. So, wrongfully sending a guy to prison for the rest of his life is not that bad? This is an argument against wrongful conviction, not against death penalty.
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
Quote from: Razgovory on September 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
You can't take back years or decades of someone's life. Making the puishment partially reversible isn't really a compelling fix to the wrongful conviction problem.
Quote from: viper37 on September 21, 2011, 08:06:09 PM
Quote from: Berkut on September 21, 2011, 07:48:08 PM
Quote from: Martinus on September 21, 2011, 04:47:48 PM
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:30:38 PM
I am not against the death penalty, but I do demand that those slated to be executed get a fair trial, have their guilt absolutely proven and that their appeals are heard promptly and fairly.
Berkut is going to respond how unjust death penalty is not worse than prison sentence in 3. 2. 1...
Berkut never made any such claim. Stop being such a liar.
You did say so in a way.
You said when it comes to an innocent being found guilty, prison or death sentence was equivalent, neither could be corrected and it wasn't a valid argument to be agains death penalty.
No, what I said was that opposition to the DP because it may result in unjust execution of someone and that is different than unlawful imprisonment because it is more permanent is fallacious, since we know that there are plenty of cases of unjust imprisonment that are never justly resolved, and hence is just as permanent as a unjust death penalty.
That is not even remotely similar to saying that killing someone is not worse than a death sentence.
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:23:47 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
You can't take back years or decades of someone's life. Making the puishment partially reversible isn't really a compelling fix to the wrongful conviction problem.
:frusty:
Christ, this is really not that hard of an idea.
Yes, you CAN in some particular case, fix a unjust imprisonment. Hell, we can even stipulate for the sake of argument that you can even make the person unjustly imprisoned whole via some kind of compensation.
That doesn't address my point in any way, shape, or form however. My point is that no matter what CAN happen in a particular case, we are 100% certain that there are many, many cases where it is never fixed. Therefore, it is certainly the case that the system of incarceration is just as flawed in that it will *certainly* result in people going to jail who should not and who will never be exonerated. IE, from the permanence perspective, they are no different than someone executed.
The fact that some people WILL in fact be exonerated has no more relevance than the fact that some DP inmates are exonerated has on the permanence argument - we know that some are not, hence the problem remains.
My point is very simple. There is no difference from a permanence standpoint between the two systems. They both suffer from the flaw that innocent people will be unjustly punished and will never be exonerated.
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:23:47 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
You can't take back years or decades of someone's life. Making the puishment partially reversible isn't really a compelling fix to the wrongful conviction problem.
This is true, but you are always going to get wrongful convictions, and every person wrongfully convicted has a very compelling reason to fix it. I don't care for the death penalty for religious reasons (stone age fairy worshiper that I am), and that it's really expensive. Also I'm not really sure it deters crime. There are some exceptions. For instance, war criminals or deserters in war time.
Quote from: Martinus on September 21, 2011, 04:47:48 PM
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:30:38 PM
I am not against the death penalty, but I do demand that those slated to be executed get a fair trial, have their guilt absolutely proven and that their appeals are heard promptly and fairly.
Berkut is going to respond how unjust death penalty is not worse than prison sentence in 3. 2. 1...
It's not.
I'm a bit confused by people claiming what Berkut said or was going to say. Berkut has never been one to shy away from telling us what he thinks, I think he can speak for himself.
Stay denied, they should be killing him as we speak.
That sucks. Take solace in the knowledge that a swift death is preferable to one more month imprisoned.
One of the guys who dragged James Byrd to death back in the late 90s was executed tonight in Texas as well. What an exciting evening for the justice system.
I wish I could decapitate him with a rusty axe and bathe in his blood.
:(
Quote from: Martinus on September 21, 2011, 04:59:03 PM
I'm just pointing out than in Europe we have decided universally that death penalty is a basic violation of human rights.
I'm rather happy to be a part of culture that considers human life to be more valuable than an ability to express a belief in imaginary creatures.
You're so happy being part of a culture that considers human life to be more valuable than an ability to express a belief in imaginary creatures, why don't you come out of the closet already and find out exactly how much that culture values your human life, cocknibbler.
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm 9/21/2011. Cause of death: homicide.
:lol: Oh, please.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 21, 2011, 10:21:15 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm 9/21/2011. Cause of death: homicide.
:lol: Oh, please.
It's what goes on the coroner's report.
Now, now. Let's focus on the important things instead: buying Exocets to fire at Japanese whaling ships. Take no prisoners, unless they look good in a dress.
I don't really give a shit about concepts like "oh let's not be barbaric" and I also don't, and will not ever, allow a bunch of Jew-murdering bigots in Europe be the ones to dictate to me what is and is not barbarism.
That being said, the truth about the death penalty in America is it's something applied to less than 0.1% of murderers (we've killed 35 this year or so), and generates a massive amount of controversy. I just simply do not see a point to it anymore. I'm fine with its philosophical underpinnings, but the way the system is set up it is not really a fairly applied punishment. Basically if, subjectively, a jury decides you need an example made of you then you win the DP lottery. You're then one of like 3500-4000 dudes who get to live on death row indefinitely (and if you're on death row in states like Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, California which only vaguely have the DP you're essentially going to die of natural causes in any case.)
I also don't really buy that this guy had any particularly strong problems with his case. He was convicted based on the testimony of many eyewitnesses, later some of those witnesses recanted--however those recantations were reviewed by many, many layers of appellate courts. He was even given a brand new evidentiary hearing at the district court level awhile back and the judge there did not find those recantations credible. Essentially every judge from Georgia state court up through the SCOTUS said "yeah, the recantations aren't credible." That probably means there was something highly fishy about the testimony they were given that "exonerated" this guy. Meaning reasonable doubt was met, and that means he was legally and rightfully eligible for whatever sentence existed under statute at the time--in this case execution was one of those sentences.
The Duane Buck case was a lot more compelling. In his case you had a state psychologist who said at his sentencing hearing that Buck was more dangerous because he was black--essentially making him a witness whose testimony seriously injured Buck's rights with his testimony. Something like five other death row inmates in Texas had that same racist psychologist testify at their sentencing hearing. What happened with those five? They said, "yeah, this tainted the sentencing hearing, so they get new ones." All five got brand new sentencing hearings during which they could have been spared death, in all five they were sentenced to death again. For whatever reason Buck has been denied a new sentencing hearing of his own. No one doubts what the outcome would be, but many (myself included) feel the justice system needs to at least try to work the same for everyone, and when you have six people on death row in the exact same situation, and you deal with 5 of them in one way and 1 of them in a different way, it injures one's sense of equal treatment before the law. In Buck's case it is truly just a legal concern, though, Buck killed his girlfriend and injured another person in the process--the person he tried to kill along with his girlfriend personally knew Buck and testified that it was Buck that attacked and killed him and that attacked and killed Buck's girlfriend--his guilt is essentially unquestioned factually.
Justice has been served.
Well Euros, if it makes you feel any better, I'd have swapped this guy out to give Mumia the needle ASfuckingAP instead.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 21, 2011, 10:30:59 PM
Well Euros, if it makes you feel any better, I'd have swapped this guy out to give Mumia the needle ASfuckingAP instead.
What will be really interesting is 50 years from now when I'm half senile in a nursing home (being optimistic, I'll probably just be dead) Europe will be governed by sharia law and they'll be beheading teenage girls for holding hands with a boy in public; but I'm sure Marti (or rather the Marti of that era, as the real Marti will have long since died from HIV) will still call us the barbarians.
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 21, 2011, 10:27:16 PM
I don't really give a shit about concepts like "oh let's not be barbaric" and I also don't, and will not ever, allow a bunch of Jew-murdering bigots in Europe be the ones to dictate to me what is and is not barbarism.
Quote of the fucking day. Kudos to the Yankees fan in Old Dominion.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:21:48 PM
Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 21, 2011, 10:21:15 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm 9/21/2011. Cause of death: homicide.
:lol: Oh, please.
It's what goes on the coroner's report.
Well, in that case, it's OK.
Quote from: Ideologue on September 21, 2011, 10:23:34 PM
Let's focus on the important things instead: buying Exocets to fire at Japanese whaling ships.
Fuck yeah.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Bye, fucking copkiller
Homicide isn't a loaded word...it's any killing of one person by another. Quite a many killings are both morally and legally defensible.
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 21, 2011, 10:39:50 PM
Homicide isn't a loaded word...
It is when celebrities and Euros use it.
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:16:10 PM
So, wrongfully sending a guy to prison for the rest of his life is not that bad?
It is bad. It is not as bad as killing him. Once he's dead, he's not coming back.
If he spents 15-20 years in jail for a wrongful conviction, he can get money as a compensation. Time is money.
Quote from: Berkut on September 21, 2011, 08:35:21 PM
That doesn't address my point in any way, shape, or form however. My point is that no matter what CAN happen in a particular case, we are 100% certain that there are many, many cases where it is never fixed. Therefore, it is certainly the case that the system of incarceration is just as flawed in that it will *certainly* result in people going to jail who should not and who will never be exonerated. IE, from the permanence perspective, they are no different than someone executed.
[...]
My point is very simple. There is no difference from a permanence standpoint between the two systems. They both suffer from the flaw that innocent people will be unjustly punished and will never be exonerated.
People who are wrongfully convicted usually do not spend the remainder of their lives in jail.
And there's no clock ticking, and the procedures are less numerous than they are when you're trying to avoid execution.
What usually happens is that in 15-20 years top, some new facts arise and they are freed. However, if he was exectued 10 years after his trial, or if bogus science was used to secure dp conviction, there's nothing to be done anymore.
Wich is why it's a valid argument against dp, and your argument is silly. The other arguments being the cost of the procedures, for the State and for the defendant. And the lack of a deterrent when used. It's not like countries with death penalty have the lowest crime rates of all the world, you know.
Quote from: viper37 on September 21, 2011, 10:49:10 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:16:10 PM
So, wrongfully sending a guy to prison for the rest of his life is not that bad?
It is bad. It is not as bad as killing him.
It's worse.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
Quote from: Maximus on September 21, 2011, 11:05:06 PM
Quote from: viper37 on September 21, 2011, 10:49:10 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:16:10 PM
So, wrongfully sending a guy to prison for the rest of his life is not that bad?
It is bad. It is not as bad as killing him.
It's worse.
If I'm guilty of an horrible crime, I think I'd want to die rather than live with my conscience.
But if I was wrongfully convicted, I think I'd prefer sitting in jail for 10-15 years and get monetary compensation rather than be executed.
Given how many death penalty cases make it to the various appeal process, up to the Supreme court or the governor, I believe many share this line of thinking. Of course, real criminals do appeal too.
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
how do you know that for a certainty? How do you know the real killer is not free and laughing about it all?
Quote from: viper37 on September 21, 2011, 11:14:53 PM
and get monetary compensation rather than be executed.
That's falling out of vogue. Not everybody's scoring compensation in civil cases in some states. Prosecution was in "good faith", and all that.
Quote from: viper37 on September 21, 2011, 11:16:16 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
how do you know that for a certainty? How do you know the real killer is not free and laughing about it all?
Convicted. The state of Georgia will have to deal with it if it's a mistake. Until then...CONVICTED.
Off-duty, working security at Burger King and intervening in a fight.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:21:36 PM
Off-duty, working security at Burger King and intervening in a fight.
Your point??
Not a cop-killer, and a reasonable doubt it wasn't Troy Davis who killed him.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:23:05 PM
Not a cop-killer, and a reasonable doubt it wasn't Troy Davis who killed him.
Cop killer, and CONVICTED
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:24:24 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:23:05 PM
Not a cop-killer, and a reasonable doubt it wasn't Troy Davis who killed him.
Cop killer, and CONVICTED
And KILLED. Hope everyone related to the deceased is transformed miraculously by this killing and never feels the pain of their loss again. God knows the death penalty can do that at least. :)
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:26:54 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:24:24 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:23:05 PM
Not a cop-killer, and a reasonable doubt it wasn't Troy Davis who killed him.
Cop killer, and CONVICTED
And KILLED. Hope everyone related to the deceased is transformed miraculously by this killing and never feels the pain of their loss again. God knows the death penalty can do that at least. :)
Yes, troy davis was put to death
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:43:19 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:26:54 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:24:24 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:23:05 PM
Not a cop-killer, and a reasonable doubt it wasn't Troy Davis who killed him.
Cop killer, and CONVICTED
And KILLED. Hope everyone related to the deceased is transformed miraculously by this killing and never feels the pain of their loss again. God knows the death penalty can do that at least. :)
Yes, troy davis was put to death
Hope it gives you at least some happiness to know Georgia killed him. :)
A murderer died. That's what justice is like.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:45:25 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:43:19 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:26:54 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:24:24 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 11:23:05 PM
Not a cop-killer, and a reasonable doubt it wasn't Troy Davis who killed him.
Cop killer, and CONVICTED
And KILLED. Hope everyone related to the deceased is transformed miraculously by this killing and never feels the pain of their loss again. God knows the death penalty can do that at least. :)
Yes, troy davis was put to death
Hope it gives you at least some happiness to know Georgia killed him. :)
;)
Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 21, 2011, 11:09:24 PM
Quote from: Maximus on September 21, 2011, 11:05:06 PM
Quote from: viper37 on September 21, 2011, 10:49:10 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:16:10 PM
So, wrongfully sending a guy to prison for the rest of his life is not that bad?
It is bad. It is not as bad as killing him.
It's worse.
I concur.
Also agree. A prison is no place for a human being. Give people the dignity and mercy of a swift death, not a slow one.
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:16:10 PM
I think that was sort of my argument, with which Berkut agreed, IIRC. However, the point of my argument was that it's kind of stupid to attack death penalty because there could have been a wrongful conviction. So, wrongfully sending a guy to prison for the rest of his life is not that bad? This is an argument against wrongful conviction, not against death penalty.
As a statistician you should know this argument is bullshit. Assuming death penalty actually means execution (and not someone being kept on the death row for the rest of his natural life span as is sometimes the case), a chance of finding evidence that the conviction was wrongful while the guy is still alive is much greater if he is in prison than if he is sentenced to death. If that happens he can still be let out and compensated somehow - a dead guy cannot.
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:23:47 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
You can't take back years or decades of someone's life. Making the puishment partially reversible isn't really a compelling fix to the wrongful conviction problem.
Again, you must realize this argument is bullshit - otherwise you would have no job as insurance would be useless. We compensate financially for various wrongs or harms done to people all the time. Why should this be different? The only case when someone cannot be compensated for a harm done to him, obviously, is when that person is dead.
Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 21, 2011, 10:17:56 PM
Quote from: Martinus on September 21, 2011, 04:59:03 PM
I'm just pointing out than in Europe we have decided universally that death penalty is a basic violation of human rights.
I'm rather happy to be a part of culture that considers human life to be more valuable than an ability to express a belief in imaginary creatures.
You're so happy being part of a culture that considers human life to be more valuable than an ability to express a belief in imaginary creatures, why don't you come out of the closet already and find out exactly how much that culture values your human life, cocknibbler.
Define "coming out of the closet". I said I'm gay to my parents, all my friends, my boss, several of my coworkers and my ex-coworkers. I don't wear a pink triangle but I think this pretty much counts for being out of the closet. Also I never pretend or pretended that I'm straight. Are you saying that in order to be out, you have to tell every individual you meet that you are gay?
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
He looks mildly retarded. Perhaps it was euthanasia.
Besides, with this hairdo and stache, he should have been executed for the crimes against style.
Edit: Sorry, just saw he was a military veteran. So yes, he actually was at least mildly retarded.
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:26:24 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
He looks mildly retarded. Perhaps it was euthanasia.
Besides, with this hairdo and stache, he should have been executed for the crimes against style.
Edit: Sorry, just saw he was a military veteran. So yes, he actually was at least mildly retarded.
Blame and demonize the vic. Typical Euro. Nice attempt at a troll..fag.
Only the shallow do not judge by appearance.
Last words of Troy Davis, spoken to the AI representatives:
"The struggle for justice doesn't end with me. This struggle is for all the Troy Davises who came before me and all the ones who will come after me. I'm in good spirits and I'm prayerful and at peace."
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:33:03 AM
Only the shallow do not judge by appearance.
Oh, shallow. I thought you wrote swallow.
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 01:37:19 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:33:03 AM
Only the shallow do not judge by appearance.
Oh, shallow. I thought you wrote swallow.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3.bp.blogspot.com%2F_AAfevDg2tPI%2FTIYWTAzuXwI%2FAAAAAAAAA00%2F5_yd9WTo54M%2Fs1600%2FSwallows.jpg&hash=8e2bd39a9a6e4641477581d2b62c08af81a04492) ???
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:37:00 AM
Last words of Troy Davis, spoken to the AI representatives:
"The struggle for justice doesn't end with me. This struggle is for all the Troy Davises who came before me and all the ones who will come after me. I'm in good spirits and I'm prayerful and at peace."
Amazing how they always find GOD in the end.
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:19:18 AM
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:23:47 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
You can't take back years or decades of someone's life. Making the puishment partially reversible isn't really a compelling fix to the wrongful conviction problem.
Again, you must realize this argument is bullshit - otherwise you would have no job as insurance would be useless. We compensate financially for various wrongs or harms done to people all the time. Why should this be different? The only case when someone cannot be compensated for a harm done to him, obviously, is when that person is dead.
Are people usually compensated for this? It seems very rare to me. :unsure:
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 01:32:04 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:26:24 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
He looks mildly retarded. Perhaps it was euthanasia.
Besides, with this hairdo and stache, he should have been executed for the crimes against style.
Edit: Sorry, just saw he was a military veteran. So yes, he actually was at least mildly retarded.
Blame and demonize the vic. Typical Euro. Nice attempt at a troll..fag.
Martinus is not the official spokesman for Europe.
Quote from: Octavian on September 22, 2011, 02:12:18 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 01:32:04 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:26:24 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
He looks mildly retarded. Perhaps it was euthanasia.
Besides, with this hairdo and stache, he should have been executed for the crimes against style.
Edit: Sorry, just saw he was a military veteran. So yes, he actually was at least mildly retarded.
Blame and demonize the vic. Typical Euro. Nice attempt at a troll..fag.
Martinus is not the official spokesman for Europe.
My apologies. But I did state Euro (singular) as apposed to Euros (plural).
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 02:18:40 AM
Quote from: Octavian on September 22, 2011, 02:12:18 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 01:32:04 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:26:24 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 21, 2011, 11:11:31 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:20:30 PM
Troy Anthony Davis, 10/9/1968 -- 11:08pm EST, 9/21/2011.
Cause of death: homicide.
Age: 27
Military veteran
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.fop9.net%2Fmarkmacphail%2Fimages%2F2.jpg&hash=f873342806a7c307876490d79bea7ada193f2d23)
Cause of Death: Murdered by Troy Davis
He looks mildly retarded. Perhaps it was euthanasia.
Besides, with this hairdo and stache, he should have been executed for the crimes against style.
Edit: Sorry, just saw he was a military veteran. So yes, he actually was at least mildly retarded.
Blame and demonize the vic. Typical Euro. Nice attempt at a troll..fag.
Martinus is not the official spokesman for Europe.
My apologies. But I did state Euro (singular) as apposed to Euros (plural).
Ah I didn't see that. Well then I apologize for accusing you of elevating Martinus to a position he most certainly does not deserve nor have.
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 02:35:58 AM
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
Point taken for the future.
Eastern Europens to West Europeans are what Mexicans are to Americans.
Poles=Mexicans.
Quote from: jimmy olsen on September 22, 2011, 02:11:15 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:19:18 AM
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:23:47 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
You can't take back years or decades of someone's life. Making the puishment partially reversible isn't really a compelling fix to the wrongful conviction problem.
Again, you must realize this argument is bullshit - otherwise you would have no job as insurance would be useless. We compensate financially for various wrongs or harms done to people all the time. Why should this be different? The only case when someone cannot be compensated for a harm done to him, obviously, is when that person is dead.
Are people usually compensated for this? It seems very rare to me. :unsure:
At least in Europe, compensation for wrongful conviction is de rigeur. People even get compensated for pre-trial arrest if they are subsequently found not guilty, if the arrest is proven to be unnecessary or too long. There is extensive caselaw of ECHR on this.
Another area where European societies are freer when it comes to wrongful actions of their governments than is the case in the US.
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 02:35:58 AM
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
How nicely racist of you. It's funny how you consider yourself a leftist. You just want the government to take money away from the rich and give it to you. That's not leftism. That's being a jealous failure.
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 03:24:09 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 02:35:58 AM
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
How nicely racist of you. It's funny how you consider yourself a leftist. You just want the government to take money away from the rich and give it to you. That's not leftism. That's being a jealous failure.
No more "racist" than calling the United States barbaric. Oh, right, when you're blithely anti-American, you're just sticking up for principles, but when you talk a little shit in return about Jew-murdering, Nazi-loving Eastern Euros who other than the Czechs and Slovaks never even had a functioning democracy until the Goddamned 1990s, you're a bigot.
Of course, not "racist" by any normal, fluent definition of the term--I didn't say shit about Slavs. "Eastern European" is not a race, you knob. It's a geopolitical unit defined by domination by the USSR and/or communism, and often marked by the enthusiastic support of totalitarianism of any stripe. Get with the pogrom.
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 03:21:34 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on September 22, 2011, 02:11:15 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:19:18 AM
Quote from: DGuller on September 21, 2011, 08:23:47 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 21, 2011, 08:18:58 PM
Well, you can sorta fix a wrongful jail sentence. You can let him go and hope bygones will be bygones. If you execute him, there's less chance of that.
You can't take back years or decades of someone's life. Making the puishment partially reversible isn't really a compelling fix to the wrongful conviction problem.
Again, you must realize this argument is bullshit - otherwise you would have no job as insurance would be useless. We compensate financially for various wrongs or harms done to people all the time. Why should this be different? The only case when someone cannot be compensated for a harm done to him, obviously, is when that person is dead.
Are people usually compensated for this? It seems very rare to me. :unsure:
At least in Europe, compensation for wrongful conviction is de rigeur. People even get compensated for pre-trial arrest if they are subsequently found not guilty, if the arrest is proven to be unnecessary or too long. There is extensive caselaw of ECHR on this.
Another area where European societies are freer when it comes to wrongful actions of their governments than is the case in the US.
But this is a fair point. Compensation for wrongful conviction is a terribly obvious thing.
Quote from: The Brain on September 22, 2011, 03:22:35 AM
Quote from: AnchorClanker on September 21, 2011, 04:30:38 PM
and seven of nine have recanted.
1. It's "has".
2. :mmm:
:lol: She was the only reason to watch that dumb show.
As to the matter being discussed in the thread, I don't really care. Seems to me the dude was guilty, then again I'm against the death penalty.
It's no big loss to humanity, folks.
The plural of Euro is Euro. :wacko:
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 03:39:06 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 03:24:09 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 02:35:58 AM
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
How nicely racist of you. It's funny how you consider yourself a leftist. You just want the government to take money away from the rich and give it to you. That's not leftism. That's being a jealous failure.
No more "racist" than calling the United States barbaric. Oh, right, when you're blithely anti-American, you're just sticking up for principles, but when you talk a little shit in return about Jew-murdering, Nazi-loving Eastern Euros who other than the Czechs and Slovaks never even had a functioning democracy until the Goddamned 1990s, you're a bigot.
Of course, not "racist" by any normal, fluent definition of the term--I didn't say shit about Slavs. "Eastern European" is not a race, you knob. It's a geopolitical unit defined by domination by the USSR and/or communism, and often marked by the enthusiastic support of totalitarianism of any stripe. Get with the pogrom.
I was talking about you looking down on Mexicans.
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 04:17:49 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 03:39:06 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 03:24:09 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 02:35:58 AM
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
How nicely racist of you. It's funny how you consider yourself a leftist. You just want the government to take money away from the rich and give it to you. That's not leftism. That's being a jealous failure.
No more "racist" than calling the United States barbaric. Oh, right, when you're blithely anti-American, you're just sticking up for principles, but when you talk a little shit in return about Jew-murdering, Nazi-loving Eastern Euros who other than the Czechs and Slovaks never even had a functioning democracy until the Goddamned 1990s, you're a bigot.
Of course, not "racist" by any normal, fluent definition of the term--I didn't say shit about Slavs. "Eastern European" is not a race, you knob. It's a geopolitical unit defined by domination by the USSR and/or communism, and often marked by the enthusiastic support of totalitarianism of any stripe. Get with the pogrom.
I was talking about you looking down on Mexicans.
I don't really. Mexicans are a fine people, albeit one with comparatively little experience with a legitimate state apparatus, much as Eastern Europeans.
In Warsaw, are there stray dogs everywhere?
Even the trolling here is stale these days. :(
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:23:05 AM
Are you saying that in order to be out, you have to tell every individual you meet that you are gay?
It would certainly make things easier when it comes to curbstomping them. Fag.
Well, let's not argue. At least we can all agree that something positive came out of this story - there is one less pig left alive. :)
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 05:52:55 AM
Well, let's not argue. At least we can all agree that something positive came out of this story - there is one less pig left alive. :)
Enjoy your day off!
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 05:52:55 AM
Well, let's not argue. At least we can all agree that something positive came out of this story - there is one less pig left alive. :)
Boo, bad form.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 21, 2011, 10:16:51 PM
One of the guys who dragged James Byrd to death back in the late 90s was executed tonight in Texas as well. What an exciting evening for the justice system.
QuoteAUSTIN (Reuters) - Texas executed a white supremacist on Wednesday convicted of helping to kill a black man by dragging him behind a truck in what some call the most notorious race crime of the post-Civil Rights era.
Lawrence Russell Brewer, 44, was convicted of capital murder along with two other men also found guilty of taking part in the kidnapping and slaying of James Byrd Jr. in 1998.
Brewer was given a lethal injection of drugs and pronounced dead at 6:21 p.m. local time in Huntsville, Texas, according to Michelle Lyons of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice. He had no last words.
Brewer, together with the two other men, offered Byrd a ride home, attacked him on a country road, chained his ankles to the back of a pickup, and then dragged him behind the truck for several miles in the vicinity of Jasper, Texas, according to a report by the Texas Attorney General's Office.
The east Texas killing touched off a national movement to strengthen punishments for crimes motivated by hate.
Of the two other men convicted in the killing, white supremacist John King is on death row awaiting an execution date. Shawn Berry is serving a life sentence.
"One down, one to go," Billy Roles, who was Jasper County Sheriff at the time and led the investigation into Byrd's death, told Reuters.
QuoteFor his last meal, Brewer requested a number of items, including chicken-fried steak and Bluebell ice cream, and then declined them all, saying he wasn't hungry, officials said.
lolz, nervous much
For my last meal I'd request a gallon of whiskey.
Quote from: Caliga on September 22, 2011, 06:19:12 AM
For my last meal I'd request a gallon of whiskey.
That's what I'm talkin 'bout.
Didn't one of the Nazis executed in Israel do something like that? :hmm:
What the hell is chicken fried steak?
Quote from: Gups on September 22, 2011, 06:26:16 AM
What the hell is chicken fried steak?
It's a cheap ass piece of beef that's breaded and fried.
Yeah. It's like KFC only with steak inside the breading instead of chicken.
Quote from: Caliga on September 22, 2011, 06:25:52 AM
Didn't one of the Nazis executed in Israel do something like that? :hmm:
If he was a real bastard he'd order pig BBQ followed by lobster. All of it with cheese on top.
The cheese wouldn't be a problem unless it was produced from hog and lobster milk (and I don't think lobster moms make milk). :)
Cheese on lobster is a problem no matter who you are.
Quote from: Gups on September 22, 2011, 06:26:16 AM
What the hell is chicken fried steak?
You aint spent much time in the South, have you boy? :lmfao:
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 06:55:14 AM
You aint spent much time in the South, have you boy? :lmfao:
Gups is a britanico. :secret:
Quote from: Caliga on September 22, 2011, 06:50:50 AM
The cheese wouldn't be a problem unless it was produced from hog and lobster milk (and I don't think lobster moms make milk). :)
I thought that it was not kosher to mix meat and dairy in the same dish, full stop.
Chicken Fried Steak explained by Bobby Flay (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jp5sIszaTtI)
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 22, 2011, 06:57:20 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 06:55:14 AM
You aint spent much time in the South, have you boy? :lmfao:
Gups is a britanico. :secret:
Ah, not an excuse. :D
Quote from: Grey Fox on September 22, 2011, 06:59:44 AM
Chicken Fried Steak explained by Bobby Flay (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jp5sIszaTtI)
Good chow right there.
Glad Davis didnt get the chair and us talkin 'bout chicken fried steak. :lmfao:
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 07:16:52 AM
Glad Davis didnt get the chair and us talkin 'bout chicken fried steak. :lmfao:
It'd be more ironic if it was chicken fried chicken in that case. :contract:
Quote from: Grinning_Colossus on September 22, 2011, 04:17:13 AM
The plural of Euro is Euro. :wacko:
Just to mess things up more, some nations (like Portugal) got special permission to call the plural of euro "euros".
So, while the plural of "euro" in some countries (like Germany) is "euro", in others (like Portugal) is "euros".
This creates a certain... confusion in people who deal with the currency in several languages.
Quote from: Martim Silva on September 22, 2011, 09:18:18 AM
Quote from: Grinning_Colossus on September 22, 2011, 04:17:13 AM
The plural of Euro is Euro. :wacko:
Just to mess things up more, some nations (like Portugal) got special permission to call the plural of euro "euros".
So, while the plural of "euro" in some countries (like Germany) is "euro", in others (like Portugal) is "euros".
This creates a certain... confusion in people who deal with the currency in several languages.
:lmfao:
:lol:
Though in all seriousness if most of the witnesses recanted then his execution was a monstrous miscarriage of justice.
Quote from: Grinning_Colossus on September 22, 2011, 10:59:03 AM
:lol:
Though in all seriousness if most of the witnesses recanted then his execution was a monstrous miscarriage of justice.
I'm way of a recantation that A: occurs decades after their original tetimony, and B: are in the form of affidavits (which means it was drafted by someone else, then merely signed).
In domestic violence court we get witness recantations on a daily basis. In order for us to actually pay any attention to a recantation, we ask the victim get legal advice regarding perjury / public mischief, and then ideally that they give their recantation under oath.
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 11:02:28 AM
Quote from: Grinning_Colossus on September 22, 2011, 10:59:03 AM
:lol:
Though in all seriousness if most of the witnesses recanted then his execution was a monstrous miscarriage of justice.
I'm way of a recantation that A: occurs decades after their original tetimony, and B: are in the form of affidavits (which means it was drafted by someone else, then merely signed).
In domestic violence court we get witness recantations on a daily basis. In order for us to actually pay any attention to a recantation, we ask the victim get legal advice regarding perjury / public mischief, and then ideally that they give their recantation under oath.
I'm philosophically an advocate of the death penalty for some crimes, but I'm opposed to it in practice and would like to see it abolished in the United States. It's got nothing to do with morality and everything to do with how the legal process for it just stinks and I don't think it's fixable with our society at present (I can imagine sci-fi scenarios in the future in which we could bring it back.)
In this case you have a "great black defendant" who is supported by Al Sharpton and others. You have, over a decade after the fact, persons recanting testimony. You have many, many levels of appellate judges who have reviewed these recantations and who have found them to be
not credible. I trust the Federal judiciary, I trust the judiciary of Georgia a little bit, too, and many judges at both State and Federal level (including the SCOTUS) have given this case a sniff.
Without digging into it myself, I'm going to wager there is a reason every single one of those courts has said the recantations aren't credible. It means they probably aren't, and they are probably a product of people who live in the "neighborhood" having Al Sharpton type activists come into their homes and basically convince them that they didn't see what they had seen. Everyone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish, and if you have some prominent community advocate types pressuring people to sign affidavits, they will probably sign it even if they don't genuinely believe it.
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 11:02:28 AM
then ideally that they give their recantation under oath.
An affidavit isnt given under oath?
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:25:12 AM
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 11:02:28 AM
then ideally that they give their recantation under oath.
An affidavit isnt given under oath?
Perhaps it was poor wording on my part.
We want viva voce evidence.
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 22, 2011, 11:14:42 AM
Everyone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish
:rolleyes:
Everyone knows what a "black" person swears to is prima facie unreliable? Are you sure you really want to take that kind of position.
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 11:27:59 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:25:12 AM
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 11:02:28 AM
then ideally that they give their recantation under oath.
An affidavit isnt given under oath?
Perhaps it was poor wording on my part.
We want viva voce evidence.
You want to test it on cross examination - that makes sense.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:28:07 AM
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 22, 2011, 11:14:42 AM
Everyone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish
:rolleyes:
Everyone knows what a "black" person swears to is prima facie unreliable? Are you sure you really want to take that kind of position.
That's not what I said, you have no acted in bad faith and thus I must treat you in like manner.
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 22, 2011, 11:39:56 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:28:07 AM
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 22, 2011, 11:14:42 AM
Everyone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish
:rolleyes:
Everyone knows what a "black" person swears to is prima facie unreliable? Are you sure you really want to take that kind of position.
That's not what I said, you have no acted in bad faith and thus I must treat you in like manner.
Go back and re-read what you said. I know nothing about this case. I was however struck that you think we should disregard affidavits sworn by "blacks" because "everyone knows" they are "clannish" and therefore inclined not to tell the truth if someone from their clan tells them not to.
Please explain to me where I have gone wrong.
Just to help you. this is what you said that caught my attention.
QuoteEveryone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish, and if you have some prominent community advocate types pressuring people to sign affidavits, they will probably sign it even if they don't genuinely believe it.
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 02:41:05 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 02:35:58 AM
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
Point taken for the future.
Eastern Europens to West Europeans are what Mexicans are to Americans.
Poles=Mexicans.
that's pretty common stereotype in Europe
regardless, most Poles would vote for DP :) ...if they had anything to say in the matter
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 22, 2011, 06:57:20 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 06:55:14 AM
You aint spent much time in the South, have you boy? :lmfao:
Gups is a britanico. :secret:
well it still beats the hell out of anything that the british serve as steak
my recollection is that no matter what the called it, it resembled pot roast.
Quote from: szmik on September 22, 2011, 11:45:47 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 02:41:05 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 02:35:58 AM
Yeah, Martinus isn't a European, he's an Eastern European. It's like how when you say "American," you don't mean "Mexican."
Point taken for the future.
Eastern Europens to West Europeans are what Mexicans are to Americans.
Poles=Mexicans.
that's pretty common stereotype in Europe
regardless, most Poles would vote for DP :) ...if they had anything to say in the matter
I dont think marty likes dp...he's anti-anal
Quote from: Rasputin on September 22, 2011, 12:12:43 PM
my recollection is that no matter what the called it, it resembled pot roast.
The Brits are famous for liking their meat boiled.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:45:31 AM
Go back and re-read what you said. I know nothing about this case. I was however struck that you think we should disregard affidavits sworn by "blacks" because "everyone knows" they are "clannish" and therefore inclined not to tell the truth if someone from their clan tells them not to.
Please explain to me where I have gone wrong.
Just to help you. this is what you said that caught my attention.
QuoteEveryone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish, and if you have some prominent community advocate types pressuring people to sign affidavits, they will probably sign it even if they don't genuinely believe it.
Where you got it wrong is I did not claim that is why we shouldn't believe the recantations. I said the recantations are probably not credible since
multiple judges in multiple courts at both the State and Federal level have openly stated they did not view the recantations as credible. I then said
without digging into it I do know that it is factually the case that the clannish black community would be very susceptible to peer pressure and manipulation. I did not postulate as to why these specific recantations were not credible, I only noted that since every judge at both the State and Federal level who has reviewed them has found them lacking in credibility, they probably aren't credible. And that is all I said.
I don't think I've ever had boiled meat (unless you count stews?)
Steak should be served rare with nothing but it's own bloody juices and a bit of seasoning. There's no excuse for coating it with breadcrumbs.
Quote from: Gups on September 22, 2011, 12:35:36 PM
I don't think I've ever had boiled meat (unless you count stews?)
Steak should be served rare with nothing but it's own bloody juices and a bit of seasoning. There's no excuse for coating it with breadcrumbs.
A good steak, sure.
But a tough steak? A cheap cut of meat? Then you might want to do something to it.
And basically it's just a schnitzel by a different name.
Stews are a big category of foods, though. A lot of seafood is boiled at some point in its preparation, and a lot of chicken dishes you also boil the chicken during preparation (and might later bake it.)
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 12:42:30 PM
Quote from: Gups on September 22, 2011, 12:35:36 PM
I don't think I've ever had boiled meat (unless you count stews?)
Steak should be served rare with nothing but it's own bloody juices and a bit of seasoning. There's no excuse for coating it with breadcrumbs.
A good steak, sure.
But a tough steak? A cheap cut of meat? Then you might want to do something to it.
Yep, leave it at the butchers. Steak should be good quality, expensive and fried. If you want a cheap cut of beef get shin or similar and cook it slowly.
Quote from: Gups on September 22, 2011, 12:51:49 PM
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 12:42:30 PM
Quote from: Gups on September 22, 2011, 12:35:36 PM
I don't think I've ever had boiled meat (unless you count stews?)
Steak should be served rare with nothing but it's own bloody juices and a bit of seasoning. There's no excuse for coating it with breadcrumbs.
A good steak, sure.
But a tough steak? A cheap cut of meat? Then you might want to do something to it.
Yep, leave it at the butchers. Steak should be good quality, expensive and fried. If you want a cheap cut of beef get shin or similar and cook it slowly.
Fried??? :o :ultra:
This, sir, means war.
A high quality steak must be grilled. :alberta:
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 01:39:00 AM
Quote from: Martinus on September 22, 2011, 01:37:00 AM
Last words of Troy Davis, spoken to the AI representatives:
"The struggle for justice doesn't end with me. This struggle is for all the Troy Davises who came before me and all the ones who will come after me. I'm in good spirits and I'm prayerful and at peace."
Amazing how they always find GOD in the end.
Given that 95% of Americans describe themselves as religious, I think many criminals already know God before death row.
Quote from: Gups on September 22, 2011, 12:51:49 PM
Yep, leave it at the butchers. Steak should be good quality, expensive and fried. If you want a cheap cut of beef get shin or similar and cook it slowly.
Uck! For a moment there you had me convinced you knew something about cooking steak.
Grilled well done with A1 sauce poured all over it.
*runs off*
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 22, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
Grilled well done with A1 sauce poured all over it.
*runs off*
Abomination!
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 22, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
Grilled well done with A1 sauce poured all over it.
*runs off*
Homo.
I think Gups means lightly fried in a pan, which is how we do it in France. Not deep fried in oil.
Quote from: Rasputin on September 22, 2011, 12:12:43 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 22, 2011, 06:57:20 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on September 22, 2011, 06:55:14 AM
You aint spent much time in the South, have you boy? :lmfao:
Gups is a britanico. :secret:
well it still beats the hell out of anything that the british serve as steak
my recollection is that no matter what the called it, it resembled pot roast.
If you make the mistake of walking into an Angus Steak House in Leicester Square you have no one to blame but yourself.
Quote from: Zoupa on September 22, 2011, 01:33:27 PM
I think Gups means lightly fried in a pan, which is how we do it in France. Not deep fried in oil.
That's how I understood it. And my response stands. :alberta:
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 02:01:48 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on September 22, 2011, 01:33:27 PM
I think Gups means lightly fried in a pan, which is how we do it in France. Not deep fried in oil.
That's how I understood it. And my response stands. :alberta:
fried steak is weird. fried beef is awesome.
Also, from capital punishment to steak. Languish is one of a kind. not sure what kind though :lol:
Quote from: HVC on September 22, 2011, 02:04:09 PM
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 02:01:48 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on September 22, 2011, 01:33:27 PM
I think Gups means lightly fried in a pan, which is how we do it in France. Not deep fried in oil.
That's how I understood it. And my response stands. :alberta:
fried steak is weird. fried beef is awesome.
Also, from capital punishment to steak. Languish is one of a kind. not sure what kind though :lol:
Both are serious issues.
You bastards, all this talk of steak has made me realise there's no food in my flat. Off to the kebab shop :weep:
Quote from: Warspite on September 22, 2011, 02:20:44 PM
You bastards, all this talk of steak has made me realise there's no food in my flat. Off to the kebab shop :weep:
Dont worry, according to this thread, even if you were to find a decent steak you couldnt find anyone to cook it properly.
the proper way to make steak is on the grill subject to the following two exceptions:
1. It is ok to pan fry a steak if it is being served for breakfast with eggs as an effort to increase greese consumption when trying to alleviate a hangover.
2. It is acceptable (and even preferred) when making prime rib, to smoke the bone in rib roast over 4+ hours on a low temp smoker.
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 11:27:59 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:25:12 AM
Quote from: Barrister on September 22, 2011, 11:02:28 AM
then ideally that they give their recantation under oath.
An affidavit isnt given under oath?
Perhaps it was poor wording on my part.
We want viva voce evidence.
I read somewhere that all seven of the witnesses who recanted refused to repeat their recantations in court. Not sure where I read that, or how credible it is, but that would certainly explain why the many courts that reviewed this case didn't find them credible.
Quote from: dps on September 22, 2011, 05:32:43 PM
I read somewhere that all seven of the witnesses who recanted refused to repeat their recantations in court. Not sure where I read that, or how credible it is, but that would certainly explain why the many courts that reviewed this case didn't find them credible.
Couldn't they be supoenaed?
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 22, 2011, 05:38:48 PM
Quote from: dps on September 22, 2011, 05:32:43 PM
I read somewhere that all seven of the witnesses who recanted refused to repeat their recantations in court. Not sure where I read that, or how credible it is, but that would certainly explain why the many courts that reviewed this case didn't find them credible.
Couldn't they be supoenaed?
Yeah, that strikes me as an unreliable report.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 22, 2011, 05:38:48 PM
Quote from: dps on September 22, 2011, 05:32:43 PM
I read somewhere that all seven of the witnesses who recanted refused to repeat their recantations in court. Not sure where I read that, or how credible it is, but that would certainly explain why the many courts that reviewed this case didn't find them credible.
Couldn't they be supoenaed?
I'm sure that they could have been, but if the defense lawyers declined to do so, that's suggestive, isn't it?
Quote from: dps on September 22, 2011, 05:48:50 PM
I'm sure that they could have been, but if the defense lawyers declined to do so, that's suggestive, isn't it?
Sure. But I''m also having trouble with the state not supoenaing them. Seems to me the prosecution would rather dismantle their recantations on the stand rather than just saying "these recantations are hokey."
Or I guess more broadly what I'd like to know is what evidence the courts examined to determine the recantations were not credible.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:45:31 AM
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 22, 2011, 11:39:56 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 22, 2011, 11:28:07 AM
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 22, 2011, 11:14:42 AM
Everyone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish
:rolleyes:
Everyone knows what a "black" person swears to is prima facie unreliable? Are you sure you really want to take that kind of position.
That's not what I said, you have no acted in bad faith and thus I must treat you in like manner.
Go back and re-read what you said. I know nothing about this case. I was however struck that you think we should disregard affidavits sworn by "blacks" because "everyone knows" they are "clannish" and therefore inclined not to tell the truth if someone from their clan tells them not to.
Please explain to me where I have gone wrong.
Just to help you. this is what you said that caught my attention.
QuoteEveryone knows the black community in the U.S. is insanely clannish, and if you have some prominent community advocate types pressuring people to sign affidavits, they will probably sign it even if they don't genuinely believe it.
I'm pretty clannish. :yes:
Well Otto is in the South where everyone is clannish.
The problem with being against the death penalty is that the defendants aren't very likeable. Even if there is reasonable doubt for the case they are being executed for, there is likely something in their background that makes them terribly unsympathetic.
Quote from: Razgovory on September 22, 2011, 07:01:39 PM
The problem with being against the death penalty is that the defendants aren't very likeable. Even if there is reasonable doubt for the case they are being executed for, there is likely something in their background that makes them terribly unsympathetic.
so if you get arrested, we should cheer for you execution? You don't strike me as very likeable, after all. I don't like you, so I want you dead :) It's a good argument as any for being pro-death penalty :)
Georgia Executing Innocent men has cause Texas to up the ante. The condemned men will no longer get to choose their last meal.
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_TEXAS_EXECUTION_LAST_MEALS?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT
QuoteTexas prisons end special last meals in executions
By MICHAEL GRACZYK
Associated Press
HOUSTON (AP) -- Texas inmates who are set to be executed will no longer get their choice of last meals, a change prison officials made Thursday after a prominent state senator became miffed over an expansive request from a man condemned for a notorious dragging death.
Lawrence Russell Brewer, who was executed Wednesday for the hate crime slaying of James Byrd Jr. more than a decade ago, asked for two chicken fried steaks, a triple-meat bacon cheeseburger, fried okra, a pound of barbecue, three fajitas, a meat lover's pizza, a pint of ice cream and a slab of peanut butter fudge with crushed peanuts. Prison officials said Brewer didn't eat any of it.
"It is extremely inappropriate to give a person sentenced to death such a privilege," Sen. John Whitmire, chairman of the Senate Criminal Justice Committee, wrote in a letter Thursday to Brad Livingston, the executive director of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice.
Within hours, Livingston said the senator's concerns were valid and the practice of allowing death row offenders to choose their final meal was history.
"Effective immediately, no such accommodations will be made," Livingston said. "They will receive the same meal served to other offenders on the unit."
That had been the suggestion from Whitmire, who called the traditional request "ridiculous."
"It's long overdue," the Houston Democrat told The Associated Press. "This old boy last night, enough is enough. We're fixing to execute the guy and maybe it makes the system feel good about what they're fixing to do. Kind of hypocritical, you reckon?
"Mr. Byrd didn't get to choose his last meal. The whole deal is so illogical."
Brewer, a white supremacist gang member, was convicted of chaining Byrd, 49, to the back of a pickup truck and dragging him to his death along a bumpy road in a case shocked the nation for its brutality.
Whitmire warned in his letter that if the "last meal of choice" practice wasn't stopped immediately, he'd seek a state statute to end it when lawmakers convene in the next legislative session.
It was not immediately clear whether other states have made similar moves. Some limit the final meal cost - Florida's ceiling is $40, according to the Department of Corrections website, with food to be purchased locally. Others, like Texas, which never had a designated dollar limit, mandate meals be prison-made. Some states don't acknowledge final meals, and others will disclose the information only if the inmate agrees, said K. William Hayes, a Florida-based death penalty historian.
Some states require the meal within a specific time period, allow multiple "final" meals, restrict it to one or impose "a vast number of conditions," he said.
Historical references to a condemned person's last meal go as far back as ancient Greece, China and Rome, Hayes said. Some of it is apparently rooted in superstition about meals warding off possible haunting by condemned people once they are put to death.
The Death Penalty Information Center, a Washington-based anti-capital punishment organization that collects execution statistics, said it had no data on final meals.
Since Texas resumed carrying out executions in 1982, the state correction agency's practice has been to fill a condemned inmate's request as long as the items, or food similar to what was requested, were readily available from the prison kitchen supplies.
While extensive, Brewer's request was far from the largest or most bizarre among the 475 Texas inmates put to death.
On Tuesday, prisoner Cleve Foster's request included two fried chickens, French fries and a five-gallon bucket of peaches. He received a reprieve from the U.S. Supreme Court but none of his requested meal. He was on his way back to death row, at a prison about 45 miles east of Huntsville, at the time when his feast would have been served.
Last week, inmate Steven Woods' request included two pounds of bacon, a large four-meat pizza, four fried chicken breasts, two drinks each of Mountain Dew, Pepsi, root beer and sweet tea, two pints of ice cream, five chicken fried steaks, two hamburgers with bacon, fries and a dozen garlic bread sticks with marinara on the side. Two hours later, he was executed.
Years ago, a Texas inmate even requested dirt for his final meal.
Until 2003, the Texas prison system listed final meals of each prisoner as part of its death row website. That stopped at 313 final meals after officials said they received complaints from people who found it offensive.
A former inmate cook who made the last meals for prisoners at the Huntsville Unit, where Texas executions are carried out, wrote a cookbook several years ago after he was released. Among his recipes were Gallows Gravy, Rice Rigor Mortis and Old Sparky's Genuine Convict Chili, a nod to the electric chair that once served as the execution method. The book was called "Meals to Die For."
© 2011 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed. Learn more about our Privacy Policy and Terms of Use.
The last meal and the ritual around the Death Penalty makes it all the more acceptible. But, shitting on the man about to die seems a bit over the top.
So in Texas, fast food is actually more expensive than a gourmet meal? wow. :unsure:
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on September 22, 2011, 11:14:42 AM
Without digging into it myself, I'm going to wager there is a reason every single one of those courts has said the recantations aren't credible.
Well, I did some digging, and while I was certainly touched by BB's concerns around the whole issue of the affividavits, I was also reminded that, just like Marti, he's a foreign lawyer from a fucking foreign country, and probably isn't aware of the impact The Antiterrorism and Effective Death Penalty Act of 1996 has being shoved up his self-righteous ass.
"Mr. Byrd didn't get to choose his last meal"? Did Brewer force him to go to Arby's before he chained him to the back of his truck?
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 07:15:54 PM
"Mr. Byrd didn't get to choose his last meal"? Did Brewer force him to go to Arby's before he chained him to the back of his truck?
"Sure, we'll take you to Popeye's. Hang on."
Quote from: viper37 on September 22, 2011, 07:07:13 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 22, 2011, 07:01:39 PM
The problem with being against the death penalty is that the defendants aren't very likeable. Even if there is reasonable doubt for the case they are being executed for, there is likely something in their background that makes them terribly unsympathetic.
so if you get arrested, we should cheer for you execution? You don't strike me as very likeable, after all. I don't like you, so I want you dead :) It's a good argument as any for being pro-death penalty :)
I'm anti-death penalty :mellow:. My point is that it's hard to get popular support for saving the life of many of these people because they aren't pleasant people.
Viper: how do you justify life and very long-term imprisonment? Is mere existence really that much more important?
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 22, 2011, 05:52:42 PM
Quote from: dps on September 22, 2011, 05:48:50 PM
I'm sure that they could have been, but if the defense lawyers declined to do so, that's suggestive, isn't it?
Sure. But I''m also having trouble with the state not supoenaing them. Seems to me the prosecution would rather dismantle their recantations on the stand rather than just saying "these recantations are hokey."
No, if I'm the lawyer for the state, I've already got the testimony I wanted in open court. No way I'd subpeona someone how might contradict that if I don't have to.
Quote
Or I guess more broadly what I'd like to know is what evidence the courts examined to determine the recantations were not credible.
Yeah, I agree with that. I'd like to repeat that I'm not particularly convinced that what I read about the people who recanted not being willing to repeat it in court is accurate.
Quote from: Viking on September 22, 2011, 07:07:21 PM
Georgia Executing Innocent men has cause Texas to up the ante. The condemned men will no longer get to choose their last meal.
The last meal and the ritual around the Death Penalty makes it all the more acceptible. But, shitting on the man about to die seems a bit over the top.
I can see imposing a cost limit or other restrictions, but this just seems petty.
Quote from: Ideologue on September 22, 2011, 07:48:09 PM
Viper: how do you justify life and very long-term imprisonment? Is mere existence really that much more important?
1 - It's cheaper than the death penalty
2 - It's crueler than the death penalty
3 - It allows for release if innocence can be proven
4 - It reduces social conflict around the issue of the death penalty where monstrous criminals somehow manage to become liberal heros
I'm actually for the death penalty, but I believe that it should be used only in special cases and should happen rarely enough that people can actually remember the names of the condemned. I think the cases of Death should be limited among other means by demanding a higher standard of proof.
See, and that's the problem with people these days. It's not enough to just execute the criminals, you have to dehumanize them as well.
Quote from: Viking on September 22, 2011, 08:03:22 PM
4 - It reduces social conflict around the issue of the death penalty where monstrous criminals somehow manage to become liberal heros
See, this is a good thing though, because it discredits liberal politics.
Quote from: viper37 on September 22, 2011, 07:09:17 PM
So in Texas, fast food is actually more expensive than a gourmet meal? wow. :unsure:
:huh: What?
Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 22, 2011, 06:09:23 AM
For his last meal, Brewer requested a number of items, including chicken-fried steak and Bluebell ice cream, and then declined them all, saying he wasn't hungry, officials said.
Bluebell icecream?
Quote from: Neil on September 22, 2011, 08:07:13 PM
Quote from: Viking on September 22, 2011, 08:03:22 PM
4 - It reduces social conflict around the issue of the death penalty where monstrous criminals somehow manage to become liberal heros
See, this is a good thing though, because it discredits liberal politics.
Darn, I was going to say that.
Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on September 22, 2011, 08:08:21 PM
Quote from: viper37 on September 22, 2011, 07:09:17 PM
So in Texas, fast food is actually more expensive than a gourmet meal? wow. :unsure:
:huh: What?
Let me translate for you:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fartfulwriter.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2009%2F02%2Fdog-whargarbl.jpg&hash=8668f06b5bbb10e373dfa69aaa20532c41a3e869)
Quote from: jimmy olsen on September 22, 2011, 08:16:35 PM
Quote from: CountDeMoney on September 22, 2011, 06:09:23 AM
For his last meal, Brewer requested a number of items, including chicken-fried steak and Bluebell ice cream, and then declined them all, saying he wasn't hungry, officials said.
Bluebell icecream?
Must be a Southern thing. It's essentially premium ice-cream that you can buy in a store.
Quote from: Razgovory on September 22, 2011, 07:18:39 PM
I'm anti-death penalty :mellow:. My point is that it's hard to get popular support for saving the life of many of these people because they aren't pleasant people.
Can't really help it. It's like you're trying to make a perfectly rational point and a bunch of code pink wackos or somebody like that shows up to agree with you. You just wish they would die in a fire, but there they are with their big pink outfits sucking all the oxygen out of everything and making everyone associated with their cause look bad. I argue against these types more than I do against the actual people I disagree with. Annoys me to no end.
Quote from: Viking on September 22, 2011, 08:03:22 PM
2 - It's crueler than the death penalty
Don't agree. Would you rather be imprisoned for thirty years or outright killed? Maybe it's a matter of personal taste.
If the DP is ok then I don't see why it should be restricted to a handful of people, with all the media hype and decades spent on death row that this entails. It would make more sense if it became routine for serious crimes (mainly murder) which had no mitigating circumstances. At the moment it is only a small minority who draw the capital punishment, they often seem to be black and/or borderline retards who can't afford a decent lawyer (to be fair those are also the people most likely to kill, I imagine)..........there is a problem of inconsistency it seems to me.
Quote from: Viking on September 22, 2011, 07:07:21 PM
The last meal and the ritual around the Death Penalty makes it all the more acceptible.
I disagree. If I were to ever support death penalty, I want it to be as mechanical as possible. It should not be an "event" and trying to make it more "acceptable" or "cozy" by inventing rituals around it is just wrong.
Quote from: Viking on September 22, 2011, 07:07:21 PM
Georgia Executing Innocent men has cause Texas to up the ante. The condemned men will no longer get to choose their last meal.
In Indiana the condemned gets their "last meal" a few days before their scheduled execution.... IIRC it's because they often end up not eating their last actual meal due to nerves.
Quote from: Caliga on September 23, 2011, 05:19:47 AM
Quote from: Viking on September 22, 2011, 07:07:21 PM
Georgia Executing Innocent men has cause Texas to up the ante. The condemned men will no longer get to choose their last meal.
In Indiana the condemned gets their "last meal" a few days before their scheduled execution.... IIRC it's because they often end up not eating their last actual meal due to nerves.
To be fair, execution is quite dangerous to the guests of honor.
As a euroweenie against the DP, I don't give a shit how you guys deal with your guilty.
But your grill your steaks? Really? As in heat from above? That's just wrong. A griddle pan is the only way to cook a steak. Even the Argies agree.
When I grill steaks, it's on a BBQ with heat from below
Quote from: Gups on September 23, 2011, 07:16:11 AM
But your grill your steaks? Really? As in heat from above?
Heat from above is broiling. Smoldering charcoal underneath an open lattice is grilling. Or open propane flame, for those so inclined.
OK, its a language thing then.
England's too wet to do BBQs all year round. Steak is good on a barbie though I have to agree. Stays juicy even if you overcook it a bit.
Quote from: Gups on September 23, 2011, 07:25:58 AM
OK, its a language thing then.
England's too wet to do BBQs all year round. Steak is good on a barbie though I have to agree. Stays juicy even if you overcook it a bit.
Plus you get those really sexy cross hatch marks.
Btw, I think a Daily Telegraph editorial also called the execution "barbaric", so even British conservatives are using the same language as I do. So I am vindicated.
Quote from: Razgovory on September 22, 2011, 07:18:39 PM
I'm anti-death penalty :mellow:. My point is that it's hard to get popular support for saving the life of many of these people because they aren't pleasant people.
Doesn't really matter. If the prosecution can prove they did the crime, they are going to be in jail for a while. With those cumulative sentences of the US, they don't really get out after 6 years for murder 1.
If they can't prove the crime and they turn out innocent, then the clock isn't ticking against them.
Quote from: Martinus on September 23, 2011, 08:23:00 AM
Btw, I think a Daily Telegraph editorial also called the execution "barbaric", so even British conservatives are using the same language as I do. So I am vindicated.
Are British conservatives the end-all, be-all of morals and ethics?
No.
I am.
So quit being so fucking barbaric.
Speaking of grills, this is from the Onion, but somehow I have a feeling this is not far from the attitudes of many Languishites:
QuoteIndoor Grill Owner Can't Wait For Start Of AutumnAugust 3, 2007 | ISSUE 43•31
ELGIN, IL—Indoor-cookout enthusiast Tom Lafferty said Monday that he is looking forward to the arrival of autumn so he can "plug in the old grill" and start enjoying the indoors. "It's still way too summery out, but once we get that first chill of the season and people start climbing into their sweater vests again, it can only mean one thing: time for some of Lafferty's famous grilled eggplant!" the 37-year-old customer service representative said. "Plus, I got a second grill last week, so I'll be able to cook up to two veggie kebabs at once." In the meantime, Lafferty said he plans to take advantage of his enclosed air-conditioned backyard deck.
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 23, 2011, 10:13:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Like you have snow... ;)
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lifeinquebec.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F03%2FSnowforsale_JobPatstone.jpg&hash=70adf534c035654ff91b8c3af8fc70c5c19d41a4)
Its true, we dont really get snow other than where it is supposed to be - on the ski hill. But if we did have snow I would still find a way to grill my meat.
Quote from: viper37 on September 23, 2011, 08:26:00 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 22, 2011, 07:18:39 PM
I'm anti-death penalty :mellow:. My point is that it's hard to get popular support for saving the life of many of these people because they aren't pleasant people.
Doesn't really matter. If the prosecution can prove they did the crime, they are going to be in jail for a while. With those cumulative sentences of the US, they don't really get out after 6 years for murder 1.
If they can't prove the crime and they turn out innocent, then the clock isn't ticking against them.
Was this actually suppose to be a response to me?
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on September 23, 2011, 02:06:11 AM
Quote from: Razgovory on September 22, 2011, 07:18:39 PM
I'm anti-death penalty :mellow:. My point is that it's hard to get popular support for saving the life of many of these people because they aren't pleasant people.
Can't really help it. It's like you're trying to make a perfectly rational point and a bunch of code pink wackos or somebody like that shows up to agree with you. You just wish they would die in a fire, but there they are with their big pink outfits sucking all the oxygen out of everything and making everyone associated with their cause look bad. I argue against these types more than I do against the actual people I disagree with. Annoys me to no end.
Yeah, but most gays aren't code pink wackos. Most people on death row are murderers. Take the Brewer case that happened this week. He and another guy grabbed up some black guy at random, chained him to the back of a truck and then drove around the county for a while. On top of that Brewer had been a small time criminal before hand, doing time for burglary. The day before he was executed he said "As far as any regrets, no, I have no regrets. No, I'd do it all over again, to tell you the truth." He's an incredibly unsympathetic person. It's hard to argue that his life should be spared when he's such nasty person.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 23, 2011, 10:13:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Indeed. I BBQ year round.
I'll admit that I have to stop when it hits -40 or so - propane starts to gel, can't keep things hot enough. But that's my only limit.
Quote from: Barrister on September 23, 2011, 02:42:11 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 23, 2011, 10:13:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Indeed. I BBQ year round.
I'll admit that I have to stop when it hits -40 or so - propane starts to gel, can't keep things hot enough. But that's my only limit.
I have the same problem
i have both a grill and a smoker and i bbq year round
the problem is in december when its down in the seventies i need to wear my jeans to stay warm; i find that long pants erode the grilling experience
Quote from: Rasputin on September 23, 2011, 03:23:14 PM
the problem is in december when its down in the seventies i need to wear my jeans to stay warm; i find that long pants erode the grilling experience
We should all have such problems.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 23, 2011, 10:13:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Because I don't like freezing my balls off.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 03:42:51 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 23, 2011, 10:13:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Because I don't like freezing my balls off.
Quit being such a Marti.
Quote from: Barrister on September 23, 2011, 03:45:06 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 03:42:51 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 23, 2011, 10:13:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Because I don't like freezing my balls off.
Quit being such a Marti.
Quit being a Canuck tard.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 03:42:51 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 23, 2011, 10:13:46 AM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:34:01 AM
pfft. I only stop when the snow comes.
Why stop when the snow comes? Our grill is outside but under cover. The alternative, frying our steaks inside, is just too horrible to contemplate.
Because I don't like freezing my balls off.
You used to be cool.
My balls are comfortably warm, and women's tongues don't stick to them. I WIN.
I grill even if I have to dig out the grill from the snow first. It's cool once the thing has been burning for a while and the snow around it begins to take a geometric shape from the radiating heat.
Quote from: Rasputin on September 23, 2011, 03:23:14 PM
the problem is in december when its down in the seventies i need to wear my jeans to stay warm; i find that long pants erode the grilling experience
:lmfao:
Quote from: MadImmortalMan on September 23, 2011, 05:49:51 PM
I grill even if I have to dig out the grill from the snow first. It's cool once the thing has been burning for a while and the snow around it begins to take a geometric shape from the radiating heat.
I tried that shit in Boston once: never again. That's why I moved, actually. :)
Pretty soon I'll be rolling the grill into the shed. The one year I didn't, my leg was busted and some fucker stole my empty propane tanks. And the cinder blocks that my wife used for an improvised step off my deck since I couldn't do shit about that.
I ever find that fucker, I'm beating him with a ball bat.
Propane? :o WHAT IN TARNATION
Quote from: Caliga on September 23, 2011, 07:57:01 PM
Propane? :o WHAT IN TARNATION
You don't want me with a can of lighter fluid.
Electric starter. :smarty:
So anyway how did a thread about executing a black guy turn into a bbq discussion? Those two things aren't related....
...anymore... :blush:
...except in Georgia. :ph34r:
Quote from: Caliga on September 23, 2011, 08:02:19 PM
Electric starter. :smarty:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages1.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20110222025603%2Fkingofthehill%2Fimages%2Fa%2Fa8%2FHqdefault.jpg&hash=c17403970ced65a2eada2d1950fa2b92c297b305)
Quote from: Caliga on September 23, 2011, 08:03:53 PM
So anyway how did a thread about executing a black guy turn into a bbq discussion? Those two things aren't related....
...anymore... :blush:
...except in Georgia. :ph34r:
They don't use the electric chair there anymore, Menelik.
I have to strongly disagree that a pan should never be used in steak preparation - a great cut of steak should be pan seared before grilling. Those who do not are ijits.
Quote from: PDH on September 23, 2011, 08:24:30 PM
I have to strongly disagree that a pan should never be used in steak preparation - a great cut of steak should be pan seared before grilling. Those who do not are ijits.
You need to use a very high heat on the grill to start. Then once seared you can turn the heat down.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 26, 2011, 09:55:19 AM
Quote from: PDH on September 23, 2011, 08:24:30 PM
I have to strongly disagree that a pan should never be used in steak preparation - a great cut of steak should be pan seared before grilling. Those who do not are ijits.
You need to use a very high heat on the grill to start. Then once seared you can turn the heat down.
A real chef uses a pan. I suppose you could put the pan on the grill, but that seems plebeian.
Quote from: PDH on September 26, 2011, 10:17:09 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 26, 2011, 09:55:19 AM
Quote from: PDH on September 23, 2011, 08:24:30 PM
I have to strongly disagree that a pan should never be used in steak preparation - a great cut of steak should be pan seared before grilling. Those who do not are ijits.
You need to use a very high heat on the grill to start. Then once seared you can turn the heat down.
A real chef uses a pan. I suppose you could put the pan on the grill, but that seems plebeian.
You are dead to me.
Quote from: PDH on September 26, 2011, 10:17:09 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 26, 2011, 09:55:19 AM
Quote from: PDH on September 23, 2011, 08:24:30 PM
I have to strongly disagree that a pan should never be used in steak preparation - a great cut of steak should be pan seared before grilling. Those who do not are ijits.
You need to use a very high heat on the grill to start. Then once seared you can turn the heat down.
A real chef uses a pan. I suppose you could put the pan on the grill, but that seems plebeian.
:lmfao:
In true languish tradition, I would like to make two things clear:
It is widely known fact that Adolph Hitler pan seared his steaks.
If General Lee had had a propane grill at Gettysburg, Pickett never would've charged.
Quote from: Rasputin on September 26, 2011, 12:17:05 PM
In true languish tradition, I would like to make two things clear:
It is widely known fact that Adolph Hitler pan seared his steaks.
If General Lee had had a propane grill at Gettysburg, Pickett never would've charged.
Bullshit, Hilter ate omelettes. Patton ate pan-seared steaks.
Quote from: PDH on September 26, 2011, 04:37:26 PM
Quote from: Rasputin on September 26, 2011, 12:17:05 PM
In true languish tradition, I would like to make two things clear:
It is widely known fact that Adolph Hitler pan seared his steaks.
If General Lee had had a propane grill at Gettysburg, Pickett never would've charged.
Bullshit, Hilter ate omelettes. Patton ate pan-seared steaks.
You commie revisionists are all alike.
I bet Hitler loved grilled omelettes.
Hitler didn't eat steak. :)
To contribute to the utter trivialization of this thread (:ultra: :ultra: :ultra:), I prefer steak cooked in the pan rather than on the grill. To me it just tastes like "grill" when it's done that way, which is OK, but pan-cooking gives it that really steaky, meatful flavor.
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:31:11 PM
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Your lack of morality has been noted.
Quote from: Neil on September 26, 2011, 08:33:53 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:31:11 PM
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Your lack of morality has been noted.
Doesn't my Continental steak preference bear more heavily on that? :cry:
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:40:48 PM
Quote from: Neil on September 26, 2011, 08:33:53 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:31:11 PM
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Your lack of morality has been noted.
Doesn't my Continental steak preference bear more heavily on that? :cry:
No. I care not how you eat your meat, only that you eat it.
Filet au Poivre :mmm:
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:40:48 PM
Quote from: Neil on September 26, 2011, 08:33:53 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:31:11 PM
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Your lack of morality has been noted.
Doesn't my Continental steak preference bear more heavily on that? :cry:
Yes. Ignore Neil. He comes from the land of great steak and so does not care if people do not cook it properly so long as they buy it. Those of us who do care about cooking steak properly have duly noted your failing in that regard.
Why do you think steak tastes better when it's not pan fried?
I understand why you'd like a charcoal barbie which adds something to the falavour but it sounds like you are just using some form of gas. What's the difference?
Quote from: Gups on September 27, 2011, 11:38:59 AM
Why do you think steak tastes better when it's not pan fried?
I understand why you'd like a charcoal barbie which adds something to the falavour but it sounds like you are just using some form of gas. What's the difference?
You still get a char from gas heat. Plus the always important grill marks.
Quote from: Barrister on September 27, 2011, 11:46:54 AM
Quote from: Gups on September 27, 2011, 11:38:59 AM
Why do you think steak tastes better when it's not pan fried?
I understand why you'd like a charcoal barbie which adds something to the falavour but it sounds like you are just using some form of gas. What's the difference?
You still get a char from gas heat. Plus the always important grill marks.
You get a char from using a really hot skillet. Plus the always important grill marks.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:31:11 PM
To contribute to the utter trivialization of this thread (:ultra: :ultra: :ultra:), I prefer steak cooked in the pan rather than on the grill. To me it just tastes like "grill" when it's done that way, which is OK, but pan-cooking gives it that really steaky, meatful flavor.
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Why do you prefer extended torture to swift oblivion? Seems illiberal to me. :(
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 23, 2011, 08:08:16 PM
Quote from: Caliga on September 23, 2011, 08:02:19 PM
Electric starter. :smarty:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages1.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20110222025603%2Fkingofthehill%2Fimages%2Fa%2Fa8%2FHqdefault.jpg&hash=c17403970ced65a2eada2d1950fa2b92c297b305)
Propane is God's gas.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 27, 2011, 11:12:03 AM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:40:48 PM
Quote from: Neil on September 26, 2011, 08:33:53 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:31:11 PM
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Your lack of morality has been noted.
Doesn't my Continental steak preference bear more heavily on that? :cry:
Yes. Ignore Neil. He comes from the land of great steak and so does not care if people do not cook it properly so long as they buy it. Those of us who do care about cooking steak properly have duly noted your failing in that regard.
A sufficiently good steak will defeat most attempts to ruin it through improper cooking.
Quote from: Gups on September 27, 2011, 11:38:59 AM
Why do you think steak tastes better when it's not pan fried?
I understand why you'd like a charcoal barbie which adds something to the falavour but it sounds like you are just using some form of gas. What's the difference?
The taste is the same with either gas or charcoal but the advantage with gas is you can control the heat.
The main differences between a pan fried steak and a grilled steak is the effect of the dripping fat over the flames which causes a taste you cannot get in a pan and the better charring effect a grill will give you which also provides more flavour.
Also, I assume you are not cooking your steak past medium rare. If you are then I concede it doesnt matter how you cook it - you are ruining it anyway.
Quote from: Neil on September 27, 2011, 01:53:34 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 27, 2011, 11:12:03 AM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:40:48 PM
Quote from: Neil on September 26, 2011, 08:33:53 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 26, 2011, 08:31:11 PM
I also prefer the abolition of the death penalty.
Your lack of morality has been noted.
Doesn't my Continental steak preference bear more heavily on that? :cry:
Yes. Ignore Neil. He comes from the land of great steak and so does not care if people do not cook it properly so long as they buy it. Those of us who do care about cooking steak properly have duly noted your failing in that regard.
A sufficiently good steak will defeat most attempts to ruin it through improper cooking.
A well done steak should be thrown in the trash no matter how good a cut it was originally.
Quote from: Ideologue on September 27, 2011, 11:59:54 AM
Why do you prefer extended torture to swift oblivion? Seems illiberal to me. :(
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 27, 2011, 03:21:55 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 27, 2011, 11:59:54 AM
Why do you prefer extended torture to swift oblivion? Seems illiberal to me. :(
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
dont go off topic.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 27, 2011, 03:21:55 PM
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
Apparently, a preference shared by CC when it comes to his steaks. Alive and mooing. :P
Quote from: Malthus on September 27, 2011, 03:23:54 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 27, 2011, 03:21:55 PM
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
Apparently, a preference shared by CC when it comes to his steaks. Alive and mooing. :P
As long as they are seared properly. That is the key.
dammit i want a steak now.
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 27, 2011, 03:21:55 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 27, 2011, 11:59:54 AM
Why do you prefer extended torture to swift oblivion? Seems illiberal to me. :(
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
Instinct clouds rational future planning. Their wishes can't be trusted.
Then again maybe others respond differently to imprisonment than me. -_-
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 27, 2011, 03:21:55 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 27, 2011, 11:59:54 AM
Why do you prefer extended torture to swift oblivion? Seems illiberal to me. :(
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
Humans are remarkably short sighted. No one wants to die tomorrow but they they aren't much better off living for 40 years with their cell mate "Sir Shanks-a-lot"
Obviously people don't understand the concept of searing - it should be on a large flat surface to change the proteins. that is why a pan is needed. After this it can be grilled, and the resultant fat dripping, etc. The key, however, is the large surface to be seared at a very high heat.
Quote from: PDH on September 27, 2011, 04:14:53 PM
Obviously people don't understand the concept of searing - it should be on a large flat surface to change the proteins. that is why a pan is needed. After this it can be grilled, and the resultant fat dripping, etc. The key, however, is the large surface to be seared at a very high heat.
One needs high heat to change the proteins. Only someone reducated in a Communist Camp would believe one can only generate such heat from a pan. Grilling has flames which directly heat the meat. No interference from the pan is required.
Let the Grill set you free.
Quote from: HVC on September 27, 2011, 03:31:03 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 27, 2011, 03:21:55 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 27, 2011, 11:59:54 AM
Why do you prefer extended torture to swift oblivion? Seems illiberal to me. :(
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
Humans are remarkably short sighted. No one wants to die tomorrow but they they aren't much better off living for 40 years with their cell mate "Sir Shanks-a-lot"
40 years without properly-cooked steak, vs. choice of last meal. ;)
Quote from: Malthus on September 27, 2011, 04:36:54 PM
Quote from: HVC on September 27, 2011, 03:31:03 PM
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 27, 2011, 03:21:55 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on September 27, 2011, 11:59:54 AM
Why do you prefer extended torture to swift oblivion? Seems illiberal to me. :(
Yet somehow most people who are actually condemned to death seem to prefer staying alive...
Humans are remarkably short sighted. No one wants to die tomorrow but they they aren't much better off living for 40 years with their cell mate "Sir Shanks-a-lot"
40 years without properly-cooked steak, vs. choice of last meal. ;)
:hmm:
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 27, 2011, 03:14:34 PM
A well done steak should be thrown in the trash no matter how good a cut it was originally.
OK, I'll give you that. If you're eating your steak well done, you're probably a Philistine.
This thread inspired me to pan fry a steak tonight. It came out really well. It's brown on the outside, pink just beneath the surface, and red-brown in the middle. It's rare enough to be rare, but still perfectly chewable. :licklips:
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:03:26 PM
This thread inspired me to pan fry a steak tonight. It came out really well. It's brown on the outside, pink just beneath the surface, and red-brown in the middle. It's rare enough to be rare, but still perfectly chewable. :licklips:
Do you even own a grill you Bolshevik?
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:03:26 PM
This thread inspired me to pan fry a steak tonight. It came out really well. It's brown on the outside, pink just beneath the surface, and red-brown in the middle. It's rare enough to be rare, but still perfectly chewable. :licklips:
Cover it in Heinz 57 sauce and post a picture. Foodies everywhere will stroke out.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 27, 2011, 07:06:31 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:03:26 PM
This thread inspired me to pan fry a steak tonight. It came out really well. It's brown on the outside, pink just beneath the surface, and red-brown in the middle. It's rare enough to be rare, but still perfectly chewable. :licklips:
Do you even own a grill you Bolshevik?
Not anymore. I used to have a Foreman grill, though.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 27, 2011, 07:07:37 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:03:26 PM
This thread inspired me to pan fry a steak tonight. It came out really well. It's brown on the outside, pink just beneath the surface, and red-brown in the middle. It's rare enough to be rare, but still perfectly chewable. :licklips:
Cover it in Heinz 57 sauce and post a picture. Foodies everywhere will stroke out.
:x Why the fuck would you want to do such a thing?
What's a foodie?
Quote from: Neil on September 27, 2011, 07:15:38 PM
What's a foodie?
Annoying assholes.
Think Whole Foods shoppers.
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:14:50 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 27, 2011, 07:07:37 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:03:26 PM
This thread inspired me to pan fry a steak tonight. It came out really well. It's brown on the outside, pink just beneath the surface, and red-brown in the middle. It's rare enough to be rare, but still perfectly chewable. :licklips:
Cover it in Heinz 57 sauce and post a picture. Foodies everywhere will stroke out.
:x Why the fuck would you want to do such a thing?
For the comedy value.
Quote from: Caliga on September 27, 2011, 07:16:38 PM
Quote from: Neil on September 27, 2011, 07:15:38 PM
What's a foodie?
A food snob.
Oh. Well, there's some levels of food snobbery that aren't so bad. But once you move past the 'condemning Caliga for eating out of the dumpster behind the local Denny's' stage, you're probably going to far.
Not necessarily a snob. More like a hobbyist.
Now that I look at the picture of my steak, the red looks really red. Is there such a thing as a steak that's too undercooked? :unsure:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg851.imageshack.us%2Fimg851%2F1411%2F002hlz.jpg&hash=221b3ded9eab3c4f92d9d00f48cab7d567675981)
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.pictureshunt.com%2Fpics%2Fc%2Fcow-7925.jpg&hash=3d23adfa21348bc4576c2235f04377662100df34)
:lol:
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:25:11 PM
Now that I look at the picture of my steak, the red looks really red. Is there such a thing as a steak that's too undercooked? :unsure:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg851.imageshack.us%2Fimg851%2F1411%2F002hlz.jpg&hash=221b3ded9eab3c4f92d9d00f48cab7d567675981)
That appears to be very rare. It's not necessarily undercooked
per se--after all, that's a matter of taste--but I wouldn't order one very rare in a restaurant. In a very rare steak, the center is almost uncooked, and that can be a food safety issue.
Did you eat it while wearing a tuxedo? If not, you are a pleb.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 27, 2011, 07:36:00 PM
Did you eat it while wearing a tuxedo? If not, you are a pleb.
I don't own one.
Food safety issue? Not at all.
My understanding is that no part on the outside should have any shade of red on it, but inside can be as red as you like. However, I don't think I ever ate a steak this red without putting it back on the pan, so I'm kinda curious if I'm going to die tonight.
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:43:30 PM
My understanding is that no part on the outside should have any shade of red on it, but inside can be as red as you like. However, I don't think I ever ate a steak this red without putting it back on the pan, so I'm kinda curious if I'm going to die tonight.
If you are eating grass fed beef it isnt a problem. If you are eating corn fed factory beef there is more concern.
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:43:30 PM
My understanding is that no part on the outside should have any shade of red on it, but inside can be as red as you like. However, I don't think I ever ate a steak this red without putting it back on the pan, so I'm kinda curious if I'm going to die tonight.
Technically, all parts of any piece of meat being cooked should be heated to at least 160 F in order to ensure safety. But there's a bit of margin built into that, and it primarily applies to food prepared in restaurants and institutions. For home cooking, you should be fine.
I assume that the cheap steak you buy at the supermarket are all corn-fed?
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:49:15 PM
I assume that the cheap steak you buy at the supermarket are all corn-fed?
Start writing your will.
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:43:30 PM
My understanding is that no part on the outside should have any shade of red on it, but inside can be as red as you like. However, I don't think I ever ate a steak this red without putting it back on the pan, so I'm kinda curious if I'm going to die tonight.
I eat them like that all the time. You have nothing to worry about.
:lol:
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:43:30 PM
My understanding is that no part on the outside should have any shade of red on it, but inside can be as red as you like. However, I don't think I ever ate a steak this red without putting it back on the pan, so I'm kinda curious if I'm going to die tonight.
Well it's not like it's a blueberry. Get a grip.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 27, 2011, 07:50:39 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:49:15 PM
I assume that the cheap steak you buy at the supermarket are all corn-fed?
Start writing your will.
How many pages do I have time for? :unsure:
I just realized that this thread would be really insensitive if the guy got a chair.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 27, 2011, 03:14:34 PM
A well done steak should be thrown in the trash no matter how good a cut it was originally.
My missus has her steak well done. This has caused more arguments between us than any other single issue. I shoudln't really care, it's her steak but it really, really pisses me off.
He family are beef farmers as well. Well known in the Basque country for the quality of their cows.
Quote from: Neil on September 27, 2011, 07:18:34 PM
Quote from: Caliga on September 27, 2011, 07:16:38 PM
Quote from: Neil on September 27, 2011, 07:15:38 PM
What's a foodie?
A food snob.
Oh. Well, there's some levels of food snobbery that aren't so bad. But once you move past the 'condemning Caliga for eating out of the dumpster behind the local Denny's' stage, you're probably going to far.
:lol:
Quote from: Gups on September 28, 2011, 04:53:26 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 27, 2011, 03:14:34 PM
A well done steak should be thrown in the trash no matter how good a cut it was originally.
My missus has her steak well done. This has caused more arguments between us than any other single issue. I shoudln't really care, it's her steak but it really, really pisses me off.
He family are beef farmers as well. Well known in the Basque country for the quality of their cows.
I think I've mentioned this on Languish before, but back when I was a kitchen porter in a fairly high class Edinburgh restaurant (the kind where'd you'd have to work five hours in the kitchen to afford a starter) a customer had the temerity to order a steak "very well done".
The chef flew into an absolute rage upon the check being read out, throwing a heated pan across the room and shouting "Very well done!? Why don't they just fucking eat their shoe!"
That's sort of my reaction too.
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 08:10:27 PM
I just realized that this thread would be really insensitive if the guy got a chair.
The chair. "A" chair has an entirely different meaning. :D
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:25:11 PM
Now that I look at the picture of my steak, the red looks really red. Is there such a thing as a steak that's too undercooked? :unsure:
Yea if it has any pink in it.
Quote from: Maximus on September 28, 2011, 10:27:18 AM
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:25:11 PM
Now that I look at the picture of my steak, the red looks really red. Is there such a thing as a steak that's too undercooked? :unsure:
Yea if it has any pink in it.
Now I see why you no longer live in Alberta.
You didn't leave by choice - you were shunned.
:mad:
Quote from: Maximus on September 28, 2011, 10:27:18 AM
Quote from: DGuller on September 27, 2011, 07:25:11 PM
Now that I look at the picture of my steak, the red looks really red. Is there such a thing as a steak that's too undercooked? :unsure:
Yea if it has any pink in it.
No steak for you!
Quote from: dps on September 27, 2011, 07:34:41 PM
In a very rare steak, the center is almost uncooked, and that can be a food safety issue.
I guess it depends on what kind of restaurants you frequent.
I regularly eat steak tartare so I guess if food was supposed to kill me, it would have already.
Quote from: Warspite on September 28, 2011, 08:46:33 AM
The chef flew into an absolute rage upon the check being read out, throwing a heated pan across the room and shouting "Very well done!? Why don't they just fucking eat their shoe!"
Did you tell him to relax? :)
Quote from: Martinus on September 28, 2011, 03:15:14 PM
I regularly eat steak tartare so I guess if food was supposed to kill me, it would have already.
:cool: It's been too long since I've had that. I need to get me some.
Quote from: Caliga on September 28, 2011, 07:26:17 PM
Quote from: Warspite on September 28, 2011, 08:46:33 AM
The chef flew into an absolute rage upon the check being read out, throwing a heated pan across the room and shouting "Very well done!? Why don't they just fucking eat their shoe!"
Did you tell him to relax? :)
Too busy dodging the missiles.
Quote from: Barrister on September 28, 2011, 01:17:34 PM
Now I see why you no longer live in Alberta.
You didn't leave by choice - you were shunned.
:mad:
Well yes, but not for that.
I'd just as soon have a burger as a steak anyway.
Quote from: Caliga on September 28, 2011, 07:26:51 PM
Quote from: Martinus on September 28, 2011, 03:15:14 PM
I regularly eat steak tartare so I guess if food was supposed to kill me, it would have already.
:cool: It's been too long since I've had that. I need to get me some.
:yuk: I've tried tartare, but I can't get past the feeling that I'm eating pet food.
Quote from: Maximus on September 29, 2011, 10:13:31 AM
Quote from: Barrister on September 28, 2011, 01:17:34 PM
Now I see why you no longer live in Alberta.
You didn't leave by choice - you were shunned.
:mad:
Well yes, but not for that.
I'd just as soon have a burger as a steak anyway.
Well that was the joke I was going for. ;)
But if you'd just as soon have a burger as a steak, we as a province are better off without you. :mad:
Quote from: Maximus on September 29, 2011, 10:13:31 AM
I'd just as soon have a burger as a steak anyway.
Now you've done it. :lol:
Quote from: Malthus on September 29, 2011, 10:23:41 AM
Quote from: Maximus on September 29, 2011, 10:13:31 AM
I'd just as soon have a burger as a steak anyway.
Now you've done it. :lol:
He is so far gone there is no point in responding to him.
I laugh at your arbitrary affectations.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 29, 2011, 11:02:10 AM
Quote from: Malthus on September 29, 2011, 10:23:41 AM
Quote from: Maximus on September 29, 2011, 10:13:31 AM
I'd just as soon have a burger as a steak anyway.
Now you've done it. :lol:
He is so far gone there is no point in responding to him.
That actually makes sense. If you like your steaks well-done, then you probably would prefer a burger, or a fresh stick of feces, to a steak. At least they're still juicy, unlike the well-done steak.
I also like meat on my pizza, the more the better.
Quote from: Maximus on September 29, 2011, 11:25:30 AM
I also like meat on my pizza, the more the better.
Dont try to pretend you are one of us. You are forever tainted.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 29, 2011, 11:31:30 AM
Dont try to pretend you are one of us. You are forever tainted.
That was for DG.
He gets outraged if you put anything on your pizza.
Quote from: Maximus on September 29, 2011, 11:33:07 AM
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 29, 2011, 11:31:30 AM
Dont try to pretend you are one of us. You are forever tainted.
That was for DG.
He gets outraged if you put anything on your pizza.
Even pineapple?
Especially pineapple.
Nah, I don't get outraged. I pity you people with such severe cases of eating disorder. :console:
Quote from: Maximus on September 29, 2011, 11:35:59 AM
Especially pineapple.
I've never had pineapple on a pizza. I could, but I don't know how it would interact with olives and jalapenos and such. Is it only good with meat?
P.S. Cheese-only pizzas, while something of a staple of mine due to dietary restrictions, aren't as good as pizzas with stuff on them.
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
Quote from: Ideologue on September 29, 2011, 01:12:19 PM
I've never had pineapple on a pizza. I could, but I don't know how it would interact with olives and jalapenos and such. Is it only good with meat?
The standard is ham and pineapple. "Hawaiin pizza."
It's not the narliest but I would never order it by choice.
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:14:52 PM
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
You do know even in Italy they frequently put stuff on their pizza...
Quote from: Barrister on September 29, 2011, 10:20:04 AM
But if you'd just as soon have a burger as a steak, we as a province are better off without you. :mad:
Depends, I think. If I'm just going for a quick bite, then a burger is one of natures perfect foods. Bread, meat and cheese all together in a convenient package. If I'm sitting down to savour a meal, then a steak is hard to beat though.
Quote from: Barrister on September 29, 2011, 01:31:41 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:14:52 PM
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
You do know even in Italy they frequently put stuff on their pizza...
The real pizza is made in New York.
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:14:52 PM
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
Wrong. Be less gay.
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:38:59 PM
Quote from: Barrister on September 29, 2011, 01:31:41 PM
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:14:52 PM
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
You do know even in Italy they frequently put stuff on their pizza...
The real pizza is made in New York.
Bleh.
Maybe it is New York bias, but pineapple or BBQ chicken or gyro meat or whatever on pizza is just crazy. Not to mention all the ludicrous bagel flavors and sandwiches. I never saw a cinnamon raisin bagel until I was about 19 and was all WTF? :uffda: Poppy seed, sesame, and everything are the only acceptable ones in my book.
Freedom has its downsides. Make people free from oppression, and they go and abuse it, and put shit like meat or pineapple on a pizza. :(
Food nazi's on the march. JAHWOL!
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F9LblO.jpg&hash=5f0c14be0872c36c766d2f66b8d705f97953372e)
P.S. I like the cinammon bagels. That come in a bag at the supermarket.
I prefer the onion ones. I like to make a sandwich of them for breakfast with cream cheese, lunch meat and cheddar cheese.
I like cinnamon raisin bagels too. :blush: But I've been out of the NY orbit for long enough that I've lost touch with my patrimony. :(
No Lender's though. That is one step too far. :mad:
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on September 29, 2011, 06:46:31 PM
I like cinnamon raisin bagels too. :blush: But I've been out of the NY orbit for long enough that I've lost touch with my patrimony. :(
No Lender's though. That is one step too far. :mad:
:lol: That is the brand I buy.
Me too, but they are pretty crap.
:yuk:
it is fitting that we speak of jew dough during the high holy days; in that spirit, let's not forgot the humble biali...the bagel with no hole. :Joos
I like Spam. But not its bastard cousin, Treet. :yuk:
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 06:40:43 PM
Freedom has its downsides. Make people free from oppression, and they go and abuse it, and put shit like meat or pineapple on a pizza. :(
That's what a pizza
is.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 29, 2011, 06:54:15 PM
I like Spam. But not its bastard cousin, Treet. :yuk:
Amen. Treet does a terrible job of pureeing the gristly bits.
Ed's bachelor lunch, Spam edition:
Slice spam thin. Fry until it browns but not slightly curled.
Toast 2 slices of bread(white preferably)
Apply thin layer of MIRACLE WHIP to one slice. Place fried spam on toast.
Eat sandwich and wish you had a wife/gf that could cook.
Don't say I don't share.
You two are banned from using my ancient recipe.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 29, 2011, 07:03:44 PM
Ed's bachelor lunch, Spam edition:
Slice spam thin. Fry until it browns but not slightly curled.
Toast 2 slices of bread(white preferably)
Apply thin layer of MIRACLE WHIP to one slice. Place fried spam on toast.
Eat sandwich and wish you had a wife/gf that could cook.
Substitute mustard for the MIRACLE WHIP. :contract:
And meat for spam
Part of me missed the old bachelor food days. Then the other part hits the 'po food part.
Actually all the ingredients in there sound completely nasty, but I will defend to the death your right to gag on iteat it.
Check out Potted Meat for extra nastiness.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.marlerblog.com%2Fuploads%2Fimage%2Ffood-for-one-dollar-potted-meat-640x480.jpg&hash=06554135bdae06963fd94c685b424c6a0916f41c)
Have you ever eaten fried Spam Max?
Tastes kinda like bacon.
Yes.
No.
Jesus, I'm going to develop anorexia after this thread. Or bulimia, one of the two.
Good thing I didn't bring up more bachelor abortions meals then.
No wonder Americans eat so much junk food. The alternative is cooking this kind of crap.
Quote from: crazy canuck on September 29, 2011, 08:33:39 PM
No wonder Americans eat so much junk food. The alternative is cooking this kind of crap.
No, it's only the altermative for people too stupid or lazy to learn how to cook.
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 29, 2011, 06:54:15 PM
I like Spam. But not its bastard cousin, Treet. :yuk:
i prefer the Canadian Spam - Klik.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mapleleaf.ca%2Finclude%2Fimagemakerdb.aspx%3FBackgroundColor%3DF8F8F8%26amp%3Bid%3D370b1ac6-c26a-413c-bff7-c8dcac14b793%26amp%3Bwidth%3D300%26amp%3Bheight%3D200&hash=7bbe0f3a4d89330fa5173a5c93f9f16fa2fd2729)
Mm, porc!
When I was a kid it was called Prem.
Why all brands of that nasty canned meat shit named by choosing monosyllabic nonsense words? I mean the name itself pretty much tells you it's going to be terrible.
I like spam. :blush:
Quote from: Ed Anger on September 29, 2011, 07:39:39 PM
Check out Potted Meat for extra nastiness.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.marlerblog.com%2Fuploads%2Fimage%2Ffood-for-one-dollar-potted-meat-640x480.jpg&hash=06554135bdae06963fd94c685b424c6a0916f41c)
I used to make sandwiches with meat spread. Abomination blah blah blah, but it was good stuff.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on September 29, 2011, 07:40:00 PM
Have you ever eaten fried Spam Max?
Tastes kinda like bacon.
Great 3am drunk food. Up there with sardines and crackers. Usually, that's the only stuff you can manage to find in the cupboard at 3am.
I was always quite fond of these colon cleaners. Usually found at the qaulity food sections of 7-Eleven and AM/PM
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.donmiguel.com%2Fimages%2Fburritos%2Fbomb%2Fthe-bomb-healthy-burritos-beef-burrito-and-bean-burrito-frozen-food.jpg&hash=704a820cc24e921ba5078d18e119b2e4dd39d59a)
Quote from: Pitiful Pathos on September 30, 2011, 02:00:49 AM
Why all brands of that nasty canned meat shit named by choosing monosyllabic nonsense words? I mean the name itself pretty much tells you it's going to be terrible.
Truth in advertising.
I've reduced my spam intake to 1 or 2 times a year. Every so often, I get a Spam craving and I fry up some. After I had my 2 spam sandwiches, the Spamostis level in my blood declines and throw out what is left.
I do have a case in the basement emergency stockpile.
I used to eat spam all the time. Sadly when I got married getting wasted every night and puking on the kitchen floor after eating a tin of spam was frowned upon.
I have loyalty to Hormel - my Mom's side are from Austin, MN and many work(ed) there over the years.
Also, the SPAM museum is pretty good fun.
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:14:52 PM
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
So just plain bread? :huh:
Quote from: HisMajestyBOB on October 01, 2011, 01:37:26 AM
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:14:52 PM
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
So just plain bread? :huh:
With stuff on top of what makes a plain pizza, of course. :rolleyes:
Quote from: HisMajestyBOB on October 01, 2011, 01:37:26 AM
Quote from: DGuller on September 29, 2011, 01:14:52 PM
If your pizza is better with stuff on it, then you're eating a terrible pizza.
So just plain bread? :huh:
You're discussing culinary matters with a Russian? He probably thinks borscht pizza is the best.
As a matter of fact, I do not. :mad:
I made my own bagels today. Turned out damn well if I may say so.
Bag-El? Of Krypton?
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
And Zoupa pretends that Americans are uncultured...
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:02:30 PM
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
It's not full of mercury.
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:02:30 PM
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
If your rare steak is bloody, then you didn't make it correctly. You failed to make it stop mooing, for one.
There is no "proper" way of cooking steak :huh: Most people do prefer bloody carcass on their plate, but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
You machomen and your stance on this is pretty hilarious.
Quote from: The Brain on October 01, 2011, 05:31:53 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:02:30 PM
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
It's not full of mercury.
It's not recommended for pregnant women to eat raw sushi. Tuna and most large top-of-the-food-chain fish found on the menu contain mercury in doses large enough to cause harm over a period of time.
Also, it tastes like shit and promotes japanese fishing "culture".
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:44:23 PM
There is no "proper" way of cooking steak :huh: Most people do prefer bloody carcass on their plate, but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
You machomen and your stance on this is pretty hilarious.
Just call 'em food nazis like I do.
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 01, 2011, 06:04:09 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:44:23 PM
There is no "proper" way of cooking steak :huh: Most people do prefer bloody carcass on their plate, but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
You machomen and your stance on this is pretty hilarious.
Just call 'em food nazis like I do.
That said - some people do have poor taste.
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 01, 2011, 06:04:09 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:44:23 PM
There is no "proper" way of cooking steak :huh: Most people do prefer bloody carcass on their plate, but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
You machomen and your stance on this is pretty hilarious.
Just call 'em food nazis like I do.
There would be no food Nazis if there weren't people like a whole lot of you in this thread with your nutty conceptions of what food is.
Quote from: DGuller on October 01, 2011, 06:56:07 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 01, 2011, 06:04:09 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:44:23 PM
There is no "proper" way of cooking steak :huh: Most people do prefer bloody carcass on their plate, but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
You machomen and your stance on this is pretty hilarious.
Just call 'em food nazis like I do.
There would be no food Nazis if there weren't people like a whole lot of you in this thread with your nutty conceptions of what food is.
Ok, black bread and borcht guy.
What's wrong with black bread or borscht?
Slavs. :rolleyes:
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn2.holytaco.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fimages%2F1.-Another-Good-Finished.jpg&hash=39de1326e625552db2c0ed90aba4a5738fe8b64a)
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:48:54 PM
Quote from: The Brain on October 01, 2011, 05:31:53 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:02:30 PM
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
It's not full of mercury.
It's not recommended for pregnant women to eat raw sushi. Tuna and most large top-of-the-food-chain fish found on the menu contain mercury in doses large enough to cause harm over a period of time.
Also, it tastes like shit and promotes japanese fishing "culture".
Solution: surfacing more submarines under them.
I almost ate black bread once, then I realized it'd been like three weeks since I'd bought it.
Borscht is pretty amazing when you consider what it's made from.
Quote from: Ideologue on October 01, 2011, 07:42:38 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:48:54 PM
Quote from: The Brain on October 01, 2011, 05:31:53 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:02:30 PM
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
It's not full of mercury.
It's not recommended for pregnant women to eat raw sushi. Tuna and most large top-of-the-food-chain fish found on the menu contain mercury in doses large enough to cause harm over a period of time.
Also, it tastes like shit and promotes japanese fishing "culture".
Solution: surfacing more submarines under them.
I see what you did there.
Here is another one for DG:
During my poor period, I loved Micro Magic microwave hamburgers and fries. For about a buck fifty in food stamps, I had a lunch that filled me up pretty well.
Sadly, I can't find pictures of the burgers on the inter highway.
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fen%2Fthumb%2F8%2F88%2FSteak-umm_Box.jpg%2F800px-Steak-umm_Box.jpg&hash=7966a74ebfe7a048b473e292fe78b6d2e1935280)
The box had a better flavor.
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 01, 2011, 08:07:24 PM
Here is another one for DG:
During my poor period, I loved Micro Magic microwave hamburgers and fries. For about a buck fifty in food stamps, I had a lunch that filled me up pretty well.
Sadly, I can't find pictures of the burgers on the inter highway.
I don't mind that. The punishment for those eating that is dished out automatically.
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 01, 2011, 07:22:09 PM
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn2.holytaco.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2Fimages%2F1.-Another-Good-Finished.jpg&hash=39de1326e625552db2c0ed90aba4a5738fe8b64a)
I'd make that if it wouldn't be way too much work.
Quote from: DGuller on October 01, 2011, 07:15:44 PM
What's wrong with black bread or borscht?
Absolutely nothing. :hug:
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 01, 2011, 07:55:57 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on October 01, 2011, 07:42:38 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:48:54 PM
Quote from: The Brain on October 01, 2011, 05:31:53 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:02:30 PM
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
It's not full of mercury.
It's not recommended for pregnant women to eat raw sushi. Tuna and most large top-of-the-food-chain fish found on the menu contain mercury in doses large enough to cause harm over a period of time.
Also, it tastes like shit and promotes japanese fishing "culture".
Solution: surfacing more submarines under them.
I see what you did there.
Exploiting tragedy for comedy is simply our way.
Quote from: Admiral Yi on October 01, 2011, 07:52:11 PM
Borscht is pretty amazing when you consider what it's made from.
What the hell is wrong with beets?
It's no use, Beebs.
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:48:54 PM
Quote from: The Brain on October 01, 2011, 05:31:53 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:02:30 PM
I don't get all of youse' obsession about how rare a steak should be. I hate the taste of raw or semi-raw meat. Hence my steaks are not bloody, and I rarely eat sushi, since it's bland, gross and full of mercury.
It's not full of mercury.
It's not recommended for pregnant women to eat raw sushi. Tuna and most large top-of-the-food-chain fish found on the menu contain mercury in doses large enough to cause harm over a period of time.
Uh, if you have seafood that's contaminated with mercury, it's not recommened that anyone eat it.
And cooking food does not remove mercury or any other chemical contaminant. Cooking will kill biological contaminants, but does nothing about chemical ones.
QuoteUh, if you have seafood that's contaminated with mercury, it's not recommened that anyone eat it.
NO WAY!!! REALLY?????
http://water.epa.gov/scitech/swguidance/fishshellfish/outreach/advice_index.cfm
QuoteAnd cooking food does not remove mercury or any other chemical contaminant. Cooking will kill biological contaminants, but does nothing about chemical ones.
Pregnant women shouldn't eat raw meat or fish, contaminants or no.
Quote from: Barrister on October 01, 2011, 10:23:08 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on October 01, 2011, 07:52:11 PM
Borscht is pretty amazing when you consider what it's made from.
What the hell is wrong with beets?
So, either you or DG need to provide me with a borscht recipe. I shall at least attempt to expand my cultural boundaries into your terrifying cuisine.
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:44:23 PM
but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
Yeah, its a test to see if they should give you the good stuff or not. If you ask for it cooked more than medium rare they know they can give you the poor quality meat because you are not going to be able to tell the difference. Also, if you think sushi is bland, you are either not eating it correctly or the restaurant you go to doesnt prepare it correctly.
Quote from: Habbaku on October 01, 2011, 11:23:09 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 01, 2011, 10:23:08 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on October 01, 2011, 07:52:11 PM
Borscht is pretty amazing when you consider what it's made from.
What the hell is wrong with beets?
So, either you or DG need to provide me with a borscht recipe. I shall at least attempt to expand my cultural boundaries into your terrifying cuisine.
Borscht prepared well is very good. Average Borscht is pretty bad. You need to find a grandmother of East European descent to cook it for you.
Do they sell those in Canada?
Quote from: Habbaku on October 01, 2011, 11:30:20 PM
Do they sell those in Canada?
no , but they are pretty easy to find. You need to date the granddaughter of one.
Quote from: crazy canuck on October 01, 2011, 11:27:48 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:44:23 PM
but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
Yeah, its a test to see if they should give you the good stuff or not. If you ask for it cooked more than medium rare they know they can give you the poor quality meat because you are not going to be able to tell the difference. Also, if you think sushi is bland, you are either not eating it correctly or the restaurant you go to doesnt prepare it correctly.
if you order well done during peak hours there's a good chance you get the reheated steak that they over cooked when someone ordered medium to rare.
Quote from: crazy canuck on October 01, 2011, 11:27:48 PM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 01, 2011, 05:44:23 PM
but there's a reason the waiter asks how well you like it.
Yeah, its a test to see if they should give you the good stuff or not. If you ask for it cooked more than medium rare they know they can give you the poor quality meat because you are not going to be able to tell the difference.
You're forgetting one thing: I'm a frog, and make sure to use my accent either in french or english. Chefs don't fuck with me.
QuoteAlso, if you think sushi is bland, you are either not eating it correctly or the restaurant you go to doesnt prepare it correctly.
Or, or, I have different tastes than you or whatever new fad everyone goes crazy for every other year.
I've dated one jap, 2 chinese, 2 viets and a flip. They know good spots. I went to Vancouver, where parents of said jap prepared us sushi. It still tasted bland and boring. Asian food overall is not great for me.
I'd go with Indian > Hakka > Korean > Chinese > Japanese.
Of course, these are my preferences. You're welcome to yours. I don't get this insistence that everybody needs to like the same shit.
Quote from: The Brain on October 02, 2011, 05:18:59 AM
One of the most awesome dishes I've ever eaten was beets-based.
Yeah, but you're half Finnish.
Quote from: Zoupa on October 02, 2011, 01:54:56 AM
Or, or, I have different tastes than you
More to the point, you dont seem to have any taste at all. Which is odd since you say you are a "frog".
Here is one for Marti to try to figure out. Zoupa is a "Frog" as Marti is a ______?
Quote from: crazy canuck on October 01, 2011, 11:29:18 PM
Quote from: Habbaku on October 01, 2011, 11:23:09 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 01, 2011, 10:23:08 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on October 01, 2011, 07:52:11 PM
Borscht is pretty amazing when you consider what it's made from.
What the hell is wrong with beets?
So, either you or DG need to provide me with a borscht recipe. I shall at least attempt to expand my cultural boundaries into your terrifying cuisine.
Borscht prepared well is very good. Average Borscht is pretty bad. You need to find a grandmother of East European descent to cook it for you.
I dunno about that. Borscht is pretty damn simple to make (though time consuming). It's not as if there's some great secret to it.
I like pickled beets.
Quote from: Barrister on October 02, 2011, 09:48:05 AM
I dunno about that. Borscht is pretty damn simple to make (though time consuming). It's not as if there's some great secret to it.
There is even a saying in Russian: "simple as borscht".
Quote from: DGuller on October 02, 2011, 11:26:39 AM
Quote from: Barrister on October 02, 2011, 09:48:05 AM
I dunno about that. Borscht is pretty damn simple to make (though time consuming). It's not as if there's some great secret to it.
There is even a saying in Russian: "simple as borscht".
Now that you mention it, I can remember my dad saying something was "easy as borscht".
Quote from: DGuller on October 02, 2011, 11:26:39 AM
Quote from: Barrister on October 02, 2011, 09:48:05 AM
I dunno about that. Borscht is pretty damn simple to make (though time consuming). It's not as if there's some great secret to it.
There is even a saying in Russian: "simple as borscht".
Similar saying in English. "Piece of cake" or "Easy as pie". Though confusingly refers to a type of musical game (and musical genre) rather then the difficulty in creating cakes and pies.
I thought it was as easy as eating cake. I find that very easy, anyway.
I've never heard "easy as borscht", but I have heard "cheap as borscht"
Quote from: Maximus on October 02, 2011, 12:57:05 PM
I've never heard "easy as borscht", but I have heard "cheap as borscht"
I've heard neither of those, but I have heard "it's got a good beet, you can dance to it, I'll give it a 78."
Quote from: Admiral Yi on October 02, 2011, 03:22:41 PM
Quote from: Maximus on October 02, 2011, 12:57:05 PM
I've never heard "easy as borscht", but I have heard "cheap as borscht"
I've heard neither of those, but I have heard "it's got a good beet, you can dance to it, I'll give it a 78."
Ugh
Quote from: Ideologue on October 02, 2011, 12:24:19 PM
I thought it was as easy as eating cake. I find that very easy, anyway.
Cakewalk. A musical game from late 19th century. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sDnVIeSn_k It could be considered a distant ancestor of modern Rock. Women looked a little heavier back then.
Quote from: crazy canuck on October 02, 2011, 09:36:18 AM
Quote from: Zoupa on October 02, 2011, 01:54:56 AM
Or, or, I have different tastes than you
More to the point, you dont seem to have any taste at all. Which is odd since you say you are a "frog".
Here is one for Marti to try to figure out. Zoupa is a "Frog" as Marti is a ______?
Ok, you win the "this thing is AWESOME because I like it and I say it is" argument.
Yay. Good for you. :huh:
Quote from: Maximus on October 02, 2011, 12:57:05 PM
I've never heard "easy as borscht", but I have heard "cheap as borscht"
Yep
Easy as a bean burrito.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 02, 2011, 03:52:17 PM
Quote from: Ideologue on October 02, 2011, 12:24:19 PM
I thought it was as easy as eating cake. I find that very easy, anyway.
Cakewalk. A musical game from late 19th century. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sDnVIeSn_k It could be considered a distant ancestor of modern Rock. Women looked a little heavier back then.
Did people really swim in those things? They look like a drowning hazard.
Quote from: Maximus on October 02, 2011, 12:57:05 PM
I've never heard "easy as borscht", but I have heard "cheap as borscht"
Now that you mention it, I think I misremembered after being prompted by DG. "Cheap as borscht" is indeed my dad's saying.
You know what I love about this thread? It just trivializes that scum bag as he should be.
Dude gets stuck
A talk about properly prepared steaks
Spam
and some cheap ass polish sausage.
Seriously, why all this bonus hate for a supposed cop killer? Is this some silly brotherhood thing that every cop seems to suffer from?
If you think about it, cop killers are least worthy of scorn. At least they killed someone who almost always can conceivably fight back. Executing someone after a robbery or rape, now that's a whole other level of scum.
Besides, this should all be moot anyway, because the dead guy wasn't acting in his capacity as a cop when he was killed, so to label the killer as a cop-killer is misleading in the first place.
Quote from: DGuller on October 03, 2011, 12:01:28 AM
Seriously, why all this bonus hate for a supposed cop killer? Is this some silly brotherhood thing that every cop seems to suffer from?
If you think about it, cop killers are least worthy of scorn. At least they killed someone who almost always can conceivably fight back. Executing someone after a robbery or rape, now that's a whole other level of scum.
Besides, this should all be moot anyway, because the dead guy wasn't acting in his capacity as a cop when he was killed, so to label the killer as a cop-killer is misleading in the first place.
Dont derail this thread, talking about Davis. We had a good thing going with food.
Quote from: 11B4V on October 03, 2011, 12:09:47 AM
Dont derail this thread, talking about Davis. We had a good thing going with food.
:huh: You brought Davis back up.
Quote from: garbon on October 03, 2011, 07:11:48 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on October 03, 2011, 12:09:47 AM
Dont derail this thread, talking about Davis. We had a good thing going with food.
:huh: You brought Davis back up.
I just said Dude got stuck. :(
Quote from: 11B4V on October 03, 2011, 12:09:47 AM
Quote from: DGuller on October 03, 2011, 12:01:28 AM
Seriously, why all this bonus hate for a supposed cop killer? Is this some silly brotherhood thing that every cop seems to suffer from?
If you think about it, cop killers are least worthy of scorn. At least they killed someone who almost always can conceivably fight back. Executing someone after a robbery or rape, now that's a whole other level of scum.
Besides, this should all be moot anyway, because the dead guy wasn't acting in his capacity as a cop when he was killed, so to label the killer as a cop-killer is misleading in the first place.
Dont derail this thread, talking about Davis. We had a good thing going with food.
That ship sailed when you gloated over the hijack of the guy's death thread, thus ruining the hijack.
Quote from: DGuller on October 03, 2011, 08:36:34 AM
Quote from: 11B4V on October 03, 2011, 12:09:47 AM
Quote from: DGuller on October 03, 2011, 12:01:28 AM
Seriously, why all this bonus hate for a supposed cop killer? Is this some silly brotherhood thing that every cop seems to suffer from?
If you think about it, cop killers are least worthy of scorn. At least they killed someone who almost always can conceivably fight back. Executing someone after a robbery or rape, now that's a whole other level of scum.
Besides, this should all be moot anyway, because the dead guy wasn't acting in his capacity as a cop when he was killed, so to label the killer as a cop-killer is misleading in the first place.
Dont derail this thread, talking about Davis. We had a good thing going with food.
That ship sailed when you gloated over the hijack of the guy's death thread, thus ruining the hijack.
Guilty as charged. :moon:
If I may say so, you come off looking worse in this thread than Troy Davis.
Quote from: DGuller on October 03, 2011, 10:13:07 AM
If I may say so, you come off looking worse in this thread than Troy Davis.
Not really, I'm still above ground.
Quote from: DGuller on October 03, 2011, 10:13:07 AM
If I may say so, you come off looking worse in this thread than Troy Davis.
The execution of Davis simply confirms to me that the state should not have the power to execute, because it will exercise that power incompetently. I'd rather not even allow it police powers, given its propensity to hire a minority of policemen who abuse that power, but the alternative is worse, so I accept it.
Celebrating the stumblefuck state's misuse of power certainly doesn't make 11B4V look good, but he is a minion of the state and so is naturally the kind to celebrate even the worst blunders made by his peers.
I am open to the possibility that Davis is innocent, and open to the possibility that he was guilty. The fact that McPhail was a city cop when he wasn't playing rent-a-cop has no bearing on the case. As we know from the news, cops are righteously killed by Americans in Afghanistan on a regular basis.
Quote from: grumbler on October 03, 2011, 01:32:47 PM
Quote from: DGuller on October 03, 2011, 10:13:07 AM
If I may say so, you come off looking worse in this thread than Troy Davis.
Celebrating the stumblefuck state's misuse of power certainly doesn't make 11B4V look good, but he is a minion of the state and so is naturally the kind to celebrate even the worst blunders made by his peers.
:rolleyes: You can make a better personal attack than that.
I had a steak today and order it medium well. My mouth just wouldn't let me say the word rare. :blush:
Quote from: garbon on October 03, 2011, 07:52:02 PM
I had a steak today and order it medium well. My mouth just wouldn't let me say the word rare. :blush:
Yeah, but doesn't that just play into the stereotype of homos and overdone steaks? Surely your need to be an individual should overpower your lack of taste?
Quote from: garbon on October 03, 2011, 07:52:02 PM
I had a steak today and order it medium well. My mouth just wouldn't let me say the word rare. :blush:
But was it good?
Quote from: 11B4V on October 03, 2011, 08:06:52 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 03, 2011, 07:52:02 PM
I had a steak today and order it medium well. My mouth just wouldn't let me say the word rare. :blush:
But was it good?
Delicious although a bit more chewy than I would have liked. However, after the first caipirinha, I hardly noticed (that place makes their drinks in decent fashion!). :blush:
Quote from: 11B4V on October 03, 2011, 08:06:52 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 03, 2011, 07:52:02 PM
I had a steak today and order it medium well. My mouth just wouldn't let me say the word rare. :blush:
But was it good?
Not if it was cooked to his order.
Quote from: Neil on October 03, 2011, 08:06:05 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 03, 2011, 07:52:02 PM
I had a steak today and order it medium well. My mouth just wouldn't let me say the word rare. :blush:
Yeah, but doesn't that just play into the stereotype of homos and overdone steaks? Surely your need to be an individual should overpower your lack of taste?
Well, I'm new to this whole eating beef thing. I've only had it occasionally since childhood and this past father's day, I had my first steak since I was a pre-teen. That steak was definitely overcooked but I ate it as my fathered had worked so hard between assembling his charcoal grill and then getting frustrated that he couldn't get the fire started. Baby steps and all, right?