[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[crazy canuck]

Bill C-3.

I did not realize what was the impact until today.

Apparently, a lot more people than I thought can be Canadian citizens.

Sav, if you're reading this, you may get your passport?


I summarize a table in Gemini:

Ancestor	Born	Status under Bill C-3
Thomas	~1830s (NB)	Anchor Citizen (Born in Canada)
James	~1860s (NB/US)	Citizen (Born to a Canadian)
Grandparent	~1900s (US)	Citizen (Newly recognized via Bill C-3)
Parent	~1930s (US)	Citizen (Newly recognized via Bill C-3)
Jim (You)	Before 2025	Citizen from Birth

Fictional ancestor of US citizen born in British Canada who would have been a Canadian citizen had he been born in 1947 (no Canadian citizenship before that)

His son emigrated to the US and all his descendants lived there until me, an American citizen, and I want to become a Canadian.

I just woke up Canadian.

That's fucked up.

Apparently many Americans are rushing to get their Canadian citizenship now.

Oh boy, no that is not how it works.  But I am not surprised that an AI tool got it completely wrong.


What is missing in that analysis is what the statute actually requires. There are two parts. Was the one of the applicant's parents a Canadian citizen when the applicant was born; and
did their Canadian parent have a "substantial connection to Canada".

 
To meet the connection to Canada test, the Canadian parents must prove they spent at least three years (1,095) days in Canada prior to the child's birth.

[mongers]

Bill C-3.

I did not realize what was the impact until today.

Apparently, a lot more people than I thought can be Canadian citizens.

Sav, if you're reading this, you may get your passport?


I summarize a table in Gemini:

Fictional ancestor of US citizen born in British Canada who would have been a Canadian citizen had he been born in 1947 (no Canadian citizenship before that)

His son emigrated to the US and all his descendants lived there until me, an American citizen, and I want to become a Canadian.

I just woke up Canadian.

That's fucked up.

Apparently many Americans are rushing to get their Canadian citizenship now.

Oh boy, no that is not how it works.  But I am not surprised that an AI tool got it completely wrong.


What is missing in that analysis is what the statute actually requires. There are two parts. Was the one of the applicant's parents a Canadian citizen when the applicant was born; and
did their Canadian parent have a "substantial connection to Canada".

 
To meet the connection to Canada test, the Canadian parents must prove they spent at least three years (1,095) days in Canada prior to the child's birth.

And yet not a jot of criticism of it if one read the wiki entry:

Gemini 2.5 Pro Experimental debuted at the top position on the LMArena leaderboard, a benchmark measuring human preference, indicating strong performance and output quality.[48][50] The model achieved state-of-the-art or highly competitive results across various benchmarks evaluating reasoning, knowledge, science, math, coding, and long-context performance, such as Humanity's Last Exam, GPQA, AIME 2025, SWE-bench and MRCR.[48][109][50][49] Initial reviews highlighted its improved reasoning capabilities and performance gains compared to previous versions.[49][51] Published benchmarks also showed areas where contemporary models from competitors like Anthropic, xAI, or OpenAI held advantages

[Valmy]

My great-great-great Grandfather William DuBois was born in Quebec in 1811 and died in the California Gold Rush. Is that good enough? 

From what I understand, yes. And your children too.

Really? Ok well I will look into it.

[Grey Fox]

My great-great-great Grandfather William DuBois was born in Quebec in 1811 and died in the California Gold Rush. Is that good enough? 

From what I understand, yes. And your children too.

Really? Ok well I will look into it.

I thought so but CCs post seem to indicate that no, it isn't how this works.

You should talk to an immigration lawyer

[viper37]

To meet the connection to Canada test, the Canadian parents must prove they spent at least three years (1,095) days in Canada prior to the child's birth.

Lost Canadians
The term "Lost Canadians" refers to people who lost or never obtained citizenship because of certain outdated rules in earlier citizenship laws.
Most cases were resolved through legislative changes in 2009 and 2015, which restored or gave citizenship to about 20,000 people. However, some people remained excluded, including section 8 "Lost Canadians" and descendants of "Lost Canadians."
Bill C-3 extends access to citizenship to these remaining "Lost Canadians," their descendants and those born abroad to or adopted abroad by a Canadian parent in the second or later generation before the new law came into effect. 

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/news/2025/12/bill-c-3-an-act-to-amend-the-citizenship-act-2025-comes-into-effect.html


The ancestor must have lived 1095 days in Canada, but that's something you can prove with a marriage certificate.

I was looking at threads like these:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Canadiancitizenship/comments/1qotej7/citizenship_by_descent_documentation_review/


Lots of people left Quebec for New England in the 19th century and assimilated into American culture.  They could come back here if they wanted now.  Millions of English speakers...

[Grey Fox]

Well that Reddit community explains why the AI answered the way it did. Almost every dossier is a 4 generation descendant of the Canadian citizen.

I don't know if it's enough but it's the same situation Valmy find himself in.

[Grey Fox]

Bill C-3 represents a fundamental shift in Canada's citizenship framework. It retroactively recognizes Canadian citizenship by descent for persons born prior to December 15, 2025, who are in the second or subsequent generation born abroad. Bill C-3 also recognizes the right of persons, who were adopted by Canadian citizens prior to December 15, 2025, to seek a grant of Canadian citizenship. In addition, it restores Canadian citizenship to persons who failed to retain Canadian citizenship under Section 8 of the previous legislation

https://www.dentons.com/en/insights/articles/2025/december/19/bill-c-3-restores-canadian-citizenship-to-lost-canadians

Since Valmy and his children were born before December 15th 2025, that would make them automatically citizens if the proper documentation can be obtained. No?

[viper37]

That's my understanding.

If Valmy finds a birth certificate or marriage certificate for an ancestor in Canada, he can apply for Canadian citizenship, or his children can.

From there, unless I am mistaken, the citizenship can be transferred without the requirement to stay 3 years in Canada so long as the chain is unbroken.

Reminds me of Astérix aux Jeux Olympiques when he discovers they're all Romans.

[viper37]

CC:
Radio-Canada has a text about this.  150 demands since January for Rimouski alone, 600 for all of Quebec, all coming from the US:
Inquiets du climat politique, des Américains se ruent vers leurs origines canadiennes

Worried about about political climate, some Americans rushed toward their Canadian origins

[crazy canuck]

Well that Reddit community explains why the AI answered the way it did. Almost every dossier is a 4 generation descendant of the Canadian citizen.

I don't know if it's enough but it's the same situation Valmy find himself in.

Yeah, the AI tool doesn't analyze the legislation, it gets trained on what social media says about it.

[crazy canuck]

CC:
Radio-Canada has a text about this.  150 demands since January for Rimouski alone, 600 for all of Quebec, all coming from the US:
Inquiets du climat politique, des Américains se ruent vers leurs origines canadiennes

Worried about about political climate, some Americans rushed toward their Canadian origins

And with all of the misinformation circulating around social media, I'm a bit surprised the number isn't larger.

[crazy canuck]

Bill C-3 represents a fundamental shift in Canada's citizenship framework. It retroactively recognizes Canadian citizenship by descent for persons born prior to December 15, 2025, who are in the second or subsequent generation born abroad. Bill C-3 also recognizes the right of persons, who were adopted by Canadian citizens prior to December 15, 2025, to seek a grant of Canadian citizenship. In addition, it restores Canadian citizenship to persons who failed to retain Canadian citizenship under Section 8 of the previous legislation

https://www.dentons.com/en/insights/articles/2025/december/19/bill-c-3-restores-canadian-citizenship-to-lost-canadians

Since Valmy and his children were born before December 15th 2025, that would make them automatically citizens if the proper documentation can be obtained. No?

That's an introductory paragraph from a law firm website to encourage people to contact the law firm for more information, i.e., it is a marketing tool to get people to talk to a lawyer to find out what the rules actually are. It is not meant to be a description of the totality of the legislative restrictions.

[crazy canuck]

I have a bit more time to answer why the interpretation Gemini gave is wrong.

The amendment to the Act was to address a constitutional challenge.  The problem to be solved was it was found unconstitutional to deny citizenship to subsequent generations also born outside Canada, if their parents were Canadian citizens and had a substantial connection with Canada.

So take a hypothetical - a Canadian couple goes on a trip to another country, and during that trip they give birth to a child.  Under the old legislation no problem - that child is deemed a citizen of Canada.  But what if, when that child grows up they also go on a trip and have a child while travelling in another country.  That child would then be out of luck under the old legislation, and that is the inconsistency the amendment addressed.

The parents have to be Canadian citizens and they have got to have a substantial connection to Canada.  There is no reaching back into the mists of time to someone who spent some time in Canada generations ago, and there is no further substantial connection with Canada.

[Grey Fox]

Sure but the act also adresses the Lost Canadians issue.

Bill C-3 automatically grants citizenship by decent to all those born abroad to a Canadian parent before the coming into force date of the legislation.

https://senate-gro.ca/c3-lost-canadians/

If you were born or adopted before December 15, 2025

Citizenship may have been restored or given to people who were born outside Canada in the second generation or later before December 15, 2025.

This means that in most cases you're automatically a Canadian citizen if you were born

    before December 15, 2025
    outside Canada to a Canadian parent

This rule also applies to you if you were born to someone who became Canadian because of these rule changes.

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/canadian-citizenship/act-changes/rules-2025.html

I'm no lawyer & I have to read all this legalese in english but how is this not what we're saying?

[Jacob]

Can dead people who would've been able to get Canadian citizenship if they were alive under the current legislation be granted Canadian citizenship retroactively?

The "OMG is this for real" reading seems to imply that if anyone of your direct ancestors were Canadians, then each of the descendants gets posthumous citizenship in turn, creating a domino effect of citizenship.

On the other hand when I read the link Grey Fox shared, the requirement seems to be at minimum that you are a grandchild of a Canadian citizen and that your Canadian descended parent spent at least 3 years in Canada. It says nothing about posthumous citizenship being granted to dead non-Canadian citizens if they would've qualified under the current law.

Presumbably if your great-great grandparent was a Canadian and had a child (your great grandparent) that spent at least 3 years in Canada, that great-grandparent could become a citizen now. But if they're dead then they are not and have never been a Canadian citizen, they're never going to be able to apply for citizenship or take the oath - so the chain of citizenship eligibility would seem to end there.