Call the Electoral Vote

[MadImmortalMan]

Here you go, Gully.

   
1:45 PM | Chris Christie tears into "know-nothing, disgruntled Romney staffers."

Chris Christie fired back today at Romney staffers who threw him under the bus in a Politico report last weekend, calling them "know-nothing, disgruntled Romney staffers" in a press conference today.

Yesterday, The Huffington Post reported that Christie had declined a request from Romney, further irritating Romney insiders.

"I told Governor Romney at that time that if the storm landed as predicted that it was going to be catastrophic to New Jersey and unprecedented," Christie said today, according to the Huff Po. "I said to him, 'Listen, Mitt, if this storm hits the way I think it's going to, I'm off the campaign trail from here to Election Day.' And he said to me, 'Chris, of course. That's what you have to do. Do your job, don't worry about me. I'll take care of things.' So all this other noise, I think, is coming from know-nothing, disgruntled Romney staffers who, you know, don't like the fact that I said nice things about the President of the United States. Well, that's too bad for them."

[The Minsky Moment]

I voted Green Party for president.

Same.

Some excerpts from the Green Party platform on foreign policy:

The U.S. must recognize and abide by the authority of the U.N. General Assembly to act in a crisis situation by passing a resolution under the Uniting for Peace Procedure when the U.N. Security Council is stalemated by vetoes.

We seek the permanent repeal of the veto power enjoyed by the five permanent members of the U.N. Security Council.

Dismantle all nuclear warheads from their missiles.

The U.S. must allow foreign teams to visit the U.S. for verification purposes [chemical/bio-weapons] at least annually.

We urge our government to phase out all bases not specifically functioning under a U.N. resolution to keep peace and bring home our troops stationed abroad, except for the military assigned to protect a U.S. embassy

We urge our government to prohibit all arms sales to foreign nations and likewise prohibit grants to impoverished and undemocratic nations unless the money is targeted on domestic, non-military needs

We reaffirm the right and feasibility of Palestinian refugees to return to their homes in Israel.

We reject U.S. unbalanced financial and military support of Israel while Israel occupies Palestinian lands and maintains an apartheid-like system in both the Occupied Palestinian Territories and in Israel toward its non-Jewish citizens. Therefore, we call on the U.S. President and Congress to suspend all military and foreign aid, including loans and grants, to Israel until Israel withdraws from the Occupied Territories, dismantles the separation wall in the Occupied West Bank including East Jerusalem, ends its siege of Gaza and its apart­heid-like system both within the Occupied Palestinian Territories and in Israel toward its non-Jewish citizens

We also reject U.S. political support for Israel and demand that the U.S. government end its veto of Security Council resolutions pertaining to Israel.

We call on the foreign and military affairs committees of the U.S. House and Senate to conduct full hearings on the status of human rights and war crimes in Palestine-Israel, especially violations committed during Israel's 2008-2009 invasion of Gaza ("Operation Cast Lead")

Replace the US Marine Corps with a dedicated amphibious battalion of a capella singers deployable within 24 hours to sing kumbaya anywhere conflict may arise around the world 

OK - maybe the last one didn't quite make the final approved platform but the rest is there.

Also - the Green Party "Foreign Policy" section includes planks for Puerto Rican Independence but nothing about the EU, China, Russia, India, Pakistan, indeed nothing regarding the entire contintents of South America, Africa, Europe, or Asia (other than Israel and Palestinians).

Sorry but you just voted for the Silly Party.

[Caliga]

I think it's pretty cool that Christie and Bruce Springsteen are pals now.  Something good came out of the storm after all.

[merithyn]

If you know my politics you'll know I'm all over new political movements.

But if order to get my vote you have to show some basic level of organization and possibility of success.  What's the point of voting Green when you know they get 0.5% of the overall vote?

On the other hand, voting for a Ross Perot made a lot more sense at the time.

It made more sense to vote for an insane guy than to vote for a woman that I actually agree with on most topics? That's just silly.

And the point of voting for them is to hopefully, over time, give them enough support that they become viable candidates and more people will vote for them despite the overwhelming odds against them.

By the way, I voted for Democrats, Republicans, Independents, and Green Party in this election.

[merithyn]

Some excerpts from the Green Party platform on foreign policy:


OK - maybe the last one didn't quite make the final approved platform but the rest is there.

Also - the Green Party "Foreign Policy" section includes planks for Puerto Rican Independence but nothing about the EU, China, Russia, India, Pakistan, indeed nothing regarding the entire contintents of South America, Africa, Europe, or Asia (other than Israel and Palestinians).

Sorry but you just voted for the Silly Party.

Those were the reasons I hadn't intended to vote for them. Nonetheless, I still believe that since my vote was merely symbolic anyway, casting it for a third party was the right thing to do.

[Caliga]

Sorry but you just voted for the Silly Party.

I didn't really vote for the Green Party because I agree with the Green Party platform.  I disagree with a big portion of it though I do agree with them on a lot of their social stances (I am for gay marriage, abortion rights, against the death penalty, etc.)

I voted Green because I knew Princesca would vote Libertarian, and as I said I usually vote Libertarian myself, so the Libs still got one vote out of our household.  But I don't recall the Green Party being on the Kentucky ballot before and I want to keep them on it, so I figure every vote counts when such a small number of Kentuckians are going to vote Green... in fact I wouldn't be surprised if I'm the only person in my county who votes for Stein.  As I mentioned earlier I hate our entrenched two-party system so anything I can do to help break it down, no matter how insignificant it might seem, is something I feel almost ethically obligated to do.

Also, there were two other reasons.  I remember Jill Stein from my Massachusetts days when she ran for Governor (against Romney in fact, IIRC) and she came across as a genuine, kind, honest person.  I like the fact that she's a doctor instead of a lawyer, since doctors devote their careers to helping people, whereas lawyers are evil monsters hell-bent on destroying civilization.  Also, I like the fact that she's a woman, since I think it's embarassing that we've still not had a female leader when countries like Brazil have already crossed that hurdle.

[Razgovory]

Dismantle all nuclear warheads from their missiles.

So putting a nuclear warhead on a missile is bad, but it's okay to drop one from a plane like it's 1945?

The funny thing is, even if we had a third party or a fifth party and a hundredth party, people would still be dissatisfied with the system.  You would still find parts of a political party that you dislike.

[Gups]

Dismantle all nuclear warheads from their missiles.

So putting a nuclear warhead on a missile is bad, but it's okay to drop one from a plane like it's 1945?

That's a hell of a non sequitor.

[The Minsky Moment]

The problem with the Greens or the Libertarians is that they are self-defining as fringe parties.  They will never be the seed for a viable alternative party because they are completely captured by their own acitivists who foist this kind of self-indulgent claptrap onto the platform.  If a competitive third party is to arise, it will need to have a much broader base of appeal and be closer to the mainstream. 

[Razgovory]

Dismantle all nuclear warheads from their missiles.

So putting a nuclear warhead on a missile is bad, but it's okay to drop one from a plane like it's 1945?

That's a hell of a non sequitor.

Eh, what?

[merithyn]

The problem with the Greens or the Libertarians is that they are self-defining as fringe parties.  They will never be the seed for a viable alternative party because they are completely captured by their own acitivists who foist this kind of self-indulgent claptrap onto the platform.  If a competitive third party is to arise, it will need to have a much broader base of appeal and be closer to the mainstream.

Agreed, but no one is going to even try that so long as there is little to no support for even the fringe groups.

I'm with Caliga on this one. There's a time and a place for third party votes, and today was the time and place for mine.

[MadImmortalMan]

Neither of you live in a swing state.

[merithyn]

Neither of you live in a swing state.

Exactly.

[Caliga]

Neither of you live in a swing state.

Yep, so following Meri's argument, the place is Kentucky (for me), and the time is every single damn election.

[OttoVonBismarck]

The only realistic third parties would just be splinters of the existing big tent.

You could have a Rockefeller Republican style center-right party that could focus on traditional conservative fiscal and economic policies while sharing some "moral support" for social causes (like being "morally" opposed to abortion and "morally" supporting traditional family values), but with the caveat that they believe those issues aren't fit for government legislation and thus should be left to personal conscience/etc. Sort of like some of the Christian Dem parties on the Continent, a lot of them have platforms where they endorse legal abortion rights but make some meaningless platitude comment about believing it is a moral concern.

I could also see a split between blue collar union style Democrats and more hippie granola eating style true lefties.

If you had a few party divisions like that it'd just result in coalitions in the House which would be fine, but it gets complicated for Presidential elections. Since we require an absolute majority to avoid kicking the vote to the House, we'd essentially have all elections decided by the House of Representatives. Unless the center-left parties and the center-right parties had the convention of nominating the same candidate (so there'd be one candidate representing the conservative / liberal sides) for the Presidency.