Swine Flu

[Malthus]

You are missing my point - which is that praising a roll-out in a region that got special resources makes no sense.

Now I know you are not actually reading my posts.  The praise for the roll out has NOTHING to do with wether or not they ran out.  The priase for the roll out was the way in which they organized it by anticipating the long lines and organizing events to accomodate that.

This has nothing to do with you and the reason why Ontario ran out.  This is about how well the Yukon dealt with the crowds.  They recieved no special resources with that.  It was just plain old fashion ingenuity.

And you don't think that, you know, actually having enough vaccine to do everyone had anything to do with how smoothly the vaccination roll out went? 

Give you two scenarios:

1. a small community of a few tens of thousands that has enough vaccine to do everyone; and

2. A huge city of several millions which only has enough vaccine to do a tiny purportion of the population

Which is going to prove the more "difficult" roll-out, do *you* think? 

[Malthus]

I'm confused.

What did the feds do right/wrong?

I think it's obvious that Ontario's problem is that they couldn't screen their first week properly. Only 70k doses for 13 millions is not enough sure, but you aren't suppose to vaccinate everybody in the first week.

The quote I heard from Iggy this morning is that the Feds should never have given control to the provinces over how the vaccine would be distributed.  He is clearly playing to the Ontario crowd where the screw up occurred.  But that will not play well at all in the West or Quebec.

That doesn't make any sense. How will pointing out that Ontario screwed up play well in Ontario?

[Josephus]

That doesn't make any sense. How will pointing out that Ontario screwed up play well in Ontario?

I think he means that it plays well as an anti-Fed (read Harper) campaign.

[Malthus]

That doesn't make any sense. How will pointing out that Ontario screwed up play well in Ontario?

I think he means that it plays well as an anti-Fed (read Harper) campaign.

Well, naturally the opposition is going to be anti-Harper, and try to pin the blame for any screw up on him.

The issue is whether they have a point or not. Certainly there has been a lot of confusion and uncertainty about the vaccine roll-out. How much of this confusion is the fault of the feds (who control the vaccine supply) and how much is the fault of the provinces (who control the overall roll-out plans) and how much is the fault of the municipalities (who it seems control the details of how the plans are implemented) is going to be a matter of finger-pointing for a while.

As for CC, seems he's already made up his mind: Ontario screwed up and that is that. Myself, I think the answer is more complex - I don't deny Ontario has screwed up but I think there have been failures on all levels: failures to ensure adequate supplies, among others.

 

[crazy canuck]

I'm confused.

What did the feds do right/wrong?

I think it's obvious that Ontario's problem is that they couldn't screen their first week properly. Only 70k doses for 13 millions is not enough sure, but you aren't suppose to vaccinate everybody in the first week.

The quote I heard from Iggy this morning is that the Feds should never have given control to the provinces over how the vaccine would be distributed.  He is clearly playing to the Ontario crowd where the screw up occurred.  But that will not play well at all in the West or Quebec.

That doesn't make any sense. How will pointing out that Ontario screwed up play well in Ontario?

No offense Malthus but you have some kind of reading block on today.  Iggy's point is pretty obvious.  If the Feds had never handed over authority to the provinces the screw up in Ontario would never have happened.  The problem is that people in the rest of the Country like to have some local control and his message, clearly designed for Ontario, will tank in the rest of the Country - including Whitehorse where the people should be justifiably proud with how well they handled the roll out.

[crazy canuck]

As for CC, seems he's already made up his mind: Ontario screwed up and that is that. Myself, I think the answer is more complex - I don't deny Ontario has screwed up but I think there have been failures on all levels: failures to ensure adequate supplies, among others.

So you think it would have been better for the feds to hold back delivery for a few weeks until there was enough to go around? 

[crazy canuck]

And you don't think that, you know, actually having enough vaccine to do everyone had anything to do with how smoothly the vaccination roll out went? 

Give you two scenarios:

1. a small community of a few tens of thousands that has enough vaccine to do everyone; and

2. A huge city of several millions which only has enough vaccine to do a tiny purportion of the population

Which is going to prove the more "difficult" roll-out, do *you* think? 

The city that had a few thousand could have screwed up in a different way if they didnt make plans to accomodate everyone coming for a vaccine within a short period of time.  They didnt.  They planned well and executed their plan well.  That is why they are getting praise.

The urban centres had different problems.  They had a limited supply and they had to communicate to people who should and should not be getting the shots in the initial stages.  Other provinces handled that well.  Ontario did not.

[Malthus]

I'm confused.

What did the feds do right/wrong?

I think it's obvious that Ontario's problem is that they couldn't screen their first week properly. Only 70k doses for 13 millions is not enough sure, but you aren't suppose to vaccinate everybody in the first week.

The quote I heard from Iggy this morning is that the Feds should never have given control to the provinces over how the vaccine would be distributed.  He is clearly playing to the Ontario crowd where the screw up occurred.  But that will not play well at all in the West or Quebec.

That doesn't make any sense. How will pointing out that Ontario screwed up play well in Ontario?

No offense Malthus but you have some kind of reading block on today.  Iggy's point is pretty obvious.  If the Feds had never handed over authority to the provinces the screw up in Ontario would never have happened.  The problem is that people in the rest of the Country like to have some local control and his message, clearly designed for Ontario, will tank in the rest of the Country - including Whitehorse where the people should be justifiably proud with how well they handled the roll out.

Sorry, but this still makes no sense. Claiming that Ontario screwing up will play well in Ontario sounds like Western-I-hate-Ontario doublethink to me. 

Whitehorse should be proud - that the feds were nice enough to give them all vaccine. 

[Malthus]

As for CC, seems he's already made up his mind: Ontario screwed up and that is that. Myself, I think the answer is more complex - I don't deny Ontario has screwed up but I think there have been failures on all levels: failures to ensure adequate supplies, among others.

So you think it would have been better for the feds to hold back delivery for a few weeks until there was enough to go around?

From what I heard, there was screw-up at the federal level over communicating exactly how much vaccine was available.

Isn't knowing how much is comming a somewhat vital planning point?

[Malthus]

And you don't think that, you know, actually having enough vaccine to do everyone had anything to do with how smoothly the vaccination roll out went? 

Give you two scenarios:

1. a small community of a few tens of thousands that has enough vaccine to do everyone; and

2. A huge city of several millions which only has enough vaccine to do a tiny purportion of the population

Which is going to prove the more "difficult" roll-out, do *you* think? 

The city that had a few thousand could have screwed up in a different way if they didnt make plans to accomodate everyone coming for a vaccine within a short period of time.  They didnt.  They planned well and executed their plan well.  That is why they are getting praise.

The urban centres had different problems.  They had a limited supply and they had to communicate to people who should and should not be getting the shots in the initial stages.  Other provinces handled that well.  Ontario did not.

Thing is you are very much comparing apples to oranges. A roll-out in a small community where the benificent feds were nice enough to provide enough vaccine for the whole population does not create anything like the same problems of a roll-out where only a tiny amount of vaccine is provided for a major city. 

Saying that the one went smoothly and the other went poorly says exactly nothing, because you would expect that. 

[Iormlund]

Seeing the words 'Yukon' and 'crowds' in the same sentence makes no sense.

[crazy canuck]

Saying that the one went smoothly and the other went poorly says exactly nothing, because you would expect that.

Think about what you are saying.  You would expect hundreds of people descending on clinics used to handling small numbers to go smoothly.  Really? 

[crazy canuck]

Seeing the words 'Yukon' and 'crowd' in the same post makes no sense.

Exactly.

[Malthus]

Saying that the one went smoothly and the other went poorly says exactly nothing, because you would expect that.

Think about what you are saying.  You would expect hundreds of people descending on clinics used to handling small numbers to go smoothly.  Really?

Think about what you are saying. A small community of a few thousand where everyone knows there is enough vaccine for all vs. a major city where everyone knows that there *isn't* enough vaccine for all (and where the shortage is even worse than everyone was told). Which will prove the most problematic, when panic sets in?

[Berkut]

Canada is panicking!

Calm down Canucklestans, it is going to be ok!