Star Wars Rogue One MASSIVE SPOILERS BY BERKUT

Started by Tamas, December 17, 2016, 11:43:34 AM

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Berkut

#345
January 05, 2017, 04:30:32 PM
Yeah, I guess it is just my male blindness, but I had no idea that romance period was an indicator in some fashion of misogyny.

I can certainly understand the complaint that women are often portrayed as not having a purpose other than romance. But I don't get the idea that a strong female lead who seems pretty laudable in every way is diminished in any way if she is *also* romantic in some otherwise appropriate fashion.
"If you think this has a happy ending, then you haven't been paying attention."

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The Brain

#346
January 05, 2017, 04:31:14 PM
I've always really enjoyed movies that don't have bolted on romance.
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

Razgovory

#347
January 05, 2017, 05:03:00 PM
Quote from: celedhring on January 05, 2017, 03:05:47 PM
Quote from: grumbler on January 05, 2017, 02:38:08 PM
Quote from: celedhring on January 05, 2017, 02:30:04 PM
Rogue One: the scene was added in reshoots so that's the reason the "romance" is just insinuated, it wasn't present in the shooting script. There's no grander plan behind it.

But there are people who saw this developing throughout the movie, and the whole movie was not reshot.  i don't think you can dismiss this as a figment of three or more peoples' imaginations.

Actually, I can. Kuleshov effect.

Plus I'm sure they may have added a moment here and there, even though I personally didn't notice anything developing. The whole movie wasn't reshot, but the beach scene wasn't the only thing they reshot either.

Damn you and your professional knowledge!
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

grumbler

#348
January 05, 2017, 05:10:37 PM
Quote from: The Brain on January 05, 2017, 04:31:14 PM
I've always really enjoyed movies that don't have bolted on romance.

Bolted-on romance, clearly added because someone was concerned that the movie or shoe might miss a buck if they didn't add some romance, sucks.  Well-done romance, especially romance that puts a heart at war with itself, can add an enormous amount of depth and tension to a story without taking much time.

You could have done A Fish Called Wanda without JLC and Cleese falling in love, but it wouldn't have been as fun.  OTOH, the "romance" bit of Midway was a total drag on the movie and ended up being meaningless.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

Eddie Teach

#349
January 05, 2017, 05:42:24 PM
Meri reminds me of the kid from The Princess Bride.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

merithyn

#350
January 05, 2017, 05:58:18 PM
Quote from: grumbler on January 05, 2017, 05:10:37 PM
Bolted-on romance, clearly added because someone was concerned that the movie or shoe might miss a buck if they didn't add some romance, sucks.  Well-done romance, especially romance that puts a heart at war with itself, can add an enormous amount of depth and tension to a story without taking much time.

You could have done A Fish Called Wanda without JLC and Cleese falling in love, but it wouldn't have been as fun.  OTOH, the "romance" bit of Midway was a total drag on the movie and ended up being meaningless.

This. 100 times this.

When the story calls for it because it makes the story better, then I enjoy seeing it. But when there's a romance just because there is a man and a woman in the movie, but it doesn't actually benefit the story at all, I don't see the point. I feel like it's lazy, just like celedhring says.

Quote from: Berkut on January 05, 2017, 04:30:32 PM
Yeah, I guess it is just my male blindness, but I had no idea that romance period was an indicator in some fashion of misogyny.

I can certainly understand the complaint that women are often portrayed as not having a purpose other than romance. But I don't get the idea that a strong female lead who seems pretty laudable in every way is diminished in any way if she is *also* romantic in some otherwise appropriate fashion.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that sometimes we just want to see a woman kick ass without having a man in the picture? I didn't call it misogyny. I said, "Sometimes I just want to see a woman kick ass without having any romantic interest, and I rarely get to see those." It's that simple. Really.
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

viper37

#351
January 05, 2017, 09:41:54 PM
Quote from: merithyn on January 05, 2017, 11:40:26 AM

Oh yeah! I was really surprised at what seems to be a total change in the direction of the ending compared to what the promos showed. It looks like they completely changed things around at the end. I wonder why.
test audience didn't react well to the ending, or studio marketing specialists simply didn't like it.
I don't do meditation.  I drink alcohol to relax, like normal people.

If Microsoft Excel decided to stop working overnight, the world would practically end.

11B4V

#352
January 05, 2017, 09:53:27 PM
Quote from: merithyn on January 05, 2017, 05:58:18 PM
Quote from: grumbler on January 05, 2017, 05:10:37 PM
Bolted-on romance, clearly added because someone was concerned that the movie or shoe might miss a buck if they didn't add some romance, sucks.  Well-done romance, especially romance that puts a heart at war with itself, can add an enormous amount of depth and tension to a story without taking much time.

You could have done A Fish Called Wanda without JLC and Cleese falling in love, but it wouldn't have been as fun.  OTOH, the "romance" bit of Midway was a total drag on the movie and ended up being meaningless.

This. 100 times this.

When the story calls for it because it makes the story better, then I enjoy seeing it. But when there's a romance just because there is a man and a woman in the movie, but it doesn't actually benefit the story at all, I don't see the point. I feel like it's lazy, just like celedhring says.

Quote from: Berkut on January 05, 2017, 04:30:32 PM
Yeah, I guess it is just my male blindness, but I had no idea that romance period was an indicator in some fashion of misogyny.

I can certainly understand the complaint that women are often portrayed as not having a purpose other than romance. But I don't get the idea that a strong female lead who seems pretty laudable in every way is diminished in any way if she is *also* romantic in some otherwise appropriate fashion.

Why is it so hard for you to understand that sometimes we just want to see a woman kick ass without having a man in the picture? I didn't call it misogyny. I said, "Sometimes I just want to see a woman kick ass without having any romantic interest, and I rarely get to see those." It's that simple. Really.

Surely, but JJ Abrams did it so poorly it was actually insulting.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

11B4V

#353
January 05, 2017, 10:00:46 PM
BTW, IMO the best female action lead was Sigorney Weaver in Alien & Aliens.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

Ed Anger

#354
January 05, 2017, 10:02:04 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on January 05, 2017, 10:00:46 PM
BTW, IMO the best female action lead was Sigorney Weaver in Alien & Aliens.

I liked the illegal chick with the maching gun.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

11B4V

#355
January 05, 2017, 10:06:59 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on January 05, 2017, 10:02:04 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on January 05, 2017, 10:00:46 PM
BTW, IMO the best female action lead was Sigorney Weaver in Alien & Aliens.

I liked the illegal chick with the maching gun.

Hip, but not a lead.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

Ed Anger

#356
January 05, 2017, 10:09:37 PM
SHE WAS A LEAD IN MY HEART
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

11B4V

#357
January 05, 2017, 10:10:43 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on January 05, 2017, 10:09:37 PM
SHE WAS A LEAD IN MY HEART

She was a dirty girl.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

Neil

#358
January 06, 2017, 12:19:00 AM
Quote from: merithyn on January 03, 2017, 10:59:56 PM
Show me an action movie where the main protagonist is a woman who isn't saved by a man and there isn't a love interest. I'll wait for your list of "hundreds".
Indeed.  Movies are so much better when people are unrelateable, sexless aliens.  See, for example, the Star Wars prequels.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

The Brain

#359
January 06, 2017, 03:23:04 AM
Who the fuck are you?
Women want me. Men want to be with me.
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