Staind singer stops concert to demand audience members stop ‘molesting’ teen

Started by jimmy olsen, June 03, 2014, 06:58:38 AM

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derspiess

"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Legbiter

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CountDeMoney

Quote from: derspiess on June 04, 2014, 08:24:15 AM
Now you did it :ph34r:

You need to come back and visit East Baltimore, and see what the Jerry Springer audiences are wearing for the summer line-up.  It's a tube top, not an innertube, lady:bleeding:

Legbiter

Quote from: derspiess on June 03, 2014, 02:01:23 PM:lol:  You went Full Meri. I sort of expected that.

Why do I have to lock my house and car. People should just not steal.  :mad:
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Valmy

Quote from: Legbiter on June 04, 2014, 08:59:19 AM
Quote from: derspiess on June 03, 2014, 02:01:23 PM:lol:  You went Full Meri. I sort of expected that.

Why do I have to lock my house and car. People should just not steal.  :mad:

No matter how many times I explain how this comparison completely fails it just keeps being made.  Just FYI: the Saudis use this exact same argument to justify all their woman-hating laws so consider the company you are keeping.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Legbiter

Quote from: Valmy on June 04, 2014, 09:02:15 AMNo matter how many times I explain how this comparison completely fails it just keeps being made.  Just FYI: the Saudis use this exact same argument to justify all their woman-hating laws so consider the company you are keeping.

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derspiess

Quote from: CountDeMoney on June 04, 2014, 08:49:56 AM
Quote from: derspiess on June 04, 2014, 08:24:15 AM
Now you did it :ph34r:

You need to come back and visit East Baltimore, and see what the Jerry Springer audiences are wearing for the summer line-up.  It's a tube top, not an innertube, lady:bleeding:

I went to Kings Island this weekend (including the water park area), so I'm up to speed on that :mellow:
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

merithyn

Quote from: frunk on June 04, 2014, 12:52:28 AM
Is the issue that there is a dress code, or that the dress code is poorly written?

The justification for the dress code.

I talked to my daughter about the dress code a few weeks ago. She walked up to me and said, "Do you think schools should have a dress code?"

I said, "Yes, because school is kind of like your job. There's a particular way that you are supposed to conduct yourself in certain places, and that includes dress and manners. Having a dress code helps teach you those manners and how best to conduct yourself. Why?"

She said, "Well your answer is better than Mr. Williams'." (Mr. Williams is the principal.) That's when I heard about the "distractions" justification. She said, "So, basically, the principal has said that it's my fault if a boy can't concentrate on his school work because I wore a shirt that's too tight, or a skirt that's too short. And that's bullsh-- er.. crap."

That's a problem.
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

derspiess

Yeah, that is a problem.  She shouldn't be using that language.  It's unladylike :angry:















:P
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

frunk

Quote from: Legbiter on June 04, 2014, 08:59:19 AM
Why do I have to lock my house and car. People should just not steal.  :mad:

Even assuming this is a reasonable equivalency, I don't see how it should make a significant difference.  I'd still expect the police to prosecute the thief, and the penalties should be just as harsh as if they broke into the house/car.  Theft is still theft. 

Malthus

Quote from: frunk on June 04, 2014, 10:01:23 AM
Quote from: Legbiter on June 04, 2014, 08:59:19 AM
Why do I have to lock my house and car. People should just not steal.  :mad:

Even assuming this is a reasonable equivalency, I don't see how it should make a significant difference.  I'd still expect the police to prosecute the thief, and the penalties should be just as harsh as if they broke into the house/car.  Theft is still theft.

I suspect both sides in this argument are all for punishing rapists.

I think the unstated assuption against the analogy is that, if only men were properly educated, they would not sexually assault women - that it is basically a cultural thing ("rape culture") that can be cured/prevented by changing the culture.

In contrast, those using the analogy are more of the view that rapists are bad people who like to rape, just as theives are bad people who like to steal, and that changing the culture isn't going to do anything to prevent them.

The difference here is that, for those who believe this is basically a cultural issue, imposing dress codes on women indirectly supports the very culture that encourages rape in the first place. For those who see rape as a crime akin to stealing, i.e. something everyone realizes is bad, but that some do anyway because they like to, dress codes and the like are merely sensible precautions, to avoid attracting attention from the bad guys.


The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane—Marcus Aurelius

jimmy olsen

Quote from: Ideologue on June 03, 2014, 11:03:53 PM
Meri, without discussing the details of any particular dress code, are there limits where a person of ordinary constitution is relieved of the responsibility of being one hundred percent in control of their thoughts, feelings, and inner life, as distinct from their actions, due to what other humans are or are not wearing?
No.
It is far better for the truth to tear my flesh to pieces, then for my soul to wander through darkness in eternal damnation.

Jet: So what kind of woman is she? What's Julia like?
Faye: Ordinary. The kind of beautiful, dangerous ordinary that you just can't leave alone.
Jet: I see.
Faye: Like an angel from the underworld. Or a devil from Paradise.
--------------------------------------------
1 Karma Chameleon point

The Brain

Quote from: jimmy olsen on June 04, 2014, 10:20:33 AM
Quote from: Ideologue on June 03, 2014, 11:03:53 PM
Meri, without discussing the details of any particular dress code, are there limits where a person of ordinary constitution is relieved of the responsibility of being one hundred percent in control of their thoughts, feelings, and inner life, as distinct from their actions, due to what other humans are or are not wearing?
No.

Correct. But why?
Women want me. Men want to be with me.

garbon

Quote from: frunk on June 04, 2014, 10:01:23 AM
Quote from: Legbiter on June 04, 2014, 08:59:19 AM
Why do I have to lock my house and car. People should just not steal.  :mad:

Even assuming this is a reasonable equivalency, I don't see how it should make a significant difference.  I'd still expect the police to prosecute the thief, and the penalties should be just as harsh as if they broke into the house/car.  Theft is still theft. 

QuoteThese girls say, "Well, I should be able to get drunk at a fraternity party and go upstairs to a guy's room without anything happening."  And I say, "Oh, really?  And when you drive your car into New York City, do you leave your keys on the hood?"  My point is that if your car is stolen after you do something like that, yes, the police should pursue the thief and he should be punished.  But at the same time, the police – and I – have the right to say to you, "You stupid idiot, what the hell were you thinking?"
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Legbiter

Quote from: frunk on June 04, 2014, 10:01:23 AMEven assuming this is a reasonable equivalency, I don't see how it should make a significant difference.  I'd still expect the police to prosecute the thief, and the penalties should be just as harsh as if they broke into the house/car.  Theft is still theft.

Nothing I disagree with here.

I find this notion that you can just wag a finger, go tut-tut and tell a rapist not to rape laughable. It's just such a delusional naive white American college chick burgeois way of seeing the world. Or it's a doctrinaire feminist's peevish, grudging rancor against men. Either way, it's stupid, it's a dangerous world out there and it's up to you to protect yourself. The lack of imagination for criminality amazes even me, and I live in a pretty docile place.

I guess I must have a very criminal mind.  :hmm:
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