[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[HVC]

I blame Sav.

It's freight, so will take a bit to hit yet, I think.

[Grey Fox]

How's the railroad strike going?

Not a strike.

CNs lock out is over and their trains are traveling again.

CPKC is still locked out.

[crazy canuck]

I blame Sav.

It's freight, so will take a bit to hit yet, I think.

Not just freight.  Some commuter rail is also affected.

How's the railroad strike going?

Not a strike.

CNs lock out is over and their trains are traveling again.

CPKC is still locked out.

The lockout was in response to an impending strike.

The Minister ordered the Labour dispute to end and the contracts to be resolved through arbitration.  The unions are refusing to follow the ministerial order and will likely be challenging the Ministerial Order in Federal Court on Monday.  The Unions will also likely go on strike on Monday.  In response the rail companies will likely seek a direction from the Canada Labour Board that the strike is illegal and commence contempt proceedings along with damage claims in the courts.

The unions are taking a big risk.

[viper37]

How's the railroad strike going?

What railroad strike?


In socialist Canuckistan, all workers are happily at work today serving their masters Government.

[viper37]

I blame Sav.

It's freight, so will take a bit to hit yet, I think.

Not just freight.  Some commuter rail is also affected.

How's the railroad strike going?

Not a strike.

CNs lock out is over and their trains are traveling again.

CPKC is still locked out.

The lockout was in response to an impending strike.

The Minister ordered the Labour dispute to end and the contracts to be resolved through arbitration.  The unions are refusing to follow the ministerial order and will likely be challenging the Ministerial Order in Federal Court on Monday.  The Unions will also likely go on strike on Monday.  In response the rail companies will likely seek a direction from the Canada Labour Board that the strike is illegal and commence contempt proceedings along with damage claims in the courts.

The unions are taking a big risk.

I read that the Teamster Union will comply with the Canada Labour Board and will seek to overturn this decision by addressing the Supreme Court.

[HVC]

How's the railroad strike going?

What railroad strike?


In socialist Canuckistan, all workers are happily at work today serving their masters Government.

I thought you'd be anti teamsters, given your distaste for mafia run labour unions

[crazy canuck]

I blame Sav.

It's freight, so will take a bit to hit yet, I think.

Not just freight.  Some commuter rail is also affected.

How's the railroad strike going?

Not a strike.

CNs lock out is over and their trains are traveling again.

CPKC is still locked out.

The lockout was in response to an impending strike.

The Minister ordered the Labour dispute to end and the contracts to be resolved through arbitration.  The unions are refusing to follow the ministerial order and will likely be challenging the Ministerial Order in Federal Court on Monday.  The Unions will also likely go on strike on Monday.  In response the rail companies will likely seek a direction from the Canada Labour Board that the strike is illegal and commence contempt proceedings along with damage claims in the courts.

The unions are taking a big risk.

I read that the Teamster Union will comply with the Canada Labour Board and will seek to overturn this decision by addressing the Supreme Court.

That happened after my post.  The unions wisely backed down and followed the CIRB order. 

[viper37]

How's the railroad strike going?

What railroad strike?


In socialist Canuckistan, all workers are happily at work today serving their masters Government.

I thought you'd be anti teamsters, given your distaste for mafia run labour unions

I am.

I do not trust them at all.

But the CN and CP do represent the Federal government and I can not trust them either.

I don't think any party is honest in their declaration.

They have wages between 150k-200k$/year.  It is expected that they have some compromises with their schedule to get that pay, compared to a regular truck driver who makes 75k$/year.

I understand they want better pay and better scheduling, but I scuff when I hear them say they are "exploited workers" and the NDP oppose all measures by the government to solve the dispute.

Security-wise, I suspect both CN and CP would like to cut corners though.

[Barrister]

So apparently BC United (the former BC Liberal party, although right-leaning) is suspending their campaign for this fall's election, urging supporters to support the BC Conservative Party.  BC United candidates nominations are being withdrawn, and some existing MLAs may now run under the BC Conservative banner.

https://globalnews.ca/news/10719653/kevin-falcon-fold-bc-united-party-suspend-campaign/

We've seen parties merge before, but never just voluntarily fold.

The closest I can think of is when Danielle Smith, then leader of the Wildrose Party, defected along with several of her MLAs to join the governing PCs.  But in that case several of the remaining Wildrose MLAs refused to go along with the plan, elected a new leader (Brian Jean), and in the subsequent election while the NDP won it was Wildrose, not the PCs, who were the main opposition party.  Danielle Smith's defection was seen not as some noble gesture to prevent an NDP victory, but as cynical politics.

[crazy canuck]

In fact we have seen parties voluntarily fold before.  And it happened in BC to effectively this same entity.  The Social Credit party folded and all its members went to the BC Liberals.  Now they are folding.  The rebranding was a terrible mistake.  BC Liberals had already started moving over to the BC Conservatives (and for those who don't block my posts you would have seen that I posted about that a while ago).  And so this is not a big surprise.   

[Barrister]

In fact we have seen parties voluntarily fold before.  And it happened in BC to effectively this same entity.  The Social Credit party folded and all its members went to the BC Liberals.  Now they are folding.  The rebranding was a terrible mistake.  BC Liberals had already started moving over to the BC Conservatives (and for those who don't block my posts you would have seen that I posted about that a while ago).  And so this is not a big surprise.   

I'm going to nit-pick - the BC SoCreds never folded.  They only existed in a purely nominal form for a number of years, and has been de-registered a couple of times, but it never disbanded.

It that way it mirrors the Alberta SoCreds.  They lost power in 1967, but they continued to exist 30-40 years later.  Ultimately they were taken over by pro-life activists and renamed the Pro-Life Party (or something like that), but the party itself, under it's new name, continues to exist.

There's just a tiny fringe of SoCred dead-enders out there for some odd reason.

[crazy canuck]

Yes, they existed as a registered entity.  If you stick with that technicality then then BC United has also not yet folded.

But you used the word folded in the sense that all its members are going over to a different party.

As I pointed out, that is not new in B.C. politics.  That is how the coalition against the NPD in this province has always functioned.  Going back to when the real B.C. Liberals came over to the Social Credit party in the 70s after the first NDP victory.

The membership just cares about defeating the NDP and that membership will go to whoever offers the best chance of accomplishing that goal.

[crazy canuck]

Getting more details now.  It is sounding more like a merger, the big decision now is what candidates are going to run in each riding.

[Oexmelin]

In 1968, the RIN, the left-leaning part of the Quebec independence movement, voted to fold, with its leadership suggesting they join, and get elected as, members of the PQ (hoping both to strengthen the independence movement, and to bring it further to the left).

[Barrister]

*puts political-legal nerd hat on*

The thing about a merger is it is a legal process.  I've been through it twice in my lifetime: the CA-PC merger, and the  Alberta Wildrose-PC merger.  Both were quite cumbersome procedures - you had to have formal votes of both parties in order to approve, there were steps to legally merge the party organizations (and the corresponding fundraising arms).  But the advantage of a formal merger is that it is FINAL - the predecessor party is gone, remains no more.

What BC United is doing reminds me much more of what Danielle Smith did in 2015 - quit, joined the PC Party, and urged her supporters to follow her.  To a lesser extent it also reminds me of the entire Reform to Canadian Alliance process - Reform brought on a small number of PC Party supporters and tried to act like it was a merger with the PCs.  In both of those cases though people did NOT follow, and fought on in the next election.

So every situation is different.  Perhaps people will follow Falcon (the BC United leader) to join the Conservatives.  Perhaps because Falcon remains as leader, and has merely "suspended" their campaign, that means the remaining BC United supporters will not be able to contest the election.  Or perhaps it leads to lawsuits, a new leader, and BC United fights on.