[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Valmy]

If you want to see the other end of the slippery slope of putting restrictions on abortion check out what laws our culture warriors are passing in Texas

I feel like at some point they will create a secret police that start throwing people in prison who don't entirely rule out having an abortion in future.

[crazy canuck]

I'm not so sure the conservatives out of Alberta wouldn't think that is ideal

[crazy canuck]

Your morning laugh

https://twitter.com/thebeaverton/status/1504920644810645512?s=21

[viper37]

Out of curiosity, how are you defining the word "socialist" in that sentence?

belief in the State as THE driving actor of the economy and the defining actor of social life over the individual choices.

That usually translates with heavy regulations & subsidies for political allies rather than collectivisation, nowadays, in occidental countries.  Marijuana, alcohol and lottery being the exception where the State usually prefers direct control.  Nationalization of a pipeline to help prevent a rebellion in the West was an exception to the aforementionned, a throwback to the 70s era of socialism.  And we know how well that turned.

Like, the childcare stuff.  It's a socialist idea.  And it lead to a shortage of places and people now insist it's a (I'd say God, but this is Quebec after all ) State given inaliable right to have a subsidized place in State childcare for every children, working parent or not.

[viper37]

Your morning laugh

https://twitter.com/thebeaverton/status/1504920644810645512?s=21

and people elect that kind of moron?  I thought Justin Trudeau was bad, but this...

[viper37]

If you want to see the other end of the slippery slope of putting restrictions on abortion check out what laws our culture warriors are passing in Texas

I feel like at some point they will create a secret police that start throwing people in prison who don't entirely rule out having an abortion in future.

That's why I voted for a political party promising strict seperation of State and Church and will continue opposing Federal politicians who promise to wage us a war on this

[viper37]

Saw a poll that was said to give the CPC "close to 10% lead" over the LPC.  But it was from February.

Anyway, looking at the polls today, it seems that nothing has really changed since last fall, except for one outlier poll.

I guess it means a few things:
- Liberal scaremongering does not work as well as it did, except for an already convinced audience
- Canadians do not believe the CPC was actively planning a coup with trucker's help.
- O'Toole wasn't as bad for the party as some hardline Conservatives wants us to think

[crazy canuck]

Polling numbers don't really tell us what is going on since the Conservative number is so heavily skewed by Alberta and Saskatchewan. https://338canada.com/ still has the Liberals at more than 80% to win a minority and a slight chance to win a majority.

[viper37]

I forgot to post the link to the proper page:
https://338canada.com/polls.htm

I'm looking at the series of polls since this January.  They're in the 28-31 range, with a 3.8% error margin.

Its not really moving.  Current events have had zero influence on the polling.

[crazy canuck]

That is because 50+ percent of voters in Alberta will support the Conservatives no matter what.

[Barrister]

I guess abortion is not a fully closed book in the Conservative Party yet. I'm looking forward to seeing how the different leadership candidates position themselves in relation to this petition and the issue.

I wish someday we could have a meaningful debate on abortion policy in this country.

In the article quoted there was one mention of reducing abortions to zero, but a greater portion about just reducing the number of abortions.  Which is I think a policy goal that should be widely popular across the spectrum (the devil is in the details, of course).

I've often said my ideals on abortion are the same as Bill Clinton - that abortion should be safe, legal, and rare.

Is there anyone out there who considers themselves "pro-abortion"?  That is that each abortion is something to celebrate?

But as soon as Conservatives say anything about abortion the Liberal attacks start painting the party as wanting to reduce women to a Handmaid's Tale-level of subjugation.  Which on one level fair enough, it seems to work.  But it just makes me very, very tired.

I know I've made this point before - when the SCC struck down Canada's existing abortion laws in the 1980s they certainly did not say that Canada could not pass any law on abortion.  The SCC even gave some guidance on what would or would not be permitted.  But because it was so politically controversial the Mulroney government of the day just punted.  We're one of the only countries that have no federal rules regarding abortion.  Instead it's up to the various medical boards across the country to regulate.

[HVC]

The safe legal and rare line confuses me. Are some women out there having abortions for fun? How does one go about reducing abortions without reducing access? Only thing I can think of is greater access to education and contraceptives, which most conservatives I know would loath to do.

[Barrister]

If you want to see the other end of the slippery slope of putting restrictions on abortion check out what laws our culture warriors are passing in Texas

I feel like at some point they will create a secret police that start throwing people in prison who don't entirely rule out having an abortion in future.

Yes, if you put even the slightest restrictions on abortion, you'll soon have the abortion secret police out to get you.

The US has several restrictions on abortion that are generally pretty popular.  Most US states have a limit on how many weeks into the pregnancy you can be.  There are limits on "partial birth abortions".  None of those restrictions exist in Canada.

[Barrister]

The safe legal and rare line confuses me. Are some women out there having abortions for fun? How does one go about reducing abortions without reducing access? Only thing I can think of is greater access to education and contraceptives, which most conservatives I know would loath to do.

I haven't heard any Canadian conservatives trying to ban access to contraceptives.

Would it be such a bad thing to ban abortion after 28 weeks, which was the old US Roe v Wade system?  Yes it's a restriction of access, but a fairly minimal one considering the fact you have 6 months in which to get an abortion.

[Valmy]

If you want to see the other end of the slippery slope of putting restrictions on abortion check out what laws our culture warriors are passing in Texas

I feel like at some point they will create a secret police that start throwing people in prison who don't entirely rule out having an abortion in future.

Yes, if you put even the slightest restrictions on abortion, you'll soon have the abortion secret police out to get you.

The US has several restrictions on abortion that are generally pretty popular.  Most US states have a limit on how many weeks into the pregnancy you can be.  There are limits on "partial birth abortions".  None of those restrictions exist in Canada.

That was a joke BB but it is based not on the concept of regulating abortions but on the toxic mix of culture war rhetoric injected in this issue. The bounty system for example. We have to keep upping the ante and use this as a method of harassing the evil enemies.