Wall Street protesters: We're in for the long haul

[crazy canuck]

I don't think anything about anyone else can be extrapolated from Grallon.

You are probably correct.

[Martinus]

I feel sure the aristocrats in Versailles sneered down at the crowds who took the Bastille

I doubt it - not unless they had a very strong telescope.

What is it about wannabe radicals and inability to grasp basic geography?

I think chronology too. I may be wrong but I think the royal court moved back to Louvre (in response to popular demand) before they stormed the Bastille.

[Sheilbh]

I think chronology too. I may be wrong but I think the royal court moved back to Louvre (in response to popular demand) before they stormed the Bastille.

I think G's right.  Fairly sure the Bastille fell before the fishwives dragged the court to Paris.

[Grallon]

Coming from a guy who grudgingly gives to charity.  You are a good example of what is wrong with your generation.  Feeling entitled and bitter and not willing to do a thing constructive about it.

I'm saving my constructive energies for when the blood starts flowing.





G.

[Jacob]

I'm saving my constructive energies for when the blood starts flowing.

Killing and tearing down the social order is, by definition, not constructive.

[KRonn]

the problem is that even those who aren't elite have it to good to rock the boat. Do you see the millions of office works throwing off the shackles of oppression?

  You don't hear them groan already?!

I am one such, beset with terrible, mindless - near sighted - obsessed with-short-term-profits management.  I witness *daily* the fruits of my work diverted into countless layers of useless middlemen.

Allow me to enlighten you then. 

I am one of a team of 18 servicing a specific site.  Out of this group - 12 are managers - of one thing or another - and 6 are actual workers - or doers.  In other words those who bring in the fucking *doe*.  I am one of the six who provides the actual service the client pays for - and the other 12 'manages' us - and get paid substantially more than *we* are - for doing so.  And when I say 'manage' - I mean useless reports - or metrics - on all aspects of what we do - whether it's demanded or not.  But whether it's demanded or not you can bet your life on that it's billed - and that *we* - the 6 doers - never see a dime on it.  It all goes to feed the 12 leeches above us.

So don't you dare come prattling on about the multitudes 'throwing off the shackles of oppression' with a sneering smile.

G.

If it is as you say then that sure sounds pretty messed up, bad management, waste of money - so much management for so few workers. Don't those managers have other tasks that do benefit the company financially? Do some of them work with customers, do billable work?

[Habbaku]

Coming from a guy who grudgingly gives to charity.  You are a good example of what is wrong with your generation.  Feeling entitled and bitter and not willing to do a thing constructive about it.

Isn't Grallon your generation?

[crazy canuck]

Coming from a guy who grudgingly gives to charity.  You are a good example of what is wrong with your generation.  Feeling entitled and bitter and not willing to do a thing constructive about it.

Isn't Grallon your generation?

I dont think so.  I thought he was closer to your age then mine. dont know for sure though.  He sure acts like he belongs to yours.

[garbon]

I thought he was in his 40s.

[Barrister]

I thought he was in his 40s.

Think so.

[crazy canuck]

Ok, closer to my generation and we have to take the blame.

[AnchorClanker]

My dad in a nutshell - He kinda likes Cain for some reason, and is just about ready to take leave to go participate in the NYC protests.   

It would make perfect sense in his world.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

Here's an example fo what Grallon was talking about...FF to about the 50 second mark if necessary.



http://youtu.be/2PiXDTK_CBY

would have been more impressive if they actually stormed the building... pfft, disappointing.

[Grallon]

If it is as you say then that sure sounds pretty messed up, bad management, waste of money - so much management for so few workers. Don't those managers have other tasks that do benefit the company financially? Do some of them work with customers, do billable work?

Most are project managers since projects are billed separately to the client and are more lucrative than standard operations.  One mostly sits on meetings and takes notes then relay them to the others.  Another does the same thing - they're the back up of each other. Then there's the 'delivery manager' who's responsible to deliver the services we provide - which far too often means that he disrupts normal operations by hoping and jumping whenever the client has a whim and flagging this or that as urgent. 

My closest colleague took the job of technical lead which I turned down and is now constantly prevented from concentrating on his job because the 'delivery manager' is constantly asking him to produce reports on what he's trying to do...   

Incidentally that is precisely why I turned it down - that and having to be on call.

We've been telling them we need more people in the field but they don't have a budget - yet they have a budget to pay all these useless mouths who hamper more than they help.

Anyhow.  For having contacts with people in other organizations I know it's exactly the same elsewhere - wherever IT is outsourced in fact.  As I said the salary attached to my current position has been devalued by 30k in the last 10 years - where do you think this money went?  To pay for the superfluous layers of management, and increase the profit margin of the account of course - so that the managers can get *their* yearly bonuses while we are told there won't be any raises or bonuses... 

So what my previous interventions boil down to is this: greed runs rampant everywhere and it must be brought under control because it's unsustainable.  This is what these people in New-York, in Spain, in Greece, etc are protesting against.




G.

[Grallon]

Ok, closer to my generation and we have to take the blame.

I'm 44 - older than you I think.




G.