Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Josquius]

The once principled british working man;

[FunkMonk]

Markets aren't liking this one bit.

[Sheilbh]

No they just elect different representatives, maybe non-white non-men in the next election. How does representative government mean something is set in stone forever? I mean it seems that way with the US Constitution but you know

You wanted examples of dramatic constitutional change decided by representatives so I provided some. Seems rather poor sporting to then say 'but that was then!' I mean what chance does that give me?

I didn't want examples. My point is that power lies with the people and we will always find the practices of the past insufficient, so we shouldn't deify the acts of the last generations representatives. The franchise will be too narrow; the corruption will be too deep; the bigotry will be motivating the votes. So, those constitutional decisions are open to be decided by the people which is where power comes from.

If they somehow seized 2/3rds control of the House and 38 State legislatures then yeah. Clearly they have pretty overwhelming public support to do that.

I disagree. I think elections are about economic policy, social policy, how you feel about the government and the direction of the country. They are not a sufficient mandate for big constitutional change like leaving the EU.

John Curtice: for every area that remain are doing better than we'd expect, there are two or three areas that leave are doing better than we'd expect.

[Ed Anger]

I just took a gander at the U.S. stocks after hours numbers.

I puked.

[OttoVonBismarck]

Tomorrow will be a "buy" day, for sure.

[Sheilbh]

Markets aren't liking this one bit.

Understandably.

Generally I think there'll be a short-term dip for the UK but it won't have huge effect on long-term growth (against the Treasury's projections).

[mongers]

OK, I need to plan for a couple hours of shut-eye before the events(carnage) of this coming morning.

What about 6-8 am ?

[Josquius]

Wonder how low the pound will go. Should I send my money home tomorrow or wait?
Should I even send it home at all? Given how reliant the uk economy is on the eu.... if we just pull the wires out that will be horrific.

[Admiral Yi]

I just took a gander at the U.S. stocks after hours numbers.

I puked.

What are you looking at?  I got to this via google and things look OK.

http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/stockresearch/screener/afterhours

[Valmy]

I didn't want examples. My point is that power lies with the people and we will always find the practices of the past insufficient, so we shouldn't deify the acts of the last generations representatives.

I am not talking about practices I am talking about the very ideology our entire systems of government are based on.

The franchise will be too narrow; the corruption will be too deep; the bigotry will be motivating the votes. So, those constitutional decisions are open to be decided by the people which is where power comes from.

Exactly. Your entire position is that representative government does not work. Because no plebiscite has ever been rigged? So therefore we assume they are pure and superior?

I disagree. I think elections are about economic policy, social policy, how you feel about the government and the direction of the country. They are not a sufficient mandate for big constitutional change like leaving the EU.

Well the Constitution of Texas would definitely agree with you. We vote on EVERY SINGLE Constitutional change. It is a complete farce IMO. Every constitutional amendment is laced with nonsense language to appeal to the average yokel. Big Constitutional changes should not be based on populist promises of 10,000 unicorns for all. That is how you get dysfunctional governments and why we all decided on representative governments to begin with Sheilbh.

[Fireblade]

I can't wait for the butthurt when PM Farage expels all the Poles, eliminates the dole, and makes all the chavs get jobs for the first time in their lives.

[Ed Anger]

I just took a gander at the U.S. stocks after hours numbers.

I puked.

What are you looking at?  I got to this via google and things look OK.

http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/stockresearch/screener/afterhours

http://money.cnn.com/data/afterhours/

[Grey Fox]

Markets aren't liking this one bit.

Markets algorythms fear change.

[Sheilbh]

Exactly. Your entire position is that representative government does not work. Because no plebiscite has ever been rigged? So therefore we assume they are pure and superior?

It works at government. It shouldn't be able to dictate the terms of government for future generations.

For example, the Scottish people - and only them - have a right to self-determination. It isn't for their MSPs to decide to leave just because the SNP win a majority.

Well the Constitution of Texas would definitely agree with you. We vote on EVERY SINGLE Constitutional change. It is a complete farce IMO. Big Constitutional changes should not be based on populist promises of 10,000 unicorns for all. That is how you get dysfunctional governments and why we all decided on representative governments to begin with Sheilbh.

When we have a written one I'll worry about that. As I say the referendums we've had over the last 40 years seem to me to be sensible: devolution, voting system and Europe.

Edit: Anyway I've always really disliked the anti-mob/democracy attitudes of the US founders

[Agelastus]

Oh God, shut up Farage...