Gay Marriage Upheld by USSC in Close Ruling

[Caliga]

I get convinced more and more that your system is similar to that of the Commonwealth of Poland and Lithuania at its heyday. What puzzles me is that, generally, as a country you are relatively succesful.

I don't know shit about Poland-Lithuania's government but the problem here is legal 'lagtime' and the difficulty of changing the Constitution as well as state constitutions (though that varies from state to state, as you might expect).  At one point in time every county in Kentucky did have a jail, but given how much more efficient transportation is nowadays, it's no longer necessary or cost efficient.

Sometimes the Spencer County jailer is asked to transport prisoners to jails in neighboring counties, but crime is so low there's no way that's a 40 hour a week job, or even 4 hour to be honest.

[Caliga]

Awesome.  Did he get the position?

No, he lost by around 300 votes.  We instead chose another random dude to sit around and collect a paycheck for doing almost nothing.

Jonathan (the lawn guy) is a county sheriff's deputy now though.

[Martinus]

Awesome.  Did he get the position?

No, he lost by around 300 votes.  We instead chose another random dude to sit around and collect a paycheck for doing almost nothing.

Jonathan (the lawn guy) is a county sheriff's deputy now though.

Am I right in getting a Jason Stackhouse from True Blood vibe from this guy?

[Eddie Teach]

Am I wrong in not getting a True Blood viewer vibe from Cal? 

[Valmy]

I get convinced more and more that your system is similar to that of the Commonwealth of Poland and Lithuania at its heyday. What puzzles me is that, generally, as a country you are relatively succesful.

I don't know shit about Poland-Lithuania's government but the problem here is legal 'lagtime' and the difficulty of changing the Constitution as well as state constitutions (though that varies from state to state, as you might expect).  At one point in time every county in Kentucky did have a jail, but given how much more efficient transportation is nowadays, it's no longer necessary or cost efficient.

Sometimes the Spencer County jailer is asked to transport prisoners to jails in neighboring counties, but crime is so low there's no way that's a 40 hour a week job, or even 4 hour to be honest.

It is very difficult to do common-sense reality based reforms of our Constitutional system. This is because it is very politically dangerous. That is why Texas still has the interim Constitution drawn up during Reconstruction in the 1870s. We have tried to have a few Constitutional Conventions since then to reform the madness but everybody always shows up with axes to grind and interests to advance rather than to make a good Constitution for Texas. So they have always broken up in politically embarrassing shit shows. So, as a result, it is just easier to have stupid antiquated 19th century shit weighing down state government.

It is just shows how miraculous the Constitutional convention of 1787 was. It could never be repeated.

[Caliga]

Am I wrong in not getting a True Blood viewer vibe from Cal? 

[Syt]

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/04/us/kim-davis-same-sex-marriage.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur

Kim Davis Ordered Jailed in Kentucky Gay Marriage Dispute

ASHLAND, Ky. — A federal judge here on Thursday ordered a Kentucky clerk jailed for contempt of court because of her refusal to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples.

The clerk, Kim Davis of Rowan County, was ordered incarcerated after a hearing here before Judge David L. Bunning of Federal District Court. The contempt finding was another legal defeat for Ms. Davis, who has argued that she should not be forced to issue licenses that conflict with her religious beliefs.

"The court cannot condone the willful disobedience of its lawfully issued order," Judge Bunning said. "If you give people the opportunity to choose which orders they follow, that's what potentially causes problems."

Judge Bunning said Ms. Davis would be released once she agreed to comply with his order and issue the marriage licenses.

On Monday, the Supreme Court turned down Ms. Davis's appeal of an Aug. 12 ruling by Judge Bunning directing her to issue marriage licenses. The justices' decision was expected to clear the way for same-sex marriages in Rowan County. But on Tuesday, the clerk and her employees again refused to issue licenses in Morehead, the seat of Rowan County.

Within hours lawyers for the couples who had initially sued Ms. Davis asked Judge Bunning to hold her in contempt. "Because Davis cannot show either that she is unable to comply with the Aug. 12, 2015, order or that she has taken all reasonable steps to comply," the lawyers wrote, "this court is left with no choice but to hold her in contempt."

The lawyers, who argued that Ms. Davis "continues to collect compensation from the Commonwealth for duties she fails to perform," asked Judge Bunning to fine the clerk, but not to jail her.

On Wednesday, when Ms. Davis again turned down a gay couple's request for a license, the clerk's lawyers argued that she should not be held in contempt, in part because it would breach her right to due process. They asked Judge Bunning to grant an injunction pending another appeal.

Ms. Davis has said little amid her legal battle, but in a statement her lawyers released on Tuesday, she said she would not change her position.

"I never imagined a day like this would come, where I would be asked to violate a central teaching of Scripture and of Jesus himself regarding marriage," she said in the statement. "To issue a marriage license which conflicts with God's definition of marriage, with my name affixed to the certificate, would violate my conscience. It is not a light issue for me. It is a heaven or hell decision."

Supporters and opponents of Ms. Davis gathered outside the federal courthouse here hours before she was due to appear. One man waved a rainbow flag — a symbol of the gay rights movement — while another clutched a flag that said, "Liberty."

"We're supporters of the rule of the law," said David Wills, a computer programmer from West Virginia who was first in line and said he had arrived at 4 a.m. for a hearing scheduled to begin seven hours later. "It's just really important to me that people be treated equally, fairly."

Ms. Davis's supporters, prepared with an ice chest filled with water, also gathered ahead of a hearing they called critical to protecting religious liberty in Kentucky and elsewhere.

"They're taking rights away from Christians," Danny Kinder, a 73-year-old retiree from Morehead, said of the courts. "They've overstepped their bounds."

He declined to predict the outcome of Thursday's hearing and what would happen to Ms. Davis.

"I've been praying about it, and we just have to turn it over to the Lord," he said. "She has got to stand for what she believes, and I have to stand for what I believe, and I'm behind her 100 percent."

[Valmy]

Once the tyrants have removed the right to stop gays from being married what next?

[Syt]

It always sucks when the right to discriminate is taken away.

[viper37]

It is just shows how miraculous the Constitutional convention of 1787 was. It could never be repeated.

if you exclude black, indians and women from participating in the works, it will be significantly easier, just like 1787

[Caliga]

So she'll go to jail, and still refuse to comply... and then what?

My wife's cousin is in the National Guard and it would be funny if he was deployed to Rowan County, especially since he's a narrow-minded bigot himself and I'm sure he supports what this crackpot is doing.

[Valmy]

It is just shows how miraculous the Constitutional convention of 1787 was. It could never be repeated.

if you exclude black, indians and women from participating in the works, it will be significantly easier, just like 1787

Um have you looked at what nutters white guys in this country are today? The blacks, Native Americans, and women are the only thing preventing another ACW.

[The Brain]

... Judge Bunning said."If you give people the opportunity to choose which orders they follow, that's what potentially causes problems."

Uh-oh, the Nuremberg cases just imploded.

[Martinus]

... Judge Bunning said."If you give people the opportunity to choose which orders they follow, that's what potentially causes problems."

Uh-oh, the Nuremberg cases just imploded.

[DGuller]

So she'll go to jail, and still refuse to comply... and then what?

My wife's cousin is in the National Guard and it would be funny if he was deployed to Rowan County, especially since he's a narrow-minded bigot himself and I'm sure he supports what this crackpot is doing.

What will happen if he refuses to carry out his orders against this crackpot?  Can his officer execute him for insubordination?