BREAKING NEWS - Malaysian airliner crashes on Russian-Ukrainian border

[grumbler]

I thought the US did pretty much immediately acknowledge it had shot down a civilian plane.  What am I missing, Raz?

  Its Raz and his whole creepy stalker routine.  Just move on.

[mongers]

I thought the US did pretty much immediately acknowledge it had shot down a civilian plane.  What am I missing, Raz?

  Its Raz and his whole creepy stalker routine.  Just move on.

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

[derspiess]

I thought the US did pretty much immediately acknowledge it had shot down a civilian plane.  What am I missing, Raz?

It took 8 years to compensate the victims, I don't think there ever was an admission of wrong doing.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2014/07/17/when-airliners-get-shot-down-facts-get-skewed-quickly/

One obvious example involves the United States. On July 3, 1988, a helicopter from the USS Vincennes, a guided missile cruiser, came under fire from Iranian gunboats while over the Persian Gulf. Seeing an aircraft speeding their way, the ship's crew opened fire with two surface-to-air missiles — and brought down a commercial jet, Iran Air Flight 655, carrying 290 people. Navy officials said the Vincennes crew thought it was an Iranian fighter jet, and a threat to their safety.

As outlined in The Washington Post the next day, the Pentagon at first denied Iranian accusations that the Navy had shot down an airliner. Within hours, however, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs at the time, Adm. William J. Crowe Jr., said the United States had confirmed the incident.

Even then, Crowe moved quickly to to back the skipper of the ship, Capt. William C. Rogers III.  He said the Airbus had flown four miles west of the usual commercial airline route, that the pilot ignored repeated radio warnings from the Vincennes to change course, and that its altitude was decreasing as it got closer. U.S. officials also said repeatedly the ship was in international waters, which would put the Iranians in the wrong for opening fire on the ship in the first place.

Few of those details turned out to be true. The Vincennes and helicopter were actually in Iranian waters and airspace, subsequent investigations found. ABC News, among others, later reported that the plane actually was flying where it should have been and had already turned away from the Vincennes when it was shot down. U.S. officials also said the helicopter that came under fire was checking on a vessel that had issued a distress call, but later investigations show the ship did not exist.

I'm just going by what he said.  The US did immediately acknowledge what it did.  Read into it whatever you choose, but he was factually correct.

[Razgovory]

Well except for initial denial, that is true.

[grumbler]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

  No, just an observation.  There is no "ball" of which I am aware.  I made a factually correct statement and drew a reasonable conclusion based on the evidence, and Raz attempted to argue that my age was somehow related to an airliner shootdown in 1988 and that i was creating an interpretation of events.  Why don't you ask him your question?  Double standards much?

[mongers]

,,,,,,

I'm just going by what he said.  The US did immediately acknowledge what it did.  Read into it whatever you choose, but he was factually correct.

I think in part that would be because the US is an organized government with a chain of command; these rebels less resemble that, than a bunch of nationalist idiots.

[crazy canuck]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

[garbon]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

Play with men or play with balls?

[derspiess]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

Play with men or play with balls?

Whatever feels natural.

[garbon]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

Play with men or play with balls?

Whatever feels natural.

Both?

[crazy canuck]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

Play with men or play with balls?

Why do you limit yourself, you are not particularly concerned about defence.

[mongers]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

Yes, I need to get with it and adopt those tactics; it's as if I haven't learnt anything from Languish. 

[crazy canuck]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

Yes, I need to get with it and adopt those tactics; it's as if I haven't learnt anything from Languish. 

[garbon]

Would this be a case of you playing the man, rather than the ball?

Just a note about proper defence.  You should always play the man not the ball.    

Play with men or play with balls?

Why do you limit yourself, you are not particularly concerned about defence.

Are you joking? Defense is pretty important.

[Razgovory]

Some US officials are going over to Ukraine to investigate.  FBI and NTSB types.  Does anyone have a problem with that?