If so, what did you think?
Herman Cain is being taken down. When Michelle Bachman says your plan is unscientific and badly thought through then you know you are in trouble.
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 12:47:17 AM
If so, what did you think?
They range from unpalatable to utterly ridiculous, and I say that as the sort of person who is a) politically fairly undogmatic and b) typically tries to look for the good qualities in people.
Herman Cain was never gonna be the guy. And his plan of balancing the budget by raising taxes on the poor and lowering them on the upper middle class is idiotic.
hmm.. with the Batshit Gallery flaming each other and themselves at every opportunity and nobody going for the Science and Reality Candidacy of Huntsman is it going to be
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fvcardona90.edublogs.org%2Ffiles%2F2008%2F03%2Fbaseball-mitt.jpg&hash=4936d5cdb908b60f5c539e6e08bc412f691eabb6) vs. (https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F10000birds.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2007%2F12%2Fnewt.jpg&hash=8db48c2f22648f5503cafd5a3cca2d939d0077db) ?
What amazes me most, I think, is that Ron Paul's supporters continue to believe he is electable.
I don't think Newt has much of a chance. I'm a bit worried that Perry will rebound and pick up the anti-Romney faction.
Quote from: Viking on October 19, 2011, 01:30:51 AM
Herman Cain is being taken down. When Michelle Bachman says your plan is unscientific and badly thought through then you know you are in trouble.
Michelle Bachman wouldn't know science if it bit her in the ass. Still his plan is the sort of catchy nonsense you'd expect from a guy in business.
Quote from: fahdiz on October 19, 2011, 01:59:25 AM
What amazes me most, I think, is that Ron Paul's supporters continue to believe he is electable.
That's hardly the most ridiculous thing Ron Paul's supporters believe.
Saw an interview with Herman Cain. Remove bank regulation, get rid of the FDIC. :frusty:
Quote from: Gups on October 19, 2011, 03:29:55 AM
Quote from: fahdiz on October 19, 2011, 01:59:25 AM
What amazes me most, I think, is that Ron Paul's supporters continue to believe he is electable.
That's hardly the most ridiculous thing Ron Paul's supporters believe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37F5yTfLgcA&feature=related
Is this real official Ron Paul channel? With links to Alex Jones and other conspiracy bullshit?
No, I have a life.
I made the mistake of following the election in 2007 and I will not make the same mistake again. No looking at election crap until it is a few weeks before I am voting on something. Total waste of time.
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 08:29:45 AM
I made the mistake of following the election in 2007 and I will not make the same mistake again. No looking at election crap until it is a few weeks before I am voting on something. Total waste of time.
Smart lad.
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 08:29:45 AM
I made the mistake of following the election in 2007 and I will not make the same mistake again. No looking at election crap until it is a few weeks before I am voting on something. Total waste of time.
:yes: It doesn't hurt that Republicans are in a full blown retard mode, which makes their debates easier to not bother with.
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 09:09:48 AM
:yes: It doesn't hurt that Republicans are in a full blown retard mode, which makes their debates easier to not bother with.
So basically, let them be completely ridiculous for the next however many months. Then a month or so before the election start paying attention and - in your case - vote Democrat anyways and - in Ed Anger's case - vote Republican as usual?
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 10:56:23 AM
So basically, let them be completely ridiculous for the next however many months. Then a month or so before the election start paying attention and - in your case - vote Democrat anyways and - in Ed Anger's case - vote Republican as usual?
Well what do you want me to do about it Jake?
My stance is to wait until near when the primary elections occur. If I pay too much attention before that...I'm liable to not end up voting. :blush:
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 10:56:23 AM
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 09:09:48 AM
:yes: It doesn't hurt that Republicans are in a full blown retard mode, which makes their debates easier to not bother with.
So basically, let them be completely ridiculous for the next however many months. Then a month or so before the election start paying attention and - in your case - vote Democrat anyways and - in Ed Anger's case - vote Republican as usual?
:yes: Jacob has a pretty good handle on American politics, here.
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 10:58:20 AMWell what do you want me to do about it Jake?
Whatever you think you need to do. I wasn't implying anything with my question.
I'm just curious because I derive some enjoyment from Languish discussion of presidential campaigns (including the nominations), much as I derive enjoyment from Languish discussions of the NFL.
I missed last night's debate but I've been paying some attention to the candidates. Romney has done very well, pretty polished on his debating, and he's been sharp off the cuff.
Perry I thought would be a contender but I've soured on him. He doesn't seem to have much in the way of deep seated ideas.
Cain I like to an extent. I like his 9-9-9 plan in that it removes many other taxes and adds a Fed sales tax. I'm not saying I strongly endorse that idea but it has some good points in freeing up the massive tax code. I don't think it will fly though, and I don't think Cain has much in the way of economic talent in his campaign. Also, I don't like that Cain makes jokes about not being up on foreign policy. Don't need another rookie in there.
I don't know enough about Huntsman to say, or Santorum, but I'd like one of these guys to show some strong running, maybe provide an alternative to Romney.
Bachman is out, a non-player. She just doesn't have the ability for President, and she does herself in too often with dumb/wrong statements. You'd think that after all her time in Congress that she'd be more on the ball. Too right wing anyway for me.
Gingrich seems one of the smarter candidates. He has a lot of facts and ideas, and I love hearing him tear some issue apart, looking at it from outside the box, with some ideas on fixing. But I don't think he's gaining much traction.
So, I think that Cain will be on the way down, after rocketing to the top as another flavor of the month. Romney keeps on the same, but not gaining either. But I haven't seen any of the others break out from the pack either.
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 11:23:44 AM
Perry I thought would be a contender but I've soured on him. He doesn't seem to have much in the way of deep seated ideas.
See Jake? Why do I bother. KRonn says it only seems like Perry has no ideas after all I have said about his track record as Governor. Clearly me talking about politics is a waste of time.
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 11:08:24 AM
Whatever you think you need to do.
Sorry when you said 'let them be ridiculous' I thought you were somehow saying they were only being ridiculous because we were not stopping them from being so.
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 11:23:44 AM
I don't think it will fly though, and I don't think Cain has much in the way of economic talent in his campaign.
His 9-9-9 plan was devised by a CPA from Ohio.
Oh, and he has Art Laffer on his "secret economics team".
:lmfao:
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 11:35:01 AM
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 11:08:24 AM
Whatever you think you need to do.
Sorry when you said 'let them be ridiculous' I thought you were somehow saying they were only being ridiculous because we were not stopping them from being so.
Valmy - it's Jacob. He can not help himself from sounding snide and condescending, even when he doesn't mean it that way. :)
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 10:56:23 AM
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 09:09:48 AM
:yes: It doesn't hurt that Republicans are in a full blown retard mode, which makes their debates easier to not bother with.
So basically, let them be completely ridiculous for the next however many months. Then a month or so before the election start paying attention and - in your case - vote Democrat anyways and - in Ed Anger's case - vote Republican as usual?
It's going to end up Obama vs. Romney. Not much difference between how they'll govern no matter what they tell their partisans.
Quote from: Barrister on October 19, 2011, 11:43:10 AMValmy - it's Jacob. He can not help himself from sounding snide and condescending, even when he doesn't mean it that way. :)
Exactly :hug:
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 06:18:05 AM
Saw an interview with Herman Cain. Remove bank regulation, get rid of the FDIC. :frusty:
A year ago, the just-minted econ "Nobel" winner Thomas Sargent gave an unintentionally hilarious interview published by the Minneapolis fed. When asked to come up with any examples of contributions that macro-economic theory had made to understanding financial crises, the two examples he could think of were a model demonstrating the benefits of deposit insurance and a Chicago School research concerning narrow banking. Given that Sargent is one of the doyens of the conservative rational expectations school, its hard to understate the degree to which significant swaths of the GOP (Cain, Paul, Bachman at least) are way out of the mainstrream on these issues.
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 10:56:23 AM
So basically, let them be completely ridiculous for the next however many months. Then a month or so before the election start paying attention and - in your case - vote Democrat anyways and - in Ed Anger's case - vote Republican as usual?
You're making it sound like my vote is a foregone conclusion. Believe it or not, I am actually planning to consider my choice between Democrats and Republicans very carefully before I will make my decision to vote for a Democrat.
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 12:52:33 PMYou're making it sound like my vote is a foregone conclusion. Believe it or not, I am actually planning to consider my choice between Democrats and Republicans very carefully before I will make my decision to vote for a Democrat.
Oh, I know that you're going to make a rational decision based on considering the merits of each of the candidates. No doubt.
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 01:06:33 PM
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 12:52:33 PMYou're making it sound like my vote is a foregone conclusion. Believe it or not, I am actually planning to consider my choice between Democrats and Republicans very carefully before I will make my decision to vote for a Democrat.
Oh, I know that you're going to make a rational decision based on considering the merits of each of the candidates. No doubt.
Yeah, but that means he'll end up voting for Obama.
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 11:26:49 AM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 11:23:44 AM
Perry I thought would be a contender but I've soured on him. He doesn't seem to have much in the way of deep seated ideas.
See Jake? Why do I bother. KRonn says it only seems like Perry has no ideas after all I have said about his track record as Governor. Clearly me talking about politics is a waste of time.
Maybe Perry will do better if he runs again in four years. He may just not be ready for prime time. Just like Romney seems to have upped his game quite a bit wit all the practice he's had.
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 01:06:33 PM
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 12:52:33 PMYou're making it sound like my vote is a foregone conclusion. Believe it or not, I am actually planning to consider my choice between Democrats and Republicans very carefully before I will make my decision to vote for a Democrat.
Oh, I know that you're going to make a rational decision based on considering the merits of each of the candidates. No doubt.
You sometimes sound too British to be British.
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on October 19, 2011, 01:56:29 PM
You sometimes sound too British to be British.
Not surprising, since I'm not British.
Wait, was Jacob sarcastic in that latest reply to me? :unsure:
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
So that means he's party crazy part angry?
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:15:58 PM
Maybe Perry will do better if he runs again in four years. He may just not be ready for prime time. Just like Romney seems to have upped his game quite a bit wit all the practice he's had.
If corrupt incompetents with no leadership abilities is what you think this country needs go ahead and hope for that.
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 02:26:04 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:15:58 PM
Maybe Perry will do better if he runs again in four years. He may just not be ready for prime time. Just like Romney seems to have upped his game quite a bit wit all the practice he's had.
If corrupt incompetents with no leadership abilities is what you think this country needs go ahead and hope for that.
We have another option?
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 10:56:23 AM
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 09:09:48 AM
:yes: It doesn't hurt that Republicans are in a full blown retard mode, which makes their debates easier to not bother with.
So basically, let them be completely ridiculous for the next however many months. Then a month or so before the election start paying attention and - in your case - vote Democrat anyways and - in Ed Anger's case - vote Republican as usual?
Actually, I doubt I'm going to vote republican this year. Or even vote at all.
I've soured a bit on Perry. I can't point to one individual thing that did it-- probably a little bit of everything.
Gott Mit Mitt :mellow:
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 19, 2011, 03:46:05 PMActually, I doubt I'm going to vote republican this year. Or even vote at all.
I'll be interested in seeing how that holds up once the time comes (you know, if you tell us).
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 04:54:16 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 19, 2011, 03:46:05 PMActually, I doubt I'm going to vote republican this year. Or even vote at all.
I'll be interested in seeing how that holds up once the time comes (you know, if you tell us).
It'll hold up.
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
I like Ron Paul for bravely representing the 19th century. The man's a mental, but there's a charm to that. He reminds me of a Republican, right-wing Tony Benn figure.
I can't stand him, so I'm biased, but I'm surprised how little love there is for Romney. The degree to which everyone seems to want another candidate is extraordinary.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on October 19, 2011, 12:41:19 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 06:18:05 AM
Saw an interview with Herman Cain. Remove bank regulation, get rid of the FDIC. :frusty:
A year ago, the just-minted econ "Nobel" winner Thomas Sargent gave an unintentionally hilarious interview published by the Minneapolis fed. When asked to come up with any examples of contributions that macro-economic theory had made to understanding financial crises, the two examples he could think of were a model demonstrating the benefits of deposit insurance and a Chicago School research concerning narrow banking. Given that Sargent is one of the doyens of the conservative rational expectations school, its hard to understate the degree to which significant swaths of the GOP (Cain, Paul, Bachman at least) are way out of the mainstrream on these issues.
Sometimes I wish understood what the hell you were talking about.
Quote from: Sheilbh on October 19, 2011, 05:23:27 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
I like Ron Paul for bravely representing the 19th century. The man's a mental, but there's a charm to that. He reminds me of a Republican, right-wing Tony Benn figure.
I can't stand him, so I'm biased, but I'm surprised how little love there is for Romney. The degree to which everyone seems to want another candidate is extraordinary.
If you called up central casting and asked for someone who looks and sounds like a generic President for your film, you'd get someone like Romney.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 05:27:37 PMIf you called up central casting and asked for someone who looks and sounds like a generic President for your film, you'd get someone like Romney.
Yep. He acts like it too. And he abuses dogs and is just weird.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 05:25:40 PM
Sometimes I wish understood what the hell you were talking about.
Questioning the usefulness of deposit insurance is flat earther kind of thinking at this point.
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 04:54:16 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 19, 2011, 03:46:05 PMActually, I doubt I'm going to vote republican this year. Or even vote at all.
I'll be interested in seeing how that holds up once the time comes (you know, if you tell us).
You people are all the same.
Quote from: The Minsky Moment on October 19, 2011, 05:42:16 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 05:25:40 PM
Sometimes I wish understood what the hell you were talking about.
Questioning the usefulness of deposit insurance is flat earther kind of thinking at this point.
Okay, that I understood. I'm not as educated as everyone else on this board, so you guys have to be patient with me.
Minsky uses big New York words to show off.
Quote from: PDH on October 19, 2011, 06:51:06 PM
Minsky uses big New York words to show off.
Marti does to. Its just that Marti often gets them in the wrong order.
Quote from: PDH on October 19, 2011, 06:51:06 PM
Minsky uses big New York words to show off.
We can afford them here.
One of my co-workers who lives in Jersey suggested that I go to Outback when I said I wanted a steak. When I looked at him blankly, he said that he was thinking on an economical basis. His boss, a Manhattanite, looked at him and we both said simultaneously, "We live in Manhattan; we're beyond saving money." I felt vulgar but then so glad not be in Jersey. :blush: :swiss:
You can be insufferable sometimes, you know that?
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 07:11:00 PM
You can be insufferable sometimes, you know that?
Now why are you buttering me up like that? What do you want?
Quote from: garbon on October 19, 2011, 07:13:32 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 07:11:00 PM
You can be insufferable sometimes, you know that?
Now why are you buttering me up like that? What do you want?
I like you garbon, you are what Marty wants to be and never will be. I find that hilarious.
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 02:26:04 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:15:58 PM
Maybe Perry will do better if he runs again in four years. He may just not be ready for prime time. Just like Romney seems to have upped his game quite a bit wit all the practice he's had.
If corrupt incompetents with no leadership abilities is what you think this country needs go ahead and hope for that.
Hehe, I'm not hoping for Perry. Just pointing out that he might get better with time in the bigger circles. As it is now, I'm fairly unimpressed with him, where at first I thought he showed promise.
Quote from: garbon on October 19, 2011, 10:59:31 AM
My stance is to wait until near when the primary elections occur. If I pay too much attention before that...I'm liable to not end up voting. :blush:
Have any states moved their primaries to December yet?
Quote from: Neil on October 19, 2011, 07:21:16 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 19, 2011, 10:59:31 AM
My stance is to wait until near when the primary elections occur. If I pay too much attention before that...I'm liable to not end up voting. :blush:
Have any states moved their primaries to December yet?
Nah don't you remember that last time around states were liable for punishment and negation if they jumped up to soon?
Quote from: Sheilbh on October 19, 2011, 05:23:27 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
I like Ron Paul for bravely representing the 19th century. The man's a mental, but there's a charm to that. He reminds me of a Republican, right-wing Tony Benn figure.
I can't stand him, so I'm biased, but I'm surprised how little love there is for Romney. The degree to which everyone seems to want another candidate is extraordinary.
Romney is a smart and capable rich guy who stands for nothing other than getting himself elected, and has spent the last 7 or so years dedicated to becoming president. On the one hand he is the only reasonable republican candidate, because the rest of the field are loons, but he is the most brazenly opportunistic candidate I can remember. This just can't end well.
Quote from: alfred russel on October 19, 2011, 07:27:12 PM
Romney is a smart and capable rich guy who stands for nothing other than getting himself elected, and has spent the last 7 or so years dedicated to becoming president. On the one hand he is the only reasonable republican candidate, because the rest of the field are loons, but he is the most brazenly opportunistic candidate I can remember. This just can't end well.
True. Look what happened to Hillary. :angry:
Quote from: garbon on October 19, 2011, 07:08:58 PM
We can afford them here.
One of my co-workers who lives in Jersey suggested that I go to Outback when I said I wanted a steak. When I looked at him blankly, he said that he was thinking on an economical basis. His boss, a Manhattanite, looked at him and we both said simultaneously, "We live in Manhattan; we're beyond saving money." I felt vulgar but then so glad not be in Jersey. :blush: :swiss:
Outback steaks are awesome. Cheese fries, bloomin' onion and coconut shrimp too. :mmm:
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on October 19, 2011, 07:30:15 PM
Quote from: garbon on October 19, 2011, 07:08:58 PM
We can afford them here.
One of my co-workers who lives in Jersey suggested that I go to Outback when I said I wanted a steak. When I looked at him blankly, he said that he was thinking on an economical basis. His boss, a Manhattanite, looked at him and we both said simultaneously, "We live in Manhattan; we're beyond saving money." I felt vulgar but then so glad not be in Jersey. :blush: :swiss:
Outback steaks are awesome. Cheese fries, bloomin' onion and coconut shrimp too. :mmm:
Oh his boss and I totally ordered cheese fries the other day for delivery at lunch. :D
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 09:09:48 AM
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 08:29:45 AM
I made the mistake of following the election in 2007 and I will not make the same mistake again. No looking at election crap until it is a few weeks before I am voting on something. Total waste of time.
:yes: It doesn't hurt that Republicans are in a full blown retard mode, which makes their debates easier to not bother with.
but so much more entertaining... I'm looking at this as pure entertainment.
Quote from: Viking on October 19, 2011, 07:52:15 PM
Quote from: DGuller on October 19, 2011, 09:09:48 AM
Quote from: Valmy on October 19, 2011, 08:29:45 AM
I made the mistake of following the election in 2007 and I will not make the same mistake again. No looking at election crap until it is a few weeks before I am voting on something. Total waste of time.
:yes: It doesn't hurt that Republicans are in a full blown retard mode, which makes their debates easier to not bother with.
but so much more entertaining... I'm looking at this as pure entertainment.
For you maybe. You don't have to live with them. It's like watching one of the weird reality shows about criminals or freaks and knowing that one of them may be your room mate next year. I look at Factcheck.org's site which ussualy has a run down of the claims and their truthfulness. I gather Herman Cain didn't really think through his 9-9-9 slogan. He's like a professional corporate executive. The type of person shareholders bring in for a quick turn around. A person not concerned with product but with sales and marketing. The type of person they replaced Steve Jobs with at Apple back in the 1980's.
I do have to live with them. I just can't do anything about it. So I realize my inability to affect it and sit back and take the only true gain I can out of the process.
:blush: I got you confused with Lucidor.
Quote from: Darth Wagtaros on October 19, 2011, 06:39:44 PM
Quote from: Jacob on October 19, 2011, 04:54:16 PM
Quote from: Ed Anger on October 19, 2011, 03:46:05 PMActually, I doubt I'm going to vote republican this year. Or even vote at all.
I'll be interested in seeing how that holds up once the time comes (you know, if you tell us).
You people are all the same.
I'm undecided between voting Obama or writing in something. It'll likely be the latter.
I'd vote for Huntsman because he's sane, believes in science and evolution, and would be a good prsident. For all those reasons he will never get the nomination, sadly.
Quote from: alfred russel on October 19, 2011, 07:27:12 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on October 19, 2011, 05:23:27 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
I like Ron Paul for bravely representing the 19th century. The man's a mental, but there's a charm to that. He reminds me of a Republican, right-wing Tony Benn figure.
I can't stand him, so I'm biased, but I'm surprised how little love there is for Romney. The degree to which everyone seems to want another candidate is extraordinary.
Romney is a smart and capable rich guy who stands for nothing other than getting himself elected, and has spent the last 7 or so years dedicated to becoming president.
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
Obama's net worth is over 10 million.
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on October 19, 2011, 10:06:43 PM
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
Obama's net worth is over 10 million.
Doesn't a good bit of that have to do with his books?
Quote from: Peter Wiggin on October 19, 2011, 10:06:43 PM
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
Obama's net worth is over 10 million.
Perhaps, but he never ran on the basis of his wealth.
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on October 19, 2011, 07:27:12 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on October 19, 2011, 05:23:27 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
I like Ron Paul for bravely representing the 19th century. The man's a mental, but there's a charm to that. He reminds me of a Republican, right-wing Tony Benn figure.
I can't stand him, so I'm biased, but I'm surprised how little love there is for Romney. The degree to which everyone seems to want another candidate is extraordinary.
Romney is a smart and capable rich guy who stands for nothing other than getting himself elected, and has spent the last 7 or so years dedicated to becoming president.
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
no real candidate runs on anything anymore, it seems (in anglo NA, anyway. don't follow any other elections). The one that do "stand" for something are nutters who want the gold standard back or some other hair brained scheme.
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
I have come to question the "capable" part.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 10:22:36 PM
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
I have come to question the "capable" part.
Nah, he is a capable man, just not much of a President.
He isn't a bad President though. Just...average. He won't do any real harm, but nor will he do any great good either.
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 10:27:21 PM
He isn't a bad President though. Just...average. He won't do any real harm, but nor will he do any great good either.
At least he's not dead set on actively sabotaging the country like most of his challengers seem to be.
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 10:27:21 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 10:22:36 PM
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
I have come to question the "capable" part.
Nah, he is a capable man, just not much of a President.
He isn't a bad President though. Just...average. He won't do any real harm, but nor will he do any great good either.
:yes: Unfortunately, he is a mediocre president at a time when we need a really great one. Even more unfortunately, he's also a mediocre president at a time when that mediocrity is by far the best option we're going to have, evidently.
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 10:27:21 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 10:22:36 PM
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
I have come to question the "capable" part.
Nah, he is a capable man, just not much of a President.
He isn't a bad President though. Just...average. He won't do any real harm, but nor will he do any great good either.
It's hard to judge I suppose. I'm not sure if anyone could get legislation threw with Republicans dead set against everything. At Cal's Senator said, "The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president." What can you do with someone like that? I suspect we are going to see something in the near future to put a halt on obstruction. It's getting near critical mass, the point where government won't be able to function. I think we still have a mess of treaties just lying around waiting to be ratified.
Obama's biggest problem is that he's naive. Not with our enemies, but with his political opponents. Obama is the type who genuinely thinks if we all sit down, talk things through we can find a solution that is acceptable to both parties. The "Beer summit" is an example of this type of thinking. There are Ayatollahs in Iran who are more likely to make concessions then the GOP.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 10:38:19 PM
It's hard to judge I suppose. I'm not sure if anyone could get legislation threw with Republicans dead set against everything. At Cal's Senator said, "The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president." What can you do with someone like that? I suspect we are going to see something in the near future to put a halt on obstruction. It's getting near critical mass, the point where government won't be able to function. I think we still have a mess of treaties just lying around waiting to be ratified.
Obama's biggest problem is that he's naive. Not with our enemies, but with his political opponents. Obama is the type who genuinely thinks if we all sit down, talk things through we can find a solution that is acceptable to both parties. The "Beer summit" is an example of this type of thinking. There are Ayatollahs in Iran who are more likely to make concessions then the GOP.
It might be convenient to blame the Republicans, but it isn't like he really had his party by his side during the last 4 years. It also might be convenient to point out that the Democratic party is less cohesive than the Republican one but that really doesn't change the view from the ground.
Quote from: HisMajestyBOB on October 19, 2011, 09:51:40 PM
I'm undecided between voting Obama or writing in something. It'll likely be the latter.
I'd vote for Huntsman because he's sane, believes in science and evolution, and would be a good prsident. For all those reasons he will never get the nomination, sadly.
I would vote for Huntsman. At the moment I'm thinking of throwing a vote to a third party if there is a quasi-quasi-reasonable alternative.
Romney's biggest strength in my eyes is that he's so disingenuous that he probably won't do anything he's saying he will do.
Quote from: garbon on October 19, 2011, 10:57:49 PM
It might be convenient to blame the Republicans, but it isn't like he really had his party by his side during the last 4 years. It also might be convenient to point out that the Democratic party is less cohesive than the Republican one but that really doesn't change the view from the ground.
It's nice when the most convenient answer is also the correct one. :) Really, it's a problem more with the rules of the Senate. They are going to have to change the filibuster rules eventually, and probably pretty soon.
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on October 19, 2011, 07:27:12 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on October 19, 2011, 05:23:27 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
I like Ron Paul for bravely representing the 19th century. The man's a mental, but there's a charm to that. He reminds me of a Republican, right-wing Tony Benn figure.
I can't stand him, so I'm biased, but I'm surprised how little love there is for Romney. The degree to which everyone seems to want another candidate is extraordinary.
Romney is a smart and capable rich guy who stands for nothing other than getting himself elected, and has spent the last 7 or so years dedicated to becoming president.
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
I don't think so. There is no way to say with certainty what Obama believes of course, but I think he does have political convictions that he wants to advance. And he may have had his eye on the presidency for 7 years, but he also kept substantial jobs were he could keep working on those issues in the meantime.
On the minus side for Obama, while he has demonstrated he is smart and capable in roles such as a lawyer, he has not done so as the executive in charge of a large organization.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 11:17:27 PM
Romney's biggest strength in my eyes is that he's so disingenuous that he probably won't do anything he's saying he will do.
Think about that though. He is so transparently disingenuous that it is hard to even pretend that he stands for anything. Is that the kind of guy you want to be making tough decisions that come up?
Yes, I know that all politicians are like this to a degree.
Quote from: alfred russel on October 20, 2011, 02:07:23 PM
There is no way to say with certainty what Obama believes of course,
Except in Mahomet?
Quote from: alfred russel on October 20, 2011, 02:22:52 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 11:17:27 PM
Romney's biggest strength in my eyes is that he's so disingenuous that he probably won't do anything he's saying he will do.
Think about that though. He is so transparently disingenuous that it is hard to even pretend that he stands for anything. Is that the kind of guy you want to be making tough decisions that come up?
Yes, I know that all politicians are like this to a degree.
Yes.
Quote from: alfred russel on October 20, 2011, 02:07:23 PM
Quote from: Berkut on October 19, 2011, 09:55:16 PM
Quote from: alfred russel on October 19, 2011, 07:27:12 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on October 19, 2011, 05:23:27 PM
Quote from: KRonn on October 19, 2011, 01:14:03 PM
I forgot to mention Ron Paul. I've never been much a fan of his, but he has some ideas that I like. Such as some of his fiscal ideas. It's good having him in there on those occasions where he kicks butt with common sense ideas, but he can be a loose cannon sometimes, seem part libertarian and I think kind of part angry.
I like Ron Paul for bravely representing the 19th century. The man's a mental, but there's a charm to that. He reminds me of a Republican, right-wing Tony Benn figure.
I can't stand him, so I'm biased, but I'm surprised how little love there is for Romney. The degree to which everyone seems to want another candidate is extraordinary.
Romney is a smart and capable rich guy who stands for nothing other than getting himself elected, and has spent the last 7 or so years dedicated to becoming president.
Replace the word "rich" with "black" and you've described Obama in the run up to the last election perfectly.
I don't think so. There is no way to say with certainty what Obama believes of course, but I think he does have political convictions that he wants to advance.
Really? What might those be? I cannot really tell, it's not like his platform was anything more than boilerplate Dem stuff. How is he different from Romney?
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And he may have had his eye on the presidency for 7 years, but he also kept substantial jobs were he could keep working on those issues in the meantime.
What might those substantial jobs be? He was a US Senator, and his record was one of doing almost nothing but run for President. Prior to that he wrote a book and practiced law, but not in anything that appear to be a meaningful manner - his law career seems to be nothing more than a way to get ready to go into politics.
Quote from: Berkut on October 20, 2011, 02:49:44 PM
Really? What might those be? I cannot really tell, it's not like his platform was anything more than boilerplate Dem stuff. How is he different from Romney?
He probably is basically a boilerplate dem. He has consistently worked on such an agenda and in such environments (a community organizer, civil rights lawyer) that it seems likely. I would be very suprised if he is a part of a future campaign against universal health care, or pro life initiatives, for example.
Quote
What might those substantial jobs be? He was a US Senator, and his record was one of doing almost nothing but run for President. Prior to that he wrote a book and practiced law, but not in anything that appear to be a meaningful manner - his law career seems to be nothing more than a way to get ready to go into politics.
The point is he had day jobs. He wasn't an unemployed super rich guy with a focus in life of being president for 7 years.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 10:38:19 PM
There are Ayatollahs in Iran who are more likely to make concessions then the GOP.
Yes but they are all under house arrest.
Hey wait, there's an idea . . .
Quote from: alfred russel on October 20, 2011, 03:11:04 PM
The point is he had day jobs. He wasn't an unemployed super rich guy with a focus in life of being president for 7 years.
Unemployed?
Quote from: alfred russel on October 20, 2011, 02:22:52 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 19, 2011, 11:17:27 PM
Romney's biggest strength in my eyes is that he's so disingenuous that he probably won't do anything he's saying he will do.
Think about that though. He is so transparently disingenuous that it is hard to even pretend that he stands for anything. Is that the kind of guy you want to be making tough decisions that come up?
Yes, I know that all politicians are like this to a degree.
Compared to the rest of those crazies? Yes. I'd rather have the guy who's the dishonest pragmatist then the genuinely nutter.
Quote from: Razgovory on October 20, 2011, 04:38:43 PM
Compared to the rest of those crazies? Yes. I'd rather have the guy who's the dishonest pragmatist then the genuinely nutter.
Well, all you've established so far is that he's dishonest, not that he's a pragmatist also. He may be a dishonest guy who makes decisions on the basis of nuttiness.
Quote from: alfred russel on October 20, 2011, 02:22:52 PMThink about that though. He is so transparently disingenuous that it is hard to even pretend that he stands for anything. Is that the kind of guy you want to be making tough decisions that come up?
Yes, I know that all politicians are like this to a degree.
I can't think of any other politician whose base think that he doesn't believe anything he's said in the last 7 years. He's the only politician whose entire campaign boils down to convincing people that he's actually a liar.
Quote from: garbon on October 20, 2011, 03:40:28 PM
Unemployed?
It's how he described himself in the most awkward Romney moment since his 'who let the dog's out' sing-a-long :bleeding:
Quote from: Capetan Mihali on October 20, 2011, 05:29:19 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on October 20, 2011, 04:38:43 PM
Compared to the rest of those crazies? Yes. I'd rather have the guy who's the dishonest pragmatist then the genuinely nutter.
Well, all you've established so far is that he's dishonest, not that he's a pragmatist also. He may be a dishonest guy who makes decisions on the basis of nuttiness.
Well, he's a dishonest pragmatist. I'm establishing that now.