Languish.org

A taste of the future?

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/05/gunman-detained-at-comet-pizza-restaurant-was-self-investigating-fake-news-reports

QuoteWashington restaurant was target of fake news reports it was operating a child abuse ring led by Hillary Clinton and an aide

US police have arrested a man wielding an assault rifle who entered a pizza restaurant that was the target of fake news reports it was operating a child abuse ring led by Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton and her top campaign aide.

An unidentified 35-year-old man was being held for questioning after police were called to the Comet Ping Pong restaurant in Washington near the Maryland border, said Aquita Brown, a spokeswoman for the Metropolitan Police Department in the nation's capital.

The suspect entered the restaurant and pointed a gun at a restaurant employee, who fled and notified authorities, police said. The man then discharged the weapon inside the restaurant. There were no injuries.

Two weapons were found inside the restaurant and a third one was recovered from the man's vehicle, police added.

They said the suspect during an interview with investigators revealed that he came to the establishment to "self-investigate" Pizzagate, the police statement said. Pizzagate is a baseless conspiracy, which falsely claims Clinton and her campaign chief John Podesta were running a child sex ring from the restaurant's backrooms.

Police said there was no active investigation of child abuse allegations relating to the restaurant.

A Reuters witness at the restaurant with his one-year-old child said it was crowded when the gunman entered, with many families dining.

Last month, various media outlets, including the Washington Post and New York Times, reported on internet postings that had sparked death threats against the owner of the restaurant.

The attack on Comet was considered an example of how fake news reports that proliferated during the election year impacted people's lives.

A fake news story was even tweeted by General Mike Flynn, Donald Trump's pick for national security adviser. In the 3 November tweet he linked to a discredited story that suggested Hillary Clinton and her "crew" were involved in child abuse and added the comment "U decide."

After the incident at Comet, the police department said in a statement that it was "monitoring the situation and aware of general threats being made against this establishment."

"We've directed the staff to notify MPD should they receive specific threats or have concerns about their safety."

The Reuters witness who was inside Comet at around 3pm ET (2000 GMT) said he was paying his bill when he saw a man entering the restaurant's front door. "It appeared to us he had a long rifle with him. We scattered," he said.

The restaurant began to empty and some staff also exited, according to the witness.

A police department tweet later stated, "Suspect armed w/assault rifle taken into custody."

The future? Ask Planned Parenthood in Colorado about fake news stories setting off crazies.

I guess but this one is so ridiculous and was actually tweeted out by someone Trump later gave a position to.

What could pizza have referred to in those emails?  Obviously the conspiracy theory is total BS, but obviously they were using pizza and other words as code for something.

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 10:51:43 AM
What could pizza have referred to in those emails?  Obviously the conspiracy theory is total BS, but obviously they were using pizza and other words as code for something.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-38156985

QuoteThe saga of 'Pizzagate': The fake story that shows how conspiracy theories spread

No victim has come forward. There's no investigation. And physical evidence? That doesn't exist either.

But thousands of people are convinced that a paedophilia ring involving people at the highest levels of the Democratic Party is operating out of a Washington pizza restaurant.

The story riveted fringes of Twitter - nearly a million messages were sent last month using the term "pizzagate".

So how did this fake story take hold amongst alt-right Trump supporters and other Hillary Clinton opponents?

Let's start with the facts.

In early November, as Wikileaks steadily released piles of emails from Clinton's campaign chairman John Podesta, one contact caught the attention of prankster sites and people on the paranoid fringes.

James Alefantis is the owner of Comet Ping Pong, a pizza restaurant in Washington. He's also a big Democratic Party supporter and raised money for both Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton. He was once in a relationship with David Brock, an influential liberal operative.

Alefantis - who's never met Clinton - appeared in the Podesta emails in connection with the fundraisers.

And from these thin threads, an enormous trove of conspiracy fiction was spun.

Users of 4chan, a message board known for free speech, extreme content and trollish behaviour, began posting speculation and supposed connections gleaned from internet searches. They trawled Alefantis' Instagram feed for pictures of children and the modern art which lines his restaurant's walls, and dreamt up a paedophile sex ring involving prominent politicians and political donors.

Soon there were protesters outside of Comet Ping Pong. Alefantis even invited some of them in - they filmed the encounter and put it on YouTube.

"They ignore basic truths," Alefantis tells BBC Trending. For instance, the conspiracy supposedly is run out of the restaurant's basement. "We don't even have a basement."

"Sometimes an innocent picture of a child in a basket is just an innocent picture of a child in a basket and not proof of a child sex trafficking ring," he says.

The conspiracy theory bubbled up from 4chan onto the mainstream internet when a Reddit user posted a long document with all of the "evidence" several days before the US election. It first appeared on a section of the site popular with Donald Trump supporters from the extremist white nationalist alt-right.

Alefantis, along with Comet Ping Pong employees and others, started to get threatening messages. He locked his Instagram account.

...

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 10:51:43 AM
What could pizza have referred to in those emails?  Obviously the conspiracy theory is total BS, but obviously they were using pizza and other words as code for something.

What the fuck are you talking about?

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 10:51:43 AM
What could pizza have referred to in those emails?  Obviously the conspiracy theory is total BS, but obviously they were using pizza and other words as code for something.

As long as they were all carried to term, who cares? #ItsAChoiceOfToppingsNotAChoice

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 10:51:43 AM
What could pizza have referred to in those emails?  Obviously the conspiracy theory is total BS, but obviously they were using pizza and other words as code for something.

I am not sure they would do that. In the past, they used codes that no one but them even recognized as code.  If they are really claiming that they are using those words as code, then they should show that.

If they were actually talking about pizza in those emails, the emails make zero sense.

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 02:58:26 PM
If they were actually talking about pizza in those emails, the emails make zero sense.

Demonstrate.

Maybe later, Raz.

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 02:58:26 PM
If they were actually talking about pizza in those emails, the emails make zero sense.

So the pizzas they were ordering from the pizza joint weren't pizzas, but .....


... satanic child sacrifice weapons.

... fake election ballots.

... chemtrail spray tanks.

... fracking drilling kit.

... doctored global warming studies.

... Chicago style pizzas?

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 03:06:43 PM
Maybe later, Raz.

No, I think today is a good time.  That was crazy bullshit, and trying to meet it half-way is disgusting.  So why don't you show us where you got that idea, huh?

Quote from: Razgovory on December 05, 2016, 03:23:07 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 03:06:43 PM
Maybe later, Raz.

No, I think today is a good time.  That was crazy bullshit, and trying to meet it half-way is disgusting.  So why don't you show us where you got that idea, huh?

From the emails I saw quoted, pizza and some other words seemed a bit out of context.  That's all.  I did say the conspiracy theory was BS.

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 03:34:02 PM

Quote from: Razgovory on December 05, 2016, 03:23:07 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 03:06:43 PM
Maybe later, Raz.

No, I think today is a good time.  That was crazy bullshit, and trying to meet it half-way is disgusting.  So why don't you show us where you got that idea, huh?

From the emails I saw quoted, pizza and some other words seemed a bit out of context.  That's all.  I did say the conspiracy theory was BS.

Actually the words were literally in context until people started taking them out of it. :hmm:

How the fuck is a pizza ever out of context?

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 03:34:02 PM

Quote from: Razgovory on December 05, 2016, 03:23:07 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 03:06:43 PM
Maybe later, Raz.

No, I think today is a good time.  That was crazy bullshit, and trying to meet it half-way is disgusting.  So why don't you show us where you got that idea, huh?

From the emails I saw quoted, pizza and some other words seemed a bit out of context.  That's all.  I did say the conspiracy theory was BS.

Demonstrate.  You say that the conspiracy theory is bullshit, but you give credence to the idea of some sort of wrong doing.  So show us where you saw these emails quoted.  Link us to the website.

No.

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 10:51:43 AM
What could pizza have referred to in those emails?  Obviously the conspiracy theory is total BS, but obviously they were using pizza and other words as code for something.

((pizza))

I get it now.  It's deplorables all the way down.

Pretty sure the "pizza" emails all came from the Wikileaks Podesta thing, raz.  The conspiracy stuff that got all crazy and started involving actual pizza joints came from all over the place.

Well.
This is something sci fi never saw coming.
What a world :(

"What could Matzah have referred to in those emails?  Obviously the conspiracy theory is total BS, but obviously they were using Matzah and other words as code for something."  -Derspeiss on the blood libel.

Trump's leading foreign policy and domestic policy advisors are in bed with this garbage. 
If he keeps them on this admin loses all credibility before Day 1.

Well this sort a thing has already endangered people's lives.  So I find Derspeiss's whole "sure it's bullshit, but they are on to something" thing rather repulsive.

Quote from: MadBurgerMaker on December 05, 2016, 03:53:56 PM
Pretty sure the "pizza" emails all came from the Wikileaks Podesta thing, raz.  The conspiracy stuff that got all crazy and started involving actual pizza joints came from all over the place.

Somehow I doubt Derspeiss read 20,000 emails.

I was just curious as to whether they were using some kind of code and, if so, what it meant.  Your repulsion is an overreaction.  I sort of understand why you're on edge with the election and all, but chill.

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 05:14:59 PM
I was just curious as to whether they were using some kind of code and, if so, what it meant.  Your repulsion is an overreaction.  I sort of understand why you're on edge with the election and all, but chill.

I've seen no evidence to support what you are arguing.  I'd say you should just chill, unless you want to break tradition and actually support an argument with evidence.

Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 05, 2016, 04:49:05 PM
Trump's leading foreign policy and domestic policy advisors are in bed with this garbage. 
If he keeps them on this admin loses all credibility before Day 1.

D-46?

Quote from: Razgovory on December 05, 2016, 05:13:15 PM
Somehow I doubt Derspeiss read 20,000 emails.

Me too.  I'm not sure how that really matters though.  You were wanting to know where they were coming from.  That's where.

Anyway, I went to wikileaks, searched for "pizza" in the Podesta emails, and one I remember people mentioning from this thing showed up on the first page:

https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/55433

This one was talked about because of the whole pizza related map on a handkerchief part.  They had come up with some codeword terminology for what some of that meant, blahblah. vOv  I'm not clicking through any more of these.  I have more than enough dumbass inane emails to read in my own inbox.

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 05:14:59 PM
I was just curious as to whether they were using some kind of code and, if so, what it meant.  Your repulsion is an overreaction.  I sort of understand why you're on edge with the election and all, but chill.

I'd treat a holocaust denier in just the same way. :)

Quote from: The Minsky Moment on December 05, 2016, 04:49:05 PM
Trump's leading foreign policy and domestic policy advisors are in bed with this garbage. 
If he keeps them on this admin loses all credibility before Day 1.

Keeps them?  Dude, they're the ones that got him there.

Quote from: Razgovory on December 05, 2016, 05:52:57 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 05, 2016, 05:14:59 PM
I was just curious as to whether they were using some kind of code and, if so, what it meant.  Your repulsion is an overreaction.  I sort of understand why you're on edge with the election and all, but chill.

I'd treat a holocaust denier in just the same way. :)

:lol:  Good for you.

What we're seeing here is precisely what the firehose of falsehoods strategy is meant to accomplish.  Dial up the bullshit to 11, and have enough imbeciles, imbecile sympathizers, and false equivalence enablers pick it up so that the correct volume of 0 is no longer the default and obvious setting.  Pretty soon every fact becomes just a matter of opinion.

I sure hope that some counter to this is developed, or that people will naturally gain immunity to this, because this informational war against the liberal societies is proving to be the biggest threat to democracy in a long, long time.

Quote from: DGuller on December 05, 2016, 07:39:26 PM
What we're seeing here is precisely what the firehose of falsehoods strategy is meant to accomplish.  Dial up the bullshit to 11, and have enough imbeciles, imbecile sympathizers, and false equivalence enablers pick it up so that the correct volume of 0 is no longer the default and obvious setting.  Pretty soon every fact becomes just a matter of opinion.

I sure hope that some counter to this is developed, or that people will naturally gain immunity to this, because this informational war against the liberal societies is proving to be the biggest threat to democracy in a long, long time.

Eventually every government will have an army of professional trolls spreading their propaganda and people will wise up. Right now it is all new.

Quote from: Valmy on December 05, 2016, 07:44:06 PM

Quote from: DGuller on December 05, 2016, 07:39:26 PM
What we're seeing here is precisely what the firehose of falsehoods strategy is meant to accomplish.  Dial up the bullshit to 11, and have enough imbeciles, imbecile sympathizers, and false equivalence enablers pick it up so that the correct volume of 0 is no longer the default and obvious setting.  Pretty soon every fact becomes just a matter of opinion.

I sure hope that some counter to this is developed, or that people will naturally gain immunity to this, because this informational war against the liberal societies is proving to be the biggest threat to democracy in a long, long time.

Eventually every government will have an army of professional trolls spreading their propaganda and people will wise up. Right now it is all new.

Will people wise up, or will people give up on the concept of truth and facts because sifting it out from BS will become impossible?

Quote from: DGuller on December 05, 2016, 07:56:11 PM
Will people wise up, or will people give up on the concept of truth and facts because sifting it out from BS will become impossible?

Both of those things are possible.

I don't think people will be giving up on the concept of truth and facts for awhile

Quote from: LaCroix on December 05, 2016, 08:05:11 PM
I don't think people will be giving up on the concept of truth and facts for awhile

A significant enough minority of them are on sabbatical as we speak.

comet ping pong is a stupid name for a pizza joint.

You all may continue with your Assburger ranting and raving.

Quote from: Ed Anger on December 05, 2016, 08:15:44 PM
comet ping pong is a stupid name for a pizza joint.

Sounds like something you'd ask the Little Missus for, and get rolleyes.

"You know what, honey;  I think tonight is Comet Ping Pong Night."
"But it's not even your birthday."

Quote from: DGuller on December 05, 2016, 08:08:32 PMA significant enough minority of them are on sabbatical as we speak.

disagree. I think most of your significant enough minority pay some mild attention to poor news sources, but that's about it. people care about truth and facts. they're just more likely to believe facts/narratives they hear that conform with their views. everyone does this to an extent. educated people are probably less prone to it, yet you see it all the time among educated groups, too.

Quote from: CountDeMoney on December 05, 2016, 08:18:19 PM

Quote from: Ed Anger on December 05, 2016, 08:15:44 PM
comet ping pong is a stupid name for a pizza joint.

Sounds like something you'd ask the Little Missus for, and get rolleyes.

"You know what, honey;  I think tonight is Comet Ping Pong Night."
"But it's not even your birthday."

I say "Chuck E Cheese"

lol, time to frolick in the ball pit, little girl

Quote from: DGuller on December 05, 2016, 08:08:32 PM

Quote from: LaCroix on December 05, 2016, 08:05:11 PM
I don't think people will be giving up on the concept of truth and facts for awhile

A significant enough minority of them are on sabbatical as we speak.

I think you cannot discount the part being played by the spiceys of the world - who know perfectly well that it is lies, damaging, and harmful to democracy...but hell, it is in the service of their side, so lets just laugh it off and pretend like it is no big deal...

Quote from: DGuller on December 05, 2016, 07:39:26 PM
What we're seeing here is precisely what the firehose of falsehoods strategy is meant to accomplish.  Dial up the bullshit to 11, and have enough imbeciles, imbecile sympathizers, and false equivalence enablers pick it up so that the correct volume of 0 is no longer the default and obvious setting.  Pretty soon every fact becomes just a matter of opinion.

I sure hope that some counter to this is developed, or that people will naturally gain immunity to this, because this informational war against the liberal societies is proving to be the biggest threat to democracy in a long, long time.

Maybe we should let Trump "tighten up the libel laws", than sue him for libel.

Boy oh boy I can't wait to get executed at a local bar at happy hour by some nut who thinks all Democrats are actually lizard people from the planet Nebulon because he's trying to protect his unborn fetuses from the lizard AIDS spread via chemtrails and the TV signals from the lamestream media.

Luckily, there's enough police and security forces in DC that any insane idiot with an assault rifle will only be able to murder maybe a dozen people. I should just make sure I sit in the way back, by the restrooms so I can hide in the stalls and run out the back through the kitchen.

Quote from: Berkut on December 05, 2016, 08:59:07 PM
I think you cannot discount the part being played by the spiceys of the world - who know perfectly well that it is lies, damaging, and harmful to democracy...but hell, it is in the service of their side, so lets just laugh it off and pretend like it is no big deal...

What am I supposed to do? 

Quote from: derspiess on December 06, 2016, 05:32:35 PMWhat am I supposed to do?

acknowledge (1) Democracy in America is dead, murdered by you; and (2) trump is the most dangerous man of this time and all time

Pretty sure something about racism has to be in there as well.

Quote from: derspiess on December 06, 2016, 05:32:35 PM

Quote from: Berkut on December 05, 2016, 08:59:07 PM
I think you cannot discount the part being played by the spiceys of the world - who know perfectly well that it is lies, damaging, and harmful to democracy...but hell, it is in the service of their side, so lets just laugh it off and pretend like it is no big deal...

What am I supposed to do? 

Not do what you are doing? :huh:

Obviously you should call bullshit bullshit. I was proud of Hans for not putting up with any of the birther shit when he was condemning Obama for ripping up the Constitution and making himself a blood stained dictator.

I wonder what Hans is doing now.

Quote from: Razgovory on December 06, 2016, 07:40:06 PM
I wonder what Hans is doing now.

Whatever the mothership tells him.

I'll take a small Pepperoni and Pre-teen. 30 minutes? Thanks!

Interesting. They've now canned Flynn's son for his tweet that occurred after the shooting incident. Apparently that's enough and we should forget about how the father spread this 'rumor' before the election...

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/07/trump-adviser-son-michael-flynn-sacked-pizzagate-comet-ping-pong-restaurant

QuoteTrump adviser's son loses transition team job for spreading fake news

The son of Donald Trump's pick for national security adviser, Michael Flynn, has lost his job in the president-elect's transition team after he spread a false conspiracy theory about Hillary Clinton that led to shots being fired in pizza restaurant.

While working for his father, Michael Flynn Jr tweeted an erroneous theory that Clinton's allies had been running a paedophile ring in the Comet Ping Pong pizza parlour in Washington.

Even after a man on Sunday fired a rifle in the restaurant, in an incident apparently sparked by the conspiracy theory, Flynn said on Twitter that the fake news would "remain a story" until proven false.

The incident has heightened concerns about the incoming administration's fondness for fake news and raised further questions about the suitability of Flynn Sr, who has also shared bogus stories on social media.

Mike Pence, the vice-president-elect, initially denied that Flynn's son was working for the troubled Trump transition team. But on Tuesday he admitted on CNN that Flynn Jr had been helping his father, but that was "no longer the case".

The New York Times reported that Flynn Jr had planned to work for his father as part of the national security council team, and started the process of getting national security clearance.

Since the election the Twitter postings of Flynn Sr have been uncontroversial. But days before the vote he tweeted a "must read" link to a story falsely claiming that Clinton's emails contained proof of money-laundering and child abuse.

Flynn also promoted conspiracy theorists throughout the campaign. He encouraged his followers to read a book by Mike Cernovich, whose website has suggested Clinton's campaign chairman was part of a "sex cult with connections to human trafficking". Flynn also tagged white nationalist Jared Wyand on social media.

Speaking to the the New York Times, Michael Hayden, the former CIA and National Security Agency director, said: "The national security adviser should have a moderating effect on the instincts of the president, and it remains to be seen if Mike can do that."

Julianne Smith, a former deputy national security adviser to the vice-president, Joe Biden, said she was deeply troubled by Flynn's tendency to promote fake news. She told the Associated Press his job would be to "ensure that the White House is focused at all times on all of the threats that the United States faces abroad".

Adam Schiff, the top Democrat on the House intelligence committee, said Flynn's willingness to promote fake news "raises profound questions about his suitability for this important position".

Tom Nichols, a professor at the US Naval War College in Newport, Rhode Island, where Flynn obtained a master's degree in national security and strategic studies in 2001, said: "If the national security adviser is going to be the direct conduit between the president and the national security world, of course it's a concern that that adviser is being taken in by conspiracy theories and fake news."

Quote from: Valmy on December 06, 2016, 07:36:31 PM
Obviously you should call bullshit bullshit.

Done.  Twice.

Quote from: derspiess on December 06, 2016, 05:32:35 PM

Quote from: Berkut on December 05, 2016, 08:59:07 PM
I think you cannot discount the part being played by the spiceys of the world - who know perfectly well that it is lies, damaging, and harmful to democracy...but hell, it is in the service of their side, so lets just laugh it off and pretend like it is no big deal...

What am I supposed to do? 

Stop laughing it off and pretending it is no big deal, for starters.

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 08:36:51 AM

Quote from: Valmy on December 06, 2016, 07:36:31 PM
Obviously you should call bullshit bullshit.

Done.  Twice.

Actually no, you haven't.  You gave "it's BS, but"

I said it was BS.  Chillax.

"The Holocaust deniers are full of BS"

vs

"Sure the Holocaust deniers are full of BS, but the Jews are certainly hiding something".

:lol:  You funny Raz.

Quote from: Razgovory on December 07, 2016, 10:18:13 AM
"Sure the Holocaust deniers are full of BS, but the Jews are certainly hiding something".

Notice how we've never seen Mrs. Malthus around...

You make a token statement like "They are full of BS"

then in every other way, act exactly as if you don't think they are full of BS at all, and in fact parrot every idiotic meme or talking point they share.

The "they are full of BS" is about as convincing as your "I don't support Trump! I voted third party!" while parroting with complete consistency the Trump line on basically every single issue.

 :lol:  I get it Speesh.  I don't get the #NeverHillary business, but this one I do.

Quote from: Berkut on December 07, 2016, 10:36:29 AM
You make a token statement like "They are full of BS"

then in every other way, act exactly as if you don't think they are full of BS at all, and in fact parrot every idiotic meme or talking point they share.

Really?  To be honest I haven't paid much attention to Pizzagate, so I don't know enough about the memes or talking points to parrot every one even if I wanted to.  All I said was that some of the words used in some emails I saw looked out of context and I was curious as to whether they meant something else.  You and Raz are acting like my little post on page 1 of this thread is going to sway some naive Languishite (if there were such a person) into believing the conspiracy theory. 

QuoteThe "they are full of BS" is about as convincing as your "I don't support Trump! I voted third party!" while parroting with complete consistency the Trump line on basically every single issue.

As I mentioned before, I'm perfectly fine with you believing I voted Trump-- it's a hoot.  But tell me-- how have I parroted "the Trump line on basically every single issue"?

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:06:00 AM
:lol:  I get it Speesh.  I don't get the #NeverHillary business, but this one I do.

She's a terrible woman and we dodged a bullet by her not winning.  Granted, we got hit with a slightly smaller bullet, but whatyagonnado.

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 11:24:43 AM
She's a terrible woman and we dodged a bullet by her not winning.  Granted, we got hit with a slightly smaller bullet, but whatyagonnado.

Like I said, I don't get it.  I don't see how anyone who can read and understand words with more than on syllable can come to the conclusion that a Hillary presidency would have been worse than a Trump presidency.

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:28:24 AM
Like I said, I don't get it.  I don't see how anyone who can read and understand words with more than on syllable can come to the conclusion that a Hillary presidency would have been worse than a Trump presidency.

You are bringing logic into it.  No one voted for trump because they really thought Trump would be a good president, I don't think.  I think they voted for Trump because they wanted to punish the country and its elites for ignoring the interests of whites, especially working class whites, and thought Trump would do that.  Some of they are ashamed of this motive and so claim to have voted for third-party candidates, others are more honest.  None of them are logical, and the pizza gunman was just a bit less logical than the average.

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 11:24:43 AM

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:06:00 AM
:lol:  I get it Speesh.  I don't get the #NeverHillary business, but this one I do.

She's a terrible woman and we dodged a bullet by her not winning.  Granted, we got hit with a slightly smaller bullet, but whatyagonnado.

:lol:  Whatever lets you sleep at night.

Quote from: grumbler on December 07, 2016, 12:33:38 PM

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:28:24 AM
Like I said, I don't get it.  I don't see how anyone who can read and understand words with more than on syllable can come to the conclusion that a Hillary presidency would have been worse than a Trump presidency.

You are bringing logic into it.  No one voted for trump because they really thought Trump would be a good president, I don't think.  I think they voted for Trump because they wanted to punish the country and its elites for ignoring the interests of whites, especially working class whites, and thought Trump would do that.  Some of they are ashamed of this motive and so claim to have voted for third-party candidates, others are more honest.  None of them are logical, and the pizza gunman was just a bit less logical than the average.

This.

There are plenty out there who are fine with all of this even if they are perfectly smart enough to know exactly how completely dangerous this is, and they are in most ways worse than the people who are just idiots and think Trump really does care about them.

You can tell these people in part because now they try to play off the anger and concern with Trump as hysteria and over-reaction.

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 11:24:43 AM

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:06:00 AM
:lol:  I get it Speesh.  I don't get the #NeverHillary business, but this one I do.

She's a terrible woman and we dodged a bullet by her not winning.  Granted, we got hit with a slightly smaller bullet, but whatyagonnado.

Is she also nasty?

Quote from: Ideologue on December 07, 2016, 01:40:45 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 11:24:43 AM

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:06:00 AM
:lol:  I get it Speesh.  I don't get the #NeverHillary business, but this one I do.

She's a terrible woman and we dodged a bullet by her not winning.  Granted, we got hit with a slightly smaller bullet, but whatyagonnado.

Is she also nasty?

And brutish.  And short.

Quote from: Ideologue on December 07, 2016, 01:40:45 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 11:24:43 AM

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:06:00 AM
:lol:  I get it Speesh.  I don't get the #NeverHillary business, but this one I do.

She's a terrible woman and we dodged a bullet by her not winning.  Granted, we got hit with a slightly smaller bullet, but whatyagonnado.

Is she also nasty?

I bet Hillary smells like a mixture of soggy carpet and Charlie perfume. Old people smell.

Quote from: Ideologue on December 07, 2016, 01:40:45 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 11:24:43 AM

Quote from: Admiral Yi on December 07, 2016, 11:06:00 AM
:lol:  I get it Speesh.  I don't get the #NeverHillary business, but this one I do.

She's a terrible woman and we dodged a bullet by her not winning.  Granted, we got hit with a slightly smaller bullet, but whatyagonnado.

Is she also nasty?

She wishes.

Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:38:21 PM
Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

She's crooked.

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 02:48:04 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:38:21 PM
Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

She's crooked.

I asked you why you were not supporting her and you said it was because she was an angry radical hard left feminist. I see you have since adopted Trump's substance-less talking points?

Much better to put in office someone who's admitted that they are crooked and stated that they plan to continue being crooked.

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:54:27 PM
I asked you why you were not supporting her and you said it was because she was an angry radical hard left feminist. I see you have since adopted Trump's substance-less talking points?

:P ;)

I bet it's like Obama.  I remember Derspeiss was sickened just by looking at a picture of him.

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 03:25:21 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:54:27 PM
I asked you why you were not supporting her and you said it was because she was an angry radical hard left feminist. I see you have since adopted Trump's substance-less talking points?

:P ;)

:lol:

DAMN YOU

:hug:  If I ever become an actual Trumpite, I'll say so (in code-- key word is 'stromboli').

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 02:48:04 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:38:21 PM
Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

She's crooked.

...so I had no choice but to support the Putin surrogate.

...so I had no choice but to support the guy who is objectively and undeniably vastly more crooked than she could ever hope to be...

...so I had no choice but to support the man who appeals to racists and white supremasists NOT THAT I AM ONE FER SURE...

...so I had no choice but to support someone who is demonstrably a sexist pig...

Of course, I didn't WANT to support  him, but you know...crooked Hillary made me. I don't actually support racism, sexism, being an entitled, whining nationalistic asshole, not at all. Just...crooked Hillary, so I had no choice.

Yeah, I can't imagine why nobody believes that this was all about Hillary and her email server.

Berkut, excellent diatribe, but you realize he said he voted for Johnson?

I trust the guy who rage typed his fingers to bloody stumps more.

Quote from: alfred russel on December 07, 2016, 05:36:39 PM
Berkut, excellent diatribe, but you realize he said he voted for Johnson?

He said he did so because Hillary was in no danger of winning his state.

Hillary was crooked so they investigated her.  You know she was crooked because she was investigated.

That's close, Hab. I voted Johnson because I was voting my conscience. Had Ohio been close in the polls I'd have possibly voted for Trump, but thankfully it didn't come to that.

Spicy: History's greatest monster

Quote from: Razgovory on December 07, 2016, 03:40:51 PM
I bet it's like Obama.  I remember Derspeiss was sickened just by looking at a picture of him.

your memory is flawed, though, so we don't know the context behind why ders was sickened, if he was sickened :hmm:

Quote from: Ed Anger on December 07, 2016, 07:59:28 PM
Spicy: History's greatest monster

Jealousy does not become you sir.

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 08:08:28 PM

Quote from: Ed Anger on December 07, 2016, 07:59:28 PM
Spicy: History's greatest monster

Jealousy does not become you sir.

I want a long diatribe written attacking me, just so I can laugh at it and post animated gifs.

  :cry:

You are worse than almost everyone.

I don't do long diatribes.

Quote from: LaCroix on December 07, 2016, 08:06:30 PM

Quote from: Razgovory on December 07, 2016, 03:40:51 PM
I bet it's like Obama.  I remember Derspeiss was sickened just by looking at a picture of him.

your memory is flawed, though, so we don't know the context behind why ders was sickened, if he was sickened :hmm:

He stated it wasn't racial, but he couldn't explain it.

Quote from: Ed Anger on December 07, 2016, 08:10:14 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 08:08:28 PM

Quote from: Ed Anger on December 07, 2016, 07:59:28 PM
Spicy: History's greatest monster

Jealousy does not become you sir.

I want a long diatribe written attacking me, just so I can laugh at it and post animated gifs.

  :cry:

And then post puzzling celebrity nonsense from Buzzfeed?  No thanks, we already have one garbon.

When I see Michelle Obama, I want to watch the original Planet of the Apes.

Quote from: Ed Anger on December 07, 2016, 08:10:14 PM
I want a long diatribe written attacking me, just so I can laugh at it and post animated gifs.

:cry:

Big deal; you don't like cunts and negroes, either.   Not exactly earth-shattering revelations.

Quote from: Razgovory on December 07, 2016, 08:23:38 PM

Quote from: LaCroix on December 07, 2016, 08:06:30 PM

Quote from: Razgovory on December 07, 2016, 03:40:51 PM
I bet it's like Obama.  I remember Derspeiss was sickened just by looking at a picture of him.

your memory is flawed, though, so we don't know the context behind why ders was sickened, if he was sickened :hmm:

He stated it wasn't racial, but he couldn't explain it.

Was this an actual thing you guys are referring to?  If it is, I don't remember.

I dunno, was just making a general comment that I've observed about raz's memory in cases like these. some details might be technically true, but it seems a lot of times the context is twisted so the comment / argument / whatever that raz repeats is not at all what the original person intended

Quote from: LaCroix on December 07, 2016, 09:05:53 PM
I dunno, was just making a general comment that I've observed about raz's memory in cases like these. some details might be technically true, but it seems a lot of times the context is twisted so the comment / argument / whatever that raz repeats is not at all what the original person intended

Indeed. He constantly makes claims about what I once said or did, that I am always like "Huh? I don't think I said that...and certainly not in the context he is suggesting, but..."

I am curious whether

A) He is just making shit up, or
B) He really believes it, but it is completely untrue,
C) He is remembering something that actually happened, and remembers the context as well, but doesn't care because he is inately dishonest, as has been shown time and again, or
D) If he is really relating something that happened, in context, and he just has a much, much better memory than the rest of us.

D is possible, but given that I've already caught him out in a straight up example of A, I suspect that we cannot really give him the benefit of that doubt.

I think it is B.

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 02:48:04 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:38:21 PM
Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

She's crooked.

Not nearly as crooked as Trump and his cronies (it doesn't get more crooked than using a tax-free "charity" to buy yourself stuff, as Trump has admittedly done), but as crooked as Washington pols tend to be.  So what?  The non-crooked politicians all failed to gain any traction in the primaries.  I think that is a lesson learned.

If you have to pick your crooks, picked incompetent crooks like Trump is the sucker's choice.

Quote from: alfred russel on December 07, 2016, 05:36:39 PM
Berkut, excellent diatribe, but you realize he said he voted for Johnson?

That's actually the code word:  "Johnson."  :lol:

I don't think he lies. I think he reads a post, makes an assumption about the intent behind the post / post's purpose, and then he carries that assumption with him for awhile. in other cases, I think he simply misremembers some key details, and his misremembering blends itself into Truth According to Raz. similar to those studies re: witness identification and faulty memory (witness *knowing* the defendant attacked her, seeing his face in her nightmares, etc., but he didn't actually do it)

Quote from: grumbler on December 07, 2016, 09:49:02 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 02:48:04 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:38:21 PM
Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

She's crooked.

Not nearly as crooked as Trump and his cronies (it doesn't get more crooked than using a tax-free "charity" to buy yourself stuff, as Trump has admittedly done), but as crooked as Washington pols tend to be.  So what?  The non-crooked politicians all failed to gain any traction in the primaries.  I think that is a lesson learned.

If you have to pick your crooks, picked incompetent crooks like Trump is the sucker's choice.

Well, when the president does it, that means it is not crooked.

Quote from: FunkMonk on December 07, 2016, 09:56:30 PM

Quote from: grumbler on December 07, 2016, 09:49:02 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 02:48:04 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:38:21 PM
Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

She's crooked.

Not nearly as crooked as Trump and his cronies (it doesn't get more crooked than using a tax-free "charity" to buy yourself stuff, as Trump has admittedly done), but as crooked as Washington pols tend to be.  So what?  The non-crooked politicians all failed to gain any traction in the primaries.  I think that is a lesson learned.

If you have to pick your crooks, picked incompetent crooks like Trump is the sucker's choice.

Well, when the president does it, that means it is not crooked.

Except that he's not the president.  :lol:

Quote from: grumbler on December 07, 2016, 09:51:09 PM

Quote from: alfred russel on December 07, 2016, 05:36:39 PM
Berkut, excellent diatribe, but you realize he said he voted for Johnson?

That's actually the code word:  "Johnson."  :lol:

"States' Rights"

"Kenyan colonialism"

"You sounded taller on the radio"

Quote from: Berkut on December 07, 2016, 09:34:57 PM

Quote from: LaCroix on December 07, 2016, 09:05:53 PM
I dunno, was just making a general comment that I've observed about raz's memory in cases like these. some details might be technically true, but it seems a lot of times the context is twisted so the comment / argument / whatever that raz repeats is not at all what the original person intended

Indeed. He constantly makes claims about what I once said or did, that I am always like "Huh? I don't think I said that...and certainly not in the context he is suggesting, but..."

I am curious whether

A) He is just making shit up, or
B) He really believes it, but it is completely untrue,
C) He is remembering something that actually happened, and remembers the context as well, but doesn't care because he is inately dishonest, as has been shown time and again, or
D) If he is really relating something that happened, in context, and he just has a much, much better memory than the rest of us.

D is possible, but given that I've already caught him out in a straight up example of A, I suspect that we cannot really give him the benefit of that doubt.

Are you talking about the the birther thing?  Cause I can link you to it.

Quote from: grumbler on December 07, 2016, 10:07:58 PM

Quote from: FunkMonk on December 07, 2016, 09:56:30 PM

Quote from: grumbler on December 07, 2016, 09:49:02 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 07, 2016, 02:48:04 PM

Quote from: Valmy on December 07, 2016, 02:38:21 PM
Spicey's reaction is exactly why we are going to be bombarded by radicals from now on. Clinton is hated by Spicey as a hard leftist but hated by the actual leftists for being a corporate conservative stooge and a warmonger. There is no point to moderating or governing as a centrist.

She's crooked.

Not nearly as crooked as Trump and his cronies (it doesn't get more crooked than using a tax-free "charity" to buy yourself stuff, as Trump has admittedly done), but as crooked as Washington pols tend to be.  So what?  The non-crooked politicians all failed to gain any traction in the primaries.  I think that is a lesson learned.

If you have to pick your crooks, picked incompetent crooks like Trump is the sucker's choice.

Well, when the president does it, that means it is not crooked.

Except that he's not the president.  :lol:

RIP tricky dick

Quote'The Intel on This Wasn't 100%,' Says Pizzeria Gunman
The Comet Ping Pong Gunman Answers Our Reporter's Questions

New York Times
By ADAM GOLDMAN
DEC. 7, 2016

WASHINGTON — Edgar M. Welch, 28, of Salisbury, N.C., was arrested Sunday after firing a gun inside a pizza restaurant in Washington as he investigated false claims in online articles that the pizzeria was at the center of a child sex slave ring, the police said. No one was injured by the gunfire, and Mr. Welch surrendered peacefully. The pizzeria, Comet Ping Pong, had been swept into a conspiracy theory, which linked the supposed ring to Hillary Clinton, because its owner had corresponded with the Clinton campaign about a fund-raising dinner.

On Wednesday, I spoke with Mr. Welch, who goes by his middle name, Maddison, by videoconference at an old hospital building adjacent to the city's jail. In his first news media interview since his arrest, Mr. Welch appeared downcast and at times distracted as he answered questions for 45 minutes, the maximum time allowed by the jail. "I just wanted to do some good and went about it the wrong way," he said.

What was his original plan?

Mr. Welch, the father of two daughters, said he woke up Sunday morning and told his family he had some things to do. He left "Smallsbury," a nickname for his hometown, for the 350-mile drive to Washington with the intention of giving the restaurant a "closer look" and then returning home. He wanted to "shine some light on it." As he made his way to Washington, he felt his "heart breaking over the thought of innocent people suffering." Once he got to the pizzeria, there was an abrupt change of plans. Mr. Welch would not say why he took a military-style assault rifle inside the restaurant and fired it. According to court documents, Mr. Welch said he had come armed to help rescue the children.

What did he think when he discovered there were no children at the pizzeria?

"The intel on this wasn't 100 percent," he said. However, he refused to dismiss outright the claims in the online articles, conceding only that there were no children "inside that dwelling." He also said that child slavery was a worldwide phenomenon.

He said it was through word of mouth. After recently having internet service installed at his house, he was "really able to look into it." He said that substantial evidence from a combination of sources had left him with the "impression something nefarious was happening." He said one article on the subject led to another and then another. He said he did not like the term fake news, believing it was meant to diminish stories outside the mainstream media, which he does not completely trust. He also said he was not political. While once a registered Republican, he did not vote for Donald J. Trump. He also did not vote for Mrs. Clinton. But he is praying that Mr. Trump takes the country in the "right direction."

What was he like?

Mr. Welch was soft-spoken and polite, and said he liked the outdoors. He was cautious when speaking about what happened, sometimes citing advice he had received from his lawyer. He said he did not believe in conspiracy theories, but then added that the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks needed to be re-examined. He has listened to Alex Jones, whose radio show traffics in conspiracy theories and who once said that Mrs. Clinton "has personally murdered and chopped up" children. "He's a bit eccentric," Mr. Welch said. "He touches on some issues that are viable but goes off the deep end on some things." Mr. Welch likes to read. A favorite is "Wild at Heart: Discovering the Secret of a Man's Soul," by John Eldredge, about masculinity in evangelical Christianity. He said he did not do drugs but drank the occasional beer. He misses his children: "They are in my thoughts every second of the day." He said he had grown religious in the last few years. Tattooed on his back are Bible verses: "Even youths grow tired and weary, and young men stumble and fall; but those who hope in the Lord will renew their strength. They will soar on wings like eagles; they will run and not grow weary, they will walk and not be faint."

Does he have any regrets?

Mr. Welch said that he had acted in haste and that, if he could, he would do a lot of things differently. "I regret how I handled the situation," he said.

Quote from: grumbler on December 07, 2016, 09:51:09 PM

Quote from: alfred russel on December 07, 2016, 05:36:39 PM
Berkut, excellent diatribe, but you realize he said he voted for Johnson?

That's actually the code word:  "Johnson."  :lol:

Johnson was actually a candidate for president. Over 4m people voted for him.

When he says he voted for Johnson, that doesn't mean he is using a code word. He may have actually voted for Johnson.

He may have.

It's a distinct possibility.

Bullshit.

Seriously.  There is a non-zero chance it happened.

Quote from: derspiess on December 08, 2016, 04:11:42 PM
Seriously.  There is a non-zero chance it happened.

Cool. .00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001 is non zero.

Quote from: derspiess on December 08, 2016, 04:11:42 PM
Seriously.  There is a non-zero chance it happened.

Did you black out in the polling booth?

Did we seriously need that giant wall of text garbo?

Quote from: Barrister on December 08, 2016, 04:24:59 PM
Did we seriously need that giant wall of text garbo?

Was the point received?

 :lol:

Garbon, have you heard of a scientific notation?

Quote from: garbon on December 08, 2016, 04:39:40 PM

Quote from: Barrister on December 08, 2016, 04:24:59 PM
Did we seriously need that giant wall of text garbo?

Was the point received?

Yeah, but it was in the 2nd line.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/12/10/business/media/pizzagate.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=image&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

Good run down including the part of the conspiracy theory Derspeiss believed in, that "obviously they were using pizza and other words as code for something."

QuoteFrom: Jim Steyer
To: John Podesta and Mary Podesta

Hey John,

We know you're a true master of cuisine and we have appreciated that for years ...

But walnut sauce for the pasta? Mary, plz tell us the straight story, was the sauce actually very tasty?

And

QuoteFrom: John Podesta
To: Jim Steyer and Mary Podesta

It's an amazing Ligurian dish made with crushed walnuts made into a paste. So stop being so California.

I wonder what kind of code they could be using...

Nuts? Clearly genderfluid bathrooms.

Eww, keep your gender fluids out of public bathrooms please.  :yucky:

Quote from: Tonitrus on December 11, 2016, 05:20:27 PM
Eww, keep your gender fluids out of public bathrooms please.  :yucky:

Sometimes it's salty, sometimes it's sweet! 

Quote from: Eddie Teach on December 08, 2016, 04:24:33 PM

Quote from: derspiess on December 08, 2016, 04:11:42 PM
Seriously.  There is a non-zero chance it happened.

Did you black out in the polling booth?

No, but as I always do I stared at the names on the ballot for a minute or so and imagined each person being president.  Except for Richard Duncan, the "Nonparty candidate".  No idea who that dude was.

I understand. It's just not your fault if all the presidents you imagine are white men. 

Quote from: Oexmelin on December 12, 2016, 11:07:40 AM
I understand. It's just not your fault if all the presidents you imagine are white men. 

I imagined Hillary.  And it was bad.

Quote from: derspiess on December 12, 2016, 11:34:57 AM

Quote from: Oexmelin on December 12, 2016, 11:07:40 AM
I understand. It's just not your fault if all the presidents you imagine are white men. 

I imagined Hillary.  And it was bad.

Did you imagine Jill?

Quote from: Valmy on December 12, 2016, 11:37:01 AM

Quote from: derspiess on December 12, 2016, 11:34:57 AM

Quote from: Oexmelin on December 12, 2016, 11:07:40 AM
I understand. It's just not your fault if all the presidents you imagine are white men. 

I imagined Hillary.  And it was bad.

Did you imagine Jill?

Yeah, briefly.  Made me giggle.