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Breaking news: Margaret Thatcher has died

Started by The Larch, April 08, 2013, 06:56:05 AM

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garbon

#60
April 08, 2013, 02:22:59 PM
Quote from: Josephus on April 08, 2013, 01:50:35 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on April 08, 2013, 11:51:19 AM
Quote from: Josephus on April 08, 2013, 07:26:04 AM
:cheers:

I expected better from you

Yes. But it was my passive aggressive reaction shown to the vitriol spewed on the Chavez thread...there was the same nonsense there.

I guess that's fair though I think the difference might be a net positive legacy versus net negative.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

derspiess

#61
April 08, 2013, 02:28:43 PM
Quote from: Jacob on April 08, 2013, 01:12:04 PM
... at least, that's how it seems to me. Does that make more sense to you?

No.  Thanks making the attempt to explain, though.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Sheilbh

#62
April 08, 2013, 02:35:49 PM
I'd add that Thatcher was very confrontational. Her political style wasn't to try and seek or build consensus (Malcolm Rifkind told a story today about once asking her if she believed in consensus, she replied 'yes, consensus behind my convictions' :lol:), she wanted to win and to vanquish her foes entirely.

I can't think of any other Western leader who described a large chunk of their country as 'the enemy within'. Also Presidents are allowed to rise above politics, especially once they've left office, whereas that's for the Queen; prime ministers are always muddy and partisan, tribal hatreds tend not to die at best they mellow.

In addition I think the Iain Martin point is valid. In large parts of the country she was seen as an almost alien force. Especially as she became increasingly grand and a little bit mad ('we are a grandmother').

It's also of course a mark of her success. No-one hates a mediocrity. There was little passion when Harold Wilson died because he hadn't achieved enough to truly inspire or offend.

It is striking, though, that her and Blair are probably the most divisive and reviled former PMs. They're also the only ones who never lost an election.
Let's bomb Russia!

Jacob

#63
April 08, 2013, 02:41:23 PM
Quote from: derspiess on April 08, 2013, 02:28:43 PM
Quote from: Jacob on April 08, 2013, 01:12:04 PM
... at least, that's how it seems to me. Does that make more sense to you?

No.  Thanks making the attempt to explain, though.
:lol:

No worries :cheers:

derspiess

#64
April 08, 2013, 02:42:41 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on April 08, 2013, 02:35:49 PM
I can't think of any other Western leader who described a large chunk of their country as 'the enemy within'.

Obama.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Sheilbh

#65
April 08, 2013, 02:45:31 PM
Who did he call 'the enemy within'?

I've not noticed many accusations of 5th columnism issuing from the White House.
Let's bomb Russia!

Jacob

#66
April 08, 2013, 02:46:13 PM
Quote from: derspiess on April 08, 2013, 02:42:41 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on April 08, 2013, 02:35:49 PM
I can't think of any other Western leader who described a large chunk of their country as 'the enemy within'.

Obama.

Link?

Viking

#67
April 08, 2013, 02:46:16 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on April 08, 2013, 02:35:49 PM
It is striking, though, that her and Blair are probably the most divisive and reviled former PMs. They're also the only ones who never lost an election.

Seeing somebody lose an election can be satisfaction enough. Just imagine LOTR or Star Wars ending with Sauron or Darth Vader still walking around undefeated having humiliated the heros only to finally be replaced when the Uruk-Hair and Imperial Stormtroopers select a new leader by vote. It certainly wouldn't be emotionally satisfying. You either die a hero (or lose an election) or see yourself become a villain.
First Maxim - "There are only two amounts, too few and enough."
First Corollary - "You cannot have too many soldiers, only too few supplies."
Second Maxim - "Be willing to exchange a bad idea for a good one."
Second Corollary - "You can only be wrong or agree with me."

A terrorist which starts a slaughter quoting Locke, Burke and Mill has completely missed the point.
The fact remains that the only person or group to applaud the Norway massacre are random Islamists.

Jacob

#68
April 08, 2013, 02:48:13 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on April 08, 2013, 02:45:31 PM
Who did he call 'the enemy within'?

I've not noticed many accusations of 5th columnism issuing from the White House.

It usually flows towards the White House these days. Secret muslim socialist and all that.

garbon

#69
April 08, 2013, 02:50:32 PM
Quote from: Jacob on April 08, 2013, 02:48:13 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on April 08, 2013, 02:45:31 PM
Who did he call 'the enemy within'?

I've not noticed many accusations of 5th columnism issuing from the White House.

It usually flows towards the White House these days. Secret muslim socialist and all that.

Well Obama did attack both the working class and the wealthy but yes I would agree that it is more of a Republican sentiment against the POTUS.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

derspiess

#70
April 08, 2013, 02:56:04 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on April 08, 2013, 02:45:31 PM
Who did he call 'the enemy within'?

I've not noticed many accusations of 5th columnism issuing from the White House.

He didn't explicitly say "the enemy within" so if you're hung up on that specific term then never mind.

He did refer to his short time working in the private sector as being "behind enemy lines" and implored Latinos to punish their enemies by voting.
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Razgovory

#71
April 08, 2013, 02:59:35 PM
 :lol:  Nice try Derspeiss.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

derspiess

#72
April 08, 2013, 03:00:13 PM
Oh, joy.  My Argie FB friends have discovered my "RIP" post :angry: :lol:
"If you can play a guitar and harmonica at the same time, like Bob Dylan or Neil Young, you're a genius. But make that extra bit of effort and strap some cymbals to your knees, suddenly people want to get the hell away from you."  --Rich Hall

Valmy

#73
April 08, 2013, 03:01:56 PM
Quote from: derspiess on April 08, 2013, 02:42:41 PM
Quote from: Sheilbh on April 08, 2013, 02:35:49 PM
I can't think of any other Western leader who described a large chunk of their country as 'the enemy within'.

Obama.

I would have gone with the Clintons and their VRWC myself.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Ed Anger

#74
April 08, 2013, 03:04:16 PM
Quote from: derspiess on April 08, 2013, 03:00:13 PM
Oh, joy.  My Argie FB friends have discovered my "RIP" post :angry: :lol:

Somebody is getting a strap on surprise tonight.
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive
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