Obama dares Republicans to block his coming jobs package

[Faeelin]

Eh even if he did offer specifics who cares?  It is not like when he does it really means anything.

I think it would mean a lot.  Particularly since he's already talking about how he'd use it against the GOP if they were against it. 

I really hope it includes a huge extension on unemployment benefits, since the administration seems to think that's a good way to get people back to work.

So, what do you think should happen to people on unemployment benefits?

I actually think the GOP will pursue austerity while in power. We aren't seeing Republican legislatures and governors pursuing stimulus programs now, right? They are probably an indication of how serious the GOP is about austerity at the expense of job creation.

[derspiess]

So, what do you think should happen to people on unemployment benefits?

Depends on how long they've been on them.  I'm not opposed to the general idea of unemployment insurance, but I think extending them to 99 weeks was a bit excessive.

I actually think the GOP will pursue austerity while in power.

Raz would like a word with you.

We aren't seeing Republican legislatures and governors pursuing stimulus programs now, right? They are probably an indication of how serious the GOP is about austerity at the expense of job creation.

I disagree with your underlying notion there, which seems to be that austerity <-----> job growth is a zero sum game, but if decreased spending comes at the cost of some unsustainable potential "make-work" jobs, then so be it.

[Valmy]

Alot of the States have to do austerity anyway regardless of what ideology they follow.  They cannot just print more money so if they do not have the money they have to either make cuts or start borrowing and most of them are not comfortable enough with their future prospects to take such a risk...oh and alot of them have balanced budget provisions in their constitutions.

So I do not think that necessarily means that will be what happens on a federal level once the Republicans get their next shot.

[11B4V]

If we include protests about TARP then I suppose that means Michael Moore is a Tea Party member.

Michael Moore

What happened to Boss Hogg

[Faeelin]

I disagree with your underlying notion there, which seems to be that austerity <-----> job growth is a zero sum game, but if decreased spending comes at the cost of some unsustainable potential "make-work" jobs, then so be it.

Well, we have seen some prominent nations pursuing austerity the past few years. How's that working out?

[Barrister]

I disagree with your underlying notion there, which seems to be that austerity <-----> job growth is a zero sum game, but if decreased spending comes at the cost of some unsustainable potential "make-work" jobs, then so be it.

Well, we have seen some prominent nations pursuing austerity the past few years. How's that working out?

Fiscal austerity very much tends to be a "short term pain for long term gain" kind of thing.

Better question is to ask how countries pursuing austerity are doing in ten years.

[grumbler]

really, what was the plan for post-war Iraq, I mean, to stabilize the country once Saddam was toppled?  What has been done within the 1st year post-Saddam?

The plan was, as Cheney announced, to have the Iraqis greet US troops with flowers, so no other plans were needed, what with Cheney being infallible and all.

[grumbler]

Better question is to ask how countries pursuing austerity are doing in ten years.

Ten years after Clinton, not so well.

[Barrister]

Better question is to ask how countries pursuing austerity are doing in ten years.

Ten years after Clinton, not so well.

I dunno - it seems to me Clinton got serious about the deficit after 1994, when Newt took the House.

1994-2004 were some pretty good years.

[grumbler]

1994-2004 were some pretty good years.

2004 had the highest unemployment between 1996 and 2009.  Government debt was rising, the trade balance was the second-worst in modern history (followed the next year by the worst), tax revenues (%GDP) were worse than before 1980, and the worst until the '09 crash.

Not so good ten years out.

This isn't to say it wouldn't have been worse without the discipline of the Clinton years, of course.

[Razgovory]

If we include protests about TARP then I suppose that means Michael Moore is a Tea Party member.

He might have been, if it wasn't for all those conservatives showing up at the movement.  Your attempt to argue based on Michael Moore has failed.

And you know, Leftists protesting corporate greed.

[Faeelin]

So, what do you think should happen to people on unemployment benefits?

Depends on how long they've been on them.  I'm not opposed to the general idea of unemployment insurance, but I think extending them to 99 weeks was a bit excessive.

Well, the unemployment rate now is 9.2% right? So what's your plan for people who can't get a job?

I disagree with your underlying notion there, which seems to be that austerity <-----> job growth is a zero sum game, but if decreased spending comes at the cost of some unsustainable potential "make-work" jobs, then so be it.

I agree that in the long term austerity can improve the economy, but I don't see how it can boost the economy in the short term.

[Razgovory]

If we include protests about TARP then I suppose that means Michael Moore is a Tea Party member.

Michael Moore

What happened to Boss Hogg

Barbour is still Scippy's gov, as far as I know.

[Admiral Yi]

Well, we have seen some prominent nations pursuing austerity the past few years. How's that working out?

For some it has achieved the intended purpose--maintaining the ability to borrow at reasonable terms.

[derspiess]

Well, the unemployment rate now is 9.2% right? So what's your plan for people who can't get a job?

Well, some of those folks are going to have make-do with taking a job that may pay less than their previous job.  I know it sucks to have to do that, but we cannot afford to extend unemployment benefits indefinitely.  Otherwise we'll end up with a nation of Cousin Eddies who are unemployed for 7 years because they're "holding out for a management position"

As far as a plan to fight fight unemployment, all I can think of is to maybe try to remove some barriers (certain labor laws, etc.) that may discourage employers.  And maybe cut down on the talk about raising taxes on "the rich"-- many small business owners are "the rich" and they're less likely to hire if they think their taxes might increase in the near future.

I agree that in the long term austerity can improve the economy, but I don't see how it can boost the economy in the short term.

Businesses think long-term.  If they see congress taking the debt/deficit problems seriously (maybe even if that includes some slight tax increases), I think they'll have more confidence in the future of the economy & resume hiring.

But beyond that, we simply can't afford any more Keynesian attempts to jump-start the economy through wasteful spending.  And FWIW, I don't think many (if any) of the recently-proposed "cuts" qualify as austerity.