Turkey for the EU!

[KRonn]

Just disgusting on so many levels. For one, to kill someone for some of the reasons stated by those who follow such customs. Then for a family to kill their own, especially for parents, and other male relatives, to be able to do this. Just barbaric. How do loving parents and a community conspire to kill kids, young girls usually? Do they actually feel good about themselves after? One would think that long ago this kind of thing would have become repulsive to them, no matter their beliefs.

[Pat]

Quite right! I've been to Turkey and Greece several times, and they really are the same, except the Turks are less annoying. In Greece people would often talk to you about their dislike of Turks and of Jews (one time the guy running our hotel said Hitler might've been on to something). I was in Turkey during Greece's victory of the European Championship, and most turks didn't seem to care when I talked to them about it. Turks are generally more chilled out than Greeks, especially Turks from the western coastal areas. And if you talk to them they'll tell you most Turks who emigrate to Europe are poor peasants from rural areas who've practically never been to a city and give Turks a bad name.

For some reason, the Greeks abroad do not engage in Turkish immigrant-like shenanigans so colour me skeptical.
They are more like Italians or even  Spaniards.

Turks from the western coastal areas are like Italians or Spaniards too. Though the same can not be said of those from rural areas in eastern Turkey.

[Grallon]

What exactly are the expected benefits of Turkey's entry into the EU?  I mean aside from cheap labor?




G.

[Duque de Bragança]

Quite right! I've been to Turkey and Greece several times, and they really are the same, except the Turks are less annoying. In Greece people would often talk to you about their dislike of Turks and of Jews (one time the guy running our hotel said Hitler might've been on to something). I was in Turkey during Greece's victory of the European Championship, and most turks didn't seem to care when I talked to them about it. Turks are generally more chilled out than Greeks, especially Turks from the western coastal areas. And if you talk to them they'll tell you most Turks who emigrate to Europe are poor peasants from rural areas who've practically never been to a city and give Turks a bad name.

For some reason, the Greeks abroad do not engage in Turkish immigrant-like shenanigans so colour me skeptical.
They are more like Italians or even  Spaniards.

Turks from the western coastal areas are like Italians or Spaniards too. Though the same can not be said of those from rural areas in eastern Turkey.

Unless you count the ladino speaking ones, I still don't see them like Italians or Spaniards, cultures are not alike. I'll grant you they are somewhat westernised though.

[Viking]

What exactly are the expected benefits of Turkey's entry into the EU?  I mean aside from cheap labor?




G.

Solidifying the democratic institutions of Turkey.
Strengthening Turkey as an object for investment and as a market for Europeans.
Reducing the immigration pressure from Turkey by providing opportunities for Turks in Turkey.
Strengthening the position of the Universalist Humanist Philosophy of Europe.
Strengthening peace and stability in all of europe.

[Pat]

Quite right! I've been to Turkey and Greece several times, and they really are the same, except the Turks are less annoying. In Greece people would often talk to you about their dislike of Turks and of Jews (one time the guy running our hotel said Hitler might've been on to something). I was in Turkey during Greece's victory of the European Championship, and most turks didn't seem to care when I talked to them about it. Turks are generally more chilled out than Greeks, especially Turks from the western coastal areas. And if you talk to them they'll tell you most Turks who emigrate to Europe are poor peasants from rural areas who've practically never been to a city and give Turks a bad name.

For some reason, the Greeks abroad do not engage in Turkish immigrant-like shenanigans so colour me skeptical.
They are more like Italians or even  Spaniards.

Turks from the western coastal areas are like Italians or Spaniards too. Though the same can not be said of those from rural areas in eastern Turkey.

Unless you count the ladino speaking ones, I still don't see them like Italians or Spaniards, cultures are not alike. I'll grant you they are somewhat westernised though.

I'd say the culture is more mediterranean than anything else. A place like Antalya or Izmir feels no less western than any spanish or italian city. It's certainly not in the arab or muslim cultural sphere.

[Josquius]

The big thing I see against Turkey in the EU is the massive border that would give the EU.
Its easy to control the current border with Turkey but the Turkish border...well we'd have loads of Arabs and Iranians and Afghans (via Iran) storming over and getting right into the EU.
I still support Turkish entry of course (though it would be better with a independant Kurdistan first) but thats the main valid argument.

[The Brain]

What exactly are the expected benefits of Turkey's entry into the EU?  I mean aside from cheap labor?




G.

Solidifying the democratic institutions of Turkey.
Strengthening Turkey as an object for investment and as a market for Europeans.
Reducing the immigration pressure from Turkey by providing opportunities for Turks in Turkey.
Strengthening the position of the Universalist Humanist Philosophy of Europe.
Strengthening peace and stability in all of europe.

[Iormlund]

I'd say the culture is more mediterranean than anything else. A place like Antalya or Izmir feels no less western than any spanish or italian city. It's certainly not in the arab or muslim cultural sphere.

Somehow I don't see the traditional aggressiveness of Italian males working that well in a Muslim country, whatever moderate.

[Agelastus]

Wiki's list of countries by murder rate has Turkey's at a bit higher than the USA, at 6.23 per 100k, which would give them about 4500 per year, if it's correct.

I'm getting curious here - am I on some people's ignore list so my posts don't show up?




As for letting Turkey into the EU? It should be done for the best reason possible...it will upset the French.

[derspiess]

well we'd have loads of Arabs and Iranians and Afghans (via Iran) storming over and getting right into the EU.

As opposed to...?

[Jacob]

What exactly are the expected benefits of Turkey's entry into the EU?  I mean aside from cheap labor?

Your annoyance alone would make it worth it.

[The Larch]

The big thing I see against Turkey in the EU is the massive border that would give the EU.
Its easy to control the current border with Turkey but the Turkish border...well we'd have loads of Arabs and Iranians and Afghans (via Iran) storming over and getting right into the EU.
I still support Turkish entry of course (though it would be better with a independant Kurdistan first) but thats the main valid argument.

Pfft, that argument doesn't hold any water. Most illegal inmigration come through airports, not by sneaking through the land borders at night, commando infiltration-wise. And there are still entire boatloads of africans, pakistanis and others coming to the shores of Greece, Italy and Spain anyway.

[citizen k]

Most illegal inmigration come through airports, not by sneaking through the land borders at night, commando infiltration-wise.

How does that work? Don't you need papers and whatnot at customs when you get off the plane? I imagine most illegal immigrants enter the EU by crossing the eastern border and from smugglers in the Med.

[The Larch]

Most illegal inmigration come through airports, not by sneaking through the land borders at night, commando infiltration-wise.

How does that work? Don't you need papers and whatnot at customs when you get off the plane? I imagine most illegal immigrants enter the EU by crossing the eastern border and from smugglers in the Med.

At least in Spain, the main way of inmigrating illegally is over staying a tourist visa, and number wise the main entrance of illegal inmigrants is Barajas airport in Madrid. Of course there's traficking too, mostly with Africans.