Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Habbaku]

[Valmy]

I forgot to post Gladstone's euphoric joy at this Liberal victory:



That man knew how to party.

[Habbaku]

Stern, sober, boring liberalism will save us all.

[Valmy]

Stern, sober, boring liberalism will save us all.

Your newsletter, sir, to which I would be very much interested in subscribing.

[celedhring]

So, for those following it more closely, I have two questions:

a) Is the bill barring a no-deal likely to get passed?
b) Would it be effective or can the Govt ignore it/find some procedimental mumbo-jumbo?

[Tamas]

Stern, sober, boring liberalism will save us all.

Unfortunately, passionate Twitter tirades, and extreme positions yelled from bottoms of lungs are far more entertaining, and therefore will remain more popular.

[Tamas]

So, for those following it more closely, I have two questions:

a) Is the bill barring a no-deal likely to get passed?
b) Would it be effective or can the Govt ignore it/find some procedimental mumbo-jumbo?

a) IMHO yes

b) In theory, they cannot lawfully ignore it, but I don't think anyone can stop them in time if they chose to. Sure, eventually the courts would declare the no-deal crashout that follows illegal, but that will be little help in, say, December, when we will already have been out. On the other hand, though, I don't think Johnson is prepared to risk his career, so he will uphold it, and call an election.

[Habbaku]

Stern, sober, boring liberalism will save us all.

Unfortunately, passionate Twitter tirades, and extreme positions yelled from bottoms of lungs are far more entertaining, and therefore will remain more popular.

The answer is clearly to go on Twitter and yell as loud as possible about how the Jews and Communists are trying to prevent us from having free trade and a clean environment.

[The Brain]

Surely the way to avoid no deal is to agree to a deal? How do you say no to no deal without agreeing to, you know, a deal?

Does UK MPs still think that Parliament saying no to no deal makes a no deal (the default position ever since Article 50 was activated) not happening?

[The Brain]

US VP Mike Pence had uncomfortable message for Varadkar: "As Brexit deadline approaches -we urge Ireland and EU as well to negotiate in good faith with Prime minister Boris Johnson and work to reach an agreement that respects UK sovereignty + minimises disruption to commerce"

Johnson is getting helpful help from the other blond pathological liar's crew.

Maybe Pence should STFU. Just a thought.

[The Brain]

So, for those following it more closely, I have two questions:

a) Is the bill barring a no-deal likely to get passed?
b) Would it be effective or can the Govt ignore it/find some procedimental mumbo-jumbo?

AFAIK the EU deals with the government, not directly with Parliament. And AFAIK the government can ignore Parliament for quite some time without ceasing to be the goverment. If Parliament cannot make the government do its bidding then clearly Parliament isn't sovereign anyway.

[Iormlund]

IIRC Parliament holds government accountable by being able to use a vote of no confidence. Except in this case, a VoNC helps Boris. That is, unless some other government is voted in (which seems unlikely).

[Tamas]

Guardian live coverage labelled it "shocking" that an EU briefing of diplomats has revealed there has been no negotiation with the Johnson government and that the UK has not put forward a single idea for the backstop alternatives Johnson touts as his wunderwaffen.


For me the shocking part is anybody considering this surprising. If a credible alternative existed, the British government would be very loudly and publicly advertising it, as it would validate their stance. It is very obvious, that no such thing exists, and Johnson is trying to force through things with the sheer power of bullshit.

[Razgovory]

Stern, sober, boring liberalism will save us all.

God I hope so.  You guys know me, I've long been critical of libertarian ideals, but were I British I would join the Lib-Dems in a sec.  I simply can't in good conscious side with either Labor or the Conservatives at this point.  I don't think Labor would even let me in.  I'd be a Blairite.

[crazy canuck]

IIRC Parliament holds government accountable by being able to use a vote of no confidence. Except in this case, a VoNC helps Boris. That is, unless some other government is voted in (which seems unlikely).

It depends entirely on how it is done. The smart move would be to have a government in waiting based on a coalition and then have the VoNC.  That way the Queen does not have to dissolve this Parliament and call an election.  She can simply say that the Boris government has lost the confidence of Parliament but the other group does and make that group government.

But you are correct, if there is simply a non confidence vote without a government in waiting then that helps Boris. Otherwise he would need a super-majority to request the Queen to call a new election.


edit: I should also add that with Corbyn at the helm of Labour, the smart move is very unlikely.