Stolen Valor: The Megathread

[grumbler]

The original was, due to free speech. It was too broad and appearenly shitbags have a right to lie about military service.
The new one only applies to people that lie about military service to receive monetary compensation or benefits.

So if Alcibiades here lied claiming he got a Bronze Star with V in Iraq, is ok because he is not making money here, but when Joe Teti lied to get a job in Dual Survival, he was lieying to receive money, therefore Stolen Valor applies.

I do like how the "I'm just a dummy grunt" schtick disappears when it comes to things you really care about! 

However, both you and Hawke misunderstand the SV Act, I believe.  The current SVA refers to specific awards that you cannot falsely claim to possess in order to receive tangible benefits.  Merely claiming to be a "combat veteran" is not, contrary to Hawke's (and your) claim, a violation of the current SVA.  It's possible that Hawke's comment came before the invalidation of the previous law, though.

[Siege]

The original was, due to free speech. It was too broad and appearenly shitbags have a right to lie about military service.
The new one only applies to people that lie about military service to receive monetary compensation or benefits.

So if Alcibiades here lied claiming he got a Bronze Star with V in Iraq, is ok because he is not making money here, but when Joe Teti lied to get a job in Dual Survival, he was lieying to receive money, therefore Stolen Valor applies.

I do like how the "I'm just a dummy grunt" schtick disappears when it comes to things you really care about! 

However, both you and Hawke misunderstand the SV Act, I believe.  The current SVA refers to specific awards that you cannot falsely claim to possess in order to receive tangible benefits.  Merely claiming to be a "combat veteran" is not, contrary to Hawke's (and your) claim, a violation of the current SVA.  It's possible that Hawke's comment came before the invalidation of the previous law, though.

Well, I see your point. He still lied though.
Judge by yourself below. To me it sounds like a complete misdirection.

[Siege]

If you say "I am a special forces operator combat veteran", and the SF stint was not in combat, and his deployments to Iraq and Afghanistan were as a civilian, then you are fuckin lying. Do you agree with me?

[Valmy]

Even if he could spin this as a truthful statement, it is still told in such a way as to give a false impression, so yes it is a fucking lie from a normal person point of view.  From a soulless law talking point of view?  Not sure.

[Barrister]

Even if he could spin this as a truthful statement, it is still told in such a way as to give a false impression, so yes it is a fucking lie from a normal person point of view.  From a soulless law talking point of view?  Not sure.

Merely telling a lie is not a crime or offence, so as a soulless law talker I could care less whether his statement was truthful or not.

[Siege]

These are his awards according to the Army, release under FOIA.
As you can see he does not have a CIB, which means no combat.
I don't know about you, but i have never seen a SF guy without a CIB.



And below you can see he served until 2000. Meaning no service in Iraq and Ahganistan.

[dps]

Even if he could spin this as a truthful statement, it is still told in such a way as to give a false impression, so yes it is a fucking lie from a normal person point of view.  From a soulless law talking point of view?  Not sure.

From a law-talking POV, in general, it's legal to lie, except under certain circumstances, such as testifying under oath.  Even if he lied to get the show, it probably wouldn't be prosecuted as a criminal fraud;  it would be up to Disney to hit him with a civil suit if they wanted to.  And even then, it might not be found to be a serious enough misrepresentation to amount to fraud (people are sort of expected to puff themselves up a bit when seeking employment) or it could come to light that there was no fraud because Disney knew all about his record and hired him anyway.

[Admiral Yi]

Is lying on an affadavit (sp?) considered perjury?

[Valmy]

Merely telling a lie is not a crime or offence, so as a soulless law talker I could care less whether his statement was truthful or not.

Well if you were prosecuting him for breaking SV laws you probably would.

[Siege]

My question is, can a civilian be a combat veteran?
I have never met anybody that claimed to a "civilian combat veteran".
But then, I have always been surrounded by people that have served.

You guys are the only civilians that I speak with, so do you see a civilian contrator as a combat veteran, or is the term reserved especificly for people serving their country?

[Valmy]

If somebody says 'I am a civilian combat veteran'.

I will think they are some sort of mercenary.

[11B4V]

These are his awards according to the Army, release under FOIA.
As you can see he does not have a CIB, which means no combat.
I don't know about you, but i have never seen a SF guy without a CIB.



And below you can see he served until 2000. Meaning no service in Iraq and Ahganistan.

This guy you're on the mark with IMO.

[dps]

If somebody says 'I am a civilian combat veteran'.

I will think they are some sort of mercenary.

I don't know;  I'd think he meant he'd been in something like the WWII French Marquis.  Well, if he was old and French, but you get the idea.

[Admiral Yi]

Veteran to me means someone who has served in the military.

[mongers]

I'd guess the producers of the TV programme might have the best, biggest claim against him; I wouldn't be surprised if there weren't clauses in the contract/s he signed that ask him to affirm his past as attested by him is real.