Scottish Independence

[Barrister]

Tyr as always shows himself to be silly. The United Kingdom is not a geographical or a historical name - it is a name specifically relevant to the political structure of the state. If the United Kingdom uses the name after Scotland leaves, it would be like modern Poland using the name of the Commonwealth of Poland and Lithuania.

Well, not quite.

The full name is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

They could just as easily keep that same name, or could change to the United Kingdom of England, Wales, and Northern Ireland.

[garbon]

Tyr as always shows himself to be silly. The United Kingdom is not a geographical or a historical name - it is a name specifically relevant to the political structure of the state. If the United Kingdom uses the name after Scotland leaves, it would be like modern Poland using the name of the Commonwealth of Poland and Lithuania.

The official name is United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. I don't see why it couldn't be "United Kingdom of England and Northern Ireland" and still go by United Kingdom as a commonly used name.

[Valmy]

It would be the United Kingdom of England and Northern Ireland technically at that point but I am sure Wales would like a mention.

[garbon]

BB & Valm

[Admiral Yi]

The official name is United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. I don't see why it couldn't be "United Kingdom of England and Northern Ireland" and still go by United Kingdom as a commonly used name.

Because the kingdoms united in the United Kingdom are England and Scotland.

[Barrister]

The official name is United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. I don't see why it couldn't be "United Kingdom of England and Northern Ireland" and still go by United Kingdom as a commonly used name.

Because the kingdoms united in the United Kingdom are England and Scotland.

No.

After the Act of Union in 1707 the name was the Kingdom of Great Britain.

After the Act of Union in 1801 that it became the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland.

So it's the "Great Britain" part of the name altered by Scotland's departure, not the "United Kingdom".

[MadImmortalMan]

I thought the Great Britain name included England and Scotland and that the addition if NI made it UK.

Edit: ninja

[Admiral Yi]

 

[derspiess]

You guys gotta do more to convince Yi.

[Admiral Yi]

The problem I'm having with that is that Ireland hadn't been a kingdom for some time when it was annexed, no?

[Barrister]

The problem I'm having with that is that Ireland hadn't been a kingdom for some time when it was annexed, no?

England (and Scotland) were essentially in a "personal union" with England (in EU terms).  Same monarch, different parliaments and governmental structure.

Edit: My googling suggests that Henry VIII converted the English holdings in Ireland from a lordship into the Kingdom of Ireland in 1541, with of course himself as King.

[Berkut]

So if this fails, and I think at this point only the insane hope otherwise, hopefully if nothing else the exercise will have shown why the entire idea is so terrible, and nobody will revisit it again.

[Richard Hakluyt]

The problem I'm having with that is that Ireland hadn't been a kingdom for some time when it was annexed, no?

It was a kingdom up until the act of Union in 1801.

[Richard Hakluyt]

So if this fails, and I think at this point only the insane hope otherwise, hopefully if nothing else the exercise will have shown why the entire idea is so terrible, and nobody will revisit it again.

I think that the overwhelming majority of UK citizens would like their government to be less centralised. Sheilbh mentioned way back in this thread how bin collections were being interfered with by a cabinet minister, utterly ridiculous but also typical of the current arrangements.

Hopefully there will be a NO vote and subsequent improvements to the way the whole of the UK is governed.

[Berkut]

So if this fails, and I think at this point only the insane hope otherwise, hopefully if nothing else the exercise will have shown why the entire idea is so terrible, and nobody will revisit it again.

I think that the overwhelming majority of UK citizens would like their government to be less centralised. Sheilbh mentioned way back in this thread how bin collections were being interfered with by a cabinet minister, utterly ridiculous but also typical of the current arrangements.

Hopefully there will be a NO vote and subsequent improvements to the way the whole of the UK is governed.

Yeah, I could certainly see that. And that would be a good thing - the tendency towards any federal government to take on power and more control to itself is well known.