[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[HVC]

Say what you will about Poilievre, but Donald Trump he aint.

You yourself posted a video that belies that statement

[Barrister]

Say what you will about Poilievre, but Donald Trump he aint.

You yourself posted a video that belies that statement

Donald Trump couldn't spell Pythagoras.  Not to mention how much he loves debt.

And Holy Shit - he even (in passing) goes after MAID - more as a symptom then a problem in and of itself, but still.

No idea if any of this is good politics, but it's great at winning the Barrister vote.

[HVC]

Pythagoras was a crazy cult leader who plagiarized his theorem and had a weird bean obsession. Not the best role model

[Grey Fox]

One more step towards independence.

[Jacob]

No idea if any of this is good politics, but it's great at winning the Barrister vote.

A shocking development 

[Admiral Yi]

Say what you will about Poilievre, but Donald Trump he aint.

You're punching a straw man.  No one said he's a carbon copy, rather that his language and approach to culture war issues is the same.

[Jacob]

I will concede that Poilievre is not completely unhinged, he is not a known sexual predator, nor is he profoundly corrupt or actively telling one brazen lie after another in an attempt to undermine democracy.

While I agree with Yi's characterization, I agree with Beeb that Poilievre is indeed no Trump; and that's a good thing.

[viper37]

Another Pierre Poilievre video dropped - on debt.  15 minutes long.

Lots of scary music, but again citing a bunch of statistics and academic papers.  I love how crunchy this stuff is.

Say what you will about Poilievre, but Donald Trump he aint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p20v8vBwJ8A


Still watching, haven't finished - but he quotes fucking Pythagoras!

The problem is he cites wrong stats or misquotes them.  This one does not seem different than the last.  It impresses people who don't know anything about economics because he looks savant.  To others, he looks as knowledgeable as Didier Raoult.

[Barrister]

No idea if any of this is good politics, but it's great at winning the Barrister vote.

A shocking development 

May I remind you I voted NDP in the last Alberta election.

[Barrister]

Another Pierre Poilievre video dropped - on debt.  15 minutes long.

Lots of scary music, but again citing a bunch of statistics and academic papers.  I love how crunchy this stuff is.

Say what you will about Poilievre, but Donald Trump he aint.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p20v8vBwJ8A


Still watching, haven't finished - but he quotes fucking Pythagoras!

The problem is he cites wrong stats or misquotes them.  This one does not seem different than the last.  It impresses people who don't know anything about economics because he looks savant.  To others, he looks as knowledgeable as Didier Raoult.

Do you see Trudeau (or Singh) putting out arguments with this kind of detail or statistics?

No, you do not.

Obviously when you put out a 15 minute video and start citing this many statistics and papers there is room to argue.  But what I like is that Poilievre is out there making the argument with statistics and papers.  This is not how politics normally works in 2023.

The contrast with Trudeau is pretty obvious here.

[crazy canuck]

BB, what do you think of lumping business debt together with personal and government debt to come up with the  time bomb metaphor?

[Sheilbh]

I will concede that Poilievre is not completely unhinged, he is not a known sexual predator, nor is he profoundly corrupt or actively telling one brazen lie after another in an attempt to undermine democracy.

While I agree with Yi's characterization, I agree with Beeb that Poilievre is indeed no Trump; and that's a good thing.

Yeah, FWIW I also apply this in the UK context and European context - I think being a risk to/trying to undermine democracy is a really important distinction to make. I might hate a lot of someone's politics, I might hate their style - but I think they can be legitimately within a democratic system in a way I don't think Trump can.

Obviously when you put out a 15 minute video and start citing this many statistics and papers there is room to argue.  But what I like is that Poilievre is out there making the argument with statistics and papers.  This is not how politics normally works in 2023.

As I say I wonder if it is a sign of the (short-term) future because we know people go to Youtube (and maybe to TikTok? I don't know, I'm old) for explainers. Seeing Poilievre do it, it makes it seem like an obvious thing to do for politicians or parties to put out videos like this.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Labour and the Tories do it here. Also because obviously while social media production is still covered by spending limits for parties, you can put out as many videos or tweets or Facebook posts as you like, whereas in the UK all the parties are allocated (I think based on a combination of past election result and current polling) five minute party political broadcasts on the major broadcasters for free but can't ever buy airtime.

You don't need to buy time on YouTube if it goes viral - and we've seen hiints of this. There was a ten minute speech by Gordon Brown that got millions of views in 2010, Corbyn's posts regularly went viral. But they weren't quite like this.

[Jacob]

Yeah, I think releasing youtube videos where the candidate provides substance and explanation (or at least the appearance thereof) is a good move. Without any comment on the substance of Poilievre's videos (I didn't watch them, and am unlikely to), it seems like they're a clever thing to do.

[Jacob]

Yeah, FWIW I also apply this in the UK context and European context - I think being a risk to/trying to undermine democracy is a really important distinction to make. I might hate a lot of someone's politics, I might hate their style - but I think they can be legitimately within a democratic system in a way I don't think Trump can.

Yeah exactly. I find Poilievre pretty unappealing on a number of levels, and I think he encourages some sentiments that I think are unhealthy, but I am not worried that our democracy is under threat if he wins the next election.

[Barrister]

BB, what do you think of lumping business debt together with personal and government debt to come up with the  time bomb metaphor?

He's pretty open about that though.  Personal debt is also a concern.