[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Jacob]

Newcomer = immigrant to Canada.

I do not know if the timer would be reset for a temporary worker who gets back home after a summer of work and comes back the next season.

So I'm an immigrant. I've been in Canada for 30+ years and educated in English. If I moved to Quebec, I - and anyone of the more than 20% of Canadians who are first generation immigrants - would be legally expected to conform to the 6 month limit to function exclusively in French, is that correct?

What's the rule for second generation immigrants? Are children of newcomers expected to be educated in French? I.e. would my son, who's in the middle of elementary school in English be expected to enter French language education? Or would he count as an Anglophone Canadian and thus exempt?

[Oexmelin]

I'm curious, if any of you know: what counts as a newcomer in the context of Bill 96 (and others)?

Obviously someone who immigrates directly to Quebec from somewhere else is a newcomer. Does it apply to anyone else?

What about someone who immmigrates to Toronto then moves to Quebec immediately, are they a newcomer? What if they move to Quebec after 6 months? Or after 10 years?

It's a good question - as far as I know, "newcomers" are all non-citizens who move into Quebec ("personnes immigrantes"), who have been in Canada less than five years. Access to public English-language schools remains  unchanged, being determined by the kids, their siblings, or their parents, having had the majority of their education in English outside Quebec.

[Oexmelin]

So I'm an immigrant. I've been in Canada for 30+ years and educated in English...

See above.

Access to public English-language schools is determined by education previously received. Second-generation immigrants in Quebec will only have access to public English-language schools if they had access to it at the first generation, whether elsewhere in Canada, or in their country of origin... This is also true, btw, of Canadian citizens in Quebec. I couldn't send my kids to an English-language public school even if I wanted to.

Note that for all, there is always the possibility of sending kids to a non-subsidized private English school.

[crazy canuck]

It should be added that up until a fairly recent court challenge, it was not possible for a French speaking immigrant to obtain a public education in French that was equally funded with English schools here in BC. 

But the unequal treatment was found to be unconstitutional.  And so the legislation in Quebec is only possible through the invocation of the Notwithstanding clause.

I think a strong argument can be made that this is the sort of issue for which the allowance of Parliamentary Supremacy was granted in our constitution.

[Jacob]

It's a good question - as far as I know, "newcomers" are all non-citizens who move into Quebec ("personnes immigrantes"), who have been in Canada less than five years. Access to public English-language schools remains  unchanged, being determined by the kids, their siblings, or their parents, having had the majority of their education in English outside Quebec.

Okay, that's reasonably reasonable. Thanks for the details

[Jacob]

It should be added that up until a fairly recent court challenge, it was not possible for a French speaking immigrant to obtain a public education in French that was equally funded with English schools here in BC.

It was found to be unconstitutional... and remedied?

As in, it's currently possible to get a French language public education in BC if you are Francophone?

[Jacob]

This looks quite recent, but is a positive development. Here's a link for those who are interested:

Link to the school board: https://www.csf.bc.ca/en/

Link to recent bill re funding and capital strategy: https://news.gov.bc.ca/releases/2022ECC0029-000644#:~:text=As%20British%20Columbia's%20only%20francophone,education%20in%20the%20French%20language.

[Jacob]

Zoupa, looks like there's two schools near where you're at right now.

[crazy canuck]

This looks quite recent, but is a positive development. Here's a link for those who are interested:

Link to the school board: https://www.csf.bc.ca/en/

Link to recent bill re funding and capital strategy: https://news.gov.bc.ca/releases/2022ECC0029-000644#:~:text=As%20British%20Columbia's%20only%20francophone,education%20in%20the%20French%20language.

The French schools are not recent.  But the increase in funding is.  A result of the court challenge.

[Zoupa]

Zoupa, looks like there's two schools near where you're at right now.

Indeed. Now I just need kids. 

[Grey Fox]

It should be added that up until a fairly recent court challenge, it was not possible for a French speaking immigrant to obtain a public education in French that was equally funded with English schools here in BC. 

But the unequal treatment was found to be unconstitutional.  And so the legislation in Quebec is only possible through the invocation of the Notwithstanding clause.

I think a strong argument can be made that this is the sort of issue for which the allowance of Parliamentary Supremacy was granted in our constitution.

Quebec's funding of the public english system is the same than it's french counterpart. In someways, the english system is better.

[Josephus]

I think quebec has to come to grips with the fact this is no longer the 19th century. I'm all for them protecting their French by keeping all their street signs French, and having official gov't documents in French and having French schools. But to force people into only speaking French is akin to forcing Chinese immigrants in B.C. or Ontario to only speak English in six months. Instead we have all sorts of gov't programs geared to them in their own language, not just the Chinese languages, but many others. Like I said, I get the distinct society thing, but times are changing and the demographics are changing too.

I mean, they're not forcing everyone to convert to Catholicsm, and that was a huge part of their distinct society at one time too.

[Sheilbh]

I agree. I can't really get up in arms about it. But if I were operating a studio in Quebec, it would definitely go down in the column of additional challenges.

Yeah absolutely - the upside with Quebec is their language is a language that is spoken elsewhere in the world. But it will be a cost/challenge for sure.

The reason I think it's might be worth paying that cost is that I think it is far more easy to preserve a minority national culture while it's still living, than when it's largely beeen swamped by the majority culture. And actually it's possibly worth pushing it even more in cultural industries like video games, publishing, film etc because they, frankly, matter more to a Quebec identity than, say, banking.

[crazy canuck]

It should be added that up until a fairly recent court challenge, it was not possible for a French speaking immigrant to obtain a public education in French that was equally funded with English schools here in BC. 

But the unequal treatment was found to be unconstitutional.  And so the legislation in Quebec is only possible through the invocation of the Notwithstanding clause.

I think a strong argument can be made that this is the sort of issue for which the allowance of Parliamentary Supremacy was granted in our constitution.

Quebec's funding of the public english system is the same than it's french counterpart. In someways, the english system is better.

But Quebec is limiting access to the English system.  That is the unconstitutional  action.

[viper37]

You are a Canadian citizen.

You were an immigrant when you arrived here 30+ years ago.

The law does not apply to you currently if you move to Quebec.  It does not apply to your children, there is an exemption for children of Commonwealth Citizens whose parents attended an English school, as per Supreme Court rules, if I'm not mistaken.  It's not a matter of where your ancestors were born, more of where your passport is issued.