Russo-Ukrainian War 2014-23 and Invasion

[Josquius]

Apparently Russian TV, in true Russian style, is reporting mass numbers of abandoned Ukranian vehicles

[Darth Wagtaros]

Apparently Russian TV, in true Russian style, is reporting mass numbers of abandoned Ukranian vehicles

Also thousands of American Special Operations from every service are being slaughtered like dogs due to their inherent incompetence and arrogance.

[viper37]

At the end of the day, the pressure on Ukraine to make a deal amounts to a price they are paying in civilian lives every day they don't make a deal.

It is pretty much entirely on them to decide if that is worth it.

However, I think no part of any deal should include any constraint on Western nations ability to continue to engage in economic and political warfare against Putin.

I'd like to see them operate on an oil-for-food programme, Iraqi-style, for the next 70 years.

Way too generous.

[Razgovory]

Apparently Russian TV, in true Russian style, is reporting mass numbers of abandoned Ukranian vehicles

The Ukrainian enemy continues his cowardly advance.

[mongers]

Seems like quite a few people here and in the West are prepared to fight to the last Ukrainian.

I think we should trust to Zelensky's judgement and if he feels it necessary to give concessions in order to save the lives of Ukrainian civilians being killed by Russians, then NATO and westerners should back the decision.

[grumbler]

Seems like quite a few people here and in the West are prepared to fight to the last Ukrainian.

I think we should trust to Zelensky's judgement and if he feels it necessary to give concessions in order to save the lives of Ukrainian civilians being killed by Russians, then NATO and westerners should back the decision.

  You are just repeating what every single person above you said, and then accusing them of being "prepared to fight to the last Ukrainian."  Do you even read the thread before posting self-congratulatory bullshit like this?

[mongers]

Seems like quite a few people here and in the West are prepared to fight to the last Ukrainian.

I think we should trust to Zelensky's judgement and if he feels it necessary to give concessions in order to save the lives of Ukrainian civilians being killed by Russians, then NATO and westerners should back the decision.

  You are just repeating what every single person above you said, and then accusing them of being "prepared to fight to the last Ukrainian."  Do you even read the thread before posting self-congratulatory bullshit like this?

Fuck off.

[viper37]

Afin de se mettre en conformité avec les exigences de Roskomnadzor (le gendarme russe des communications), le livre de Léon Tolstoï "Guerre et Paix" a été renommé "Opération spéciale et haute trahison".

To conform with legal requirements of Roskomnadzor (Russian communication authority), Leon Tolstoï's book "War and Peace" has been renamed "Special operation and high treason"

[viper37]

I think we should trust to Zelensky's judgement and if he feels it necessary to give concessions in order to save the lives of Ukrainian civilians being killed by Russians, then NATO and westerners should back the decision.

I trust his judgement and he has the right to give away part of the country as a peace settlement. 

However, I oppose the reduction of occidental sanctions against Russia, and I believe that a deal "oil for food" is even too generous for Russia's current regime and the level of support it enjoys in the population.

[Jacob]

Seems like quite a few people here and in the West are prepared to fight to the last Ukrainian.

Zelenskyy and his officials are asking for military materiel. I think we should give it to them.

I also think that the West should continue to ratchet up sanctions, and we should maintain them after any potential settlement

I think we should trust to Zelensky's judgement and if he feels it necessary to give concessions in order to save the lives of Ukrainian civilians being killed by Russians, then NATO and westerners should back the decision.

Zelenskyy can make whatever concessions are within his power, though I think they'll be predicated on getting the support of the people of Ukraine for them as well.

Personally, I expect that there will be more pressure from the West to "normalize" relations than from Ukraine, which is why I'm advocating that we take as hard a line as possible.

From a negotiation standpoint, it is better for Zelenskyy to say "Putin old boy, I'll see if I can convince those unreasonable Europeans and the US the ease off the sanctions a bit" than to be  in a position where he's hearing "come on, find a way to make peace ASAP so we can sell Coca Cola in Russia again without feeling bad."

But yes, we should support Zelenskyy.

Cessation of hostilities, saving Ukraine, and saving Ukrainian lives is of paramount importance. Russia will continue to exist at the end of this war, quite possibly with Putin at its helm. It is IMO very very likely that Russia will be dissatisfied with whatever peace is agreed upon. As such it is prudent to take action to minimize the likelihood of Russia coming back for a second kick at the can in 5-10-20 years... and maintaining sanctions and undermining Russia's industrial capacity and technological advancement is a key element there.

[Admiral Yi]

Also thousands of American Special Operations from every service are being slaughtered like dogs due to their inherent incompetence and arrogance.

They have been weakened by perfidious LGBTQ mind washing.

[Barrister]

Seems like quite a few people here and in the West are prepared to fight to the last Ukrainian.

I think we should trust to Zelensky's judgement and if he feels it necessary to give concessions in order to save the lives of Ukrainian civilians being killed by Russians, then NATO and westerners should back the decision.

I'm Ukrainian-Canadian.  I don't think your characterization of people here is fair.



My first girlfriend was a Ukrainian immigrant from when she was in her teens (I met her in her early 20s).  We dated for about 3 years when I was in undergrad.  Her home town was in western Ukraine, near Romania.  I remember celebrating Orthodox Ukrainian Christmas with her family (her grandfather was an Orthodox priest).  I keep listening for any military action near her hometown - thankfully nothing.

I mean - I'm not pining for her - I broke up with her in the end.  But I very keenly feel the loss of Ukrainian civilians in this ongoing war.

[Malthus]

My wife and I have been trying to convince her relatives who live in Ukraine to come to Canada, but so far none are willing to leave. Even though we could sponsor them and have places for them to stay. They simply refuse to be driven out. Fortunately they are in the Western part of the country.

My sister in law (my wife's brother's wife) has a brother whose son is in the Ukrainian army. Of course they are all worried about his safety. No word yet on where he is.

[Legbiter]

As has been mentioned before, attacking a foe who is pulling back can be a very effective maneuver - sometimes turning a planned retreat into chaos.

And that seems to be the case. Ukrainians up North are reporting enormous quantities of destroyed and abandoned armored vehicles. Open intelligence source twitter accounts are complaining about the gigantic backlog of Russian kit they have to document...

[jimmy olsen]

Twitter is just awash with horror today.

Video after video of streets littered with civilian corpses lying in the streets where they were gunned down.

Russian paratroopers from the first failed assaults just heaped in piles, seemingly untouched since they were dumped there.

Streets clogged with countless burnt out Russian tanks, APCs and trucks.