First 3-D-printed gun fired, but its digital blueprints make bigger bang

[derspiess]

If plastic doesn't work well (and in spite of your repeated statements I don't really see why not - many plastics are extremely hard),

Plastic bullets are specifically used as non-lethal rounds for crowd control* (and training in some cases).  If some new, dense, space-age plastic would make a good lethal bullet projectile there would probably be something like that on the market.  Ammo manufacturers love gimmicks.  About the closest I see to that in the "lethal" category is a polymer tip that just helps the copper-jacketed lead round expand.

*Before some goofball tries to use it as a gotcha, yes there have been isolated instances of people dying from plastic or rubber bullet wounds, but I'm talking about relative lethality.

why not stone bullets in a smoothbore?

Accuracy, maybe?

[crazy canuck]

Well, actually.....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/4713323.stm

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar - or in this case a flint knapper.

Did you find that at debunkphallussymbols.com?

No, I found it in the article you posted.

In addition to being a symbolic representation of male genitalia, it was also at times used for knapping flints

[MadImmortalMan]

Obviously, the point here being to make a functional weapon, not an ideal one.

[garbon]

Obviously, the point here being to make a functional weapon, not an ideal one.

I like to have both form and function.

[Malthus]

Plastic bullets are specifically used as non-lethal rounds for crowd control* (and training in some cases).  If some new, dense, space-age plastic would make a good lethal bullet projectile there would probably be something like that on the market.  Ammo manufacturers love gimmicks.  About the closest I see to that in the "lethal" category is a polymer tip that just helps the copper-jacketed lead round expand.

*Before some goofball tries to use it as a gotcha, yes there have been isolated instances of people dying from plastic or rubber bullet wounds, but I'm talking about relative lethality.

Those are plastic bullets especially made to be non-lethal as a design feature.

Not all plastic is the same. Some is very hard and some is softer. That's why manufacturers like plastic, it can have different consistencies, depending on the formula.

Just because non-lethal bullets = plastic, it does not of necessity follow that plastic bullets = non-lethal.

I doubt though that you could make a plastic with all the desireable qualities of lead, like heaviness. Lead bullets will probably always be somewhat better for killing than plastic ones ... but a terrorist or robber would no doubt be happy to exchange the more desireable lead for plastic, if they wanted to hijack an airplane or something.

Accuracy, maybe?

I imagine it would be as accurate as a shotgun firing slugs.

Good enough for a bank robber or a terrorist, anyway. 

[crazy canuck]

Obviously, the point here being to make a functional weapon, not an ideal one.

I like to have both form and function.

So would the gun nuts but in compensation they carry guns instead.

[Barrister]

Obviously, the point here being to make a functional weapon, not an ideal one.

The whole point of this thing is as a symbol.  Obviously nobody should be seriously  threatened today that thugs armed with this plastic gun are going to run amok.

But 3-D printers are progressing.  The types of plastic they use are improving.  Remember there are already firearms out there that are mostly plastic.

It's not impossible to imagine that in 5-10 years someone would be able to reproduce a fully functional AR-15 in a 3D printer, either out of advanced polymers, or out of metal (they're working on that as well).

[Malthus]

Obviously, the point here being to make a functional weapon, not an ideal one.

The whole point of this thing is as a symbol.  Obviously nobody should be seriously  threatened today that thugs armed with this plastic gun are going to run amok.

But 3-D printers are progressing.  The types of plastic they use are improving.  Remember there are already firearms out there that are mostly plastic.

It's not impossible to imagine that in 5-10 years someone would be able to reproduce a fully functional AR-15 in a 3D printer, either out of advanced polymers, or out of metal (they're working on that as well).

The real concern to my mind isn't just that anyone can make one, but that an all-plastic gun is difficult to detect. If you require an actual manufacturing facility to make one, it is easier to control.

[Razgovory]

I don't see why a very hard plastic bullet would not be deadly, albeit not as deadly as a metal one. Again, it doesn't have to be. 

I'm not saying it couldn't kill, just that it wouldn't be nearly as lethal as a metal bullet.  And that it may not be lethal enough to use over other alternatives.

This is sorta saying that it's not a lethal as a 120mm cannon.  True, but lethal enough.

[MadImmortalMan]

The real concern to my mind isn't just that anyone can make one, but that an all-plastic gun is difficult to detect. If you require an actual manufacturing facility to make one, it is easier to control.

The idea is that it can't be controlled. The box is open and Pandora ripped the top off and burned it.

[Martinus]

I'm sure it can contain *a* blast-- just with less powder than what you'd use in a normal gun.  Even with that I wouldn't dare fire it.  And like I said, a plastic bullet isn't going to be a particularly deadly projectile.

A high density plastic bullet is more than capable enough of killing someone.

And while nobody sane would dare fire it, that's not the ones that we worry about. A perturbed person would be perfectly willing to do so. Or someone toying with suicide. Or even just a kid. That's an interesting angle actually, how are you going to keep children and teens from downloading and printing weapons?

And then there's another angle: what about those countries where guns are rare?


I have a very hostile attitude against censorship but this tech creates quite a dilemma.

I have full faith that our American friends will be as successful at keeping plastic guns out of the hands of kids, deranged maniacs or criminals as they are when it comes to ordinary guns.

[derspiess]

Plastic bullets are specifically used as non-lethal rounds for crowd control* (and training in some cases).  If some new, dense, space-age plastic would make a good lethal bullet projectile there would probably be something like that on the market.  Ammo manufacturers love gimmicks.  About the closest I see to that in the "lethal" category is a polymer tip that just helps the copper-jacketed lead round expand.

*Before some goofball tries to use it as a gotcha, yes there have been isolated instances of people dying from plastic or rubber bullet wounds, but I'm talking about relative lethality.

Those are plastic bullets especially made to be non-lethal as a design feature.

Not all plastic is the same. Some is very hard and some is softer. That's why manufacturers like plastic, it can have different consistencies, depending on the formula.

Just because non-lethal bullets = plastic, it does not of necessity follow that plastic bullets = non-lethal.

I doubt though that you could make a plastic with all the desireable qualities of lead, like heaviness. Lead bullets will probably always be somewhat better for killing than plastic ones ... but a terrorist or robber would no doubt be happy to exchange the more desireable lead for plastic, if they wanted to hijack an airplane or something.

Well, if plastic guns with plastic bullets become a big problem, you get to tell me you told me so.  I'm not losing any sleep over it.

[derspiess]

I don't see why a very hard plastic bullet would not be deadly, albeit not as deadly as a metal one. Again, it doesn't have to be. 

I'm not saying it couldn't kill, just that it wouldn't be nearly as lethal as a metal bullet.  And that it may not be lethal enough to use over other alternatives.

This is sorta saying that it's not a lethal as a 120mm cannon.  True, but lethal enough.

Not at all. Another swing & a miss for Raz. 

[Valmy]

Well, if plastic guns with plastic bullets become a big problem, you get to tell me you told me so.  I'm not losing any sleep over it.

Lame.

[Berkut]

You know, there is an interesting analogy here - porn.

Today, how do you police and manage access to pornography by your kids?

When I was a kid, of course we were not allowed to have porn, and my parents would certainly punish us if they ever found any (not that it stopped us, but there was risk involved, etc., etc.)

Today, I feel kind of silly telling my son he is not allowed to look at porn - he isn't, but we cannot really control it *at all* via any kind of attempt to control their access to it. It is too easy to get if they want to get at it, with the internet just a click away.

So we don't even bother trying to control it's impacy by simply trying to control the physical object of pornography any more. Rather you have to try to

1) Teach them some self control and appropriate/responsible behavior, and more importantly
2) Teach what porn actually means, what it doesn't mean, and how to keep it from negatively shaping their views towards sex and sexuality.

You simply cannot, in any meaningful way, hope to deal with the issue via restricting exposure anymore, so you are forced to deal with the consequences of the exposure instead.

If guns become so easy to make, then bitching about it won't change anything - rather it will simply become more imperative that as a society we deal with what that means, the dangers they present, and how to handle them.

If nothing else, maybe it would cause the gun nuts to stop masturbating all the time over their penis symbols?