First 3-D-printed gun fired, but its digital blueprints make bigger bang

[Razgovory]

Well, you are. 

No, but feel free to support your case.

Also, there's no reason a plastic barrel, case and bullet need too weak to contain a blast.

Oh, Good.  Since Schumer is bringing up a law to outlaw such a weapon I'll be glad to see your support for such a ban.  I'll be nice to argue on the same side for once.

I mean to say, There's no reason a plastic barrel, case and bullet need to be too weak to contain a blast.  HDPE has some pretty high tensile strengths.

[Valmy]

Require a background check to own 3d printers then. 

How exactly is that funny?  They will probably be very tighly controlled indeed.

[Malthus]

Does it have to be? Could one make a hard plastic bullet in a plastic tube filled with propellent?

If one is going through all the trouble of making a plastic gun, why not make plastic ammo to go with it?

I'm sure you could.  But I'd imagine you'd have to use so little powder that the round might not be lethal-- especially with a plastic projectile.

Not sure I understand. Why would you have to use only a small amount of powder (or whatever it is they put in cartridges these days?)

Because a plastic case, chamber, and barrel are not going to be able to handle the pressure of a full load.  It would probably just explode in your hand.

Would that not be a problem with using conventional ammo in a plastic gun? It's the barrel that takes the pressure, not the cartridge; the explosion simply fits the walls of the cartridge more snugly to the inside of the chamber. 

Early "integrated cartridges" were made out of ... paper.

They worked okay, though for various reasons, metal was better.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartridge_(firearms)

[derspiess]

Oh, Good.  Since Schumer is bringing up a law to outlaw such a weapon I'll be glad to see your support for such a ban.  I'll be nice to argue on the same side for once.

I would oppose that law, as well as most everything else Chuckie cooks up.  Not sure how that makes me worried, though.

I mean to say, There's no reason a plastic barrel, case and bullet need to be too weak to contain a blast.  HDPE has some pretty high tensile strengths.

I'm sure it can contain *a* blast-- just with less powder than what you'd use in a normal gun.  Even with that I wouldn't dare fire it.  And like I said, a plastic bullet isn't going to be a particularly deadly projectile.

[frunk]

Require a background check to own 3d printers then. 

How exactly is that funny?  They will probably very tighly controlled indeed.

The Diamond Age

Matter compilers receive their raw materials from the Feed, a system analogous to the electrical grid of modern society. The Feed carries streams of both energy and basic molecules, which are rapidly assembled into usable goods by matter compilers. The Source, where the Feed's stream of matter originates, is controlled by the Victorian phyle (though smaller, independent Feeds are possible). The hierarchic nature of the Feed and an alternative, anarchic developing technology, known as the Seed, mirror the cultural conflict between East and West that is depicted in the book. This conflict has an economic element as well, with the Feed representing a centrally-controlled distribution mechanism, while the Seed represents a more flexible, open-ended, decentralised method of creation and organization.

Implicit in the Feed technology were limitations on what could be created.

[Razgovory]

That makes you worried.  One doesn't oppose laws you aren't concerned with.  And people have died on bullets made from weaker stuff then HDPE and fired with weaker loads then modern cartridges for centuries.

[Syt]

Require a background check to own 3d printers then. 

How exactly is that funny?  They will probably very tighly controlled indeed.

The Diamond Age

Matter compilers receive their raw materials from the Feed, a system analogous to the electrical grid of modern society. The Feed carries streams of both energy and basic molecules, which are rapidly assembled into usable goods by matter compilers. The Source, where the Feed's stream of matter originates, is controlled by the Victorian phyle (though smaller, independent Feeds are possible). The hierarchic nature of the Feed and an alternative, anarchic developing technology, known as the Seed, mirror the cultural conflict between East and West that is depicted in the book. This conflict has an economic element as well, with the Feed representing a centrally-controlled distribution mechanism, while the Seed represents a more flexible, open-ended, decentralised method of creation and organization.

Implicit in the Feed technology were limitations on what could be created.

Transmetropolitan teaches us that "makers" would probably be hacked into creating illegal substances. Actually, a decentralized "each home with its own independent machine" somehow seems more realistic to me in America. You don't want THE MAN suppressing you and tell you what you can make and what not, or cut you off from important supplies because HE feels like it.

[derspiess]

Would that not be a problem with using conventional ammo in a plastic gun? It's the barrel that takes the pressure, not the cartridge; the explosion simply fits the walls of the cartridge more snugly to the inside of the chamber. 

The cartridge case, chamber, and barrel all take on pressure. Anyway, I'd like to know what kind of .380 ammo the dude used in his gun.  It's a fairly weak cartridge to begin with, but I'd bet he downloaded the powder charge.

Early "integrated cartridges" were made out of ... paper.

They worked okay, though for various reasons, metal was better.

They worked okay because the chamber and barrel were metal.  Not to say that you couldn't do something similar in a plastic gun, but like I keep saying, you're not gonna go full power.  I kinda doubt the lethality of a plastic gun.  With range, accuracy, and caliber being so limited you might as well just walk up & stab someone with something.

[derspiess]

That makes you worried.  One doesn't oppose laws you aren't concerned with. 

Still not worried, Raz.  Your logic is flimsy.

nd people have died on bullets made from weaker stuff then HDPE and fired with weaker loads then modern cartridges for centuries.

You *can* die from a lot of things.  Doesn't make them as lethal as a conventional firearm.

[Malthus]

I'm sure it can contain *a* blast-- just with less powder than what you'd use in a normal gun.  Even with that I wouldn't dare fire it.  And like I said, a plastic bullet isn't going to be a particularly deadly projectile.

The issue, though, at least my issue, was why it would not be possible to have non-metalic ammo.

No doubt an all-plastic gun will not have the same lethality as an all-metal gun, or have bullets that travel as far - but it doesn't have to. The only reason to have an all-plastic gun in the first place is to avoid detection. All it has to do is to be able to intimidate or kill people, presumably at short range, like a hostage-taker sticking the thing in a person's face.

I don't see why a very hard plastic bullet would not be deadly, albeit not as deadly as a metal one. Again, it doesn't have to be. 

[Razgovory]

I'm sure it can contain *a* blast-- just with less powder than what you'd use in a normal gun.  Even with that I wouldn't dare fire it.  And like I said, a plastic bullet isn't going to be a particularly deadly projectile.

The issue, though, at least my issue, was why it would not be possible to have non-metalic ammo.

No doubt an all-plastic gun will not have the same lethality as an all-metal gun, or have bullets that travel as far - but it doesn't have to. The only reason to have an all-plastic gun in the first place is to avoid detection. All it has to do is to be able to intimidate or kill people, presumably at short range, like a hostage-taker sticking the thing in a person's face.

I don't see why a very hard plastic bullet would not be deadly, albeit not as deadly as a metal one. Again, it doesn't have to be.

It could be just as deadly as a lead bullet.

[Malthus]

The cartridge case, chamber, and barrel all take on pressure.

That's not my understanding, and it is kinda contradicted by the existence of integrated paper cartridges. Paper is not a material generally associated with channeling explosive force. 

In any event, a plastic cartridge would handle the explosion just as well as a paper one, right?

[Malthus]

It could be just as deadly as a lead bullet.

It would probably not be as "good". Lead is perfect for bullets made to kill people, being both very heavy and with the ability to deform when it hits flesh and bone.

That noted, a hard plastic bullet doesn't have to be as "good" as a lead one - it could still kill people just fine.

[Razgovory]

I do not attribute moral qualities to bullets or metals.  Only Noble gases are capable of morality.  That's what makes them so noble.

[KRonn]

The cartridge case, chamber, and barrel all take on pressure.

That's not my understanding, and it is kinda contradicted by the existence of integrated paper cartridges. Paper is not a material generally associated with channeling explosive force. 

In any event, a plastic cartridge would handle the explosion just as well as a paper one, right?

I think paper rounds were used in muzzle loaders. The powder in the paper gave the right power charge needed. It was poured into the barrel, not loaded like a bullet.  A paper casing would foul a gun as it would leave debris in the chamber and barrel.