European views on American involvement in the Vietnam war.

[Valmy]

Or perhaps white people to higher standard then East Asians...

When you are the world power and you publicly announce that you are an exceptional country the rest of the world should be inspired by, you do tend to be held to a higher standard.

[Razgovory]

Still with Yi here.  If American efforts can be described Imperialistic, should the Soviet Union, PRC, and North Vietnam itself also be considered imperialistic?  If so it's sort of a wash.  What war isn't considered Imperialistic?

Wait has anybody ever suggested the Soviet Union or the PRC were/are not Imperialistic?  Granted the PRC prefers a more localized empire.

Communists and sympathizers. 

David Horowitz was then a member of the Bertrand Russell Peace Foundation. He confirms that the Russell Tribunal never held any intention of investigating alleged Communist atrocities. In his memoirs, Horowitz describes overhearing Jean-Paul Sartre insist that the North Vietnamese and National Liberation Front were, by definition, incapable of committing war crimes. "I refuse to place," said Sartre, "in the same category the actions of an organization of poor peasants... and those of an immense army backed by a highly organized country."

[Razgovory]

Or perhaps white people to higher standard then East Asians...

When you are the world power and you publicly announce that you are an exceptional country the rest of the world should be inspired by, you do tend to be held to a higher standard.

What country doesn't announce they are an exceptional country?  Besides the same could be said for both China and the Soviet Union in the 1960's and 1970's.

[Valmy]

Communists and sympathizers.

Wait so people who get their talking points from the Soviet Union had only positive things to say?  Shocking.

[Syt]

Well, I think people over here want the U.S. to be the good guys, to take the high road, not realizing that while there's a big overlap between Europe and the U.S. in ideas and culture, there's also significant differences - see gun laws, violence vs. eroticism in media, etc.

Still, a popular nickname for the U.S. in Germany is the "land of unlimited possibilities." It had a very positive connotation, these days it's often used in a cynical or satirical way when another supposedly crazy story is in the tabloids.

[Neil]

Yes.  A hypocritical view for a lot of them. If the US is to be castigated for events taht happened in the past so should Spain, Portugal, and a number of other nations.

1)  You're stupid for thinking that hypocrisy is a bad thing.
2)  There are no people on Earth who feel more shame for their history and hate their countries more than Europeans.

[Razgovory]

Communists and sympathizers.

Wait so people who get their talking points from the Soviet Union had only positive things to say?  Shocking.

Actually the Euro Communists had pretty much stopped listening to Moscow at the time.  Are you going to say that two major European philosophers "got their talking points from the Soviet Union"?

[Valmy]

What country doesn't announce they are an exceptional country?  Besides the same could be said for both China and the Soviet Union in the 1960's and 1970's.

Not every country declares itself to be a global force of good and shining city on a hill to be an inspiration to the world.  And the others do not have their Head of State's speeches broadcast internationally so nobody else knows about it.

And the prententions of the Soviets and the Maoist Chinese were well known and the fact they failed to meet those standards was, indeed, something that hurt them.  You may have noticed the Soviet Union and Maoist Revolution are not really going strong anymore.

[Valmy]

Actually the Euro Communists had pretty much stopped listening to Moscow at the time.  Are you going to say that two major European philosophers "got their talking points from the Soviet Union"?

Sartre?  He might as well have.

[Viking]

Communists and sympathizers.

Wait so people who get their talking points from the Soviet Union had only positive things to say?  Shocking.

Actually the Euro Communists had pretty much stopped listening to Moscow at the time.  Are you going to say that two major European philosophers "got their talking points from the Soviet Union"?

They had stopped listening to the "Soviet Union = Good" part of the Soviet Narrative. They did continue to listen to the "USA = Bad" part of the narrative and when Soviet evil came to light (in hungary and the prague spring) they created their own narrative "USA is Just as bad as Soviet Union which has betrayed true socialism."

[Eddie Teach]

Not every country declares itself to be a global force of good and shining city on a hill to be an inspiration to the world. 

We've been calling ourselves a city on a hill for nearly 400 years, doesn't really have anything to do with late 20th century foreign policy. And China's opinion of itself makes ours seem a paragon of humility.

[Viking]

Well, I think people over here want the U.S. to be the good guys, to take the high road, not realizing that while there's a big overlap between Europe and the U.S. in ideas and culture, there's also significant differences - see gun laws, violence vs. eroticism in media, etc.

Still, a popular nickname for the U.S. in Germany is the "land of unlimited possibilities." It had a very positive connotation, these days it's often used in a cynical or satirical way when another supposedly crazy story is in the tabloids.

These are minor differences compared to democracy, individual rights etc. It's an expression of what Kissinger observed about academic quarrels. They were so intense because the stakes were so low.

[Viking]

Not every country declares itself to be a global force of good and shining city on a hill to be an inspiration to the world. 

We've been calling ourselves a city on a hill for nearly 400 years, doesn't really have anything to do with late 20th century foreign policy. And China's opinion of itself makes ours seem a paragon of humility.

France and Britain did precisely the same thing as well. The reason this annoys people is that it remains true.

[Valmy]

We've been calling ourselves a city on a hill for nearly 400 years, doesn't really have anything to do with late 20th century foreign policy.

Yes it has everything to do with it.  And I think it is a good thing.  We hold ourselves to a higher standard and others do as well.

[Valmy]

France and Britain did precisely the same thing as well. The reason this annoys people is that it remains true.

For the record I also hold those countries to a pretty high standard.  And how they present themselves has alot to do with that.