Obama to fire gay military officer. Martinus pops vein.

[Martinus]

Wow, Reagan actually said that? My opinion of him just improved a lot. No wonder Jack Kemp considered him a puppet of the gay lobby. 

the guy worked in Hollywood, how homophobic could he be?

Well, that's not a certainty in itself - after all, there are also many Jewish people in Hollywood, yet some Hollywood actors and directors can be pretty antisemitic, too.

[Martinus]

Wow, Reagan actually said that? My opinion of him just improved a lot. No wonder Jack Kemp considered him a puppet of the gay lobby. 

the guy worked in Hollywood, how homophobic could he be?

That guy from Lethal Weapon and the Road Warrior also worked in Hollwood...

OMG I made the same argument as Siegy.

[grumbler]

And yet, there's a lot of overlap between the signatories of the Constitution and the 1st Congress...

A legislator /= a legislature.

[Caliga]

Everybody is born straight.
Then you choose to be physically, mentally, and morally weak.

Seige: the soldier psychologist 

[Martinus]

Everybody is born straight.
Then you choose to be physically, mentally, and morally weak.

Seige: the soldier psychologist 

Don't use "soldier" as a synonym for "stupid". 

[ulmont]

And yet, there's a lot of overlap between the signatories of the Constitution and the 1st Congress...

A legislator /= a legislature.

Yes, as crazy canuck noted previously...

In the US presumably the constutitution was drafted and amended by US legislators.

[grumbler]

A legislator /= a legislature.

Yes, as crazy canuck noted previously...

In the US presumably the constutitution was drafted and amended by US legislators.

And, as I noted, the fact that there were legislators there does not make it a legislature, just as the fact that there were generals there didn't mean it was drafted and amended by a junta, and the fact that there were governors there meant that it was drafted and amended by an executive.

[Valmy]

Everybody is born straight.
Then you choose to be physically, mentally, and morally weak.

Yeah because it is so much easier to be gay and you really have to overcome so much to be straight.

[Berkut]

Everybody is born straight.
Then you choose to be physically, mentally, and morally weak.

Yeah because it is so much easier to be gay and you really have to overcome so much to be straight.

Hey, for Siege that may very well be the case! He might have to tell himself he isn't gay and he doesn't want to blow his fellow soldiers every single day.

I admire his willpower and willingness to resist his natural state for the good of America. We promise not to ask if he promises not to tell.

[grumbler]

Hey, for Siege that may very well be the case! He might have to tell himself he isn't gay and he doesn't want to blow his fellow soldiers every single day.

Correct.  He figures once a week (each) is enough, and wants no more than that.

[MadImmortalMan]

And there's more

By Lt. Daniel Choi
Special to CNN

Open Letter to President Obama and Every Member of Congress:

I have learned many lessons in the ten years since I first raised my right hand at the United States Military Academy at West Point and committed to fighting for my country. The lessons of courage, integrity, honesty and selfless service are some of the most important.

At West Point, I recited the Cadet Prayer every Sunday. It taught us to "choose the harder right over the easier wrong" and to "never be content with a half truth when the whole can be won." The Cadet Honor Code demanded truthfulness and honesty. It imposed a zero-tolerance policy against deception, or hiding behind comfort.

Following the Honor Code never bowed to comfortable timing or popularity. Honor and integrity are 24-hour values. That is why I refuse to lie about my identity.

I have personally served for a decade under Don't Ask, Don't Tell: an immoral law and policy that forces American soldiers to deceive and lie about their sexual orientation. Worse, it forces others to tolerate deception and lying. These values are completely opposed to anything I learned at West Point. Deception and lies poison a unit and cripple a fighting force.

As an infantry officer, an Iraq combat veteran and a West Point graduate with a degree in Arabic, I refuse to lie to my commanders. I refuse to lie to my peers. I refuse to lie to my subordinates. I demand honesty and courage from my soldiers. They should demand the same from me.

I am committed to applying the leadership lessons I learned at West Point. With 60 other LGBT West Point graduates, I helped form our organization, Knights Out, to fight for the repeal of this discriminatory law and educate cadets and soldiers after the repeal occurs. When I receive emails from deployed soldiers and veterans who feel isolated, alone, and even suicidal because the torment of rejection and discrimination, I remember my leadership training: soldiers cannot feel alone, especially in combat. Leaders must reach out. They can never diminish the fighting spirit of a soldier by tolerating discrimination and isolation. Leaders respect the honor of service. Respecting each soldier's service is my personal promise.


The Department of the Army sent a letter discharging me on April 23rd. I will not lie to you; the letter is a slap in the face. It is a slap in the face to me. It is a slap in the face to my soldiers, peers and leaders who have demonstrated that an infantry unit can be professional enough to accept diversity, to accept capable leaders, to accept skilled soldiers.

My subordinates know I'm gay. They don't care. They are professional.

Further, they are respectable infantrymen who work as a team. Many told me that they respect me even more because I trusted them enough to let them know the truth. Trust is the foundation of unit cohesion.

After I publicly announced that I am gay, I reported for training and led rifle marksmanship. I ordered hundreds of soldiers to fire live rounds and qualify on their weapons. I qualified on my own weapon. I showered after training and slept in an open bay with 40 other infantrymen. I cannot understand the claim that I "negatively affected good order and discipline in the New York Army National Guard." I refuse to accept this statement as true.

As an infantry officer, I am not accustomed to begging. But I beg you today: Do not fire me. Do not fire me because my soldiers are more than a unit or a fighting force – we are a family and we support each other. We should not learn that honesty and courage leads to punishment and insult. Their professionalism should not be rewarded with losing their leader. I understand if you must fire me, but please do not discredit and insult my soldiers for their professionalism.

When I was commissioned I was told that I serve at the pleasure of the President. I hope I have not displeased anyone by my honesty. I love my job. I want to deploy and continue to serve with the unit I respect and admire. I want to continue to serve our country because of everything it stands for.

Please do not wait to repeal Don't Ask, Don't Tell. Please do not fire me.

Very Respectfully,

Daniel W. Choi
1LT, IN
New York Army National Guard

[The Brain]

He claims to know shit about truth and honesty and he effectively lied for years instead of quitting the service?

[Ed Anger]

After that letter, I hope they toss him so fast, he gets whiplash.

[Admiral Yi]

By Lt. Daniel Choi
I have personally served for a decade under Don't Ask, Don't Tell: an immoral law and policy that forces American soldiers to deceive and lie about their sexual orientation. Worse, it forces others to tolerate deception and lying. These values are completely opposed to anything I learned at West Point. Deception and lies poison a unit and cripple a fighting force.

As an infantry officer, an Iraq combat veteran and a West Point graduate with a degree in Arabic, I refuse to lie to my commanders. I refuse to lie to my peers. I refuse to lie to my subordinates. I demand honesty and courage from my soldiers. They should demand the same from me.

When was he forced to lie?

[Berkut]

He claims to know shit about truth and honesty and he effectively lied for years instead of quitting the service?

So he is taking a stand on principle, and your bitch is that he didn't do it sooner?