How much does weight factor in?

[Lettow77]

You know Sheilbh is gay, right?

This place has always been thick with The Gays. I don't keep a running track- unless you stand out by being a pedophile, polish or black, it's hard to be be bothered to remember who's part of languish's gay cabal.

I don't really guess that invalidates my questions, though. sexual desire is sexual desire, isn't it? Substitute "she" for "he." I suppose the notion that sexuality is a woman's only redeeming feature is cast away, as it would be hard for a man who lusts after other men to feel men's only worth was the opportunities they provided for sexual gratification. (I think?)

(Does this mean that women may have no value whatsoever to Shielbh? I've heard the sentiment from some homosexuals before.)

I was really seeking to understand how sexuality can be such a consuming aspect of a relationship's importance- the genders don't come into it, I guess, especially not if the party I am addressing is a man and thus I have some baseline by which I can presume to relate. Feel free to answer this yourself if you would.

[Martinus]

Yeah right. And owns a castle.

[Martinus]

Lettow, to answer your question, I think with men, it is possible to keep physical attraction going on despite age - of course there are gay guys who are into young guys only but in general a man who is, say, 55, can keep fit and be attractive much easier than a woman of 55 since we perceive different aspects of male and female beauty. There are many male movie stars and celebrities who are for example athletic and look good despite their age - but for women, even the slim ones, we look at stuff like aging of their skin (compare muscular Brad Pitt with freaky Madonna).

[Sheilbh]

Is sexual attraction really so utterly vital? It can't be dispensed with, if she was intensely appealing otherwise?
Or is that a woman's chief value?

First of all what the Brain said.

Secondly, yeah, I think it is that vital.  I think you need sexual attraction to someone to make it worth having a go - in all sorts of ways.  Obviously what we find sexually attractive varies but for me weight is a part of it.  I think as long as what I'm looking for is a sexual relationship then that's always going to be my view.  Like Marty I've been with a guy who was more overweight than I normally go for, but he was really charismatic.  So I'm not some sort of bastard who gets the callipers out on the first date (that's a third date kind of thing), but sex matters and for me weight matters in that.

How do you reconcile this essential nature with aging and what it does to female attractiveness? Do you count on your desire to fade, or will you always seek younger women?

I don't know.  I don't find age as unattractive.  I hope to be a silver fox and with one

[Sheilbh]

Lettow, to answer your question, I think with men, it is possible to keep physical attraction going on despite age - of course there are gay guys who are into young guys only but in general a man who is, say, 55, can keep fit and be attractive much easier than a woman of 55 since we perceive different aspects of male and female beauty. There are many male movie stars and celebrities who are for example athletic and look good despite their age - but for women, even the slim ones, we look at stuff like aging of their skin (compare muscular Brad Pitt with freaky Madonna).

I disagree.  I think this is a social thing that's changing.  Just look at Helen Mirren

[Lettow77]

 If you think its a social thing, it certainly isn't changing in Japan any time soon.

Would it be impossible for you to enjoy someone else's company so much that sexual contact between the two of you was exclusively for their sake? Suppose you didn't enjoy it, but they did. Would their happiness not suffice, if you cared about them enough?

Sexuality in a relationship is another aspect of closeness, isn't it? If there was someone you felt the overriding desire to be close to, surely even sexual revulsion could be suppressed in the name of furthering your bond with that person.

Couldn't you lie back and think of san francisco?

[Sheilbh]

Would it be impossible for you to enjoy someone else's company so much that sexual contact between the two of you was exclusively for their sake? Suppose you didn't enjoy it, but they did. Would their happiness not suffice, if you cared about them enough?

I don't think so I mean this is the sort of thing that leads to divorce.  I don't think aspects of a relationship should be exclusively for their sake or for yours.  So, in my view and I may be wrong, mutual attraction matters.

Sexuality in a relationship is another aspect of closeness, isn't it? If there was someone you felt the overriding desire to be close to, surely even sexual revulsion could be suppressed in the name of furthering your bond with that person.

No.  Sexuality is sex.  Just because I sleep with someone doesn't mean I want to know about the time they lost their childhood puppy or whatever - and vice versa.  Emotional closeness and being simpatico with one another are essential, without them you've a one night stand.  But, in my view, so's sex.  Without that you've a friendship.

Also I think the gays may be stricter on weight because there's no upside to bigger guys.  Bigger girls often have bigger boobs or better arses.  Bigger men often have bigger boobs too...

[Lettow77]

 Friendship doesn't really cover it though, and friendship isn't really enough.

I appreciate your answers, but we don't understand each other.

[11B4V]

This place has always been thick with The Gays.

What does that matter?

languish's gay cabal

[Lettow77]

 It doesn't matter at all. Did I not make that clear enough? I mean, it's no business to me how gay shielbh is or isn't. I hadn't bothered to take note of it before. I knew that there were plenty on languish, but unless they make it their personality (see: martinus) someone's homosexuality isn't really of enough note for me to keep it as a fixed idea about their character. I'm more likely to remember where they are from, for example.

Isn't indifferent and unconsidering acceptance the sort of equality homosexuals seek?

As for the gay cabal- perhaps you remember the gay mafia? It was a languish thing, long ago. A signature picture and everything.

[11B4V]

It doesn't matter at all. Did I not make that clear enough? I mean, it's no business to me how gay shielbh is or isn't. I hadn't bothered to take note of it before. I knew that there were plenty on languish, but unless they make it their personality (see: martinus) someone's homosexuality isn't really of enough note for me to keep it as a fixed idea about their character. I'm more likely to remember where they are from, for example.

Isn't indifferent and unconsidering acceptance the sort of equality homosexuals seek?

As for the gay cabal- perhaps you remember the gay mafia? It was a languish thing, long ago. A signature picture and everything.

Cabal is kind of a gay substitute for Mafia dont you think?

[Eddie Teach]

Also I think the gays may be stricter on weight because there's no upside to bigger guys. 

Bigger guys have bigger muscles, assuming similar levels of activity.



I thought it was gay mafia and lawyer's cabal. 

[11B4V]

Also I think the gays may be stricter on weight because there's no upside to bigger guys. 

Bigger guys have bigger muscles, assuming similar levels of activity.



I thought it was gay mafia and lawyer's cabal. 

That would make more sense.

[Martinus]

Well, there are definitely chubby-chasers out there (a friend of a friend is 120 kilos and in his 40s, and there are young twinks apparently lining up to be fucked by him) and bears have their own thing but neither Sheilbh nor myself are into that - I don't know about you heteros but among gays, this is more like a fetish - like being into peed on or fisted or something - there are many people who like it but if you are not into it, you are not into it.

[Lettow77]

 Mafia is such an unpleasant word, though. It calls Sicilians to mind.