Trayvon Martin case: use of Stand Your Ground law or pursuit of a black teen?

[Admiral Yi]

But you probably won't.

[Kleves]

What, from the original 911 phone call?  Quite frankly, I didn't think that was what he said the first time I heard it.

Yeah, who says "coon"?

Sanford, Florida (CNN) -- George Zimmerman told his lawyers that he whispered "punks," not a racial slur, in the moments before he shot Trayvon Martin, his attorneys told CNN on Thursday.

Some people interpreted the police recording of Zimmerman's call to 911 as evidence the fatal shooting was racially motivated.

Zimmerman attorneys Hal Ulrig and Craig Sonner told CNN their client told them that he said, "F---ing punks."

Forensic audio expert Tom Owen, who analyzed 911 recordings, agreed the garbled word that raised controversy was "punks," not the racial slur some people said they heard

When Owen, chairman emeritus of the American Board of Recorded Evidence, used a computer application to remove cell phone interference, the word became clearer, he said. After discussions with linguists, he said he became convinced that Zimmerman said "punks."
He provided CNN with a copy of the newly processed audio.

CNN also enhanced the sound of the 911 call, and several members of CNN's editorial staff repeatedly reviewed the tape but could reach no consensus on whether Zimmerman used a slur.
Martin's family and supporters say Zimmerman, who is Hispanic, profiled Martin, who was black, as "suspicious" and ignored a police dispatcher's request not to follow him. Martin did not live in Sanford, Florida, but he was there with his father, whose fiancee lives in Zimmerman's neighborhood.

Zimmerman, 28, fatally shot Martin, 17, on February 26. The case has triggered a nationwide debate about Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law, race and racial profiling.

While Zimmerman's attorneys may welcome Owen's analysis of their client's 911 call, they disagree with his conclusions about what is heard on another 911 recording.

Zimmerman has said he was yelling for help, according to his family members and his account to authorities, as first reported by The Orlando Sentinel and later confirmed by Sanford police.

But Martin's relatives, including his cousin Ronquavis Fulton, have said they are certain the voice heard on the 911 call is Martin's.

Owen and another audio expert, Ed Primeau, analyzed the recording for the Sentinel using different techniques, and they said they don't believe it is Zimmerman who is heard yelling in the background of one 911 call. They compared the screams with Zimmerman's voice, as recorded in a 911 call he made minutes earlier describing a "suspicious" black male.

"There's a huge chance that this is not Zimmerman's voice," said Primeau, a longtime audio engineer who is listed as an expert in recorded evidence by the American College of Forensic Examiners International.

"After 28 years of doing this, I would put my reputation on the line and say this is not George Zimmerman screaming."

Owen also said he does not believe the screams came from Zimmerman.

He does not have a sample of Martin's voice for comparison, he said.

He cited software that is widely used in Europe and has become recently accepted in the United States that examines characteristics such as pitch and the space between spoken words to analyze voices.

Using it, he found a 48% likelihood the voice is Zimmerman's. At least 60% is necessary to feel confident that two samples are from the same source, he told CNN on Monday -- meaning it's unlikely it was Zimmerman who can be heard yelling.

The experts, both of whom said they have testified in cases involving audio analysis, stressed that they cannot say who was screaming.

[CountDeMoney]

What, from the original 911 phone call?  Quite frankly, I didn't think that was what he said the first time I heard it.

Yeah, who says "coon"?

People down Caliga's way, not metro Florida.

I thought he said "punks" as well first time I heard it.

[Razgovory]

But you probably won't.

I'm waiting now, ain't I?

[Sheilbh]

CNN now seems to doubt Zimmerman used a racial slur, after filtering out some background noise from the tape.

Some people did and some people didn't, personally I never heard him say 'coon'.  But whether he's a bit racist or not seems a side issue, unless it was the only route for a decent investigation (I think the DoJ can step in then?).

[Neil]

DG is a Russian.  Magical thinking is his forte.

[derspiess]

CNN now seems to doubt Zimmerman used a racial slur, after filtering out some background noise from the tape.

Some people did and some people didn't, personally I never heard him say 'coon'.  But whether he's a bit racist or not seems a side issue, unless it was the only route for a decent investigation (I think the DoJ can step in then?).

I wasn't 100% sure what it sounded like, but of to me it sounded more like "coons" than any other word-- which would have been pretty damning IMO if that had been the case.  In the cleaned-up audio it sounds more like "cold", but Zimmerman's lawyers are claiming he said "punks".

[DGuller]

DG is a Russian.  Magical thinking is his forte.

[Kleves]

I wasn't 100% sure what it sounded like, but of to me it sounded more like "coons" than any other word-- which would have been pretty damning IMO if that had been the case.  In the cleaned-up audio it sounds more like "cold", but Zimmerman's lawyers are claiming he said "punks".

Still, its a pyrrhic victory for Zimmerman if it turns out that Martin is the one screaming for help during the call.

[Razgovory]

Pyrrihic victory for Martin either way.

[derspiess]

I wasn't 100% sure what it sounded like, but of to me it sounded more like "coons" than any other word-- which would have been pretty damning IMO if that had been the case.  In the cleaned-up audio it sounds more like "cold", but Zimmerman's lawyers are claiming he said "punks".

Still, its a pyrrhic victory for Zimmerman if it turns out that Martin is the one screaming for help during the call.

Sure, but whatever happens to him I don't see any solid evidence now to pin any hate crime charges on him. 

[Admiral Yi]

You can only get the hate crime bonus if you're convicted of a vanilla crime first, right?  Seems like hate crime is the least of Zimmereman's worries.

[Razgovory]

You can only get the hate crime bonus if you're convicted of a vanilla crime first, right?  Seems like hate crime is the least of Zimmereman's worries.

I think they can charge him for denying the use of a public facility based on race.  I don't know if a sidewalk counts.

[jimmy olsen]

Howard Morgan, Black Off-Duty Cop Shot 28 Times By White Chicago Officers, Faces Up To 80 Years In Prison

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/03/howard-morgan-ex-cop-shot_n_1399834.html

What the hell?

The same jury that cleared him of opening fire on the officers, however, deadlocked on a charge of attempted murder

[Zoupa]

Yup. He's now serving 40 years.

America.