Alex Salmond to let 16-year-olds vote in bid to secure independence

[viper37]

Anyway, despite efforts - I don't think the demographic of the US is becoming whiter or more English.

But they still assimilate to the general US culture.  And there's no specific exceptions in the laws of the countries for a particular group.  No islamic tribunal, afaik.  No officially bilingual states for Spanish.  Unilingual states, howere, do exists, like California and Arizona.  That ain't exactly multi-cultural.  One could argue that building a fence around the country, on its southern border as well as its norther border ain't exactly a sign of opening to immigration.

Blacks may have a different skin color, but their culture have merged with the general white population.

[Razgovory]

I think you missed the point.  How about this, would it be acceptable if French had the same status as First nation languages in Quebec and the rest of Canada?  I don't think the law requires you be served in Cree on an Air Canada flight.  I don't think any First Nation language has the protection status as French.

Different matter entirely.
For once, most of the indians do not speak their ancient native language, they have assimilated to English&French for the most part.  It just wouldn't be practical for them.

What is this "Based on reservations" caveat?  I'm thinking of huge chunks of Canada.  The Francophones can have St. Lawrence river valley, the rest go to the Indians.

The claims were relinquished in various treaties with the British, the Canadians and later Quebec.  Indians that were expelled from the US by British, Americans or Iroquois have no claims in Canada, unfortunately.

Ah, so you aren't so keen on protecting their language.  Your definition of "protect" seems to be "don't overtly hinder to much".  Though apparently even reservations must be bilingual.  Like I said, you don't offer the same status to First Nation languages as the Anglophones offer to French.   Practical is not a consideration in Identity politics as the pro-Independence types in Quebec aptly demonstrate.


The French relinquished their claims on Quebec through treaties.  As the people of Quebec were French Subjects, those claims were relinquished on their behalf.  So using your logic, Quebec shouldn't be independent either.

[garbon]

Anyway, despite efforts - I don't think the demographic of the US is becoming whiter or more English.

But they still assimilate to the general US culture.  And there's no specific exceptions in the laws of the countries for a particular group.  No islamic tribunal, afaik.  No officially bilingual states for Spanish.  Unilingual states, howere, do exists, like California and Arizona.  That ain't exactly multi-cultural.  One could argue that building a fence around the country, on its southern border as well as its norther border ain't exactly a sign of opening to immigration.

Blacks may have a different skin color, but their culture have merged with the general white population.

Culture is solely an artifact of language?

Also, you should probably get your facts straight. California's official language is English but about 1/4 of Californians speak Spanish as well and it looks like Arizona has a comparable statistic.  Additionally there is Spanish on many signs and products all over the southwest. According to wiki, some legal documents in New Mexico are required to have Spanish.

Oh and were you aware that in California it is no longer mandatory for employers to check immigration status? Illegal immigrants can also get financial aid and in-state tuition for college. Sounds exactly like a sign of being close to immigration.

[Razgovory]

Anyway, despite efforts - I don't think the demographic of the US is becoming whiter or more English.

But they still assimilate to the general US culture.  And there's no specific exceptions in the laws of the countries for a particular group.  No islamic tribunal, afaik.  No officially bilingual states for Spanish.  Unilingual states, howere, do exists, like California and Arizona.  That ain't exactly multi-cultural.  One could argue that building a fence around the country, on its southern border as well as its norther border ain't exactly a sign of opening to immigration.

Blacks may have a different skin color, but their culture have merged with the general white population.

We also don't have any official language.  It would be difficult to claim that the culture of the US in 1811 is the same culture as that of 2011.  Saying they "assimilated" is inaccurate.  Hell most of us are descended from Germans.  Like me.

[garbon]

We also don't have any official language.  It would be difficult to claim that the culture of the US in 1811 is the same culture as that of 2011.  Saying they "assimilated" is inaccurate.  Hell most of us are descended from Germans.  Like me.

Actually many individual states do have official languages.

[Grey Fox]

I think you missed the point.  How about this, would it be acceptable if French had the same status as First nation languages in Quebec and the rest of Canada?  I don't think the law requires you be served in Cree on an Air Canada flight.  I don't think any First Nation language has the protection status as French.

Different matter entirely.
For once, most of the indians do not speak their ancient native language, they have assimilated to English&French for the most part.  It just wouldn't be practical for them.

What is this "Based on reservations" caveat?  I'm thinking of huge chunks of Canada.  The Francophones can have St. Lawrence river valley, the rest go to the Indians.

The claims were relinquished in various treaties with the British, the Canadians and later Quebec.  Indians that were expelled from the US by British, Americans or Iroquois have no claims in Canada, unfortunately.

Ah, so you aren't so keen on protecting their language.  Your definition of "protect" seems to be "don't overtly hinder to much".  Though apparently even reservations must be bilingual.  Like I said, you don't offer the same status to First Nation languages as the Anglophones offer to French.   Practical is not a consideration in Identity politics as the pro-Independence types in Quebec aptly demonstrate.


The French relinquished their claims on Quebec through treaties.  As the people of Quebec were French Subjects, those claims were relinquished on their behalf.  So using your logic, Quebec shouldn't be independent either.

The Anglos, they offer nothing. We made it happen.

[Razgovory]

The Anglos, they offer nothing. We made it happen.

There are lots of Democracies that don't extend such rights and privileges to minority languages.  France for example.  A minority doesn't force a majority to do something with out the majority allowing it to happen unless by force of arms.

[Razgovory]

We also don't have any official language.  It would be difficult to claim that the culture of the US in 1811 is the same culture as that of 2011.  Saying they "assimilated" is inaccurate.  Hell most of us are descended from Germans.  Like me.

Actually many individual states do have official languages.

The Feds don't.  The states are like retarded children off getting into trouble.  They often do stupid things.  When they do, we just sigh and shake our head.

[viper37]

If we nitpick on the small cultural differences, then of course, each individual is different, each family would represent a cultural identity in itself.

Not sure why you narrow down to the individual and then go macro by focusing on the family.

well, I don't know the english word for the term I'm seeking.  The smallest unit we analyzes in micro-economy.

[Maximus]

Indians that were expelled from the US by British, Americans or Iroquois have no claims in Canada, unfortunately.

Do the Quebecois have claims within Canada?

[Neil]

No islamic tribunal, afaik.

  Not this again.

[Neil]

Culture is solely an artifact of language?

Quebec sovereigntists have created some rather intricate philosophical constructions to try and justify their position.

[viper37]

Culture is solely an artifact of language?

No.  But it's the basis.

Also, you should probably get your facts straight. California's official language is English but about 1/4 of Californians speak Spanish as well and it looks like Arizona has a comparable statistic.  Additionally there is Spanish on many signs and products all over the southwest. According to wiki, some legal documents in New Mexico are required to have Spanish.

While the judicial system has noted that the laws are largely symbolic and non prohibitive, public school staff often interpret them to mean English is the mandatory language of daily life.[citation needed] In one instance, an elementary school bus driver prohibited students from speaking Spanish on their way to school after Colorado passed its legislation.[21] In 2004 in Scottsdale, a teacher claimed to be enforcing English immersion policies when she allegedly slapped students for speaking Spanish in class.[22] In 2005 in Kansas City, a student was suspended for speaking Spanish in the school hallways. The written discipline referral explaining the decision of the school to suspend the student for one and a half days, noted: "This is not the first time we have [asked] Zach and others to not speak Spanish at school." [23]

And this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposition_227
No bilingual education for California.

Oh and were you aware that in California it is no longer mandatory for employers to check immigration status? Illegal immigrants can also get financial aid and in-state tuition for college. Sounds exactly like a sign of being close to immigration.

Let's talk about Arizona.

[viper37]

Indians that were expelled from the US by British, Americans or Iroquois have no claims in Canada, unfortunately.

Do the Quebecois have claims within Canada?

Labrador.

[Maximus]

But not Quebec itself? Interesting. Upon what would you base this claim?