Denmark to reinstate border controls to Germany, Sweden

[grumbler]

Just put Narn at all of the customs areas.

[chipwich]

Where is the European Shay's rebellion going to happen?

[MadImmortalMan]

Where is the European Shay's rebellion going to happen?

Greece

[Liep]

This is turning out to be way more entertaining than it should be. Nazicards are being pulled left and right, disgraced politicians make worthy comebacks only to be disgraced again, and our foreign minister proves herself incompentent again.

Go Denmark!

[Martim Silva]

State to state? No papers?

Interestingly enough, that was the natural state of things until WWI. Before 1914, nobody needed any papers to go and live wherever they wanted to; the whole idea of controlling peoples' movements just seemed silly. Only diplomats and people who needed safe passage for one reason or another were issued with proper papers.

The massification of passports became a reality almost overnight in August 1914, when people suddenly saw themselves in need to prove which nationality they were, in a Continent which became suddenly *very* paranoid about infiltrated spies. It became madness, with passports of one nation being issued by other nations.

(there are some funny stories in the Imperial War Museum about US consulates issuing ad hoc passports to British citizens in Germany on the first days of August to prove that the people were Subjects of the King).

So, we're just going back to the old days. The reality is that the "big novelty" of the EU is... getting us back to pre-1914 ways.

[Valmy]

getting us back to pre-1914 ways.

No wonder Otto von Habsburg was so keen on the project.

[Berkut]

Just a question.  Can the EU force it's members to follow the treaties they signed?  More broadly, how does the EU enforce any of it's laws?

The EU is built on consensus and is composed of sovereign states. If a country stops complying the worst that can happen is that the ECJ or EC fine the respective country (by withholding EU funds).

That doesn't seem very effective, and could open itself to abuse (wealthy countries flaunting the rule and such).  I admit, I don't understand the EU that well.

Well, what happens if a US state passes law that is contrary to the US constitution and the law is declared invalid by the Supreme Court, but the US state continues to enforce it? Does the US President send in the National Guard?

Yes, if necessary.

But that is an apples and oranges comparison, I think. The EU is not at all analogous to the US in its level of power/responsibilities/relationship with respects to member EU nations and US states.

[11B4V]

Argumentum ad populum?

Really?

Weak.

Agreed, so stop making them. 

Huh?
Argumentum ad Populum (popular appeal or appeal to the majority): The fallacy of attempting to win popular assent to a conclusion by arousing the feeling and enthusiasms of the multitude.  There are several variations of this fallacy, but we will emphasize two forms.
"Snob Appeal":  the fallacy of attempting to prove a conclusion by appealing to what an elite or a select few (but not necessarily an authority) in a society thinks or believes.
(There are many non-fallacious appeals in style, fashion, and politics--since in these areas the appeal is not irrelevant.)
Person L says statement p or argument A.
Person L is in the elite.
Statement p is true or argument A is good.

"Bandwagon": the fallacy of attempting to prove a conclusion on the grounds that all or most people think or believe it is true.
Most, many, or all persons believe statement p is true.
Statement p is true.

Ah...Ha.

This Thread=

[Jacob]

This is turning out to be way more entertaining than it should be. Nazicards are being pulled left and right, disgraced politicians make worthy comebacks only to be disgraced again, and our foreign minister proves herself incompentent again.

Go Denmark!

What happened?

[Mr.Penguin]

This is turning out to be way more entertaining than it should be. Nazicards are being pulled left and right, disgraced politicians make worthy comebacks only to be disgraced again, and our foreign minister proves herself incompentent again.

Go Denmark!

What happened?

Well, the original political deal somehow along the way went from increased border/custom control to full border control with the Danish peoples party (DF) claiming all the credit. The German interior minister throws a hissy fit and plays the nazi card, DF plays it back claiming that Germany still wants to control its neighbors, this time through a federal Europe...

Various professional and some not so professional experts denounce the Danish government, saying that the agreement is against the Schengen agreement. Some these experts can't quite resist some name calling and political backlash ensue, with question about the role and neutrality of these experts, with counter claims of political gag orders...

At the same time, do some political backbenchers withdraw their support for the whole deal, only reinstate their support after some shady deals, that in reality amounts to a whole lot of nothing...

And last but not least, does it turn out that our foreign minister haven't really bothered to try and explain the whole deal for our neighbors, leaving this part of the job to some incompetent public officials, somehow can't make a German translation of the deal, with making a mess of it all, apparently. All this of course leads back to why the German interior minister did throw his hissy fit in the first place...         

[garbon]

Shouldn't Germans be more careful about playing the Nazi card on other nations?

[Liep]

Shouldn't Germans be more careful about playing the Nazi card on other nations?

As I read it the Germans only pulled a nationalism card to which the DPP responded, "shouldn't Germans be more careful about playing the Nazi card on other nations?"

[Ed Anger]

Lol, the Germans are just mad they didn't slam the door on the Turks a long time ago.

[Mr.Penguin]

Shouldn't Germans be more careful about playing the Nazi card on other nations?

As I read it the Germans only pulled a nationalism card to which the DPP responded, "shouldn't Germans be more careful about playing the Nazi card on other nations?"

Well, the German interior minister did make a reference to "the kind of nationalism, that in his country's name did bring Europe indescribable suffering"...

[grumbler]

Argumentum ad populum?

Really?

Weak.

Agreed, so stop making them. 

Huh?
Argumentum ad Populum (popular appeal or appeal to the majority): The fallacy of attempting to win popular assent to a conclusion by arousing the feeling and enthusiasms of the multitude.  There are several variations of this fallacy, but we will emphasize two forms.
"Snob Appeal":  the fallacy of attempting to prove a conclusion by appealing to what an elite or a select few (but not necessarily an authority) in a society thinks or believes.
(There are many non-fallacious appeals in style, fashion, and politics--since in these areas the appeal is not irrelevant.)
Person L says statement p or argument A.
Person L is in the elite.
Statement p is true or argument A is good.

"Bandwagon": the fallacy of attempting to prove a conclusion on the grounds that all or most people think or believe it is true.
Most, many, or all persons believe statement p is true.
Statement p is true.

Ah...Ha.

This Thread=

Argumentum ad Populum is weak.  That is what Sluggo said, that's what I said, and that's what your source said.  How could you still be  at that assertion after seeing all the supporting evidence?