[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Malthus]

I suppose I should say, I worry about an immature right wing in this country that continues to do whatever it can to make the Liberals the natural governing party.  The Liberals are chastened now but a few more years of rule with no real prospect of political challenge will return us to the bad old days of the later years of the Chretian governments.  You know the period of time made possible by another group of right wingers.  If history repeats itself, you will only have yourself to blame.

I see you have internalized my cyclical Canadian political theory. 

Sadly, I suspect this sort of thing is more or less inevitable ... look on how long the Libs spent in the wilderness last "cycle". I suspect the cons may have the same long slog ahead of them, particularly if they are seen as embracing Trump Lite-like politicians ... 

[Barrister]

I suppose I should say, I worry about an immature right wing in this country that continues to do whatever it can to make the Liberals the natural governing party.  The Liberals are chastened now but a few more years of rule with no real prospect of political challenge will return us to the bad old days of the later years of the Chretian governments.  You know the period of time made possible by another group of right wingers.  If history repeats itself, you will only have yourself to blame.

Yes, I know your position.  You like there to be two centrist parties that can alternate in government.

I like there to be meaningful policy and philosophical differences between the party.  I think history has shown Canadians are not opposed to voting for a principled conservative party.

[Barrister]

I suppose I should say, I worry about an immature right wing in this country that continues to do whatever it can to make the Liberals the natural governing party.  The Liberals are chastened now but a few more years of rule with no real prospect of political challenge will return us to the bad old days of the later years of the Chretian governments.  You know the period of time made possible by another group of right wingers.  If history repeats itself, you will only have yourself to blame.

I see you have internalized my cyclical Canadian political theory. 

Sadly, I suspect this sort of thing is more or less inevitable ... look on how long the Libs spent in the wilderness last "cycle". I suspect the cons may have the same long slog ahead of them, particularly if they are seen as embracing Trump Lite-like politicians ...

You guys are acting as if O'Leary is going to win the race, which hasn't even started yet and he hasn't actually announced he would run.

And, as I said, there are a lot of differences between O'Leary and Trump.

[Malthus]

You guys are acting as if O'Leary is going to win the race, which hasn't even started yet and he hasn't actually announced he would run.

And, as I said, there are a lot of differences between O'Leary and Trump.

Naw. I'm saying a cycle is inevitable, and more so/longer lasting if guys like O'Leary run (and win).

He's different from Trump, but even you have claimed his statements are part "schtick".

[crazy canuck]

I suppose I should say, I worry about an immature right wing in this country that continues to do whatever it can to make the Liberals the natural governing party.  The Liberals are chastened now but a few more years of rule with no real prospect of political challenge will return us to the bad old days of the later years of the Chretian governments.  You know the period of time made possible by another group of right wingers.  If history repeats itself, you will only have yourself to blame.

I see you have internalized my cyclical Canadian political theory. 

Sadly, I suspect this sort of thing is more or less inevitable ... look on how long the Libs spent in the wilderness last "cycle". I suspect the cons may have the same long slog ahead of them, particularly if they are seen as embracing Trump Lite-like politicians ...

Yeah, well it was painfully obvious what would happen with the Reformers split.  I can see something like that happening again if the vocal right wing nuts back a candidate who has publicly announced unions should be outlawed.

[crazy canuck]

I suppose I should say, I worry about an immature right wing in this country that continues to do whatever it can to make the Liberals the natural governing party.  The Liberals are chastened now but a few more years of rule with no real prospect of political challenge will return us to the bad old days of the later years of the Chretian governments.  You know the period of time made possible by another group of right wingers.  If history repeats itself, you will only have yourself to blame.

Yes, I know your position.  You like there to be two centrist parties that can alternate in government.

I like there to be meaningful policy and philosophical differences between the party.  I think history has shown Canadians are not opposed to voting for a principled conservative party.

Then you haven't been paying attention.  For years I have been saying it would be best if the Liberals disappeared as a meaningful political force leaving the NDP and the Conservatives to compete with eachother from their own political perspective.  Who knew the Conservatives would render themselves unelectable during the election campaign so that the Liberals could come from single digit support to winning a majority.

I agree with you that Canadians are not opposed to voting for a principled Conservative party.  But history has also shown that a loony right wing party will ensure exactly the kind of government you do not want.

[viper37]

Who knew the Conservatives would render themselves unelectable during the election campaign so that the Liberals could come from single digit support to winning a majority.

People prefer the comfortable lie over the hurtful truth, that is a constant in our universe.

A young boy dead on a beach became a symbol of how racist canada had become.  How selfish we now were.
The Libs promised it would change, willing to sacrifice our comfort and our security to bring in 25 000 refugess by year's end.

They failed.

Ottawa and Vancouver are putting a big STOP sign to the programs, facing a shortage of renting space.
Many of the Syrians do not even want to come here.

So far, the Cons targets have been respected, maybe a little more people came in, nothing really dramatic that would change the lives of Syrians.  And we do that by screwing all other refugees in the world, reducing our quotas to accept more syrians.

It's hypocrisy to the 1000th exponent.

But people like it.  The lie makes them feel good.  They are able to look at others with contempt and call them "racist" for pointing the truth.  It pleases lots of people, hence why we have non truthful politicians.

[crazy canuck]

Who knew the Conservatives would render themselves unelectable during the election campaign so that the Liberals could come from single digit support to winning a majority.

People prefer the comfortable lie over the hurtful truth, that is a constant in our universe.

A young boy dead on a beach became a symbol of how racist canada had become.  How selfish we now were.
The Libs promised it would change, willing to sacrifice our comfort and our security to bring in 25 000 refugess by year's end.

They failed.

Ottawa and Vancouver are putting a big STOP sign to the programs, facing a shortage of renting space.
Many of the Syrians do not even want to come here.

So far, the Cons targets have been respected, maybe a little more people came in, nothing really dramatic that would change the lives of Syrians.  And we do that by screwing all other refugees in the world, reducing our quotas to accept more syrians.

It's hypocrisy to the 1000th exponent.

But people like it.  The lie makes them feel good.  They are able to look at others with contempt and call them "racist" for pointing the truth.  It pleases lots of people, hence why we have non truthful politicians.

Viper, you should know that the "big STOP" in Vancouver will last exactly 5 days.  They are doing that to give all the volunteers who have been doing the work some time off since they worked through the Holiday Season.

[viper37]

Viper, you should know that the "big STOP" in Vancouver will last exactly 5 days.  They are doing that to give all the volunteers who have been doing the work some time off since they worked through the Holiday Season.

Where are the 25 000?  So far, what we have, is the number of refugees the Conservatives promised.

[Grey Fox]

The. Number. does. not. matter.

[Barrister]

The. Number. does. not. matter.

Of course it does.

Trudeau picked the number very specifically so that it was higher than what the Conservatives and NDP were promising.

Of course it now turns out that picking a number for political purposes, and not based on practical factors, isn't a very good idea.  Who knew?

[The Minsky Moment]

The government claims that over 10,000 have now come in; if so the Conservative "quota" for the year ended 9/2016 has already been surpassed.  Since AFAIK the program continues, I don't see how one can say that the Cons targets are being respected.

[crazy canuck]

The government claims that over 10,000 have now come in; if so the Conservative "quota" for the year ended 9/2016 has already been surpassed.  Since AFAIK the program continues, I don't see how one can say that the Cons targets are being respected.

Yeah, we had that argument a while back when the Libs announced they were not going to be able to meet the target by the deadline but that there were continuing to use best efforts to reach the target.  I see nothing wrong with that and it is certain significantly different from the position of the Conservative government.

[Josephus]

It's an argument the Liberals are always going to face.

If they bring in 25,000 tomorrow, people would say "oh no, not vetting, terrororists in our midst. The end is nigh."

If they take a year it's all "ah, Liberals can't do what they promised. It was just an empty campaign propaganda...blah blah."

[Barrister]

It's an argument the Liberals are always going to face.

If they bring in 25,000 tomorrow, people would say "oh no, not vetting, terrororists in our midst. The end is nigh."

If they take a year it's all "ah, Liberals can't do what they promised. It was just an empty campaign propaganda...blah blah."

Because it was a stupid promise.  There was no way to do it without either slipping on doing a proper screening, or it would take longer than they said.