[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Malthus]

More election hilarity: Angry old man rant inspires internet memesters.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/conservative-supporter-yells-reporters-memes-1.3196052

[Josephus]

On a scale of 1-10 how much of an effect do you think Duffy will have on this election?

As far as scandals go, my prediction is that this one peaked too soon to have maximum impact on the election. So closer to the lower end of the scale.

I may agree. The general population has short memories

[viper37]

On a scale of 1-10 how much of an effect do you think Duffy will have on this election?

As far as scandals go, my prediction is that this one peaked too soon to have maximum impact on the election. So closer to the lower end of the scale.

That's why I think the date the findings of the Court are important.  Right now there is a mass of conflicting evidence so everyone can be reinforced in their own bias.  If the Court finds as a fact that the PMO or even the PM did something inappropriate then that might change the view of some Conservative supporters.  But right now the trial is not scheduled to end until after the election.

The facts which are not disputed have, as Malthus pointed out, been known for a long time and are already reflected in the polls.

honestly, I don't see the big deal with this scandal.
Duffy was caught cheating, like many other Senators.  Ok, he was named by Harper.  Others were not, some others were.
That whole institution is based on the idea that we live in a aristocratic system where there's a class of people who know more than the lower masses by virtue of their birth or political position.  It is a stupid system and it leads to abuse, as we have seen with various General and Lieutenant Governors.  You tell people they're special, better than the commoners and they start not only believing it, but acting like it.

So back to Duffy.  He did what others do, Harper did not like it, thought it would be bad for the party, tried to cover it up by having Duffy pay back.  Duffy did not want to because he feels it's his due.  His billionaire friends steps in, give him money to save the party from a scandal and let it appear as if Duffy was repentant.  Harper was likely made slightly aware that Duffy could not pay back and something else had done, but willingly tried to ignore the details and his cabinet chief did everything he could to shield him from the details so that he could have plausible deniability in case it became public.

No public funds were hurt.  That PM and the PMO may have acted unethically by hiding the facts, but in the end, the amount Duffy misappropriated was refunded.

There are worst things to be concerned about, imho.  From all party leaders.  Except Justin.  He's perfect.  Being empty certainly helps a lot with that.

[Josephus]

Agreed it's not much of a scandal in the grand scheme of things but

1. It's a Canadian scandal...we don't get much of them.

2. It's a Harper appointee to an institution Harper vowed to reform.

3. Most Canadians don't read the news beyond their Twitter feed, so although it LOOKS like nothing, as long as it gets played up it looks bad...on Harper.

[Grallon]

More election hilarity: Angry old man rant inspires internet memesters.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/conservative-supporter-yells-reporters-memes-1.3196052

The Conservative base at its... most honest it seems.  Who knows, the NDP brand of corruption (to be) might prove even more amusing!


G.

[Josephus]

The Globe today ran an editorial which points out the bigger problem with the Duffy scandal in that it reveals the unrestrained power of the PMO, something which the Globe points out, began in the PET era and grew from there.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/editorials/ottawas-accountability-problems-start-at-the-top-in-the-pmo/article26041816/

[viper37]

Agreed it's not much of a scandal in the grand scheme of things but

1. It's a Canadian scandal...we don't get much of them.

2. It's a Harper appointee to an institution Harper vowed to reform.

3. Most Canadians don't read the news beyond their Twitter feed, so although it LOOKS like nothing, as long as it gets played up it looks bad...on Harper.

#2 has to be looked in the global picture sense.  The fact that he nominated him for that position doesn't do much for me, others, named by Chrétien, are in trouble too.  The fact that he did not reform the Senate is the crux of the issue for me, not the false Duffy scandal.
#3 Yes, it is pleasing for any NDP supporter

[viper37]

More election hilarity: Angry old man rant inspires internet memesters.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/conservative-supporter-yells-reporters-memes-1.3196052

The Conservative base at its... most honest it seems.  Who knows, the NDP brand of corruption (to be) might prove even more amusing!


G.

the PQ membership reacts exactly the same way when we dare question PKP.  It's just that PKP's medias would never air such things.

[viper37]

The Globe today ran an editorial which points out the bigger problem with the Duffy scandal in that it reveals the unrestrained power of the PMO, something which the Globe points out, began in the PET era and grew from there.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/editorials/ottawas-accountability-problems-start-at-the-top-in-the-pmo/article26041816/

Quebec has been complaining about this for the last 30 years, but we get called whiners and spoiled-babies for it.
Now that Ontario's media are getting on board (along with Ontario's government it seems), things might evolve a little.  I just don't expect it will change with Mulcair or Trudeau.

A socialist party would not relinquish control on the power it gets.  We've seen how much of a democrat was Chavez, I don't expect much more from Thomas Mulcair and the NDP.  They can't pass their global, coast-to-coast, programs if they don't have full control over every aspect of the government.  A simple majority in the House of Commons is not enough, opposition needs to be squashed everywhere if you want this to work without hiccups.  Besides, ex-NDP MPs are complaining of Mulcair's dictatorship, saying he's worst then Hitler Harper.

The Liberals have always been in favour of a strong and (dis)united Canada.  Regional/provincial power does not exist in their vocabulary.  No matter what Trudeau thinks, the party's establishment would be opposed to any kind of devolution toward the provinces or other offices.

What we need in this country is real decentralization, toward the provinces.  This way, we avoid repeating a concentration of power in the hands of the PMO, since there's less power to concentrate in the first place.

[Grallon]

the PQ membership reacts exactly the same way when we dare question PKP.  It's just that PKP's medias would never air such things.

Oh give me a break Vip - I haven't been a member since the late 80s!  And I'm very dubious about PKP - he hasn't impressed me so far yet.  We're talking about a Conservative supporter who trash talk journalists here - not the fantasies you have about the PQ!



G.

[Josephus]

The Globe today ran an editorial which points out the bigger problem with the Duffy scandal in that it reveals the unrestrained power of the PMO, something which the Globe points out, began in the PET era and grew from there.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/editorials/ottawas-accountability-problems-start-at-the-top-in-the-pmo/article26041816/

A socialist party would not relinquish control on the power it gets.  We've seen how much of a democrat was Chavez, I don't expect much more from Thomas Mulcair and the NDP. 

yeah, alright you've lost me now

[Josephus]

Typical uninformed Canadian.

Discussion with co-worker we'll call Ella, mostly because that's her name.

Ella: Who's the leader of the NDP?
Me: Mulcair. [with hint of sarcasm] He's going to be our prime minister soon.
Ella: No...The NDP never wins.
Me: They're polling well.
Ella: Really. I thought it's just Harper and Trudeau.
Me: I'm going to post this discussion on Languish. Be right back.

[Malthus]

Typical uninformed Canadian.

Discussion with co-worker we'll call Ella, mostly because that's her name.

Ella: Who's the leader of the NDP?
Me: Mulcair. [with hint of sarcasm] He's going to be our prime minister soon.
Ella: No...The NDP never wins.
Me: They're polling well.
Ella: Really. I thought it's just Harper and Trudeau.
Me: I'm going to post this discussion on Languish. Be right back.

Should invite her to post here.

[viper37]

not the fantasies you have about the PQ!

they're not fantasies.  But so far, they're mostly on-line, on media's comments sections.

[viper37]

Typical uninformed Canadian.

Discussion with co-worker we'll call Ella, mostly because that's her name.

Ella: Who's the leader of the NDP?
Me: Mulcair. [with hint of sarcasm] He's going to be our prime minister soon.
Ella: No...The NDP never wins.
Me: They're polling well.
Ella: Really. I thought it's just Harper and Trudeau.
Me: I'm going to post this discussion on Languish. Be right back.

a poll this morning says 1 in 20 Quebecers have no idea who's in power at the federal government.  Men and 55+ poll better than women.
These people don't know the heads of Federal party.

Somehow, I don't think the numbers would be radically different in Canada or the US.