[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[garbon]

Seems like, especially with your desire to conduct international relations, you should just push for separatism rather than weakening Canada's federal government to the point that it barely exists.

[viper37]

Seems like, especially with your desire to conduct international relations, you should just push for separatism rather than weakening Canada's federal government to the point that it barely exists.

We'de need economical union, defense union, political union for common interests... It would getting out of Canada to re-enter at our convenience.  It works fine in some strategy game, doesn't work that well in real life.

We have a multitude of treaties signed in Canada's name, we'd need to redo the work all over again.  Meanwhile, no NAFTA, no NATO contracts, no UN committees, no WTC, etc, etc.  It'd be chaos.  Plus, the leftists would be in power.

As I said before, you don't form a country out of love for everyone else.  If that were the case, the United States would never had existed, they did came to blows 80 years later, after all.

I think in time, Canadians will realize the wiseness of our positions.  Often, they already do, they ask the Feds for the same thing we do.  But Canadians have this irrational fear&hatred of seperatists wich blinds them to everything.

That's why in a decentralized country, it doesn't matter.  The US is far more decentralized than Canada, btw.

[Neil]

And the US is a fucking catastrophe.  You can go wrong being overly centralized, but this is the 21st century.  Large systems are the way of the future.

[viper37]

And the US is a fucking catastrophe.  You can go wrong being overly centralized, but this is the 21st century.  Large systems are the way of the future.

Russia said the same in the early 20th.  It didn't work that well.
Big states lack the necessary flexibility to survive the challenges that appear.  Look at many big corporations "too big too fail".  They avoided failure because smaller states rushed to their rescue, not because of their inherent strenght.
The European colonial powers crumbled under their weight in the later half the 20th century.
The actual European union is struggling with one feet in a centralized government and the other with regional autonomy, not knowing what to do, and it resulted in an economical mess.

Centralization is good for smaller mono-cultural states.  Just like the world of businesses.  An SMB can be heavily centralized, all functions residing in the hands of its CEO.  A bigger company could not work like that.

[Neil]

I think that the too big to fail corporations didn't fail because the US federal government came in to rescue them.  And the US federal government is the largest body around.  The European colonial powers crumbled because they weren't interested in being colonial powers anymore, and found other things more interesting.  The hard part of centralization is finding the sweet spot that allows for some level on local initiative, but balkanization is never the answer, especially when we're talking about giving every goofy ethnic minority some level of self-determination.  But that's not really what we're talking about here, since if you guys ever get your way, you'll crush the Indians unless they submit to French rule.  There's nothing principled about the Quebec viewpoint, it's just the same old 19th-20th century ethnic chauvinism.

[viper37]

The European colonial powers crumbled because they weren't interested in being colonial powers anymore,

Wich explains wars like Angola, Algeria, Indochine...  Or maybe not

But that's not really what we're talking about here, since if you guys ever get your way, you'll crush the Indians unless they submit to French rule. 

I'd say they are probably better treated here than in the rest of Canada.  Within the limits of provincial power, many bands have achieved a great deal of autonomy on their reservations and the surrounding territories.

There's nothing principled about the Quebec viewpoint, it's just the same old 19th-20th century ethnic chauvinism.

While Canada is an enlightened country.  Of course, I've heard it all before.  Indians have zero problems in Canada, they're all happy folks worshipping the Queen.

[Razgovory]

Seems like, especially with your desire to conduct international relations, you should just push for separatism rather than weakening Canada's federal government to the point that it barely exists.

If the left, they couldn't blame the rest of Canada for all their problems.

[garbon]

Seems like, especially with your desire to conduct international relations, you should just push for separatism rather than weakening Canada's federal government to the point that it barely exists.

If the left, they couldn't blame the rest of Canada for all their problems.

Well yes then they'd actually have to confront real issues.

[Neil]

The European colonial powers crumbled because they weren't interested in being colonial powers anymore,

Wich explains wars like Angola, Algeria, Indochine...  Or maybe not

None of those places are in Europe.

[HVC]

While Canada is an enlightened country.  Of course, I've heard it all before.  Indians have zero problems in Canada, they're all happy folks worshipping the Queen.

I get all your other griping, I don't agree, but I can see where you're coming fun, but I can't understand your weird distaste for the Queen.

[crazy canuck]

Centralization is good for smaller mono-cultural states.  Just like the world of businesses.  An SMB can be heavily centralized, all functions residing in the hands of its CEO.  A bigger company could not work like that.

What?

[HVC]

Small and Medium Business. He's trying to confuse you with accounting talk

[Barrister]

There's nothing principled about the Quebec viewpoint, it's just the same old 19th-20th century ethnic chauvinism.

While Canada is an enlightened country.  Of course, I've heard it all before.  Indians have zero problems in Canada, they're all happy folks worshipping the Queen.

Actually our first nations have a weird reverance for the Queen.  They like to go on about how they signed their treaties with the Queen, and not Canada, so they periodically appeal to Buckingham Palace when they have a dispute with Ottawa.

[Grallon]

...


I think in time, Canadians will realize the wiseness of our positions.  Often, they already do, they ask the Feds for the same thing we do.  But Canadians have this irrational fear&hatred of seperatists wich blinds them to everything.

That's why in a decentralized country, it doesn't matter.  The US is far more decentralized than Canada, btw.

They don't want to decentralize and they are the majority in this godsdam federation...   It's because of people like you we're stuck in limbo - not going anywhere and remaining under the thumb of foreigners.   




G.

[crazy canuck]

Small and Medium Business. He's trying to confuse you with accounting talk

I know what SMB means.  The rest of it is what makes no sense.