[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Barrister]

I'm surprised there is no mention yet of the widespread childish hilarity created by the Wildrose Bus ad:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/inside-politics-blog/wildrosebus-584.jpg

Come on Malthus - you have to hotlink the picture for maximum effect:

[HVC]

she's got an innie and and outtie. that's got to be rare.

[Josephus]

She's only half-cold.

[crazy canuck]

So... it's just posturing for a certain part of the base to let this guy talk about abortion for a while and then have a free vote on the bill, whatever it is, and make sure it doesn't pass behind the scenes? Is that how it's going to play out?

Have you ever met a conspiracy theory regarding the Conservatives you didnt like?

[Jacob]

So... it's just posturing for a certain part of the base to let this guy talk about abortion for a while and then have a free vote on the bill, whatever it is, and make sure it doesn't pass behind the scenes? Is that how it's going to play out?

Have you ever met a conspiracy theory regarding the Conservatives you didnt like?

You think that's a conspiracy theory?

What do you think is happening with this proposed bill and how is it going to play out?

[crazy canuck]

So... it's just posturing for a certain part of the base to let this guy talk about abortion for a while and then have a free vote on the bill, whatever it is, and make sure it doesn't pass behind the scenes? Is that how it's going to play out?

Have you ever met a conspiracy theory regarding the Conservatives you didnt like?

You think that's a conspiracy theory?

What do you think is happening with this proposed bill and how is it going to play out?

The bolded part is the conspiracy theory.  Why do you think someone is "letting this guy talk"?  What makes you think there is any orchestration behind the scenes.  Why isnt it what it appears to be on its face - a back bencher who has an abortion agenda not shared by the government?

[Jacob]

The bolded part is the conspiracy theory.  Why do you think someone is "letting this guy talk"?  What makes you think there is any orchestration behind the scenes.  Why isnt it what it appears to be on its face - a back bencher who has an abortion agenda not shared by the government?

Ah okay.

I was under the impression that the party whip could influence back-benchers on whether they brought forward a bill. I was also under the impression that the speaker of the house has some say on how and when a bill is being presented to parliament. In other words, if Harper and the Conservative leadership really thought it worthwhile to they could stop this bill. After all there weren't any similar bills during the minority (where Harper presumably had less power over his back benchers).

So yeah, I expect there's some behind the scenes orchestration going on. I don't, however, think it's a conspiracy because that's he bread and butter of parliamentary politics. What bills see the light of day, when and how are all part of how things are done. The Conservative leadership did not throttle this bill. Why? Is it because they don't have to political capital and tools to do so right now? If so why not? Or is it because they don't really care one way or another, and it's not worth the effort? I'm just wondering why things are happening the way they are in details beyond "some guy thought it was a good idea."

[Josephus]

So... it's just posturing for a certain part of the base to let this guy talk about abortion for a while and then have a free vote on the bill, whatever it is, and make sure it doesn't pass behind the scenes? Is that how it's going to play out?

Have you ever met a conspiracy theory regarding the Conservatives you didnt like?

You think that's a conspiracy theory?

What do you think is happening with this proposed bill and how is it going to play out?

The bolded part is the conspiracy theory.  Why do you think someone is "letting this guy talk"?  What makes you think there is any orchestration behind the scenes.  Why isnt it what it appears to be on its face - a back bencher who has an abortion agenda not shared by the government?

Because quite frankly we get the impression that none of the backbenchers are allowed to fart unless they run it past harper.

[Neil]

I dunno.  Isn't this guy the MP who's always rabblerousing about abortion, which is why he's trapped at the back of the back bench?

It's not like there's all that much that the whip can do in situations where an MP likes to shoot his mouth off, but isn't really doing anything that would get him bounced from caucus.  Sure, you can fuck with his committee assignments and junkets, but if the guy cares more about his message than the perks of being an MP, what do you do?

[crazy canuck]

Because quite frankly we get the impression that none of the backbenchers are allowed to fart unless they run it past harper.

Yeah, that is why I teased Jacob about his view.  It feeds into the vast conspiracy theory of the left.

Neil is quite right.  This isnt the first time we have heard from this wing nut and it wont be the last.  This incident is good evidence that Harper does not exercise the kind of control your particular bias supports.  Rather the opposite.

[crazy canuck]

The bolded part is the conspiracy theory.  Why do you think someone is "letting this guy talk"?  What makes you think there is any orchestration behind the scenes.  Why isnt it what it appears to be on its face - a back bencher who has an abortion agenda not shared by the government?

Ah okay.

I was under the impression that the party whip could influence back-benchers on whether they brought forward a bill. I was also under the impression that the speaker of the house has some say on how and when a bill is being presented to parliament. In other words, if Harper and the Conservative leadership really thought it worthwhile to they could stop this bill. After all there weren't any similar bills during the minority (where Harper presumably had less power over his back benchers).

So yeah, I expect there's some behind the scenes orchestration going on. I don't, however, think it's a conspiracy because that's he bread and butter of parliamentary politics. What bills see the light of day, when and how are all part of how things are done. The Conservative leadership did not throttle this bill. Why? Is it because they don't have to political capital and tools to do so right now? If so why not? Or is it because they don't really care one way or another, and it's not worth the effort? I'm just wondering why things are happening the way they are in details beyond "some guy thought it was a good idea."

Its hard for me to pick apart where you are serious and where are are being sarcastic so I wont bother.

edit: in fairness maybe you really dont understand how the Parliamentary system works.  But you claim you do have such an understanding which makes your comments - particularly about the Speaker and the implication that somehow Harper controls him too a bit absurd.

[Jacob]

Its hard for me to pick apart where you are serious and where are are being sarcastic so I wont bother.

Makes for pretty dull conversations then.

edit: in fairness maybe you really dont understand how the Parliamentary system works.  But you claim you do have such an understanding which makes your comments - particularly about the Speaker and the implication that somehow Harper controls him too a bit absurd.

So, it's a case of Harper having no particular influence over this guy, possibly being mildly embarrassed by the bill, and hoping it will go away as quietly as possible?

[Jacob]

Yeah, that is why I teased Jacob about his view.  It feeds into the vast conspiracy theory of the left.

Neil is quite right.  This isnt the first time we have heard from this wing nut and it wont be the last.  This incident is good evidence that Harper does not exercise the kind of control your particular bias supports.  Rather the opposite.

You keep seeing conspiracy theories where there are none. You're clearly a conspiracy-theory-conspiracy-theorist.

[crazy canuck]

Yeah, that is why I teased Jacob about his view.  It feeds into the vast conspiracy theory of the left.

Neil is quite right.  This isnt the first time we have heard from this wing nut and it wont be the last.  This incident is good evidence that Harper does not exercise the kind of control your particular bias supports.  Rather the opposite.

You keep seeing conspiracy theories where there are none. You're clearly a conspiracy-theory-conspiracy-theorist.

You are the one that just suggested the Speaker was part of the Conservative cabal controlling the agenda.  Now if it were the case that the Speaker was not acting independently as that Office must then that would indeed be a story.

[viper37]

So, it's a case of Harper having no particular influence over this guy, possibly being mildly embarrassed by the bill, and hoping it will go away as quietly as possible?

there's a procedure wich an MP can use to have a debate on his private bill.  In the Canadian parliament, no MP needs the approval of the Whip to have his bill studied by the parliament in 1st reading.  That's why you had oppostion parties presenting private bills when the Conservatives where a minority.

Then the bill is voted to be on the agenda, it's the 1st reading.  If successfull, it goes to parliamentary commissions to be studied, then goes back to house of commons to be voted into a law wich will receive the royal sanction.

This bill won't survive the 1st vote.

1 year ago, I would have said the Tories were too intelligent to let this happen, but seeing their actions lately, everything is possible.  So, maybe, I can be wrong on this one.