[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Malthus]

Toronto is world-class ... in the ineptitude of our mayors. A solid run of losers for as long as I can remember, but the present lard-ass is truly in a class of his own. 

[HVC]

Toronto is world-class ... in the ineptitude of our mayors. A solid run of losers for as long as I can remember, but the present lard-ass is truly in a class of his own. 

at least he's right about the subways . i mean broken clock and all that

[Zoupa]

No politicians here ever talk about Montreal being world class, as they just assume with cocky arrogance that it is.

In reality it's more like third-world class.

[Jacob]

In all seriousness though if the Conservatives did this, as alleged, we will have nobody worthy of governing.

Yeah. Messing with the basic mechanics of the election process and impersonating Crown Agents is pretty wrong. Let's just hope it's a few bad eggs.

[Neil]

What little I've read seems to indicate that it was mostly in a couple of no-hope Ontario ridings, so maybe it was a few desperate campaigns grasping at straws.  Still, if Vic Toews or that guy who is always trying to ban abortion got taken out, that would be nice.

[crazy canuck]

If this happened as alleged I dont think the damage will stop at a couple of rotten apples.  I think it more likely that a lot of people, including me, would be more amenable to Oex's interpretation of events.  The Tories have been successful because they have portrayed themselves as people you can trust relative to the Grits.

With that gone the door opens wide for the NDP to establish that they are relatively more trustworthy.  Layton would have had an easy time walking through that door.  I can think of a few NDP leadership hopefuls that have no shot.  Mulcair strikes me as one that does.

It will be interesting to see how things work out on all fronts.

[Jacob]

There was an NDP event for Mulcair in the old Woodwards building the other night. I walked through it on my way home from work. He's the Quebec based guy, right?

[Malthus]

I dunno, the Harper conservatives have always struck me as willing to pull some dubious tricks. Though messing with the elections directly is going pretty far.

I don't think they have been successful primarily because of the comparative corruption value relative to the Libs; rather, because they (well, Harper at least) could be trusted not to push too far with social conservatism, and thus they were able to move in on the Lib's natural turf. 

[crazy canuck]

I don't think they have been successful primarily because of the comparative corruption value relative to the Libs; rather, because they (well, Harper at least) could be trusted not to push too far with social conservatism, and thus they were able to move in on the Lib's natural turf.

There has to be some other explanation.  The Liberals can be trusted more not to push too far with social conservatism but that didnt help them.  I dont think the Liberals have finished with the fall out from their own scandals.

[crazy canuck]

There was an NDP event for Mulcair in the old Woodwards building the other night. I walked through it on my way home from work. He's the Quebec based guy, right?

Yeah, he was the lone NDP MP in Quebec prior to this election.

[Barrister]

I dunno, the Harper conservatives have always struck me as willing to pull some dubious tricks. Though messing with the elections directly is going pretty far.

I dunno - my take on the Conservative war machine is they were unafraid to play hard-nosed.  The "in-and-out" financing scandal was an example - they used an agressive accounting system for election expenses, but everything was above board in that it was all disclosed.

This is beyond playing hard-nosed if some of the allegations are true.  We'll see though - the accounts coming out are rather confusing.

[Malthus]

There has to be some other explanation.  The Liberals can be trusted more not to push too far with social conservatism but that didnt help them.  I dont think the Liberals have finished with the fall out from their own scandals.

Well, clearly. It was the lack of emphasis on social conservatism that enabled the Tories to move into the centre; why the Libs could not stop the Tories from doing so is a whole other story unto itself.

To my mind, there was a whole set of interlocking reasons which can be summarized as the Libs falling out of touch with the electorate, losing direction, and lacking leadership. Certainly big scandals were a part of that process. But the Harper Tories have had their share of those as well. Canadians will forgive scandals (god knows they have seen enough of 'em), but they cannot forgive a party lacking any leadership or direction, even if it is pure as the driven snow.

The problem here is that the Libs have not got their groove back (really, Bob Rae? WTF? Is that the best that can be done?) and the NDP currently has a beloved ghost for a leader. Canadians by and large loathe Harper - or at least, they do not love him - but they sense he's a guy who can do stuff (even if often the stuff you don't want done). An autocratic manager.

Even if Layton was alive, I doubt the NDP would be a serious contender - for the same reason the Cons would not be if they hadn't dumped more or less social conservatism: they are seen as too ideological. The Libs aren't a contender until they get a serious contender for leader, which is taking them a while. Unless the scandal has Harper's personal mitts on it (unlikely), I don't see it as changing this basic dynamic ... 

[Neil]

No matter how trustworthy the NDP might appear, they'll always be the NDP.

[crazy canuck]

No matter how trustworthy the NDP might appear, they'll always be the NDP.

That is the biggest thing they have to overcome.  Here in BC they did it by cutting formal ties with the labour movement - eg no more assured delegates etc.  But under the new leader that is coming back I think.

The Federal NDP cant even agree on removing the socialist references from their organization.

So long as they want to stay on the hard left they will not form government.  At least that is the hope.

[Jacob]

One riding where this went down went Conservative by only 18 votes, which is pretty close. Can Elections Canada force a by election, or is that up to the government?

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1138013--robo-calls-listen-to-this-fraudulent-elections-canada-message?bn=1 (apparently there's also a link so you can listen to the call)

And... apparently the phone number that made the robo-calls were registered to one Pierre Poutine of Separatist Street, Joliette, Quebec.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2012/02/28/pol-robocalls-guelph-pierre-poutine.html?cmp=rss