[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Sheilbh]

I think the battle is for people who have voted for Trudeau in the past, but who are fatigued of him. If they think the choice is between a Tiresome-by-now Trudeau and an inoffensive Conservative, they're much likely to vote C than if the choice is between Tiresome-by-now Trudeau and Poutine Trump.

Agree - I think where I'm not sure it's effective is that you're a couple of years into a cycle now and they're polling at 40%. This doesn't feel like a new attack line at least is my impression.

I think that means the attack line didn't work in the first two years. Now a number of people have already decided that he's not Trump and swung, I can't see why it would work now. I can imagine the reverse has happened in the last ten years or so with some Conservative attacks on Trudeau (possibly privilege etc) not working for actual swing voters who took a look and made up their minds, but resonating internally so they keep doing it.

[Jacob]

Agree - I think where I'm not sure it's effective is that you're a couple of years into a cycle now and they're polling at 40%. This doesn't feel like a new attack line at least is my impression.

I think that means the attack line didn't work in the first two years. Now a number of people have already decided that he's not Trump and swung, I can't see why it would work now. I can imagine the reverse has happened in the last ten years or so with some Conservative attacks on Trudeau (possibly privilege etc) not working for actual swing voters who took a look and made up their minds, but resonating internally so they keep doing it.

I kind of disagree. Poilievre is in the midst of his attempt to transform from "obnoxious rightist jerk who really triggers the libs" (which is what he needed to cement his leadership internally) to "inoffensive conservative who is relatable and wants the best for everyone, whose rightwing ideas aren't crackpot but simply mild improvements and common sense" (which is the preferred position for the general election).

That transformation has only really gathered steam in the last little while - and takes a while to percolate throughout the population. This campaign is an attempt to counter / subvert the conservative attempt to reposition Poilievre.

Would it have been great (from  Lib perspective) to start it pre-emptively, to make it a tougher slog for the Conservatives? Quite possibly. Is it futile now, because that battle is already finished? No, I don't think so.

[Jacob]

Basically, broad strokes:

Conservative messaging was - for the longest time - "Trudeau sucks, amirite?" Now it's shifted to "Poilievre is a swell pal, not a jerk."

Liberal messaging was - for the longest time - "..." (or, more charitably, "we're governing"). Now it's shifted to "watchu talking about? Poilievre is totally a jerk."

Personlly I don't think people (or the "addressable market" segment of voters) have permanently made up their mind about who's the most insuffereable yet.

[Barrister]

Lets be honest - Poilievre is still pretty much unknown to most Canadians.  The Conservatives polling at 40% is much more an anti-Trudeau vote than a pro-Poilievre one.  I mean it's long been said that opposition parties don't win elections - governments lose them.

COnservatives are trying to soften Poilievre's image - see how he's ditched the glasses all of a sudden - but I disagree they're trying to re-position him as "inoffensive".  Poilievre's strength has been his no-nonsense "just answer the question" style while in Parliament.  The Conservatives loved that side coming out in the viral apple orchard video (the one the Liberals were trying to turn against him).

So yes - there's always room for the Liberals to try and convince the public that Poilievre is a scary right-winger who is going to take away your health care.  It's what the Liberals have done against every Conservative leader.  Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.  We'll see.

[Sheilbh]

Lets be honest - Poilievre is still pretty much unknown to most Canadians.  The Conservatives polling at 40% is much more an anti-Trudeau vote than a pro-Poilievre one.  I mean it's long been said that opposition parties don't win elections - governments lose them.

Yeah I agree with that saying - with the qualification that oppositions can also lose them and then it's just a competition of who lost them most. For example Britain 2019

That all makes sense to me and seems reasonable. I still think people who are telling pollsters they've swung from Liberals to Conservatives have probably already broken the seal on that and this won't necessarily persuade. But fully see the other side.

[Jacob]

Yeah I guess we'll see

[HVC]

Ontario is making asking about Canadian job experience in postings or applications illegal. I don't know why, but I have a feeling this will back fire. Like people with foreign sounding names not even getting first interviews style backfire.

[Jacob]

... what?

You can't ask "do you have Canadian experience"?

Can you ask "can you tell me about where you've worked"? Can you look at a resume and see what the previous employers were, and ask enough questions that allow you to determine if they have Canadian experience?

I do think the boat has sailed on "foreign sounding names" in this country, though.

[HVC]

You can Google companies and find stuff out, if you go through extra effort, but easier to filter by name. Which I agree happens now (look at my name ), but I feel this adds extra incentive to name filter.

I don't know if you can ask directly once the person is in the interview, it's unclear from the articles I looked up, but you can't request it in the posting or questionnaire.

They've also pushed professional organizations to either remove foreign experience blocks (other set of issues, for example in my field of accounting) and/or reviewing foreign education credits (sort of more in favour)

[HVC]

kind of a funny experience I had, sort of tied to this. I did a lot of the hiring for accounting at different divisions and provinces so got experienced at perusing resumes and the like. Saw one I liked for head office. was Covid time so did a first round phone interview. Lady had a bit of an accent, but nothing that would effect communication. Chinese accent if it makes a difference. Set up a second interview in person with me and my boss. In person always has two people, for opinions and honestly liability, external phone calls are recorded so no issue there. Lady comes in. Looks older than she sounded on the phone, but that happens. We start the interview and it's a totally different person. English is almost non existent. I assume she had her daughter or someone else do the phone interview

[Sheilbh]

Or maybe?


I can see the logic of asking about it but I'm not sure it's entirely practical just because unlike someone's name (or education) the interview is going to be about their experience.

In the UK there was a big move to name-blind applications a few years ago - at least for university applications and entry level positions. A lot of big employers have also gone blind on education. So you may need to have x qualification, but they don't want to know where you went to school/university. That's still developing but when I was  a graduate it was still a thing to see employers specific Russell Group university (positioned as top 25 or so unis in the country - they're actually not, but....). I think it's been picked up by big recruiters of grads like EY and Deloitte though and has, apparently, worked very well.

To our eyes the weirdest is some European CVs where the norm is to include a photo on your CV. Where I work now that gets removed in the version that goes to the people making decisions, but whenever I see it I cannnot think of a good, non-racist reason for having it?

[garbon]

A lot of photos and info cam be gleaned from LinkedIn

[Sheilbh]

Yeah - and I think stuff like name and education blindness, no pictures etc are probably really helpful at graduate/entry level recruitment.

But once you're moving company or job I don't think it's helpful because, as you say, people will be on LinkedIn. Hopefully, though, they've got useful experience from that first job. In part maybe because that's the only bit that can be fixed in this way, but also maybe because getting on the ladder is the most difficult step.

I think some of the big city law firms, EY, KPMG, civil service fast stream etc have moved to that model - and I imagine it's easier to move once you have that sort of practical work experience on your CV.

[Josquius]

Try the Japanese system where all CVs have to be handwritten in a particular format and include a specific sort of photo wearing a specific sort of suit. 

Needless to say if I were Japanese I'd be fucked.

[HVC]

Sorry sheilbh, don't get the reference