[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[crazy canuck]

I might have to change my views about the legalization issue. 

[viper37]

First he said the NDP would not change personal income tax rates. 

You don't need to change personal income tax rates to increase (or decrease) effective tax rates (the money that really goes out of your pocket).  The Cons lowered the taxes for some people withouth touching the tax rates.  The NDP plans to reverse that, and other chances too.

The second is that he said the NDP would gradually increase corporate rates to the G7 average but would reduce income tax for small corporations.

The income tax for SMBs is already pretty low.  Our corporate income tax is lower than other countries (namely US) because our corporations don't have the same flexibility as other countries when it comes to reducing the taxable income.

See in the US, when employees are paid with stock options, that is an expense deductible from their taxable income. Not here.  So even if the tax rate is higher, the effective tax rate they pay, the real money out of their pocket is lower.  So, advantage for tech companies.

When it comes to natural resources, in a highly fluctuative market, you can switch your inventory calculation method to better adjust your income.  Accounting wise, there is flexibility.  But in Canada, when it comes to taxable income, it's always FIFO (First in-first out) that is used.  In the US, they can use FIFO for their taxable income, wich most often gives them a lower income.  Again, the effect is that the effective tax rate for a US oil company would be lower than for a Canadian company.

There's also the issue of GST/PST/HST.  All expenses related to meals&travels are reimbursed only at 50%.  All entertainement expenses are deductible at 50% of their real costs, that hurts big corporations more than in the US where only meals are deducted at 50% and they have no sales tax to pay.

One more item to consider that the NDP would never tell you is that State Income tax, when there are any, are deductible from Federal Income tax.  In Canada, the Federal income tax is added to your Provincial income tax (well, in our case, totally seperate thing). 

Then comes dividend tax.  Our personal income are much greated than in the US, so our shareholders will get shafted by this NDP measure.  Our stocks will look less attractive than US stocks once we reincrease our tax rates, making it that more difficult for big canadian corporations to find funds for their investment project.  More businesses selling themselves to US interest, instead of the opposite.

The great irony is that I will probably get a tax break under the NDP plan. 

You'll lose revenue sharing as proposed by the Cons.  But you might be willing to make that sacrifice.

The average corporate tax rate for the OECD is 26%.  The average for G7 is 29.9%.  In Quebec, both taxes amount to 26.9%.
Since the tax rates were lowered, the Quebec government actually earns more than before.

[viper37]

There's a good article on why high corporate taxes are a bad idea:
http://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/051614/do-us-high-corporate-tax-rates-hurt-americans.asp

there's too much of this nonsensical bullshit from Mulcair and his goons for me to ever consider voting NDP.
His position on ISIS is ridiculous.  Had he been PM in WWII's time, would he have said "Not our business"?
His statement that the Federal gov should negotiate with Indians from nation to nation stinks of hypocrisy when he would deny the same for Quebec. 
His ideas of a centralized Canada are just about as bad as the Liberal's ideas were.  He'll simply trample Province's rights to establish his own pan national programs, totally disregarding the wishes of the local population.
His idea of a centralized state run daycare program is about the worst thing that can happen to Canada.  It costs a ton, it opens to doors for favoritism by giving a Minister absolute power to grant licenses worth millions of $ and it is less efficient than giving money to parents and let them choose where they send their kids.  I don't think we need the Feds to tell us where the kids should go.  Will we let them choose the schools too?  That'd be nice, I guess.  No more private schools, yeah!

[viper37]

The first time I voted I was 18. Voting day was the first day back to school, so I guess the Tuesday after Labour Day. I met up with some friends I hadn't seen in a while. We smoked pot. then I voted. I voted for the Communist party candidate.

My first election, I voted Bloc.  The first election of Lucien Bouchard.  Voted for them again with Duceppe at their head, but I quickly regretted my choice.  Stopped voting for a while, until the Conservative Party of Canada made a re-appearance.  I voted for them the last 4 elections.  I'll likely end up pinching my nose and voting for them, or not voting at all.  No way I'm voting for the orange clowns or the red menace.

[Ancient Demon]

I'm still planning to vote Conservative.

[Barrister]

I'm still planning to vote Conservative.

Me too.  I don't get all the talk that they are "corrupt".  The Senate scandal is miniscule - and let's not forget that the Conservatives pushed hard to elect senators, only for the SCC to shut them down.

Harper's government isn't perfect, but it's been pretty solid from where I stand - and miles better than what I'd expect from a Trudeau or Mulcair government.

[viper37]

Me too.  I don't get all the talk that they are "corrupt".  The Senate scandal is miniscule - and let's not forget that the Conservatives pushed hard to elect senators, only for the SCC to shut them down.

Oh come on.  They knew from the beginning they couldn't touch the Senate without a modification to the Constitution.  While it was just Quebec that was screaming there was a problem, you could safely ignore us.  But now, a pivotal piece of your party program can't be done without opening the Constitution.  You have the Indian problems, wich will require constitutional change.  And Ontario is starting to give headaches to the Conservatives.  And Alberta has shifted to a provincial NDP government wich won't be as lenient to the Feds as was the former Conservative government.

Harper could promise to begin Constitutional talks with the province and enshrine lots of things he already did:
- recognize Quebec as a distinct society (yes, the words scare Canadians, but just stop being pussies, it won't weaken Canada any more than the British Empire received a death blow in 1867)
- limit the federal spending power
- veto right for provinces with full monetary compensation for every federal program infringing on their powers
- abolish the indian reservation, have them pay taxes like everyone, give them individual or collective property of their lands&houses, decentralize power to let them collect their own taxes, enter natural resources sharing agreement, etc
- require all SC judges to be bilingual
- require all senior officials to be bilingual
- cut the ties to the British monarchy (ok, in my dreams only )
- give all provinces immigration powers (Quebec has already signed a deal with the Feds, but that could be revoked by the Liberals or NDP on a whim)
- let the provinces pick candidates for Supreme Court and Senators.  I could see provincial elections for Senators, wich would be binding.  Equal Senate, of course.  Well, the Triple-E thing the western provinces have been pushing for the last 2 decades. 

Now is the time.  If Harper packs all this into a proposed constitutional reform, he will get the support he lacks to maintain himself in power for another decade.

Harper has already shown a lot of respect for French Canadians, but he needs to back words with actions.  Let us build a new Canada, for French, English and First nations as well.

Harper's government isn't perfect, but it's been pretty solid from where I stand - and miles better than what I'd expect from a Trudeau or Mulcair government.

that is the problem, essentially. There's no one better.

[Grey Fox]

I have voted 9 times, 4 Federally & 5 Provincially.

Federal Elections :

2004 : Bloc Québécois
2006 : Bloc Québécois
2008 : Liberal Party*
2011 : NDP

Provincial Elections ;

2003 : UFP - Commies
2007 : ADQ - Right Wing afa Quebec is concern
2008 : Liberal Party*
2012 : Parti Québécois
2014 : Parti Québécois


*I am really unsure of the 2008 élections but I remember that after 2006 I decided that I wasn't voting BQ again.

[Barrister]

Me too.  I don't get all the talk that they are "corrupt".  The Senate scandal is miniscule - and let's not forget that the Conservatives pushed hard to elect senators, only for the SCC to shut them down.

Oh come on.  They knew from the beginning they couldn't touch the Senate without a modification to the Constitution.  While it was just Quebec that was screaming there was a problem, you could safely ignore us.  But now, a pivotal piece of your party program can't be done without opening the Constitution.  You have the Indian problems, wich will require constitutional change.  And Ontario is starting to give headaches to the Conservatives.  And Alberta has shifted to a provincial NDP government wich won't be as lenient to the Feds as was the former Conservative government.

Harper could promise to begin Constitutional talks with the province and enshrine lots of things he already did:
- recognize Quebec as a distinct society (yes, the words scare Canadians, but just stop being pussies, it won't weaken Canada any more than the British Empire received a death blow in 1867)
- limit the federal spending power
- veto right for provinces with full monetary compensation for every federal program infringing on their powers
- abolish the indian reservation, have them pay taxes like everyone, give them individual or collective property of their lands&houses, decentralize power to let them collect their own taxes, enter natural resources sharing agreement, etc
- require all SC judges to be bilingual
- require all senior officials to be bilingual
- cut the ties to the British monarchy (ok, in my dreams only )
- give all provinces immigration powers (Quebec has already signed a deal with the Feds, but that could be revoked by the Liberals or NDP on a whim)
- let the provinces pick candidates for Supreme Court and Senators.  I could see provincial elections for Senators, wich would be binding.  Equal Senate, of course.  Well, the Triple-E thing the western provinces have been pushing for the last 2 decades. 

Now is the time.  If Harper packs all this into a proposed constitutional reform, he will get the support he lacks to maintain himself in power for another decade.

Why the fuck would he do any of that?

[Grey Fox]

To maintain himself in power for another decade.

[Barrister]

So emasculate the federal government and what - suddenly Quebec will elect 60+ Conservative MPs?  I don't think so.  And that platform isn't going to appeal to anyone in the other 9 provinces.

[crazy canuck]

I don't think they are corrupt (although what the hell was the Chief of Staff doing paying Duffy 90k to take care of his expenses problem?) But I do think they have made poor public policy decisions for reasons that are purely driven by political ideology rather than empirical evidence.  The large numbers of cases they have taken to the Supreme Court of Canada over issues that were bound to fail in defence of poorly conceived policy decisions come immediately to mind.  Insite, senate reform, pot regulation etc etc.


Add to that the inexcusable attack on the Chief Justice and ironically we have a conservative party that thinks very little of the Rule of Law.

[Grey Fox]

So emasculate the federal government

Isn't that the Conservative end goal?

[Neil]

I'm voting Conservative because I think very little of the rule of law, or more accurately the rule of lawyers.

[Barrister]

I'm voting Conservative because I think very little of the rule of law, or more accurately the rule of lawyers.