[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Valmy]

Not to mention that an independent Alberta would be a landlocked country with no independent way to get our oil to foreign markets.  You think we're having problems building pipelines now?  Wait till we have to negotiate with ROC as a foreign country.  And the US?  We couldn't build any when we were a part of Canada - what leverage would an independent Alberta have?

The fact that this idea is an impressively stupid and self-destructive idea only makes it more likely to happen in this political climate 

[crazy canuck]

If fucking Alberta manages to get 50%+1 before Quebec (twice), I'm gonna riot.

 

But as BB has already said, this isn't a serious proposal.

Jacob, for context these sorts of separatist noises coming out of Alberta happen every couple of decades.  In the past, and I think now, the best response is to ignore them completely.

If anybody in Alberta actually took them seriously then people in Alberta, who don't spend all their time paying attention to politics might mistakenly think that this is a serious thing to consider.

[Jacob]

Okay CC and BB. But if Alberta secedes I reserve the right to call out your complacency!

[Grey Fox]

I look forward to my all expenses paid trip to Calgary to profess my love of Alberta.

[crazy canuck]

Okay CC and BB. But if Alberta secedes I reserve the right to call out your complacency!

Sure, and how long do we have to wait before we can call you out for being an alarmist?

[Jacob]

Okay CC and BB. But if Alberta secedes I reserve the right to call out your complacency!

Sure, and how long do we have to wait before we can call you out for being an alarmist?

If one or more of the following come to pass:

1) A referendum is called and it fails by a significant margin (less than 30% of votes in favour).

2) Smith, while still premier, rules out a referendum.

3) Smith leaves and her successor does not bring up a referendum.

[Grey Fox]

If fucking Alberta manages to get 50%+1 before Quebec (twice), I'm gonna riot.

We should encourage them. Get the federal government to look somewhere else.

[viper37]

Separatist group releases potential Alberta referendum question
Alberta Prosperity Project says it will push the premier to hold referendum in 2025

An Alberta separatist group released on Monday a referendum question on independence from Canada that it will petition to get in front of provincial voters — but only once it has garnered support from 600,000 Albertans.

That's more than triple the number of signatures the Alberta Prosperity Project (APP) would need under a new United Conservative Party government bill that makes it much easier to force a referendum on the ballot.

The group also said it would push Premier Danielle Smith to allow a separation referendum later in 2025, instead of next year as she's suggested. They said a critical mass of separatist UCP members can persuade the premier to fast-track the referendum.

...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/calgary-alberta-prosperity-project-referendum-question-1.7532890

My suggestion to Conservative Albertans who do not want to separate is to start a federalist conservative party to challenge Danielle Smith. Federalist MPs should cross the floor to form this new party, and UCP activists and members should join it.

Please take the threat to Canada seriously.

A very modest proposal Jacob.

There is no threat to Canada of Albertan separation.  There's nobody of any consequence who is actually in favour of it.  Smith certainly isn't.  They like to hold this kabuki dance of "well you better give us what we want or the separatists will win" when there aren't actually any separatists.

Not to mention that an independent Alberta would be a landlocked country with no independent way to get our oil to foreign markets.  You think we're having problems building pipelines now?  Wait till we have to negotiate with ROC as a foreign country.  And the US?  We couldn't build any when we were a part of Canada - what leverage would an independent Alberta have?

I disagree there is no threat.  You have a right wing populist movement which is, again, fanning the flames of radicalism.

The thing with forest fires is, you never know how manageable they'll be once you start an non controlled one.

As for your comments, they are sound and logical, but these debates are based on feelings, on emotions.

Right now, Alberta is more susceptible to conspiracy theories than other regions.  Th at Rath guy making the rounds with his 600 000 names petition for a referendum on independence, he's claiming that Alberta's oil productiom will magically increase by 25% yearly once seperated from Canada. 

600 000 Albertans believe him.

600 000 Albertans believe that 30 billions $/year in subsidies and loan guarantees is not enough, we must do more to support an industry that sees its decline coming., surpassed by green tech.

[viper37]

I look forward to my all expenses paid trip to Calgary to profess my love of Alberta.

I always wanted to see the Prairies.
Think they'll make it a Canada-wide train tour this time around? 😅

[viper37]

I look forward to my all expenses paid trip to Calgary to profess my love of Alberta.

I always wanted to see the Prairies.
Think they'll make it a Canada-wide train tour this time around? 😅

[viper37]

Okay CC and BB. But if Alberta secedes I reserve the right to call out your complacency!

Sure, and how long do we have to wait before we can call you out for being an alarmist?

Anything >40% is a win for the movement.

They'll be embolden and will entrench themselves, keep promotimg the idea that Alberta would be better treated as 51st state.  This idea will make its way among the young voters.

Unless the Libs use their old tricks of sending massive immigration to Alberta, but they have to strategize, something Trudeau didn't do because he was a dimwit compared to Machiavel Chrétien.

[crazy canuck]

Okay CC and BB. But if Alberta secedes I reserve the right to call out your complacency!

Sure, and how long do we have to wait before we can call you out for being an alarmist?

If one or more of the following come to pass:

1) A referendum is called and it fails by a significant margin (less than 30% of votes in favour).

2) Smith, while still premier, rules out a referendum.

3) Smith leaves and her successor does not bring up a referendum.

If the past is any guide to the future, none of those things are going to happen. The separatist noise just stops.

[viper37]

Got derailed by your silly Wildrose conspiracies, again.  bleh. 

Came here to report that, much to the relief of many, the CCP has not cnanged their ways.  They are still out there fighting the good fight against truth and integrity by spreading conspiracy theories.  

25% of Conservative voters believe the election was stolen.  what does the party leadership do? Double dowm on the narrative to increase their funding.

[HVC]

If fucking Alberta manages to get 50%+1 before Quebec (twice), I'm gonna riot.

We should encourage them. Get the federal government to look somewhere else.

I don't think Quebec being a vassal state of the US would be a better option at this point. 

[Bauer]

Smith is just plain irresponsible.  She could be having hard but constructive talks to work on solutions to difficult problems.  But it just seems like the Alberta brand of politician likes to lay all the blame outside.  Although i also share disappointment in the lacklustre ability to build pipelines nationally.

Also according to this professor a separate Alberta's borders might end up a lot smaller...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/separation-consequences-1.7529623