TV/Movies Megathread

[The Brain]

There are all kinds of problems with the movies, but the special effects generally hold up well.

Not least of which is that Sam was clearly on a promise and I think it's a very poor show from Frodo

Yes, he asked him kindly to share the load.

[Jacob]

I wasn't sure if Jake was serious given the voice of game version Mario.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Martinet

I wasn't being serious

[garbon]

I wasn't sure if Jake was serious given the voice of game version Mario.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Martinet

I wasn't being serious

[viper37]

The army of the dead business was one of the missteps in the series, which I agree otherwise holds up really well.

Not just because the special effects don't work as well as the others, but the whole business of them eating the giant elephant things looks very absurd.

In the books, they don't eat anyone, they just fill the enemy with terror and cause a panic, if I recall correctly.

Which is equally silly.

Seasoned warriors from the South with their mighty beasts of war and orks specifically bread for war are scared of a few ghosts.

Another problematic bit was how Denathor, the Steward of Gondor, was treated: there appears to be no particular reason given for his odd actions. In the book, he acted weird because he had one of those seeing stone things and he had been using it to see stuff, which Sauron used to mess with his mind. They really should have included some hint of that in the movie, after all they had a whole plot about how those stones were dangerous. As it is, he just seems like a jerk who hates his second kid and then goes nuts for no particular reason.

It would have been redundant.  Besides, you don't really need justification other than that: he's a jerk
A father having preference for one son over the other seem a common theme through litterature.  There are some time limits on what you can show, even for 4.5 hrs movie

[Duque de Bragança]

The local independent movie theater (in the sense that it doesn't belong to a chain, not that it shows art house flicks) showed the extended versions of Lord of the Rings over the past three weeks.  I had never seen the extended editions before so it was pretty cool to see them on the big screen.  The additional scenes, I thought, added much to the atmosphere of Middle Earth; but did tend to slow the action down.

I had heard that Christopher Lee was upset that his death scene was cut from Return of the King.  I had thought they had filmed the scouring of the Shire and was dreading an even more drawn out ending to the film; so I was relieved when he died at Isengard.  (I think that scene should have been left in, as it ties up a major loose end and explains how Pipin found the Palantír.)

I thought the CGI held up remarkably well for a 20 year old film (in part because Jackson used practical effects whenever possible) the one exception is the Army of the Dead which looked like they had escaped from Disney's Haunted Mansion.

Overheard this as I was leaving ROTK: "No, The Two Towers is my favorite one; The Return of the King is the best one."  Also there were a couple tween boys arguing over who was more annoying, Frodo or Gollum - I thought that was great that they held such strong opinions about a movie that was released before they were born.

Some of the CGI has been probably redone or rather upconverted for 4K, given the new UHD transfers on video. Not always a good thing since Jackson said in an interview he wanted the films to look as good as Marvel blockbusters. 

[grumbler]

Which is equally silly.

Seasoned warriors from the South with their mighty beasts of war and orks specifically bread for war are scared of a few ghosts.

The power of terror that the Dead had in the books was magical.  Orcs and men couldn't resist it.

The worst part about the way Jackson used the Dead was that they made all of the valor of everyone else redundant.  The Rohirrim should have just stayed home.

It would have been redundant.  Besides, you don't really need justification other than that: he's a jerk
A father having preference for one son over the other seem a common theme through litterature.  There are some time limits on what you can show, even for 4.5 hrs movie

Jackson's treatment of Denethor was done the way it was because Jackson didn't understand the books.  The same was true for the way he had Aragorn march on the Black Gates - essentially doing it because it was boneheaded and he was a bonehead.  In the books, Aragorn and Gandalf (and Elrond) had set it up so the Sauron was sure that Aragorn had The Ring.  That's why Sauron "emptied his lands" in the books - he thought he could grab The Ring if he sent enough orcs and trolls that not even The Ring could save Aragorn.

[celedhring]

I thought the CGI held up remarkably well for a 20 year old film (in part because Jackson used practical effects whenever possible) the one exception is the Army of the Dead which looked like they had escaped from Disney's Haunted Mansion.

Overheard this as I was leaving ROTK: "No, The Two Towers is my favorite one; The Return of the King is the best one."  Also there were a couple tween boys arguing over who was more annoying, Frodo or Gollum - I thought that was great that they held such strong opinions about a movie that was released before they were born.

Yes. I haven't watched the Extended Edition or seen any of the films in the cinema since they came out - but I probably re-watch once a year (normally at Christmas at home or if there's a shitty bank holiday weather-wise) and they hold up really, really well compared to other far more recent films including, generally, the CGI.

Yeah, LOTR is a great "put it in the background during a family dinner" movie for some reason. We rewatch it quite often this way.

They have their problems, but they hold up quite well and are a really watchable movies despite their length.

[Darth Wagtaros]

Foundation was pretty good. I look forward to the rest. 

I agree with grallasaurus' interpretation of Jackson's interpretation of LoTR.

[mongers]

'Count Me In' an excellent Netflix documentary about rock drummers.

[viper37]

The same was true for the way he had Aragorn march on the Black Gates - essentially doing it because it was boneheaded and he was a bonehead.  In the books, Aragorn and Gandalf (and Elrond) had set it up so the Sauron was sure that Aragorn had The Ring.  That's why Sauron "emptied his lands" in the books - he thought he could grab The Ring if he sent enough orcs and trolls that not even The Ring could save Aragorn.

that's pretty much implied that they want the Eye of Sauron fixed on them.

[Sophie Scholl]

Which is equally silly.

Seasoned warriors from the South with their mighty beasts of war and orks specifically bread for war are scared of a few ghosts.

The power of terror that the Dead had in the books was magical.  Orcs and men couldn't resist it.

The worst part about the way Jackson used the Dead was that they made all of the valor of everyone else redundant.  The Rohirrim should have just stayed home.

It would have been redundant.  Besides, you don't really need justification other than that: he's a jerk
A father having preference for one son over the other seem a common theme through litterature.  There are some time limits on what you can show, even for 4.5 hrs movie

Jackson's treatment of Denethor was done the way it was because Jackson didn't understand the books.  The same was true for the way he had Aragorn march on the Black Gates - essentially doing it because it was boneheaded and he was a bonehead.  In the books, Aragorn and Gandalf (and Elrond) had set it up so the Sauron was sure that Aragorn had The Ring.  That's why Sauron "emptied his lands" in the books - he thought he could grab The Ring if he sent enough orcs and trolls that not even The Ring could save Aragorn.

Totally agreed on the Army of the Dead. If memory serves, they only take out the Corsairs of Umbar/ The Black Fleet and then Aragorn leads a force of Rangers of the North and the various coastal fiefdoms that are saved by the Fleet being taken out. The arrival of Aragorn and his army doesn't ensure victory, it just makes it more likely and it is still a brutally hard battle that is fought. The Extended Editions do go a little more into Aragorn using the Palantir to get Sauron to focus in on him and make him thing that Aragorn is marching with the ring or at least might have possession of it. Denethor is definitely treated terribly in the movies. Embarrassingly so. Faramir has some issues, too, but ultimately holds up. I just watched the Extended Edition of RotK as the local theater was showing the films near me as well. I agree that they still hold up remarkably well, though it does seem that PJ got more indulgent toward poor decision making regarding plot changes and filming choices with a growing CGI obsession as the movies went along. This was incredibly apparent in the ensuing Hobbit trilogy where he just butchered things. There is still a core worth watching to some degree, but all of his worst habits and tendencies are writ large in that trilogy.

[grumbler]

The same was true for the way he had Aragorn march on the Black Gates - essentially doing it because it was boneheaded and he was a bonehead.  In the books, Aragorn and Gandalf (and Elrond) had set it up so the Sauron was sure that Aragorn had The Ring.  That's why Sauron "emptied his lands" in the books - he thought he could grab The Ring if he sent enough orcs and trolls that not even The Ring could save Aragorn.

that's pretty much implied that they want the Eye of Sauron fixed on them.

It's outright stated that they want the Eye of Sauron fixed on them, but in the movies there's no reason for Sauron to fix on them at all.  They were less than 10,000 guys with no siege equipment on the outside of an impregnable gate.  Without the ring, they are no threat at all.  The decision to attack was even presented as a boneheaded one with "certainty of death" and "small chance of success." Jackson could easily have replaced the bonehead dialogue with dialogue showing that Sauron would conclude from the defeat of his overwhelming army and the killing of the Chief Nazgul that Aragorn must have used The Ring (since Sauron knew nothing about the Army of the Dead).

[grumbler]

I just watched the Extended Edition of RotK as the local theater was showing the films near me as well. I agree that they still hold up remarkably well, though it does seem that PJ got more indulgent toward poor decision making regarding plot changes and filming choices with a growing CGI obsession as the movies went along. This was incredibly apparent in the ensuing Hobbit trilogy where he just butchered things. There is still a core worth watching to some degree, but all of his worst habits and tendencies are writ large in that trilogy.

Agree that the films got more Jackson-the-horror-film-director as the movies went on.  In fact, i think that The Fellowship of the Ring is by far the best of the movies. The moronic march of the Rohan civilians into the jaws of the army of Isengard was stupid and is painful to watch, but doesn't last long enough to ruin the second film. 

I never did figure out why Jackson even filmed the silly "Frodo in Osgiliath" scenes, et alone why he left them in the movie when it was clear that not even he could figure out how Frodo could possibly have escaped the Nazgul he came face-to-face with (the film just cuts away and Frodo is next shown having escaped). [BTW, how cool is it that "Nazgul" is a word in the spell-check vocabulary?]

The Hobbit movies might make a single decent movie if all of them were combined and cut to about 110 minutes, but they'd need to re-shoot the Bennie Hill scenes.

[Sophie Scholl]

Agreen of Fellowship being the best. It is by far my favorite, too. I'm a sucker for anything set in Gondor, so I enjoy the visuals of the "Frodo in Osgiliath" scenes even if the script is non-sensical and is part of the issue with how Faramir is used in the films. It also makes for the problematic issue you mention as well as now, in theory, Sauron via the Nazgul know there are halflings in Osgialith and with the army of Gondor. It is an unnecessary and poor change from the source material that does nothing but add problems (bar the awesome scenery!). I actually downloaded a re-cut Hobbit that cuts it all down to one normal length film. I haven't watched it yet though. I love the added White Council things Jackson adds, but they honestly don't belong and add to the bloat of an already severely bloated group of movies. The slapstick goofiness is also immersion breaking as heck for me. I don't mind humor and think it can even be used to good effect, but whether it be... way too much in The Hobbit movies or Gimli being made into a walking joke or Legolas surfing on everything, it just isn't done well often by Jackson.

[Sheilbh]

I slightly disagree on him getting more Peter Jackson the horror director as things went on - I think that's the more inventive, creative stuff, the practical effects etc from his cheap horror background. I think it sort of got more blockbustery/epic as things went on and that bleeds through into the Hobbit movies. Not the pretty laser focus on a few core stories and being creative with no money.

Although personally my favourite is the Two Towers.