RIP Jack Chick

[Martinus]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth.

Why would you need myth? Sounds infantile.

I edited my post a bit more.

[The Brain]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth.

Why would you need myth? Sounds infantile.

I edited my post a bit more.

Seems to me you may be using myth also for things that aren't.

[garbon]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth. This doesn't even have to be overtly spiritual. It could be a belief in humanism, or social and political activism, or even your kids. Cynical life is unbearable. Just be careful you don't fall into a crusading mode.

So not believing a myth = cynicism?

[Martinus]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth.

Why would you need myth? Sounds infantile.

I edited my post a bit more.

Seems to me you may use myth also for things that aren't.

All these things are a myth. If you think about everything around in a truly and fully cold and rational way, life is not worth living. So you need your myth, your purpose to live. The key is not to live someone else's myth. That's such a waste of life.

[Martinus]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth. This doesn't even have to be overtly spiritual. It could be a belief in humanism, or social and political activism, or even your kids. Cynical life is unbearable. Just be careful you don't fall into a crusading mode.

So not believing a myth = cynicism?

Yeah. If you have nothing that makes you get up in the morning, then what's the point of living?

Incidentally, I don't see the concept of myth in any negative way.

[The Brain]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth.

Why would you need myth? Sounds infantile.

I edited my post a bit more.

Seems to me you may use myth also for things that aren't.

All these things are a myth. If you think about everything around in a truly and fully cold and rational way, life is not worth living. So you need your myth, your purpose to live. The key is not to live someone else's myth. That's such a waste of life.

You honestly think things like love, a good meal or a child's smile aren't enough? You're a dried up husk of a person.

[Martinus]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth.

Why would you need myth? Sounds infantile.

I edited my post a bit more.

Seems to me you may use myth also for things that aren't.

All these things are a myth. If you think about everything around in a truly and fully cold and rational way, life is not worth living. So you need your myth, your purpose to live. The key is not to live someone else's myth. That's such a waste of life.

You honestly think things like love, a good meal or a child's smile aren't enough? You're a dried up husk of a person.

Stop with the name calling. They are enough when they are enough. If they are not enough they aren't enough. I think the mistake is to think one size fits all - different people need different things to satisfy this need. So you need some meta rules to stop people from hurting each other as they seek for their "mythical fulfilment".

[The Brain]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

Questions that generally end with, oh that myth my parents told me about might not be true.

True. But life without myth is very dull and boring one. The trick is to find your own life's myth.

Why would you need myth? Sounds infantile.

I edited my post a bit more.

Seems to me you may use myth also for things that aren't.

All these things are a myth. If you think about everything around in a truly and fully cold and rational way, life is not worth living. So you need your myth, your purpose to live. The key is not to live someone else's myth. That's such a waste of life.

You honestly think things like love, a good meal or a child's smile aren't enough? You're a dried up husk of a person.

Stop with the name calling. They are enough when they are enough. If they are not enough they aren't enough. I think the mistake is to think one size fits all - different people need different things to satisfy this need. So you need some meta rules to stop people from hurting each other as they seek for their "mythical fulfilment".

I'm talking about you. Is it correct that to you they aren't enough?

[Martinus]

I'm talking about you. Is it correct that to you they aren't enough?

I don't have children. Love and good meal aren't enough. So yes, it is correct. I found the missing part in what we are discussing here.

[Berkut]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins,

Actually, you are already cheating a bit here Beebs.

That is by no means the "fundamental" message, that has built into a huge set of answers to questions you are not even asking.

Once you accept the fundamental message that there is such a thing as "God" to begin with, THAT opens up a bunch of questions, and you have to literally answer a nearly infinite number if them in a very precise manner to end up with "...Jesus was the Son of God..."  and then a bunch more questions to get to "...who died for our sins". And honestly, the answers to those questions are just as ridiculous as "...and then he found the magic glasses that allowed him to read the magic plates...".

I still think that is one of the most insane of all the religious ideas. The basic premise that

1. There is a God.
2. He cares about humans and "sin".
3. This creates a problem because humans sin
4. The solution to said problem somehow involves God pretending to be human and pretending to die.
...
...
...
10. Salvation!


Do you ever wonder about the timing of it all?

I mean, why the long wait from Adam and Eve to Jesus? Why did it take that amount of time? If Jesus was going to be necessary, why not just skip over all the Old Testament stuff and have Jesus come along immediately?

What was it about that particular time that made it the right time for salvation, and not before or after? Surely it wasn't just random or something, right? So why then?

[The Brain]

I'm talking about you. Is it correct that to you they aren't enough?

I don't have children. Love and good meal aren't enough. So yes, it is correct. I found the missing part in what we are discussing here.

Then I stand by my husk comment.

[The Brain]

I mean, why the long wait from Adam and Eve to Jesus? Why did it take that amount of time? If Jesus was going to be necessary, why not just skip over all the Old Testament stuff and have Jesus come along immediately?

And not murder almost all living things? Come on, you know God.

[Berkut]

I mean, why the long wait from Adam and Eve to Jesus? Why did it take that amount of time? If Jesus was going to be necessary, why not just skip over all the Old Testament stuff and have Jesus come along immediately?

And not murder almost all living things? Come on, you know God.

The weird thing is that I was raised a born again Christian. My mom was and is very evangelical.

So I was exposed to all this at a young age, and I believed it all because I was told that it was all true, I would burn in hell, etc., etc., etc.

But I can remember sitting in bible classes at a very, very young age asking these kinds of questions. I remember asking my Sunday school teacher if Satan could really just kill people and he told us sure, he could. So I asked, well...why doesn't he then?

I remember wondering these things, these kind of practical sorts of things. Where is heaven, exactly? Where is hell? Are they in some other galaxy or underground, or what?

How does Christ dieing for our sins actually result in salvation? Is God impressed so much by it that he forgives us...in which case it is up to him, right? And can't he just forgive us without the entire Jesus thing? And if he knew how the Jesus thing was going to play out, and we know he did because the "proof" of Jesus was based on prophesy...what was the point of actually doing it?

I spent a good amount of time believing in the "truth" of the fundamentalist Christian view of the world, while still not at all understanding how it could make sense. I think I assumed that the more I learned and understood as I got older, all this would start making sense - my lack of understanding was simply a lack of information or education since I *knew* the conclusion was "true".

So of course asking lots of questions would be the way to understand it better. Instead it just seemed to piss everyone off...

[Hamilcar]

The thing is - once you accept the fundamental message that Jesus was the Son of God who died for our sins, it quite frankly opens up a lot more questions from there.  If God exists why is there evil in the world?  Are Christians required to keep kosher?  So what day of the week is the sabbath?  How exactly do we organize God's Church here on earth?

The foundation of your understanding of the cosmos is a story so preposterous that you simply have to accept it. Once you have, it opens up contradictions and insoluble puzzles that derive in large part from its patently parochial human origin.

You won't do this, but you could actually approach the question of whether your religion is plausible as a scientific one: are your observations of the world as it is consistent with your god? You'll respond, "of course, god is omnipotent" and I'll retort that "god did it" (just as "it's magic") is an explanation for *any* observation, and it therefore is no explanation at all.

An omnipotent, omniscient god is the philosophical equivalent of a division by zero. It just gives you nonsensical answers. How about this old trope: can your god make a rock so heavy that he can't lift it?

[Hamilcar]

I'm talking about you. Is it correct that to you they aren't enough?

I don't have children. Love and good meal aren't enough. So yes, it is correct. I found the missing part in what we are discussing here.

Then I stand by my husk comment.

Why are you bringing US college football into this?