Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[garbon]

You know, it might just be old fashion elitism. We are all beneath them.

So charges of racism shouldn't come as a shock.

[mongers]

what the hell is upper working class?

I'll guess skilled WC like train drivers, welders, plumbers etc.

[Sheilbh]

what the hell is upper working class?

I'll guess skilled WC like train drivers, welders, plumbers etc.

Yeah - I'd interpret as skilled working class. Also probably in more high tech/advanced industries and factories.

[Tamas]

You know, it might just be old fashion elitism. We are all beneath them.

So charges of racism shouldn't come as a shock.

i guess the royals think it cannot be racism if it is true

[HVC]

what the hell is upper working class?

I'll guess skilled WC like train drivers, welders, plumbers etc.

Yeah - I'd interpret as skilled working class. Also probably in more high tech/advanced industries and factories.

but they would make more then a lower middle class guy, right? so why are they placed below? a 60k a year plumber is ranked below a 30k middle management guy because he wears overalls?

[mongers]

what the hell is upper working class?

I'll guess skilled WC like train drivers, welders, plumbers etc.

Yeah - I'd interpret as skilled working class. Also probably in more high tech/advanced industries and factories.

but they would make more then a lower middle class guy, right? so why are they placed below? a 60k a year plumber is ranked below a 30k middle management guy because he wears overalls?

Exactly, you've uncovered the underlying 'logic' to the British class system. 

[Gups]

but they would make more then a lower middle class guy, right? so why are they placed below? a 60k a year plumber is ranked below a 30k middle management guy because he wears overalls?

As always George Orwell has the answer

George Orwell - The Road to Wigan Pier - Chapter 8: I was born into what you might describe as the lower-upper-middle class. The upper-middle class... the layer of society lying between £200 and £300 a year: my own family was not far from the bottom.... Before the war you were either a gentleman or not a gentleman, and if you were a gentleman you struggled to behave as such, whatever your income might be.... People in this class owned no land, but they felt that they were landowners in the sight of God and kept up a semi-aristocratic outlook by going into the professions and the fighting services rather than into trade. Small boys used to count the plum stones on their plates and foretell their destiny by chanting, 'Army, Navy, Church, Medicine, Law'.... To belong to this class when you were at the L400 a year level was a queer business, for it meant that your gentility was almost purely theoretical. You lived, so to speak, at two levels simultaneously. Theoretically you knew all about servants and how to tip them, although in practice you had one, at most, two resident servants. Theoretically you knew how to wear your clothes and how to order a dinner, although in practice you could never afford to go to a decent tailor or a decent restaurant. Theoretically you knew how to shoot and ride, although in practice you had no horses to ride and not an inch of ground to shoot over. It was this that explained the attraction of India (more recently Kenya, Nigeria, etc.) for the lower-upper-middle class. The people who went there as soldiers and officials did not go there to make money... they went there because in India, with cheap horses, free shooting, and hordes of black servants, it was so easy to play at being a gentleman.

In the kind of shabby-genteel family that I am talking about there is far more consciousness of poverty than in any working-class family above the level of the dole. Rent and clothes and school-bills are an unending nightmare, and every luxury, even a glass of beer, is an unwarrantable extravagance. Practically the whole family income goes in keeping up appearances.... The real bourgeoisie, those in the L2000 a year class and over, have their money as a thick layer of padding... in so far as they are aware of the Lower Orders at all they are aware of them as employees, servants, and tradesmen. But it is quite different for the poor devils lower down who are struggling to live genteel lives on what are virtually working-class incomes. These last are forced into close and, in a sense, intimate contact with the working class, and I suspect it is from them that the traditional upper-class attitude towards 'common' people is derived.

And what is this attitude? An attitude of sniggering superiority punctuated by bursts of vicious hatred. Look at any number of Punch during the past thirty years. You will find it everywhere taken for granted that a working-class person, as such, is a figure of fun, except at odd moments when he shows signs of being too prosperous, whereupon he ceases to be a figure of fun and becomes a demon. It is no use wasting breath in denouncing this attitude. It is better to consider how it has arisen, and to do that one has got to realize what the working classes look like to those who live among them but have different habits and traditions.... In such circumstances you have got to cling to your gentility because it is the only thing you have; and meanwhile you are hated for your stuck-up-ness and for the accent and manners which stamp you as one of the boss class...

[Sheilbh]

but they would make more then a lower middle class guy, right? so why are they placed below? a 60k a year plumber is ranked below a 30k middle management guy because he wears overalls?

Lower middle class = the oeuvre of Patricia Routledge.

[crazy canuck]

what the hell is upper working class?

Doesn't matter, the poll is about how people see themselves, and very few see themselves as that.

[crazy canuck]

It must be tough as you have to balance the negative impact care system will have on child's life but also extent to which child will actually live if the morbid obesity isn't brought under control. I think I'd need to know more about how long this had been going on to judge.

That article cites a 5 year old girl previously taken into care who was 10 stone 5lbs (145 lbs, 65.8 kg) and that does seem like it would be a problem to keep children in that situation.

Yeah I agree. I thought it sounded ridiculous and then I got to that example and I'm not sure. That feels to me like neglect albeit of a different type to a very malnourished child.

It would be interesting to see the reasons for judgment and not just a few snippets quoted in the article.  The part where the judge applied the legal test for removing children, for example.  We would then know why the judge thought it was appropriate to do so.

[grumbler]

but they would make more then a lower middle class guy, right? so why are they placed below? a 60k a year plumber is ranked below a 30k middle management guy because he wears overalls?

The survey is about how people self-identify, not about their income.  Eskimos have a hundred words for different kinds of snow; Brits have a hundred words for different levels of social class.

[crazy canuck]

but they would make more then a lower middle class guy, right? so why are they placed below? a 60k a year plumber is ranked below a 30k middle management guy because he wears overalls?

The survey is about how people self-identify, not about their income.  Eskimos have a hundred words for different kinds of snow; Brits have a hundred words for different levels of social class.

Two common errors, but there is enough acknowledgement now that it should be corrected.  Eskimo is a slur and should not be used.  The Inuit, who I think you are referring to, did and do not have 100 words for snow.  That was another misunderstanding that has since been corrected.

[HVC]

i thought it's only a slur in canada, is it not? Innuit in Alaska use the term eskimo? Unless that's another error, in which case i apologize.

[crazy canuck]

i thought it's only a slur in canada, is it not? Innuit in Alaska use the term eskimo? Unless that's another error, in which case i apologize.

It is not just limited to Canada.  From the Alaska Native Language Center website

Although the name "Eskimo" was commonly used in Alaska to refer to Inuit and Yupik people of the world, this usage is now considered unacceptable by many or even most Alaska Natives, largely since it is a colonial name imposed by non-Indigenous people. Alaska Natives increasingly prefer to be known by the names they use in their own languages, such as Inupiaq or Yupik. "Inuit" is now the current term in Alaska and across the Arctic, and "Eskimo" is fading from use. The Inuit Circumpolar Council prefers the term "Inuit" but some other organizations use "Eskimo".

https://www.uaf.edu/anlc/resources/inuit_or_eskimo.php

[Barrister]

i thought it's only a slur in canada, is it not? Innuit in Alaska use the term eskimo? Unless that's another error, in which case i apologize.

It's... complicated.

The main complaint against the word eskimo is that it did not come from those people themselves.  The etymology is either from an algonquin word which means 'eater of raw meat', or from the french word esquimeaux, for one who nets snowshoes (both of which are not unfair descriptors for arctic first nations people).  Inuit, on the other hand, is their own word (it just means 'the people).

When doing surveys over the name of the Edmonton CFL team they found about half of Inuit supported the name, the other half saw it as a slur.

And yes I think you're right that it is used in Alaska.