Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Tamas]

All part of the attempt to paint the EU as the bad guys despite their side being clear from the start.

It really is a disgrace.

It's a good thing I live in the UK and I can see it from the inside, operating still mostly on normalcy and rule of law because if all I had to go on was the last 3 years of British politics and the way the British political class behaved itself, I would have a very diminished view of this country.

[Josquius]

All part of the attempt to paint the EU as the bad guys despite their side being clear from the start.

It really is a disgrace.

It's a good thing I live in the UK and I can see it from the inside, operating still mostly on normalcy and rule of law because if all I had to go on was the last 3 years of British politics and the way the British political class behaved itself, I would have a very diminished view of this country.

In a way that makes it all the more worrying to me.
Our country is on the brink. Our way of life could change fundamentally for the worse at the end of October if there is no action.
And people see it as a new form of entertainment. Politics is an alternative to football. There are no subtleties, you support the blue team or the red team and hope for their absolute victory at all costs.
I look forward to the future when books are written on this collective insanity.

[Tamas]

And people see it as a new form of entertainment.

Yes, good point. I am afraid that's actually a big reason for the popularity of Trump, Bolsano, Johnson, Farage, etc.

[Maladict]

Well for politics. The most sensible would be there's nothing we are going to change about the deal given there is no magical solution you can come up with...bar having NI stay in customs union with hard border on ports into rest of UK.

I guess. But 'most sensible', in the context of Brexit, still doesn't mean all that much.

[The Larch]

Politicians really have no shame. David Davis was the effin' Brexit minister for what, a full year? Achieved precisely nothing, then now stands up and gives a "shopping list" (his quote) of things that absolutely have to change in the WA beside the backstop, all deemed "perfectly reasonable and acceptable by the EU" by him. I'll spare you the exact list because its cakeism of the most horrible kind.

Please do share the shopping list, as I can't find much about it after a cursory search, only vague points like making the "divorce payment" conditional to the future relationship.

[ulmont]

Politicians really have no shame. David Davis was the effin' Brexit minister for what, a full year? Achieved precisely nothing, then now stands up and gives a "shopping list" (his quote) of things that absolutely have to change in the WA beside the backstop, all deemed "perfectly reasonable and acceptable by the EU" by him. I'll spare you the exact list because its cakeism of the most horrible kind.

Please do share the shopping list, as I can't find much about it after a cursory search, only vague points like making the "divorce payment" conditional to the future relationship.

It's mostly vague yeah.  And shopping list was Davis's phrase.

Mr Davis said the Prime Minister should look for "sunset clauses" on the European Court of Justice (ECJ) and withhold part of the £39 billion withdrawal bill until the future relationship is settled with the bloc.

He told The Telegraph: "I'd argue for contingency on the money. I'd argue for tighter limits, timetable limits, sunset clauses on ECJ and things like that. I'd have a small shopping list.

"It wouldn't be a ridiculous one, but one I think that any serious European Parliament and any European Council that wants a deal could go with.

"If I were doing this for Boris, I would be insistent on is that they make the bill - the £39 billion, the second half of it - contingent on progress on the future economic partnership."

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1169468/Brexit-news-latest-boris-johnson-deal-changes-macron-merkel-irish-backstop-no-deal

If you have a Telegraph subscription you can probably find a better quote.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/08/22/brexiteer-tories-warn-boris-johnson-stripping-northern-ireland/

[The Brain]

Is there anyone in British politics who isn't a fuckwit?

[Tamas]

Is there anyone in British politics who isn't a fuckwit?

Yes but there are far from reaching a critical mass.

Unfortunately partly because they refuse to compromise their own specific flavour of moderation.

We had that during the indicative votes during the spring. The Remainers refused then to entertain even on the theoretical level the prospect of soft brexit, while the soft Brexiters refused to entertain the theoretical idea of staying.

For some reason, everyone would rather see the country burn than to get something they consider only second best to ideal.

[Zanza]

[Tamas]

  Very accurate

[garbon]

Government expected to ask Queen to suspend parliament from mid-September

[Tamas]

Government expected to ask Queen to suspend parliament from mid-September

Although not official, there are so many leaks of this, that it seems certain, unless Johnson dances back from the edge seeing the opposition to it.

What's the procedure here? Can the Queen actually say "no you keep going"? Surely she must be able, if she wants to.

Either way, this can become very serious.

[Tamas]

Good comment I read:

Shutting down a country's parliament to pass measures that could never gain majority support, and what's worse, measures that will profoundly change the country and its future, is obscene. It is not normal, nor inevitable, nor legitimate.

[garbon]

Good comment I read:

Shutting down a country's parliament to pass measures that could never gain majority support, and what's worse, measures that will profoundly change the country and its future, is obscene. It is not normal, nor inevitable, nor legitimate.

Yeah, it is quite horrible.

[Tamas]

If Johnson will submit this request to the Queen, she will end up having to choose sides: Parliament, or the cabinet performing a coup and no deal crashout. She will have no middle ground.