Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Gups]

The level of incompetence is pretty staggering.

Looks like no deal, and a hard crash for the UK. Scotland will probably get out within 2-3 years.

Every cloud

[Zanza]

I think May has under performed at what was probably an impossible task, but I still think Cameron deserves the massive share of blame, easily the worst PM the Brits have had in my living memory.

BoJo: "Challenge accepted!"

[Tamas]

I think May has under performed at what was probably an impossible task, but I still think Cameron deserves the massive share of blame, easily the worst PM the Brits have had in my living memory.

BoJo: "Challenge accepted!"

I think he has lost out as the favourite of the retards to Rees-Mogg. Mogg is our Trump now, not BoJo

[Richard Hakluyt]

I think May has under performed at what was probably an impossible task, but I still think Cameron deserves the massive share of blame, easily the worst PM the Brits have had in my living memory.

BoJo: "Challenge accepted!"

I think he has lost out as the favourite of the retards to Rees-Mogg. Mogg is our Trump now, not BoJo

Which is why it is important that Gove is currently behaving himself. If I understand Tory leadership rules correctly then the runners for the leadership are whittled down to two by the parliamentary party. The choice between the final two is then made by party members ( about 70,000 elderly xenophobes; that party is ripe for entryism as an aside). So you don't give them a chance to vote for Mogg. The offering made to them might be Javid or Gove for instance.

Boris is disliked by most of the parliamentary party and Mogg is not mainstream.

Of course it would be no surprise if everything went crazy (again!) 

[garbon]

Is this a common thing to happen in the UK?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/25/jewish-newspapers-claim-corbyn-poses-existential-threat

Jewish newspapers claim Corbyn poses 'existential threat'

A government led by Jeremy Corbyn would pose an existential threat to Jewish life in the UK, a joint editorial published by the country's three most prominent Jewish newspapers has claimed.

The Jewish Chronicle, Jewish News and Jewish Telegraph each produced similar front pages for their Thursday editions attacking the Labour party's decision not to fully absorb an internationally accepted definition of antisemitism into its code of conduct, and its wider record on the issue since Corbyn became leader in 2015.

In their joint editorial, they said the party was until recently the natural home for the Jewish community, but that Labour had "seen its values and integrity eroded by Corbynite contempt for Jews and Israel" and now faced being seen as institutionally racist.

The papers said: "The stain and shame of antisemitism has coursed through her majesty's opposition since Jeremy Corbyn became leader in 2015." They produced the joint editorial "because of the existential threat to Jewish life in this country that would be posed by a Jeremy Corbyn-led government.

"With the government in Brexit disarray, there is a clear and present danger that a man with a default blindness to the Jewish community's fears, a man who has a problem seeing that hateful rhetoric aimed at Israel can easily step into antisemitism, could be our next prime minister."

...

[Tamas]

As much as I dislike Corbyn, and as much as I do not doubt for a second that the left, in the UK especially, is choke full of antisemites, I find this anti-Corbyn campaign to be reeking from sweat. Just feels horribly forced and out of proportions.

Besides, it's like accusing Trump of being a rude misogynist and expecting his followers to desert him. That's the bloody reason they like him in the first place.

[Josquius]

They saw Corbyn was anti zionist.
They realised this was a great way to smear him as the racist one.
The accusations are just stupid.

[garbon]

As much as I dislike Corbyn, and as much as I do not doubt for a second that the left, in the UK especially, is choke full of antisemites, I find this anti-Corbyn campaign to be reeking from sweat. Just feels horribly forced and out of proportions.

Besides, it's like accusing Trump of being a rude misogynist and expecting his followers to desert him. That's the bloody reason they like him in the first place.

I don't get that analogy. I don't think most Labour voters who like Corbyn, like him because of potential harm to Jews.

[Tamas]

As much as I dislike Corbyn, and as much as I do not doubt for a second that the left, in the UK especially, is choke full of antisemites, I find this anti-Corbyn campaign to be reeking from sweat. Just feels horribly forced and out of proportions.

Besides, it's like accusing Trump of being a rude misogynist and expecting his followers to desert him. That's the bloody reason they like him in the first place.

I don't get that analogy. I don't think most Labour voters who like Corbyn, like him because of potential harm to Jews.

Potential harm? Oh no. But having a general bad attitude toward Jewish "business influence" and such? On that I am quite sure.

[Josquius]

Potential harm? Oh no. But having a general bad attitude toward Jewish "business influence" and such? On that I am quite sure.

You'd be wrong.
Jews have historically been pretty prominent in British socialism. We've never really gone in for the old school European Jews are running the world stuff (do people even still think that on the continent?)
It's all Israel related.
Some stupid people can't tell the difference between Jews and Zionists (from both the pro and the anti side).

[Tamas]

Potential harm? Oh no. But having a general bad attitude toward Jewish "business influence" and such? On that I am quite sure.

You'd be wrong.
Jews have historically been pretty prominent in British socialism. We've never really gone in for the old school European Jews are running the world stuff (do people even still think that on the continent?)
It's all Israel related.
Some stupid people can't tell the difference between Jews and Zionists (from both the pro and the anti side).

Yes but that was before more and more of the working class was made out of people with East European and Middle Eastern/Asian origins/heritage, wasn't it?

And BTW while nowadays the Israel government is despicable, the "I am not against Jews in general, I just want the state of Israel to be gone" excuse has usually been just that, a lame excuse.

[Josquius]

Yes but that was before more and more of the working class was made out of people with East European and Middle Eastern/Asian origins/heritage, wasn't it?

Fair point, poor Pakistani communities likely introduce a bit of genuine antisemitism. But they're still a minority.

And BTW while nowadays the Israel government is despicable, the "I am not against Jews in general, I just want the state of Israel to be gone" excuse has usually been just that, a lame excuse.

It's not though. Its a very valid point of view which isn't at all anti-semitic.
I would like Israel as it stands to be gone (unified Palestinian state where Jews and Arabs have equal rights would be the dream) but have absolutely zero issue with Jews. You find plenty of anti-zionist Jews too.
This whole "the left are anti-semites thing!" is more often than not an excuse the right use to hide their far more prominent Islamophobia.

[Richard Hakluyt]

The specific point in this instance is that the three principal UK Jewish newspapers have attacked the Labour party's position; the problem seems to hinge on the definition of anti-semitism :

https://www.thejc.com/comment/leaders/three-jewish-papers-take-the-unprecedented-step-of-publishing-the-same-page-on-labour-antisemitism-1.467641

"We do so because the party that was, until recently, the natural home for our community has seen its values and integrity eroded by Corbynite contempt for Jews and Israel.

The stain and shame of antisemitism has coursed through Her Majesty's Opposition since Jeremy Corbyn became leader in 2015.

From Chakrabarti to Livingstone, there have been many alarming lows. Last week's stubborn refusal to adopt the full International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance's definition of antisemitism, provoking Labour MP Dame Margaret Hodge to call her leader an antisemite to his face, was the most sinister yet.

Labour has diluted the IHRA definition, accepted in full by the government and more than 130 local councils, deleting and amending four key examples of antisemitism relating to Israel.

Under its adapted guidelines, a Labour Party member is free to claim Israel's existence is a racist endeavour and compare Israeli policies to those of Nazi Germany, unless "intent" — whatever that means — can be proved. "Dirty Jew" is wrong, "Zionist bitch" fair game?

In so doing, Labour makes a distinction between racial antisemitism targeting Jews (unacceptable) and political antisemitism targeting Israel (acceptable).

The reason for this move? Had the full IHRA definition with examples relating to Israel been approved, hundreds, if not thousands, of Labour and Momentum members would need to be expelled."

[mongers]

As much as I dislike Corbyn, and as much as I do not doubt for a second that the left, in the UK especially, is choke full of antisemites, I find this anti-Corbyn campaign to be reeking from sweat. Just feels horribly forced and out of proportions.

Besides, it's like accusing Trump of being a rude misogynist and expecting his followers to desert him. That's the bloody reason they like him in the first place.

I don't get that analogy. I don't think most Labour voters who like Corbyn, like him because of potential harm to Jews.

Potential harm? Oh no. But having a general bad attitude toward Jewish "business influence" and such? On that I am quite sure.

Plenty of British business, some national institutions are Jewish in origin and I've never heard anyone express resentment against them. For instance Marks and Spencers, a cornerstone of retailing, various British cultural memes associated with it like M&S underwear, pyjamas etc. Much liked and generally know to be have Jewish foundations, which in this context is seen as a positive re quality and jewish people in the rag trade nothing their stuff etc.


edit:
Oh and our two largest food retailers, Tesco and Sainsbury's have Jewish founders and I've never heard or read anything that could be seen as anti-Semitism directed against the companies.

[The Brain]

It's 1290 all over again.