Any Languish vegetarians?

[alfred russel]

I think it would be quite difficult to be a vegetarian in Poland.

[Ideologue]

Good friend of mine follows that. I've never understood drawing a line between seafood/fish and land animals, though.

Charisma.

I draw a line between brains indisputably capable of feeling pain and ones that don't.  All vertebrates are out, as are cephalopods.  Other mollusks are in.  I'm considering dropping crustaceans.  I drink milk and eat eggs, although I guess I shouldn't.  It would be very difficult to completely avoid dairy products however without essentially limiting my diet to food I prepared, mainly tofu and rice, especially since I dislike greens as well as many vegetables.

Besides ethical concerns, the other reason is that meat production is a monstrous source of greenhouse gas.  It should be heavily constrained by the State for that purpose alone.

I'm looking forward to labgrown meat, although I question its footprint, too.

[frunk]

I don't see how you can reasonably hope to answer the question of whether it is better to be born or not.

I don't have a problem with giving a being a life in order to figure out for themselves.

Also, I think there is something to be said that the vast majority of food animals are handled in such a way that one thinks is cruel and thus one doesn't want to help support that.

Yeah, as I said I could see insisting on free range/ethically raised animals.

I guess there could be, though I don't think Marti is thinking that, some sort of ethical concern over eating animals - in some sort of Jain type way.

Sure.

[Ideologue]

So meat is murder, fish is justifiable homicide?

You should really shun dairy if you're going veggie on ethical grounds. They slaughter calves to keep the mothers lactating, and they in turn are slaughtered when they've passed peak production, at five years or so out of a 30-year lifespan.

And even if you make sure your eggs are free-range, laying hens are slaughtered at the end of their useful lives.

If he wants to avoid the factory farmed meat he could just switch out the supermarket pork and chicken with for instance  lamb, goat, venison and beef. Maybe see if there's a local farmer's market where he can get free range eggs, chicken and pork. In and of itself being a veggie isn't more ethical if you help contribute to turning the entire planet into a giant wheat/soybean plantation.   

Only if you accept the existence of, say, cows as a positive good, an axiom I don't think you can easily prove.

[garbon]

I don't see how you can reasonably hope to answer the question of whether it is better to be born or not.

I don't have a problem with giving a being a life in order to figure out for themselves.

We don't really have a good way though of determining what our livestock ultimately decide.

[Norgy]

meat production is a monstrous source of greenhouse gas.  It should be heavily constrained by the State for that purpose alone.

The carbon footprint of the wild animals, like elk or moose, deer or boar is rather heavy too. However, their existence alone keeps forests in reasonable shape. Grazing isn't necessarily a bad thing.

I'd rather go all in against private cars than meat.

[Tonitrus]

For what it's worth, I work with an LT who is a lacto-ovo vegetarian (and a yoga instructor), and he easily maxes out our physical fitness tests (he is very much a slim build guy, not a muscle monster).  So it should be possible to live healthy on such a diet. 

[Caliga]

I've gone several weeks without eating meat before.  Didn't really notice any changes in anything (appetite, weight, etc.) at all except my shit smelled a lot less.

[lustindarkness]

For what it's worth, I work with an LT who is a lacto-ovo vegetarian (and a yoga instructor), and he easily maxes out our physical fitness tests (he is very much a slim build guy, not a muscle monster).  So it should be possible to live healthy on such a diet. 

Yeah but your PRT consists of a few rounds of golf.

[Scipio]

I've vegan 52% of the year, due to religious observance. The hardest part is getting back on meat; going vegan is great for your digestion. Eat a lot of mushrooms, and you will do fine. And that was not an oral sex joke. Pervs. Mushrooms have a fuckton of nutrients.

[Brazen]

I think it would be quite difficult to be a vegetarian in Poland.

Only because of the much tastier alternatives. Warsaw is painfully hipster and full of slim health freaks.

France or Italy, especially the rural parts, are more difficult.

For what it's worth, I was a vegetarian for my first year at Uni. My hair started falling out and my nails broke. Though I admit I wasn't particularly scientific about it.

[Duque de Bragança]

I think it would be quite difficult to be a vegetarian in Poland.

Only because of the much tastier alternatives. Warsaw is painfully hipster and full of slim health freaks.

France or Italy, especially the rural parts, are more difficult.

You can add Spain and Portugal too. Being vegetarian is senseless in a mediterranean diet land.

[Martinus]

I find it fascinating that, having asked vegetarians for tips, I instead get lectures from non-vegetarians telling me why vegetarianism is stupid. 

That's like asking for parenting tips, only to be told that one should not have kids in the first place. Or asking for running shoes' recommendations, only to be told that running is bad for your knees and you should try swimming instead.

[Martinus]

I think it would be quite difficult to be a vegetarian in Poland.

Not any more, at least not in the downtown Warsaw. In fact, there is at least a dozen purely vegetarian places within a walking distance from the place I work/live in.

[Martinus]

I've gone several weeks without eating meat before.  Didn't really notice any changes in anything (appetite, weight, etc.) at all except my shit smelled a lot less.

Well, one of the reasons I am willing giving it a try, is that I thought I had a kidney stone (turned out it was just my back muscles) and when waiting for tests to be back, I went without meat (protein is bad for your kidneys) for 2 weeks - and lost 6 pounds (whilst I was unable to lose weight earlier on a variety of diets). I also felt quite good, having no issues with my bowels.

As I said, ethically, I don't really have huge philosophy about this (it seems to me, people who want to justify eating meat are trying to come up with more ethical gymnastics than those who don't) and if it turned out abstaining from meat is bad for me I would switch back. That being said, the Cecil the Lion thread got me thinking and if I can lead a healthy life without eating animals I would not want to kill with my own hands - then perhaps it is ethical I should stop eating them.