Ubik commited to mental institution, tries to sue everyone

[Razgovory]

Maybe it's when facing legal penalty, but I've never seen in Schizophrenia.

[MadImmortalMan]

They do have the tendency to have sudden breakdowns and there's no guarantee that won't happen in a court or at a job. Totally random.

[Barrister]

They do have the tendency to have sudden breakdowns and there's no guarantee that won't happen in a court or at a job. Totally random.

It's not totally random.  It's not even mostly random.  They tend to go in cycles.

[Razgovory]

I have never seen one on a cycle. Uni, bi, tri, or motor.  Not once.

[The Minsky Moment]

I was dealing with a lady in court the other day, charged with assaulting a cop.  On the night she was charged she was yelling delusional things such as "I am Jesus Christ, all of Canada exists because of me".

Useful illustration of the fallacy of Pascal's Wager.

[Razgovory]

Please don't do that.  You'll attract Vikings.

[dps]

From what I've seen they rarely can keep the delusions to themselves. Especially if unmedicated.

to friends and family, sure. to strangers? people they don't have any desire to interact with? do you randomly discuss politics or personal topics with someone you meet on the street? no, and not all paranoid schizophrenics rant about conspiracies with everyone they come across. some do, maybe even many do, but not every single paranoid schizophrenic.

But that's the problem--if you have a job where you deal directly with the general public, you have to interact with people you would otherwise have no desire to talk to.   And some of those people will want to tell you all about their political positions.  Or there religious beliefs.  Or how their mother-in-law is a complete bitch.  Or brag about how well their grandchildren are doing in school.  Or tell you how you should be ashamed that the company you work for doesn't offer a particular service or product, or that it's you fault they happened to be sold out.  Or any other topic under the sun.  That can get tough after a while even on someone who doesn't have any mental health issues to start with.

[LaCroix]

Yeah, you seem to think this is just a quirk in the personality like believing the moon landing was a Hoax.  A person who is suffering from schizophrenia doesn't attempt to hide their psychosis, anymore then you would try to hide the fact that Barak Obama is President of the United States.  These psychosis tend to be utterly bizarre like the belief that the vacuum cleaners at the Post office are turning people's knees to jelly so it doesn't take long before figuring this out.  Even when they don't reveal their psychosis you can tell something is wrong very quickly.  Their speech is strange.  Sometimes it's just nonsense, but you typically notice things like an odd cadence, strange vocabulary, repeated phrases. jumping from topic to topic, emotions shown at wrong times, and illogical connections.

I have no idea what you base your impressions on, beyond not wanting to grant the authority to force treatment on people who can't make that choice for themselves.

Here's an example of the type of speech I'm talking about https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avbfd_OkLoU  Now, do you really think this guy could be working at a call center?

raz, it became very clear earlier in the discussion that you don't know what you're talking about. the moment you said schizophrenia had no spectrum of mild and severe cases, i suspected you were basing your perception of paranoid schizophrenics from those you've met at a mental institution or the cases you may have read about in some book or article. when you want to truly understand a mental condition, you don't look at the extreme cases. this goes for anything in life.

we're not talking about the extreme cases. we're talking about the minor cases. the cases you said could not exist because paranoid schizophrenia is not a spectrum. you've claimed that a paranoid schizophrenic cannot work steady employment because they're just all nuts with all sorts of delusions. except, not every paranoid schizophrenic is so nuts they're screaming "i'm jesus" at every moment of their existence.

my mother is a diagnosed, unmedicated paranoid schizophrenic and doesn't believe she's a paranoid schizophrenic. she's almost sixty -- her schizophrenia is deeply entrenched. she has never been fired from a job. when i was younger, she often quit jobs because she thought her employers were out to harm her. to this day, i still hear the same spiel every time i interact with her for more than five minutes. yet, she's been working full time at a call center for roughly seven years. she consistently performs higher than most in her department, and i've seen actual evidence of this. while she thinks her coworkers are bad people who are out to get her, she doesn't mention it to her supervisors or to others. she trusts this employer and believes management will eventually root out the the bad ones.

my mother doesn't form delusions with callers, because she is able to focus on her duties and provide assistance. she doesn't rant and rave at work. when i still lived at home, a stressful day merely meant she ranted to me in private more than she would otherwise. that's it. she's conditioned herself to keep her delusions quiet, because she knows people won't believe her -- even if she knows it's true. oh, and she doesn't have the odd speech pattern in your video. as your video says, odd speech patterns is a symptom that "may be present."

as barrister suggested, paranoid schizophrenics aren't some caricature from a hollywood flick who all act in one way. they're very human. my mother left my father and took me to bahrain when i was seven, because she wanted to go to a country where the government chopped off the hands of thieves. she has never told me this and still skirts the subject to this day. her avoidance is not out of fear of legal repercussions. schizophrenics, just like the rest of us, have a survival instinct that kicks in where necessary. those with severe schizophrenia are less likely to employ self-control, just as those with severe bipolar or autism are less likely to employ restraint with their own particular issues.

i told you this because i want you to know just how wrong you are. as you said, "i've never seen in schizophrenia." i assume you've based your impression of schizophrenics on extreme cases you've witnessed first-hand and have applied this impression to all schizophrenics that will ever exist. take a look at the south korea-irish thread. it's wrong there as it's wrong here.

[Razgovory]

I think you misunderstand the term spectrum.  It's not a matter of severity but of subtypes.  I'm sorry that your mother is ill with this and it's good she has a family to keep her stable, but a lot don't.  They are just abandoned and die in the street.  Also I don't think Paranoid schizophrenia is a valid diagnosis anymore.