Changing The Creepy Guy Narrative

[Josquius]

I've seen bitching about this sort of thing elsewhere recently. Its weird considering most advice for guys is that they need to try and go against their natural instsinct and do more of this stuff, not less.

The advice is to harass women until some dork comes to save them?

The hit on random strangers in inappriopriate places part at least.

[Eddie Teach]

It's not harassment until she tells him to stop. Directly, with words, not body language.

[The Brain]

In the name of love?

[Viking]

Douchebags like the dude hitting on the girl are annoying, but then so are (albeit to a lesser extent) guys who have a hero complex like the writer.

The sad fact is that some women actually respond positively to this kind of approach-- apparently just enough to encourage guys to hit on women like this.

More a case of some women have such low self esteem hitting on them like that actually works some time.

[derspiess]

Douchebags like the dude hitting on the girl are annoying, but then so are (albeit to a lesser extent) guys who have a hero complex like the writer.

The sad fact is that some women actually respond positively to this kind of approach-- apparently just enough to encourage guys to hit on women like this.

More a case of some women have such low self esteem hitting on them like that actually works some time.

Women with low self-esteem are still able to say no.

[Malthus]

I've seen bitching about this sort of thing elsewhere recently. Its weird considering most advice for guys is that they need to try and go against their natural instsinct and do more of this stuff, not less.

It's pretty simple.

Hitting on women is a good idea, because just hanging around and hoping that women will, as it were, drop in your lap by magic, doesn't work. Guys have to have the confidence to put themselves out there, or they don't get any action. Simple as that.

On the other hand, recognizing when women don't want to be hit on is also a good idea. One clue is when she tells you to fuck off, but hopefully one can learn some more subtle cues. 

Absolutely necessary to avoid being seen as a creepy douchebag: when a woman isn't interested and "tells" you so, either expressly or (say) by saying something like 'I really want to read my book now', do not react with butthurt anger and self-entiled outrage, like she owes it to you to pay attention to you. Do not say stuff like "wadaya mean, bitch, you should be honoured by my complements!" or whatever.

[derspiess]

This guy has it figured out:

[derspiess]

The Cat Facts one is my favorite:

http://www.buzzfeed.com/daves4/how-to-avoid-talking-to-huge-creep

[fhdz]

This guy has it figured out:

[crazy canuck]

I've seen bitching about this sort of thing elsewhere recently. Its weird considering most advice for guys is that they need to try and go against their natural instsinct and do more of this stuff, not less.

It's pretty simple.

Hitting on women is a good idea, because just hanging around and hoping that women will, as it were, drop in your lap by magic, doesn't work. Guys have to have the confidence to put themselves out there, or they don't get any action. Simple as that.

On the other hand, recognizing when women don't want to be hit on is also a good idea. One clue is when she tells you to fuck off, but hopefully one can learn some more subtle cues. 

Absolutely necessary to avoid being seen as a creepy douchebag: when a woman isn't interested and "tells" you so, either expressly or (say) by saying something like 'I really want to read my book now', do not react with butthurt anger and self-entiled outrage, like she owes it to you to pay attention to you. Do not say stuff like "wadaya mean, bitch, you should be honoured by my complements!" or whatever.

Yep.

It is possible to strike up a conversation with women in a non creepy douchebag way after all.

My older son had a good learning moment about this last summer.  We were walking along a trail to a popular river swimming spot near our house when we met a guy we knew coming from that direction.  He mentioned to my son that he had passed four good looking girls who were asking for directions to the swimming spot.  His words to my son - go join them!

So off he went running ahead to catch up to girls.  A few minutes later I caught up to them.  The girls were walking fairly slowly because they were carrying a heavy bag.  My son for some strange reason was walking about 20 feet ahead of them.  So as to avoid embarrassment to him I called out for him to come and help me with something.  When the girls were well out of sight and earshot we had a conversation that changed his outlook on how to approach and treat girls/women.

I asked him what had happened.  He explained that he had walked up to them but they didnt say anything and so he kept going and wasnt sure what to do next.  So I explained to him that he should just strike up a conversation.  I told him to start with what he already knows about them - that they had stopped our friend to ask for directions and explain to them that he was going the same way and he would show them how to get there.  I also explained to him that it would be a nice touch if he offered to help them carry some of their heavy things.

He looked at me like I was crazy - "You mean actually talk to them" 

I explained to him that most guys dont actually talk to good looking girls with one important exception - almost all the guys that do talk to good looking girls are complete jerks.  So, I explained, it stood to reason, that being one of the few non jerks who does talk to good looking girls would probably mean that the girls would want to talk to him.

That made a lot of sense to him, he overcame his shyness and ended up having a wonderful day with the girls down at the river.  He has since become quite at ease talking to good looking girls - which has gotten him into trouble with their boyfriends on a couple of occasions - but that is another life lesson.

[garbon]

Do not say stuff like "wadaya mean, bitch, you should be honoured by my complements!" or whatever.

Actually as compliments from me are so rare, they better be fucking appreciated.

[Berkut]

I've seen bitching about this sort of thing elsewhere recently. Its weird considering most advice for guys is that they need to try and go against their natural instsinct and do more of this stuff, not less.

It's pretty simple.

Hitting on women is a good idea, because just hanging around and hoping that women will, as it were, drop in your lap by magic, doesn't work. Guys have to have the confidence to put themselves out there, or they don't get any action. Simple as that.

On the other hand, recognizing when women don't want to be hit on is also a good idea. One clue is when she tells you to fuck off, but hopefully one can learn some more subtle cues. 

Absolutely necessary to avoid being seen as a creepy douchebag: when a woman isn't interested and "tells" you so, either expressly or (say) by saying something like 'I really want to read my book now', do not react with butthurt anger and self-entiled outrage, like she owes it to you to pay attention to you. Do not say stuff like "wadaya mean, bitch, you should be honoured by my complements!" or whatever.

Yep.

It is possible to strike up a conversation with women in a non creepy douchebag way after all.

My older son had a good learning moment about this last summer.  We were walking along a trail to a popular river swimming spot near our house when we met a guy we knew coming from that direction.  He mentioned to my son that he had passed four good looking girls who were asking for directions to the swimming spot.  His words to my son - go join them!

So off he went running ahead to catch up to girls.  A few minutes later I caught up to them.  The girls were walking fairly slowly because they were carrying a heavy bag.  My son for some strange reason was walking about 20 feet ahead of them.  So as to avoid embarrassment to him I called out for him to come and help me with something.  When the girls were well out of sight and earshot we had a conversation that changed his outlook on how to approach and treat girls/women.

I asked him what had happened.  He explained that he had walked up to them but they didnt say anything and so he kept going and wasnt sure what to do next.  So I explained to him that he should just strike up a conversation.  I told him to start with what he already knows about them - that they had stopped our friend to ask for directions and explain to them that he was going the same way and he would show them how to get there.  I also explained to him that it would be a nice touch if he offered to help them carry some of their heavy things.

He looked at me like I was crazy - "You mean actually talk to them" 

I explained to him that most guys dont actually talk to good looking girls with one important exception - almost all the guys that do talk to good looking girls are complete jerks.  So, I explained, it stood to reason, that being one of the few non jerks who does talk to good looking girls would probably mean that the girls would want to talk to him.

That made a lot of sense to him, he overcame his shyness and ended up having a wonderful day with the girls down at the river.  He has since become quite at ease talking to good looking girls - which has gotten him into trouble with their boyfriends on a couple of occasions - but that is another life lesson.

Great story.

I think my 13 year old is pretty shy when it comes to girls. I imagine he would never have the balls to just go talk to one.

I am at a loss on how to tell him to get over it though - I think back to myself at that age, and there are two basic problems:

1. Kids at that age lack confidence, and
2. Kids at that age are convinced that their parents are pretty much idiots, and have nothing to teach them.

That leaves me in something of a quandry. I know what he needs to be told, but am pretty sure my telling him would make it almost certain he would act in some exactly opposite manner.

My daughter, while only 10, will have an entirely different set of problems. How to get her to NOT talk to random good looking boys will be a much large issue.

[crazy canuck]

I am at a loss on how to tell him to get over it though - I think back to myself at that age, and there are two basic problems:

1. Kids at that age lack confidence, and
2. Kids at that age are convinced that their parents are pretty much idiots, and have nothing to teach them.

That leaves me in something of a quandry. I know what he needs to be told, but am pretty sure my telling him would make it almost certain he would act in some exactly opposite manner.

Agreed.  I was just lucky to get that teaching moment and it ended so well for him he got the best kind of positive reinforcement which sent him on his way.

My daughter, while only 10, will have an entirely different set of problems. How to get her to NOT talk to random good looking boys will be a much large issue.

Yeah, she is definitely going to be one of the girls I would tell my boys to go talk to.  So I really have no advice to give other than to tell her that if she ever sees a tall Canadian boy approaching her, who isnt a jerk, says he is from Vancouver and has a really tall dad, she shouldnt immediately brush him off.

[merithyn]

My daughter, while only 10, will have an entirely different set of problems. How to get her to NOT talk to random good looking boys will be a much large issue.

I feel your pain.

[Malthus]

My 7 year old has, so far, no problems with self-confidence and talking to girls - the only problem is that he only wants to talk about his interests. But he's willing to combine his interests with a girl's if she is. 

Amusing example: he struck up a conversation with the (very girly) daughter of a friend of my wife the other day. He wanted to talk about his favorite book, which was all about deadly creatures. The two ended up talking about planning a wedding for the crocodile - the girl added, with evident relish, that the crocodile bride could have a dress made of "human skin".