Changing The Creepy Guy Narrative

[Jacob]

That's not what I said, Stevie Wonder.

Sure thing, Ted Nugent.

Obviously the blame falls on the creeps themselves.  But women stopped responding to this approach, many/most of the creeps would stop trying it.

You say that, but do you have any evidence to back up that claim?

[garbon]

Doubtful. I doubt most of these creeps have had high success rates with this method, if any success. People aren't always rational machines.

They don't need high success rates.  I've known plenty of guys who would have no problem being creeps and getting shot down by 19 girls, if it at least worked on the 20th one.

I'm just as disturbed by the aggressive creep approach as you guys are-- it just disturbs me even more when it works.

I still disagree. I could see it not working at all (and in fact, anecdotally, I don't know of cases where it has) and it still being tried. After all, there are newbie creeps every day.

And just because 1 out of 20 people will respond well to garish behavior doesn't really excuse one for acting that way.

[Jacob]

They don't need high success rates.  I've known plenty of guys who would have no problem being creeps and getting shot down by 19 girls, if it at least worked on the 20th one.

I'm just as disturbed by the aggressive creep approach as you guys are-- it just disturbs me even more when it works.

So you're postulating that all the creepy guys have had at least one success with the creepy method, and that's why they're doing it? Because that's rather circular reasoning in that they'd have had to be successful as creeps to start being creeps.

Or are you suggesting that maybe they're being creepy because they hope it will work, even if it hasn't so far? Because if you are, then the women's reaction - at least in terms of responding positively to the approach - has little to do with the creep being a creep since the hope doesn't have to be connected to reality to be effective.

An alternate motivation could be that the creeps enjoy the act of being creepy, in which case the women's responses are secondary to the creep being creepy.

I'm suggesting that your cause and effect argument is unsound and a red herring.

[Neil]

High-quantity low-quality advances.  It's a legitimate tactic.  I don't think I'll single this particular form of interaction out for any special condemnation.

[garbon]

Or are you suggesting that maybe they're being creepy because they hope it will work, even if it hasn't so far? Because if you are, then the women's reaction - at least in terms of responding positively to the approach - has little to do with the creep being a creep since the hope doesn't have to be connected to reality to be effective.

[derspiess]

I still disagree. I could see it not working at all (and in fact, anecdotally, I don't know of cases where it has) and it still being tried. After all, there are newbie creeps every day.

I've seen it work, several times.  I wish I hadn't, for what that's worth.

And just because 1 out of 20 people will respond well to garish behavior doesn't really excuse one for acting that way.

Come on, dude, don't do that.  You're above the strawman thing.  I never claimed it was excusable. 

[DGuller]

Talking to strangers on public transport........  ..the horror! the horror!

Agreed.  In Florida the guy would get shot, if there was public transportation in Florida.

[derspiess]

So you're postulating that all the creepy guys have had at least one success with the creepy method, and that's why they're doing it? Because that's rather circular reasoning in that they'd have had to be successful as creeps to start being creeps.

Nope.  I'd guess that many/most of them have either had the tactic work for them or have seen it work.  And I don't mean to say that this is the cause for all creeps to act like creeps.  If that certain portion of women were to wise up and stop responding to creepy behavior, I'm sure we'd still have some creeps.

You guys just love twisting my words in the worst possible way when it comes to subjects like women.

[Malthus]

Doubtful. I doubt most of these creeps have had high success rates with this method, if any success. People aren't always rational machines.

They don't need high success rates.  I've known plenty of guys who would have no problem being creeps and getting shot down by 19 girls, if it at least worked on the 20th one.

I'm just as disturbed by the aggressive creep approach as you guys are-- it just disturbs me even more when it works.

I think you are mixing up two things here - making "scattergun" passes at every woman in sight (which can work) and acting all butthurt and entitled when the pass fails (which cannot).

The problem isn't the guys who have "no problem" with getting shot down by 19 girls. The problem is with the guys who definitely have a problem with being shot down.

[The Brain]

There's no expectation of privacy in a public place. Creepy guys constantly talking to you? Tough titties.

[garbon]

Nope.  I'd guess that many/most of them have either had the tactic work for them or have seen it work.  And I don't mean to say that this is the cause for all creeps to act like creeps.  If that certain portion of women were to wise up and stop responding to creepy behavior, I'm sure we'd still have some creeps.

I don't really know what you are saying then. Creeps will still exist regardless so seems pretty much like what Jake said that the woman's response is basically a non-factor.

You guys just love twisting my words in the worst possible way when it comes to subjects like women.

Perhaps you should reflect on the things you say about women.

[garbon]

The problem isn't the guys who have "no problem" with getting shot down by 19 girls. The problem is with the guys who definitely have a problem with being shot down.

I don't know. I think there is still something wrong at the dudes who catcall women insofar as it makes those women uncomfortable.

[Malthus]

The problem isn't the guys who have "no problem" with getting shot down by 19 girls. The problem is with the guys who definitely have a problem with being shot down.

I don't know. I think there is still something wrong at the dudes who catcall women insofar as it makes those women uncomfortable.

Catcalling isn't a legitimate pass. No wolf-whistling construction worker seriously hopes that the leggy blonde passing on the sidewalk is going to actually give him her number. 

What makes the guy in the article creepy isn't that he asked her what she was reading etc., it is that he didn't stop doing it when she clearly indicated she wasn't interested.

[CountDeMoney]

Obviously the blame falls on the creeps themselves.  But women stopped responding to this approach, many/most of the creeps would stop trying it.

But they don't, which is why they are creeps.

[MadImmortalMan]

God I hate that stupid snarky writing style. Douchcanoe? Really?