Orson Scott Card, Anti-Gay Author, Responds To 'Ender's Game' Boycott Campaign

Started by garbon, July 09, 2013, 12:53:38 PM

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Razgovory

Quote from: Admiral Yi on July 09, 2013, 01:54:36 PM
Quote from: Razgovory on July 09, 2013, 01:35:05 PM
What's your beef, Yi.

A phobia is an irrational fear.  Homosexualists use homophobe to describe anyone who is opposed to homosexuality, much like rag heads use Islamophobe to describe anyone who criticizes Islam or Muslims.  Both of those are bullshit.

Okay, I'm cool with that.  What term would you use?  I typically use "Bigot".
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

merithyn

Quote from: garbon on July 09, 2013, 02:15:18 PM

I suppose you might have a case if both sides are equally good and supporting hate is a legitimate cause.

At any rate, I don't think there is hypocrisy involved in not forking over money to someone who will fork over money to causes that hurt you (/you disagree with).

Exactly
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

Neil

Quote from: 11B4V on July 09, 2013, 02:08:49 PM
Quote from: merithyn on July 09, 2013, 02:02:13 PM
Quote from: Jacob on July 09, 2013, 01:23:52 PM

He sure is.

And people are entitled to think he's still a bigot because of the opinion he holds; and they are entitled to not go watch his movie if they're the sort of people who don't want to make movies made by bigots.
I don't care what a person thinks or feels. However, Card puts a portion of his income in trying to force his opinion into law. Because of that, I won't support him or his film. Which sucks, because Card used to be one of my favorite authors, and I've been waiting for this movie for a very long time.

Ah well.

Other people from the opposing side put a portion of their income in trying to force their opinion into law. Hypocritical IMO.

I'll see it and hope it's good. Dont care about the other BS.
But we're not talking about other people.  This is a choice for the individual, if they can't live with the idea that somebody who is politically suspect might be earning a little bit of money off of their decisions.

Granted, it's a foolish choice rooted is vicious, obscurantist stupidity, but it's still legitimate.
I do not hate you, nor do I love you, but you are made out of atoms which I can use for something else.

11B4V

Quote from: merithyn on July 09, 2013, 02:15:03 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on July 09, 2013, 02:08:49 PM

Other people from the opposing side put a portion of their income in trying to force their opinion into law. Hypocritical IMO.

I'll see it and hope it's good. Dont care about the other BS.

How is it hypocritical? I didn't say that he couldn't do as he pleases with his cash. I just said that I choose not to support it.

Like someone else said, get a pirated copy, or wait till it comes out on DVD and borrow it.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

OttoVonBismarck

I love how everyone just ignored the point I made about the fact if Card's deal is anything like normal ones, he received a lump sum for selling the film rights to his novel and probably doesn't make any money off of ticket sales. Does anyone have any evidence he has an unusual deal with Ender's game? If not that part of the argument doesn't make sense.

A lot of times authors sell the film rights many years or even decades prior to the film being produced. It's quite possible he sold the rights to Ender's game back in the 80s or maybe 90s, and it has traded hands from one studio to another over the years, meaning he may have even received a relatively small amount of money for it given there's been a lot of inflation in the payouts for film rights for popular novels in the past 10-15 years.

merithyn

Quote from: 11B4V on July 09, 2013, 02:18:40 PM

Like someone else said, get a pirated copy, or wait till it comes out on DVD and borrow it.

I'm not sure that I won't, but I'm not going to go out of my way for it.
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

Razgovory

Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on July 09, 2013, 02:19:36 PM
I love how everyone just ignored the point I made about the fact if Card's deal is anything like normal ones, he received a lump sum for selling the film rights to his novel and probably doesn't make any money off of ticket sales. Does anyone have any evidence he has an unusual deal with Ender's game? If not that part of the argument doesn't make sense.

A lot of times authors sell the film rights many years or even decades prior to the film being produced. It's quite possible he sold the rights to Ender's game back in the 80s or maybe 90s, and it has traded hands from one studio to another over the years, meaning he may have even received a relatively small amount of money for it given there's been a lot of inflation in the payouts for film rights for popular novels in the past 10-15 years.

Didn't you mention that the deal was unusual?  After all Card is Coproducer.  Question:  If the film is a success and they make a sequel does he get another check?
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

garbon

Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on July 09, 2013, 02:19:36 PM
I love how everyone just ignored the point I made about the fact if Card's deal is anything like normal ones, he received a lump sum for selling the film rights to his novel and probably doesn't make any money off of ticket sales. Does anyone have any evidence he has an unusual deal with Ender's game? If not that part of the argument doesn't make sense.

A lot of times authors sell the film rights many years or even decades prior to the film being produced. It's quite possible he sold the rights to Ender's game back in the 80s or maybe 90s, and it has traded hands from one studio to another over the years, meaning he may have even received a relatively small amount of money for it given there's been a lot of inflation in the payouts for film rights for popular novels in the past 10-15 years.

I'm not sure if it is as cut and dry as you are suggesting as certainly different individuals can come up with different structures (much in the same way that different compensation schemes exist for different screenplay writers).

At any rate, let's theorize that this boycott took place and one could observe that it really hurt film sales. Seems like that would play a role in whether or not a film based on another of his works gets greenlit.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

11B4V

Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on July 09, 2013, 02:19:36 PM
I love how everyone just ignored the point I made about the fact if Card's deal is anything like normal ones, he received a lump sum for selling the film rights to his novel and probably doesn't make any money off of ticket sales. Does anyone have any evidence he has an unusual deal with Ender's game? If not that part of the argument doesn't make sense.

A lot of times authors sell the film rights many years or even decades prior to the film being produced. It's quite possible he sold the rights to Ender's game back in the 80s or maybe 90s, and it has traded hands from one studio to another over the years, meaning he may have even received a relatively small amount of money for it given there's been a lot of inflation in the payouts for film rights for popular novels in the past 10-15 years.

IMO this boycott wont amount to shit.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

garbon

Quote from: 11B4V on July 09, 2013, 02:26:02 PM
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on July 09, 2013, 02:19:36 PM
I love how everyone just ignored the point I made about the fact if Card's deal is anything like normal ones, he received a lump sum for selling the film rights to his novel and probably doesn't make any money off of ticket sales. Does anyone have any evidence he has an unusual deal with Ender's game? If not that part of the argument doesn't make sense.

A lot of times authors sell the film rights many years or even decades prior to the film being produced. It's quite possible he sold the rights to Ender's game back in the 80s or maybe 90s, and it has traded hands from one studio to another over the years, meaning he may have even received a relatively small amount of money for it given there's been a lot of inflation in the payouts for film rights for popular novels in the past 10-15 years.

IMO this boycott wont amount to shit.

I think that's likely true.
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

Eddie Teach

Quote from: garbon on July 09, 2013, 02:24:12 PM
At any rate, let's theorize that this boycott took place and one could observe that it really hurt film sales.

But one can't observe that. One can merely observe that the movie didn't meet some expectation of returns and theorize that the boycott caused it.
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

merithyn

Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on July 09, 2013, 02:19:36 PM
I love how everyone just ignored the point I made about the fact if Card's deal is anything like normal ones, he received a lump sum for selling the film rights to his novel and probably doesn't make any money off of ticket sales. Does anyone have any evidence he has an unusual deal with Ender's game? If not that part of the argument doesn't make sense.

A lot of times authors sell the film rights many years or even decades prior to the film being produced. It's quite possible he sold the rights to Ender's game back in the 80s or maybe 90s, and it has traded hands from one studio to another over the years, meaning he may have even received a relatively small amount of money for it given there's been a lot of inflation in the payouts for film rights for popular novels in the past 10-15 years.

Because the point is irrelevant. Even if he doesn't earn more through the box office, the success or failure of this film will dictate whether or not more of his books are made into movies. Ender's Game isn't a one-off; it's the first of a series.
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...

garbon

Quote from: Peter Wiggin on July 09, 2013, 02:28:43 PM
Quote from: garbon on July 09, 2013, 02:24:12 PM
At any rate, let's theorize that this boycott took place and one could observe that it really hurt film sales.

But one can't observe that. One can merely observe that the movie didn't meet some expectation of returns and theorize that the boycott caused it.

ok?
"I've never been quite sure what the point of a eunuch is, if truth be told. It seems to me they're only men with the useful bits cut off."
I drank because I wanted to drown my sorrows, but now the damned things have learned to swim.

11B4V

Quote from: garbon on July 09, 2013, 02:27:21 PM
Quote from: 11B4V on July 09, 2013, 02:26:02 PM
Quote from: OttoVonBismarck on July 09, 2013, 02:19:36 PM
I love how everyone just ignored the point I made about the fact if Card's deal is anything like normal ones, he received a lump sum for selling the film rights to his novel and probably doesn't make any money off of ticket sales. Does anyone have any evidence he has an unusual deal with Ender's game? If not that part of the argument doesn't make sense.

A lot of times authors sell the film rights many years or even decades prior to the film being produced. It's quite possible he sold the rights to Ender's game back in the 80s or maybe 90s, and it has traded hands from one studio to another over the years, meaning he may have even received a relatively small amount of money for it given there's been a lot of inflation in the payouts for film rights for popular novels in the past 10-15 years.

IMO this boycott wont amount to shit.

I think that's likely true.

Now that's not saying they dont have cause to boycott. Just the youth nowadays dont give a shit if it's a good movie.
"there's a long tradition of insulting people we disagree with here, and I'll be damned if I listen to your entreaties otherwise."-OVB

"Obviously not a Berkut-commanded armored column.  They're not all brewing."- CdM

"We've reached one of our phase lines after the firefight and it smells bad—meaning it's a little bit suspicious... Could be an amb—".

merithyn

Quote from: 11B4V on July 09, 2013, 02:26:02 PM

IMO this boycott wont amount to shit.

It might or might not. I'll still know that I'm not giving my money to his endeavors. *shrugs*
Yesterday, upon the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there
He wasn't there again today
I wish, I wish he'd go away...